Passat Plant in TN to Unionize

[Stimulacra]

Not sure if this really belongs here but my rationale is that this is the plant where all of our Passats are assembled and hence the relevance.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...en-is-helping-a-union-organize-its-own-plant/

Heard it mentioned on NPR. VW is either neutral or for the plant unionizing (UAW) but the lawmakers are mostly opposed to it. Interesting disconnect. Also unusual in that VW is tacitly encouraging unionization.

Was curious to know what others thought.

 

[JSWTDI09]

Unlike the Japanese car makers, VW has a long history of working with Unions in Germany, Brazil, Mexico. etc. Therefore it is not surprising that they are willing to accept unionization in Tennessee. We will just have to wait and see what the workers and the politicians want to do about this.

Have Fun!

Don

 

[30_Yr_Dsl_Veteran]

There goes the price of the cars.

 

[Bug Smasher]

Unions had real value 50-100 years ago, but today they are little more than bureaucratic juggernauts. I would think twice before accepting a job offer from a company that was unionized.

 

[IXLR8]

Unions had real value 50-100 years ago, but today they are little more than bureaucratic juggernauts. I would think twice before accepting a job offer from a company that was unionized.

I agree with that. I interviewed at a shop that was unionized, once I realized how controlling the union rules were I ended the interview early. They didn't understand why I would not work under those conditions.

 

[20IndigoBlue02]

From what I hear, UAW is making a lot of promises with VW's biggest German union... such as forming a workers council, as well as promising that UAW with work with VW Group America for efficiency.

Under our own labor laws, they can't do a worker council modeled after the Germans.... that's illegal.

UAW is anything but efficient.

Remember what UAW did to its members at the NUMMI plant?

http://youtu.be/B3yxVuLi2Sk

http://youtu.be/S4DZ74IXh1U

Remember when UAW sued Chrysler over their firings of workers (UAW members) caught drinking alcohol and/or smoking pot on their breaks? Seriously, do you want these type of people assembling your car?

I'm for unions (as I am a union member), but the UAW has far outgrown its usefulness. They are sucking union dues to support their leadership (6 figure incomes) and their political allies.

Unfortunately, the UAW has a monopoly on representation of automotive industry workers

VW Chattanooga employers can regret their decision when they realize the UAW's true colors

 

[phlfly]

I worked for airlines and when I started my career at airlines, I was naive and was excited about union (AMFA). But later after many years I understood, it's bad for good and responsible workers and good for lazy and idiots. I could not get right shift because old farts would not retire and would not work as well. I have seen many those mechanics are sitting near tool box and produced nothing. But it's not all bad the union saved couple good guys after they run airple to the building while towing it into.
But if the company will say it's enough is enough nothing would help save your job, North West replaced all their mechanics with contractors ( scubs) but in my view at that time it was right thing to do, you got to fired useless one away, and reduce overhead, and scubs well I admired these guys now after so many years. They did what union and NW mechanics thought would not be able.
I'm big against unions.

 

[PassatSE4me]

Unions ain't what they used to be. It'll be lower wages and less benefits. Maybe not even a pension. It's not like the good ole days.

Whether or not it works for VW in Tennessee remains to be seen.

 

[jrm]

My work unionized 8 years ago, and it went from the best $70K per year job one could dream about to a $45K (commission, value share and Christmas bonus were all removed) per year nightmare where every supervisor is trained to document as much dirt as possible to keep on your file just incase things go south. Even in this economy new hires are quitting before there 90 days as its a very unhappy negative place to work.
That's my .02 on the fabulous unions in todays world.

 

[Rico567]

Unions ain't what they used to be. It'll be lower wages and less benefits. Maybe not even a pension. It's not like the good ole days.

Whether or not it works for VW in Tennessee remains to be seen.

This is one of the few relevant posts in this thread. The subject of the OP will work out if all the parties involved want to make it work.

 

[cfm56]

I worked for airlines and when I started my career at airlines, I was naive and was excited about union (AMFA). But later after many years I understood, it's bad for good and responsible workers and good for lazy and idiots. I could not get right shift because old farts would not retire and would not work as well. I have seen many those mechanics are sitting near tool box and produced nothing. But it's not all bad the union saved couple good guys after they run airple to the building while towing it into.
But if the company will say it's enough is enough nothing would help save your job, North West replaced all their mechanics with contractors ( scubs) but in my view at that time it was right thing to do, you got to fired useless one away, and reduce overhead, and scubs well I admired these guys now after so many years. They did what union and NW mechanics thought would not be able.
I'm big against unions.

Unions have their purposes and in some situations are needed. In other cases, they do not work and or needed.

seems as all you can bring forth are the negatives of a union and leave the positives out. This attitude can be seen on this board in regards to the vehicles we drive.

Glad you decided to move on from a union job, hope its working out for you.

 

[pparks1]

Unions ain't what they used to be. It'll be lower wages and less benefits. Maybe not even a pension. It's not like the good ole days.

Whether or not it works for VW in Tennessee remains to be seen.

What the heck is a pension?

 

[PassatSE4me]

What the heck is a pension?

Used to be a retirement income. Harder to come by these days. Especially a good one.

 

[D-Cell_Mekanick]

Used to be a retirement income. Harder to come by these days. Especially a good one.

Generally because the government allows companies to restructure after bad investments. Take from the poor workers and get grants from the government (ie the poor workers tax dollars) to pay their CEO's bonuses, happens all the time. Just look at what happen with the airlines and automakers and the banks these last 5-10 years. They are rewarding the jagoffs that made the mess and screwing the workers not just out of a job, but their retirement/pension, healthcare (don't even get me started on this Obamacare fiasco) and their tax dollars by giving tax breaks to business' that don't need them. Rant over!

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

So is forming a works council a condition of allowing the UAW into the plant? The article isn't clear. It seems that it's the works council that management really wants, and that the council will then make the union comply with changes in hours and automation, for example. Not clear to me what value the union brings to the converstaion, unless it's getting workers to comply with the council as a group.

 

[upsbroke]

unions

Hopefully the unionization will work out well for the Tennessee workers. I worked full time as a driver at UPS for 30 years. It was a very enjoyable job- especially since I worked in Florida.

Teamsters was a good thing at UPS-I would see harassment on a daily basis and I wondered every day what my supervisor could dig up to have me "brought into the office."

I saw a mention of "senior" employees being slackers. Not at UPS-they demanded as much if not more from drivers in their 50's and even 60's. Management had no problem firing a driver for minor infractions. Depending on the infraction,management generally knew he/she would get their job back after the grievance hearing in a month or so. Then- UPS would offer their job back with no back pay- or they could fight for backpay and maybe NOT get their job back. LOL- one of my best friends with 33 years seniority who also happens to be a shop steward- has been fired 7 times for as little as having a white t-shirt under his UPS shirt. He got his job back every time- WITH back pay. In most situations- UPS rules the roost-not the Union.

All this being said-drivers again got raises in their last contract and pensions were improved- even more for 30+ year drivers. UPS management now pays a portion of their paycheck for insurance but hourly's escaped that because of the Union.

Again- I enjoyed working (hard) 55-60 hour- 5 day weeks for UPS and I all businesses should be as well run (profitable) as UPS but in my workplace I was thankful for the Union.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Our UPS driver is in his 50s and loves his job. He takes advantage of his seniority by taking really busy days off (Tuesday after a holiday, for example) and apparently the Teamsters negotiated allowing drivers to smoke cigars. We can tell when our driver has arrived by the smell.

 

[pparks1]

Used to be a retirement income. Harder to come by these days. Especially a good one.

Yes, I know. I was being sarcastic. I've been out of college now about 17 years and I've never had a job with a pension. I only know a couple of friends who have jobs that include a pension plan. To me, a pension is like the magical unicorn.

 

[Lightflyer1]

I also worked as a full time driver at UPS for almost 10 years, both as a package driver and semi's. Hated the Teamsters there. Totally different experience for me than upsbroke's experience. I had no trouble dealing with and understanding what my manager wanted/needed from me. I had a huge problem with what I saw the union stewards standing up for and allowing. I have no issue with either as both can be bad or good depending on many factors, but prefer to work in a non union environment.

A lot of companies robbed or under funded their pension plans and/or went under. Turning them over to the government Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. I have a pension coming from one company I worked for, but like my 401k much better as I am in control of it and it is always mine no matter what happens to the company.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Yes, I know. I was being sarcastic. I've been out of college now about 17 years and I've never had a job with a pension. I only know a couple of friends who have jobs that include a pension plan. To me, a pension is like the magical unicorn.

Don't plan on finding one. Got to do it yourself. Time is on your side, at least for now.

 

[Bobmws]

Here's another POV about VW & Union.

FWIW As a public employee in FL for 23 years, My position has been covered by a union I am not required to join. They offer no benefit other than grievance representation for those who screw up!
I've saved about $3300 by not paying dues!

 

[oilhammer]

My union experience in my younger days was bad. Old, lazy, crusty farts that knew they simply couldn't be fired. They'd pick and choose what gravy jobs they'd do, one guy would save his vacation up and essentially take the summer off, making it so that nobody else got any time off at all during the summer.

Of course, that employer (a big grocery store chain) has found a way out of that over the years, and now hardly any of the people in the store actually work for the store. They are mostly outside vendors.

The auto service union wasn't much better. Nothing like getting booted off your rack an hour before your scheduled time off because the next shift has a higher seniority.

 

[phlfly]

I give one about union might don't know about. It's mafia and leave like a mafia. They have hunting properties is only for union executives, they bribe top management to keep contract going. In the end they need your money. Their salaries are twice or three time as much as you are getting paid. I did a lot research during North West strike on AMFA, I wanted understand why did they allow go to strike, and didn't t try save mechanics jobs. Well I don't have those links anymore but it was pretty interesting read how they sold their union workers to keep their contract and pay from North West. It was well planed executions with top North West executives, to remove cleaners and catering people from the Union. It was colds blooded contract, many families stuck with a lot problems lots of loss houses, divorse, have to leave way from the families. So union sold them in my opinion.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Vote is today. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.

 

[tdiatlast]

...sigh...yet another discussion on a topic that has had such enormous paradigm changes over the past few years that...well...too many variables. I think it's impossible to say what is best for the workers in Chattanooga. The workers there have only their current management to rely on for accurate, honest information, such as it is.

Only time will tell.

Don't expect a "fair and balanced" report on the situation, either, from Fox OR MSNBC. It's all about drama, and what will get people riled up. (or should I say "Rileyd" up?)

Just as our CR TDIs aren't "your father's Oldsmobile diesel", so unions of today can't be compared to unions back in the day.

 

[Justinw303]

Here's hoping the vote goes against the UAW. I like seeing the southeast bringing in all these manufacturing jobs, would hate to see unions creep in and ruin it.

As far as pensions go, you don't want one. All I means is less money now, so you can MAYBE get some money when you're retired. Screw that, set up an IRA and pay yourself.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Chris]

Yes, I know. I was being sarcastic. I've been out of college now about 17 years and I've never had a job with a pension. I only know a couple of friends who have jobs that include a pension plan. To me, a pension is like the magical unicorn.

My employer just converted our "defined benefit" pension plan into a 401k scheme.

There won't be any pensions anywhere soon.

 

[Lincoln]

Unions can be extremely valuable when/where employees are being mistreated or where safety is an issue. But with modern workers' rights laws, there are fewer and fewer situations where a union is really needed. Yet they live on, feeding off of the workers they are supposed to be helping, even at the expense of driving businesses under. If the workers in TN are being treated fairly already, then a union will just be a leech draining company profitability and worker pay (legal fees, dues, cut benefits, etc.).

 

[Lincoln]

My employer just converted our "defined benefit" pension plan into a 401k scheme.

There won't be any pensions anywhere soon.

I'm really happy to have a 401k instead of a pension plan. At least I know that when I retire the money is in a fund with my name on it. Otherwise, I'd be depending on my company never declaring bankruptcy and cutting my retirement entirely. I'll take a 401k over an uncertain pension any day.

 

[Stimulacra]

Sorry it wasn't my intent to stir the pot with this topic. As best as I know the only thing the Chattanooga factory manufactures are the NMS Passat. I figured it would have a direct impact on this sub-forum if nowhere else.

Currently as the owner of a 2012 Passat TDI SE with 60k miles on it, it is likely that I'll be looking to upgrade to the next version (probably in a higher trim level) in 4-5 years time. As such, I do have an interest in how things at the TN factory pans out.

I see the people there as the people who make my car. This hasn't been the case with other cars from other manufacturers.

...sigh...yet another discussion on a topic that has had such enormous paradigm changes over the past few years that...well...too many variables. I think it's impossible to say what is best for the workers in Chattanooga. The workers there have only their current management to rely on for accurate, honest information, such as it is.