P2002 - Rawtek Delete Here I Come?

[-:vw:-]

Hey all,

As I was driving around town the other day the cell on my 2014 SportWagen popped up. Scanned it with VCDS and found the P2002 code:

1 Fault Found:

008194 - Particulate Trap Bank 1
P2002 - 007 - Efficiency Below Threshold - MIL ON
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 11100111
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 255
Mileage: 95540 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2014.12.07
Time: 17:42:28

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2047 /min
Speed: 104.0 km/h
(no units): 81.6
(no units): 40.8
(no units): 2.75
Pressure: 326 mbar
Pressure: 64 mbar

With COVID and me working from home the car has not been getting any highway trips in just local trips to the stores and back home.

My DPF is showing the following in VCDS:

Ash: 69ml
Soot: 18g
Requested Regens: 5

I've been unable to locate thresholds or recommended levels for soot and ash on the interwebs so far. Does anyone know what I'm looking at here?

I'm assuming that "Requested Regens" is the number of missed regens that have been requested?

Am I looking at a dead DPF or just a good highway cruise to get a regen in and clear it out?

Rawtek DPF here I come?

 

[turbobrick240]

Take it for a nice drive somewhere first. 30+ miles of steady driving should give it a chance to burn off the soot.

 

[iamatt]

Here go drive 30 miles so your car feels better... Come on. Who owns who lol. If you can, just remove and be done with the BS and drive knowing you won't have to deal with the silly exhaust issues. Good luck.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

 

[turbobrick240]

Let's see- a bit of driving vs. well over $1000 of(less than legal) mods that aren't going to help resale value. I'd try the driving first.

 

[oilhammer]

Sad to say, the deletes are much more popular for those of us that actually still OWN these cars and actually have to rely on them. Dieselgate made the already fragile system even worse. And now that the boomerang warranties are all running out and/or the dealers are keyed in on denying anything and everything, the deletes are even more sought after.

But I agree that in this instance, since the car clearly has not been driven much as the owner pointed out, a good run down the highway for a while would be my first try too.

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

Great cars but sad to say the average "turn the key and drive" type driver is doomed to a short love affair with this car. Good or bad you must understand and work with a DPF. MY compromise was to get a non delete tune and be nutty about vigilant monitoring/driving requirements... Im kooky that way anyway lol.

 

[-:vw:-]

40+ min drive cruise set at 64mph the entire time all highway. Cell lit back up.

Long shot #2 - bad pressure sensor?

Also how damaging is this to the engine? I'm assuming this is not helping EGT's on the turbo. Should the car not be driven until this is resolved?

 

[dandywriter]

I recall reading the rpm has to be greater than 2000 rpm for a regen to occur. This is 4th or 5th in my manual 6 speed.


Found it in Ross-Tech Wiki:


"Regeneration while Driving Prerequisites (General):

• Ignition ON
• Engine ON (Idle)
• Coolant Temperature above 70 °C (see MVB 002.4)
• Particle Filter Load below Specification (see MVB 108.2/3, VCDS should give the specified values)
  • If the Particle Filter Load is above Specification the Particle Filter needs to be replaced since the car may burn down when regenerating.
  • If the Particle Filter Load value in MVB 108 is blank, use alternate group 241.2/3 instead.
• Power Consumers ON (Light, Seat Heating, Front/Rear Window Heater, Climate Control)
• Engine Hood Closed

Conditions (Driving Cycle):

• Vehicle Speed above 60 km/h (40 MPH)
• Engine Speed between 2000-2500 RPM (4th or 5th Gear, Automatic Transmission in Tiptronic)
• Duration approx. 10-15 Minutes
• Exhaust Gas Temperature before Turbo Charger above 170 °C (MVB 099.2)
• Exhaust Gas Temperature before Diesel Particle Filter above 150 °C (MVB 099.3)
• Exhaust Gas Temperature after Diesel Particle Filter above 150 °C (MVB 099.4)

Drive the car based on the above Conditions until the Particle Filter Load is as low as possible (close to 0 %). In case the Regeneration fails there can either be problems with the Driving Cycle Conditions or with the Engine Hardware."



Dan

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

My DPF is showing the following in VCDS:
Ash: 69ml
Soot: 18g
Requested Regens: 5
I've been unable to locate thresholds or recommended levels for soot and ash on the interwebs so far. Does anyone know what I'm looking at here?
I'm assuming that "Requested Regens" is the number of missed regens that have been requested?
Am I looking at a dead DPF or just a good highway cruise to get a regen in and clear it out?
Rawtek DPF here I come?

I've never used a VCDS scanner but it appears to me it is listing 5 failed regen attempts? Any experienced VCDS users with input? From what you said about your type driving this makes sense that it keeps attempting. From my experience so far "acual soot" level of 24.5 m gr is the main trigger to activating a regen given all other basic requirements like fully warmed engine are met.

Take it out on the freeway for a long run and hold the rpm @ 2500. You have the VCDS apparently so I would think it shows a live soot count or DPF temperature. If its @ 1100* or up Is drive it hard, if you see the soot level trending downward.

Sad to say, the deletes are much more popular for those of us that actually still OWN these cars and actually have to rely on them. Dieselgate made the already fragile system even worse. And now that the boomerang warranties are all running out and/or the dealers are keyed in on denying anything and everything, the deletes are even more sought after.
But I agree that in this instance, since the car clearly has not been driven much as the owner pointed out, a good run down the highway for a while would be my first try too.

This is the guy you want to listen to! On his note about the fragile emmion system, I installed the polar ifs and its worth every cent in preserving these components

40+ min drive cruise set at 64mph the entire time all highway. Cell lit back up.
Long shot #2 - bad pressure sensor?
Also how damaging is this to the engine? I'm assuming this is not helping EGT's on the turbo. Should the car not be driven until this is resolved?

Why do you think pressure sensor? Code? I did have a p13ce & p13do (#1 pressure sensor/glow plug) with a CEL when I 1st bought my 2011. Warranty covered 100% as it is emmision related.

What are your EGT's? Side note, Its good to always make sure the EGT's are below 400* before shut down

 

[-:vw:-]

I'll give it a shot at higher RPMs tomorrow and see what happens.

I'm a bit baffled by the specifics that need to occur to get one to kick off that dandywriter posted.

I've had regens kick off cruising through my neighborhood! Makes sense why everyone wants to tear these things off their cars...

Regarding the pressure sensor, there are MBAR readings in the DTC. What's performing those readings? Is it misreading?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[vincej]

I found it interesting that when I bought oil and filter for the last oil change they recorded it against the VIN. It speaks to me that there could be future warranty denials for those who can't prove they used the correct oil.

My pre dieselgate car ran better and got better fuel economy than this one, which has had the fix. I guess I will suffer through until it is off warranty and I find some guru who can make it behave better, or perhaps I'll take a test ride in one of the new electrics.

 

[-:vw:-]

"I am Jacks raging bile duct."

I drove the piss out of it. 70mph in 5th @ 2.75kish RPM way more than 15 minutes.

Code comes right back and now it brought it's EGR code friend.

This car has under 60k on it!

Wednesday,05,August,2020,22:57:58:53094
VCDS Version: Release 19.6.2 (x64) Running on Windows 10 x64
www.Ross-Tech.com

Address 01: Engine Labels: 03L-906-022-CBE.clb
Control Module Part Number: 03L 997 030 E HW: 03L 907 309 AA
Component and/or Version: R4 2.0l TDI G000AG 9983
Software Coding: 0050078
Work Shop Code: WSC 74291 008 00000
VCID: 30391052862FA5E7797-8064
2 Faults Found:

008194 - Particulate Trap Bank 1
P2002 - 007 - Efficiency Below Threshold - MIL ON
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 11100111
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 255
Mileage: 96104 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2002.14.09
Time: 16:44:57

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2162 /min
Speed: 91.0 km/h
(no units): 76.5
(no units): 25.5
(no units): 2.75
Pressure: 238 mbar
Pressure: 36 mbar

001025 - EGR System
P0401 - 001 - Insufficient Flow - MIL ON
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 11100001
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 255
Mileage: 96142 km
Time Indication: 0
Date: 2002.14.09
Time: 21:35:36

Freeze Frame:
RPM: 1219 /min
Speed: 26.0 km/h
Voltage: 13.76 V
Load: 71.4 %
Load: 100.0 %
Mass Air / Rev.: 235.0 mg/str
Mass Air / Rev.: 325.0 mg/str


Readiness: 1 2 0 X 0

Has anyone gotten a regen to successfully go at idle with VCDS?

With the newer CR-TDI engines there are 2 different types of regenerations available depending on the actual soot mass/load. If either the calculated or measured soot mass is above 30g but below 40g you can initiate a regeneration while standing (Idle will be raised etc.), a forced regeneration while driving is also possible. Once the values are above 40g (but below the max 45g) the regeneration while standing is no longer available and the regeneration while driving is the only way.

The above is from Ross-Techs page. Note the soot levels 30 to 45g. I'm at 18g, why is this happening?

 

[turbobrick240]

Seeing as how the car should still be under the extended emissions warranty, I'd take it to the dealer and let them throw new parts at it.

 

[-:vw:-]

Ya, might as well right? I'm just trying to think of anything they will try to throw at me to get out of it.

Do they test the diesel fuel? I just filled up and I use Power Service every time.

I use the Pentosin approved oil for my oil changes and have receipts and logs for those.

The tune will have to come off obviously.

Anything else? Any recommended tactics that I need to employ ?

 

[turbobrick240]

They only pull the fuel shenanigans for failed hpfp's. I very much doubt they'll give you a hard time for any emissions system problems. Still, I wouldn't mention the power service usage. Just be polite and they should take care of it.

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

What tune do you have? I ask because that may set some readiness codes. You may want to reset first before the dealer get it for warranty work?

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Keep in mind there's about a 2 month backorder on replacement dpfs for these cars. I think most would agree it's ok to continue to drive the car on short trips until the parts arrive.

 

[-:vw:-]

It's got a Malone Stage II.

2 month back order? You can't make this crap up.

 

[tjg]

It's got a Malone Stage II.

2 month back order? You can't make this crap up.

last year I waited 6 months for a new secondary cat for my sportwagen... At month 2 with no ETA I decided to go malone stage 2.

 

[oilhammer]

Yep, common. The tuners and people who make the straight pipes are loving this.

 

[-:vw:-]

Question. I'm trying to find the process to reflash the stock tune on Malones site.

It's no where to be found. Anyone have?

 

[tjg]

is this what you're looking for?


https://malonetuning.com/fz

 

[-:vw:-]

Sorry but no. That only show how to flash the new tune not revert back to OEM.

I'd like to revisit the regen while driving. Are the VCDS steps needed or just the driving? In looking at Ross-Techs page there is additional items to what was posted earlier in the thread:

Regeneration while Driving
Prerequisites (General):
Ignition ON
Engine ON (Idle)
Coolant Temperature above 70 °C (see MVB 002.4)
Particle Filter Load below Specification (see MVB 108.2/3, VCDS should give the specified values)
If the Particle Filter Load is above Specification the Particle Filter needs to be replaced since the car may burn down when regenerating.
If the Particle Filter Load value in MVB 108 is blank, use alternate group 241.2/3 instead.
Power Consumers ON (Light, Seat Heating, Front/Rear Window Heater, Climate Control)
Engine Hood Closed
Conditions (Driving Cycle):
Vehicle Speed above 60 km/h (40 MPH)
Engine Speed between 2000-2500 RPM (4th or 5th Gear, Automatic Transmission in Tiptronic)
Duration approx. 10-15 Minutes
Exhaust Gas Temperature before Turbo Charger above 170 °C (MVB 099.2)
Exhaust Gas Temperature before Diesel Particle Filter above 150 °C (MVB 099.3)
Exhaust Gas Temperature after Diesel Particle Filter above 150 °C (MVB 099.4)
Drive the car based on the above Conditions until the Particle Filter Load is as low as possible (close to 0 %). In case the Regeneration fails there can either be problems with the Driving Cycle Conditions or with the Engine Hardware.

[Select]
[01 - Engine]
[Security Access - 16]
Enter the Code shown by VCDS next to Adaptation Enabling (e.g. Regeneration while Driving)
[Do It!]
[Adaptation - 10]
Select Channel for Regeneration while Driving
[Read]
Enter/Save 1 as new Value.
[Save]
[Done, Go Back]
[Meas. Blocks - 08]
Select Blocks 099 and 108 at once.
[Go!]
MVB 099.2: Exhaust Gas Temperature before Turbo Charger
MVB 099.3: Exhaust Gas Temperature before Particle Filter
MVB 099.4: Exhaust Gas Temperature after Particle Filter
MVB 108.2 or 241.2: Particle Filter Soot Mass (calculated)
MVB 108.3 or 241.3: Particle Filter Soot Mass (measured)
Now Start the Driving Cycle and keep watching the Measuring Blocks (2nd Person required).
[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]

I cannot tell if that VCDS stuff is necessary or....?

Also I realized that when I did my last drive I did not have the "Power Consumers ON"

Does anyone have any clarity on this? I have a feeling I may not have done what was required to trigger the regen.

Lastly, I just tried to do a standing regen and the following step completely loses me in the process:

[Basic Settings - 04]
Select Block for Regeneration while Standing
[Go!]
[On/Off/Next] if Basic Settings isn't automatically ON at the top of the screen.

Follow the Instructions on the Screen. This process may take up to 30 minutes.

The "Instructions on the Screen" are some of the most cryptic I've ever seen.

First it says to hit the brake 10 times. I put my foot on the brake and dialogue box then switches to hit full throttle 10 times??

Anyone done this before?

I'm friggin' LOST.

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

That's really interesting. I didn't know one prerequisite was "power consumer ".

I always have A/c on anyway, since the system is on 100% of the time, It just varies load.

 

[tjg]

You should have the stock tune on your flashzilla still. It should be a simple as plugging the FZ into the car and selecting the stock tune to load

 

[oilhammer]

You need to initiate the manual DPF regen, while driving, and I really hate the way Volkswagen does this. The other manufacturers, even those with Bosch EDC, such as Mercedes-Benz, allow this to be done while the vehicle is stationary. They just tell you to do things like open the hood, place a "safe zone" around the tail pipe, etc. And it is MUCH safer, easier, and seems to work just fine.

 

[-:vw:-]

Wait... Are you telling me you are not able to do a regen with VCDS while sitting?

 

[oilhammer]

Wait... Are you telling me you are not able to do a regen with VCDS while sitting?

Not on that car, no. It isn't a VCDS thing, it is a Volkswagen thing. VCDS only "unlocks" what is already there. At least I have never been able to do one. Only the "while driving" one.

 

[-:vw:-]

Fair enough. Thank you for that clarification.

Can you verify any of the regen conditions while driving?

I.E. Power consumers, and the need to run and do things with VCDS while driving trying to get it to go?

"Enter the Code shown by VCDS next to Adaptation Enabling (e.g. Regeneration while Driving)
[Do It!]"

 

[mu3098]

I have done dpf regeneration while standing a few times with my 2011 Golf Wagen.
I just tried it again starting with a cold engine. I backed the car out of the garage set parking brake engine running, entered security code for regen while standing under engine => security and then go to basic settings select dpf regen while standing click on/next, press and hold clutch and brake (just press them one time) release the when it tells you to press throttle engine will rev up and the computer lowers it to 1500 rpm release throttle and let it do it's thing. It will take about 30 minutes to complete. Do not touch pedals while it is in progress otherwise it will end the process.