Order up a 2013 MkVI or wait for a 14/15 MkVII?

LooseBoltsRob

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Hey everyone. This is my first post and it's probably the biggest post as it really makes the determining factor on my purchase. I am at a point where I want a new car...my 1998 BMW M3 has 103k miles and is slowly getting closer to soon needing tires, brakes, shocks, rebuilt VANOS unit, belts, and more. So my situation now is trying to decide if I go get a 2013 6MT Tech Package Golf now or drop $2000 or so into the M3 in the next 18 months and then buy a 2014/15 Golf....or maybe even get lucky enough to buy a GTD? I keep getting more and more info on the new Golf and it sounds like a real winner...still built in Germany, lighter, lower, larger, and a more upscale interior. It sounds like a no brainer but my patience is wearing thin on an increasingly aging old bimmer.
We just got my wife a pure white '13 Touareg TDI and we both love it. She's averaging 28.5 mpg in 70/30 highway/city driving with only 1500 miles on the clock.
I love the features of the tech package Golf...keyless access and Dynaudio go above and beyond our $53k Lux level Touareg! I have to say, the non-Dynaudio system in the Touareg really sucks for such a premium priced vehicle.
So, I keep going back and forth with my decision...sell the M3 now, save the $2k in upkeep, and buy a 2013 Golf or throw the cash at the M3 and wait for a 2014/15 and maybe even a GTD.
Any insight is much appreciated!
 
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ksing44

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The MKVII does look great. I'm hoping the MKVII is going to be available with at least some of the upgrades that I've seen in the photos, but there really is no way to know if those same items will make it to the USA. I have a 2010 Golf TDI with the RNS510 system, but after 2010 you couldn't get the nicer higher resolution big screen, with navigation, HD radio, hard drive, and DVD that are in the RNS510. The good news is the RCD510 was improved in later models, with HD radio and phone support, but it still isn't an RNS510. And I don't think I'd go for the RNS315, with the small screen and no HD radio.

I'm just saying you never know what the MKVII will actually offer when it finally gets here. Maybe you could be happy in an MKVI for a while and then upgrade to the MKVII or an MKVIII after some time goes by. It really all depends how bad your current car is right now.

I drove a 1995 E320 Mercedes for 15-years and it finally had to go. I loved it, but the thing turned to total crap. Even so, it sure looked gorgeous. It was also way behind the times, but that was charming in a way too. The new 2010 Golf has all kinds of nice stuff that wasn't invented yet when the 1995 E320 hit the streets.

The 1995 E320 was gorgeous


The Golf TDI is pretty nice too
 
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IndigoBlueWagon

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Do some reading here: You'll get some things and give up others. Unless I missed something both cars will have the same drivetrains. The new car is supposed to be lighter, but how much once the diesel and NA safety stuff is added is an open question. It won't have true IRS, nor will it have a spare. As a BMW owner you probably know a bit about run flat tires, which I've read the VIIs will have. Those would have to go immediately on any car I own.

Styling and interior are in the eye of the owner. I like the new car except for the funny front quarter windows. I don't feel that strongly about either interior. Both are OK, but I honestly like my A4 better.

As time goes on it seems that I'm forced to buy more and more equipment I'd prefer not to have. I believe that will include rear view cameras on the new Golf. That's why I hang on to my W124 Mercedes.
 

whiplash willy

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Do some reading here: You'll get some things and give up others. Unless I missed something both cars will have the same drivetrains. The new car is supposed to be lighter, but how much once the diesel and NA safety stuff is added is an open question. It won't have true IRS, nor will it have a spare. As a BMW owner you probably know a bit about run flat tires, which I've read the VIIs will have. Those would have to go immediately on any car I own.

Styling and interior are in the eye of the owner. I like the new car except for the funny front quarter windows. I don't feel that strongly about either interior. Both are OK, but I honestly like my A4 better.

As time goes on it seems that I'm forced to buy more and more equipment I'd prefer not to have. I believe that will include rear view cameras on the new Golf. That's why I hang on to my W124 Mercedes.
Where did you read that the MK7 won't have "True IRS"?

I thought the MK7s were going to have a new 2.0l TDI Engine and a mechanical diff.

One thing I do know is VW is focusing on making the MK7 even cheaper to produce then the MK6s. Part of that comes from new/better manufacturing practices and streamlined process. Part of that will also come from cutting corners like they did with the Jetta. The real question will be is how many, and what corners will they cut.
 

LooseBoltsRob

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2013 Touareg TDI
One thing I do know is VW is focusing on making the MK7 even cheaper to produce then the MK6s. Part of that comes from new/better manufacturing practices and streamlined process. Part of that will also come from cutting corners like they did with the Jetta. The real question will be is how many, and what corners will they cut.
That's a big concern of mine as well...VW keeps dumbing down their product line and moving production to cheaper locations. That's not okay in my book so while they still expect the MKVII to be made in Germany, what cost cutting measures will they take like the 2010 Jetta, and will that make me regret waiting. Choices choices choices
 

nikhsub1

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The first MKVII's might not even show up here until mid 2014 as it is... I will give the new platform at least 18 months to bake before I jump over...
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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The engine choices aren't clear: One article I read said the new 2.0 TDI will have 190 HP and 280 ft/lbs., but another says the 2.0 Golf TDI will have 150 HP. And I also read that the new engine will have urea to treat the exhaust, but VW has maintained that it cannot guarantee meeting long-term emissions standards in a low price car with Urea. I know that's nonsense, but it's what they've said, and I wonder if they'll relent and allow urea in the Golf. Or if they'll use the old TDI as a carry-over in the NA market, as the emissions equipment is already in place.

It does appear the car has a twist-beam axle on some drivetrains. Don't know if that will include the diesel or not. It has with the MKVI Jetta and Beetle, for what that's worth.

And finally, the new Golf for the NA market will be built in Mexico. I know it's silly, but that matters to me.
 

LooseBoltsRob

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The engine choices aren't clear: One article I read said the new 2.0 TDI will have 190 HP and 280 ft/lbs., but another says the 2.0 Golf TDI will have 150 HP. And I also read that the new engine will have urea to treat the exhaust, but VW has maintained that it cannot guarantee meeting long-term emissions standards in a low price car with Urea. I know that's nonsense, but it's what they've said, and I wonder if they'll relent and allow urea in the Golf. Or if they'll use the old TDI as a carry-over in the NA market, as the emissions equipment is already in place.

It does appear the car has a twist-beam axle on some drivetrains. Don't know if that will include the diesel or not. It has with the MKVI Jetta and Beetle, for what that's worth.

And finally, the new Golf for the NA market will be built in Mexico. I know it's silly, but that matters to me.
I'm assuming the GTD would be the one with a 190/280 version. I read it'll be 148/236, so just a minor bump (like the 2013 touareg...same motor, just 15 HP bump and same torque vs. earlier 3.0s).


Being built in Mexico is a big turn off for me too. I thought I read they were still going to be coming across the pond. Are you certain on that source? My 2500 Ram was built in Mexico and while it's been a good truck, I'm always turned off by that idea...and that's just compared to being built here. I'd be more annoyed by the Mexico vs. Germany assembly. VW's push to become the biggest car company really kills it for enthusiasts.
 

LooseBoltsRob

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The first MKVII's might not even show up here until mid 2014 as it is... I will give the new platform at least 18 months to bake before I jump over...
That's not a big concern of mine as they are currently being sold as a 2013 model in Europe....we just get shafted till early/mid 2014 before we get them. Just gives the platform plenty of time to mature before they make it stateside.
 

nikhsub1

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That's not a big concern of mine as they are currently being sold as a 2013 model in Europe....we just get shafted till early/mid 2014 before we get them. Just gives the platform plenty of time to mature before they make it stateside.
Yeah but apparently all of ours will be made in Mexico, or Tennessee... not the motherland. Those won't start until who knows when.
 

LooseBoltsRob

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Yeah but apparently all of ours will be made in Mexico, or Tennessee... not the motherland. Those won't start until who knows when.
Ah, ok...that makes sense. Crazy to think that an entirely separate production line is worth building just to save on import taxes and shipping.
 

whiplash willy

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Yea, even though I have had as many problems with my German made Golf, as I have had with my Mexican Made Jetta, I still rather have my VIN start with a "W". On paper, they say it doesn't make a difference, but it does in the real world.

It seems with new cars that we are on the downward slope of the bell curve. Early to mid 2000s was at the peak, now manufactures are cheapening everything up to meet a price point. There was a time when all BMWs, Mercedes, Audis came with Projector HIDs standard. There was a time when all VWs had independent rear suspensions....Its weird to see a new BMW now with halogen lights, and a new VW with a solid rear axle and drum brakes.... How soon before we start seeing luxury vehicles with hubcaps standard? The industry should be moving forward not backward....

I am glad I got my MK6 Golf. Who knows, when the MK7s come out, the MK6s may be worth more used then new MK7s, just like we see now with the MK5 Jettas vs the MK6 Jettas...
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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I'm pretty sure about manufacturing in Mexico, read it in a couple of places. And I know the cost of German assembly has been a problem for VWs sold in the US. Having said that, I would happily buy a Sportwagen built in Mexico: my son's '98 built in Mexico has been one of the best TDI's in the family. However, my wagon has been so excellent that I am biased towards Germany, and that's partly why I got a Golf last year.

FWIW, VW "A" platform cars only have had true IRS since '05.5, and rear disc brakes since '99.5. The new beam axle setup on the MKVII cars is similar to the '05 and earlier cars, not like the current Jetta sedan and Beetle.
 

nikhsub1

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FWIW I prefer the MKV Jetta over the MKVI and the older Passat over the new one... Pretty sure that VW went with the MQB strategy to simplify everything - it can be assembled anywhere, kind of like a set of legos. While things hopefully improve with each generation sadly that isn't always the case... Thankfully I love my current 2011 JSW so I have no desire for something new but if I were in your shoes I would be torn as well. If you wait too long, finding a new MKVI won't be possible if you don't like what you see when the MKVII ever makes it here.

Throwing money at your M3 seems like money that will never be recovered - these TDI's seem to hold their resale value pretty well - I dunno, you have a tough decision for sure.
 

LooseBoltsRob

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FWIW I prefer the MKV Jetta over the MKVI and the older Passat over the new one... Pretty sure that VW went with the MQB strategy to simplify everything - it can be assembled anywhere, kind of like a set of legos. While things hopefully improve with each generation sadly that isn't always the case... Thankfully I love my current 2011 JSW so I have no desire for something new but if I were in your shoes I would be torn as well. If you wait too long, finding a new MKVI won't be possible if you don't like what you see when the MKVII ever makes it here.

Throwing money at your M3 seems like money that will never be recovered - these TDI's seem to hold their resale value pretty well - I dunno, you have a tough decision for sure.
Thanks for the info. I have the same concerns about waiting for the MKVII. I have a buddy who just pushed me into looking at a slightly used 12/13 Golf R as well. Found a nice white 4 door nav/sunroof not far from me with only 6700 miles for $30k...only a grand more than a new TDI. He's concerned I'll miss the tuner aspect going to a TDI from my M3 (which has wayy too many mods). I'm confident I'm done with going fast and guzzling fuel, plus I want to tow the toys (dirt bikes, jet skis, quads, ect) with whatever I go with and a hitch on the R isn't an option. I think I am content going with the MKVI now thanks to all of your responses. The resale value retention is a big bonus too in case I want to upgrade to a possible GTD in 2-3 years.
 

gumaku1

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just pony up and buy the 2013 and then when the 2014 becomes a 2016 (dialed in) trade up, that way you don't have to wait to drive a modern 2.0L CR TDI!!!
 

noobTDI

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I agree

just pony up and buy the 2013 and then when the 2014 becomes a 2016 (dialed in) trade up, that way you don't have to wait to drive a modern 2.0L CR TDI!!!
It's always better to buy a model at the end of the run if you are in for the long haul, they usually have all the kinks worked out. It's always a gamble with a new model. Re-sale always takes a hit on the previous model when a new look hit's the market, few aspects to consider.

My cars have been getting slower and slower over the last 10-15 years and I'm not missing the fast bit, however I still have a turbo 86 in the garage for when I need a fix.... which is becoming less and less.

My first couple weeks have been a pleasure, love this thing. I doubt you'll regret it either way.

Neil
 

tdi90hp

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It's always better to buy a model at the end of the run if you are in for the long haul, they usually have all the kinks worked out. It's always a gamble with a new model. Re-sale always takes a hit on the previous model when a new look hit's the market, few aspects to consider.

My cars have been getting slower and slower over the last 10-15 years and I'm not missing the fast bit, however I still have a turbo 86 in the garage for when I need a fix.... which is becoming less and less.

My first couple weeks have been a pleasure, love this thing. I doubt you'll regret it either way.

Neil
the current car is SUCH a great german built car that i would hesitate to wait and maybe even dissapointed although the press are messing their collective pants about the Mark VII car. its still a solid year and a half before the new one gets here....buy the current one and I am sure you can arrange a good trade in a coupe of years once the first ones get sold at over retail to the "anxious" crowd. I doubt they will cheapen the Golf according to what I have read. They even voted the golf top ten in car and driver again for 2 years in a row. Cant get better than that for 26K or so!!
 

cd_booth

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That's a big concern of mine as well...VW keeps dumbing down their product line and moving production to cheaper locations. That's not okay in my book so while they still expect the MKVII to be made in Germany, what cost cutting measures will they take like the 2010 Jetta, and will that make me regret waiting. Choices choices choices
Just to be clear, the cost cutting started in 2011. :cool:

I just read an article in Motor Trend about the MKVII Golf and it is listed with a 148 HP, 236 ft. lb. engine (8 more HP, same torque), claiming that it's mostly the same engine with some weight reduction.
 

t_b

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Were I on the fence about going with a '13 or waiting for a '14 I'd be very concerned about:

a) Will the 2014 and up Golf TDIs require urea like the current Passat TDI, and

b) Will the 2014 and up Golfs available to us here in North America possess a "W" at the start of the VIN like they do now, or will they start with a "3" instead? From what I've read there seems to be a very good chance that when MKVIIs are available here they will be versions that were Hecho en Mexico. Nothing against our good neighbors to the south, but I'd prefer to have a German car that was made in Germany.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Urea is a good thing. It allows the manufacturer more flexibility in tuning and improves fuel efficiency. Look at he FE numbers people are getting in the new Passat. Urea is cheap, and in VWs it's designed to be filled when you do an oil change. No problem.

And as I posted above, although I'm inclined to prefer cars manufactured in Germany, VW has been building cars in Mexico for close to 20 years. They do a fine job. I wouldn't let that be a deal breaker. Honestly I'd be more concerned about Tennessee, as it's a newer plant.
 

PlaneCrazy

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We were sort of faced with the same dilemma. With VW, a car on the lot is better than a promise for 2014... you never know what will be available and what will finally make it over here. In pics the Mk VII looks nice, but we can't see if, for example, it has really cheapened door hardware (hinges) like the new Jetta has. The Mk VI Golf is got much beefier door hardware than the new Jetta.

Then there's what model/engine/drivetrain combos will make it over here.

My wife really likes the current Golf Wagon (Canadian name for the JSW) which is in fact a Mk V Jetta wagon, but which is much more substantial than the current Jetta. But we weren't ready to buy until the spring. Then I noticed wagon availability going down, and especially manual transmissions. What to do? It looks like the 2015 MY before the wagon gets over here. And given the N. American trend to Allroad/Alltrack/Crosstrek/Outback type vehicles, there's guarantee it won't have $5k of extra off-road kit that I really, really don't need, don't want, and don't want to pay for. Look at what Audi did to the A4 wagon; the A3 will only be available as a sedan, etc. etc.

So I scoured the dealers, found a brand new 2013 Golf TDI wagon in Comfortline trim with Bluetooth and iPod interface, and we pulled the trigger. We get it Tuesday. About 6 months sooner than planned, but her current Passat has 250k km on it, has a few issues (including rust): the A/C no longer works, there's a power steering leak, some suspension clunking (those damned control arms again, cost a bundle). So it's going to be my winter/teen beater for now and my wife gets a brand new wagon :D

If there's a VW you really like, and it's available now, I'd say go for it. There's always a new model around the corner. At some times you just have to bite the bullet.

The Mk Vs (Golf/Jetta wagons) and Mk VIs (Golf hatch) are pretty solid cars as they now stand. I do find the Mk VIIs look really, really sharp but I also like the Mk VI. And even though my wife went for the Mk V wagon, when my own Golf comes up due in 5-7 years a Mk VII could be in my future. But there's no rush, the Mk VI is very good.
 
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