Oil Coolers... You have options guys. LOOK!

[Kennedy]

I know the concept of auxillary oil cooling is a hotly debated issue and I don't want this post to center around the validity or requirement for oil cooling. Here's some new parts that fit, make of it what you will.
- My opinion: First, let's not call it an oil cooler, it's an oil/engine coolant heat exchanger. It serves to bring the engine oil up to normal operating temperature (NOT) more quickly, as well as it keep it there under loads. Jeff @ Rocketchip has made many comments as to the importance of keeping the oil at NOT with souped up engines that run higher egt's (i.e. chipped). I strongly feel that all TDI engines could benefit from having an uprated heat exchanger as they serve to bring the engine to NOT quicker and keep it there better than stock cooler.
Dieselgeek sells a kit on his site, which is merely an oil cooler for a V6 4motion Passat (or at least appears to be). I found this out last week while changing Eric's oil in his 4motiion gasser Passat. Thanks again Eric for the cluster work.

Anywho, to the meat here:

The wimpy single coil exchanger on the left is the stock cooler on the MKIV tdi...

The middle cooler is a stock gasser V6 4motion Passat oil cooler, which appears to be identical to the Dieselgeek oil cooler. I used to have a Dieselgeek OC on my auto and it bolts right up. I've confirmed the V6 the 4motion Passat will also bolt up as well. It should be noted that although it bolts right up, it stresses the coolant lines a bit, as they aren't long enough to connect to the lower connectors on the cooler. I belive Oldpoopie discussed how difficult it is get that the little booger in place a while back.
Dieselegeek sells these for $210 complete, which isn't a bad price. If you know a good parts counter, you can get everything for about $185 new.

The part numbers you'll need are:
028117021E OIL COOLER (should come with upper gasket)
038117061 LOWER COVER TO OIL COOLER WITH SEAL

Now, the big daddy on the right is the oil cooler from a 04 130HP PD Passat. It will bolt right up as well, as Lito has been running it for a few weeks now. The coolant connectors sit on top of the cooler... you can either trim your coolant lines about 2 inches, or leave them long (just zip tie the excess). Install is a snap according to Lito.

All the parts you need can be gotten for about $200 from vwparts.com (call Jerry!), or any other parts vendor out there that you know and trust.

038117021B OIL COOLER
038117061 LOWER COVER TO OIL COOLER WITH SEAL
038117070B SEAL

There ya go...
Oil cooling options for all.

 

[Davin]

[ QUOTE ]

Now, the big daddy on the right is the oil cooler from a 04 130HP PD Passat. It will bolt right up as well, as Lito has been running it for a few weeks now. The coolant connectors sit on top of the cooler... you can either trim your coolant lines about 2 inches, or leave them long (just zip tie the excess). Install is a snap according to Lito.


[/ QUOTE ]

Wow... that's a monster cooler! Lito, can you chime in on how well this thing works? Do you have an oil temp gauge?

 

[NoPlugz]

I got the V6 4motion cooler for $75.00 on Ebay. Looks new, smells new......works like new. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[DZLPOWR]

I love it! The first thing I noticed on our new 04 Passat is the oil cooler. I think my exact words were "damn, that's a big oil cooler". Of course the salesperson had no clue what I was talking about. Looks like another mod for my 98 NB TDI. Thanks for the info.

 

[tongsli]

Davin,

Unfortuneately, I removed my oil temp gauge when I added the NAVI. I lost my single din location for the gauges. But I can tell you when I did have it and when I was running the V6 4-motion Passat oil cooler my oil temps were never an issue. Summertime on really hot days(95+) and it'd climb another 5-7 degrees but no higher.

Chris is right, the oil cooler/heat exchanger keeps the temperature close to 190-200 deg or so(normal operating temperature). It's about how quickly the coolant can take away any additional heat(to your oil) generated by your phat injectors, chip, etc, etc. The larger the heat exchanger, the more efficient it does it's job.

The 150hp TDI has a larger oil cooler as well, just not as large as the Passat's.

A note about the Passat TDI installation: You have to cut apart the two hoses and cut the 90 degree bend off as well.

L

 

[AtomicDog]

What's the highest oil temp that is considered to be safe? It's not uncommon for my oil temp guage to read ~210F w/ just my Upsolute chip. Maybe I could use one of these coolers...

 

[vwnumber3]

I would like to know too. In this heat with the AC going I have been around 220 or a little better when warmed up. I may need the passat oil cooler too!

 

[Peter Cheuk]

Would these fit an A3 TDI (AHU)?

 

[hpc]

WOW! A big motha! Just did a parts search on 1stvwparts
and came up with $173.28 plus shipping. THe parts are
listed as stuff for the 3.2L gasser.

Nice post Chris!

Cheers,

lon

 

[Birdman]

this is great for the mountians but my highly modded engine never goes over 190 unless on a mountian then have seen it get to 210 which is still safe in my book.
now the BIG hills out west this would help. Just MHO

 

[Kennedy]

[ QUOTE ]
I got the V6 4motion cooler for $75.00 on Ebay. Looks new, smells new......works like new. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a damn good price. You'll probably need to order the oil cooler cap, as the OEM mount uses a stud with a spin on filter.

 

[VWRacer1]

[ QUOTE ]
The larger the heat exchanger, the more efficient it does it's job.

[/ QUOTE ]
Minor point...a larger heat exchanger has a greater heat transfer capacity, but isn't necessarily more efficient. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Someone asked about oil temps. I run synthetics in my race cars, and the oil company recommends 220°-230° F for maximum thermodynamic efficiency. Anything from 200° to 250° is okay for sustained running. Below that and the engine is not considered fully warmed up, and much above that the oil starts having stability problems.

 

[tongsli]

[ QUOTE ]
Minor point...a larger heat exchanger has a greater heat transfer capacity, but isn't necessarily more efficient

[/ QUOTE ]

Tell my why it isn't more efficient?

If my capacity is larger, and even at the same rate of heat transfer from oil to coolant, if I'm processing twice as much hot oil as you are then why wouldn't a larger capacity oil cooler be doing a more efficient job?

For that matter, at the same heat tranfer rate, ANY amount larger than the OEM/Stock oil cooler is an advantage. Right?

L

 

[VWRacer1]

[ QUOTE ]
Tell my why it isn't more efficient?

If my capacity is larger, and even at the same rate of heat transfer from oil to coolant, if I'm processing twice as much hot oil as you are then why wouldn't a larger capacity oil cooler be doing a more efficient job?

For that matter, at the same heat tranfer rate, ANY amount larger than the OEM/Stock oil cooler is an advantage. Right?

L

[/ QUOTE ]
The term "efficient" suggests the achievement of maximum result with minimum effort, whereas "effective" emphasizes the actual production of an effect when in use. A larger heat exchanger is more effective (has a greater heat transfer capacity) than a similar smaller one, but is not necesarily more efficient. As I said, a minor point... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

To your second question, yes, a larger heat exchanger is a good thing if the engine is loaded more than the stock exchanger can effectively handle. I.E., if one finds that the oil temp is going much above, say 230°F, then a larger oil cooler will help keep temps in line. Just as one shouldn't let oil get too hot, it is also important to ensure that it gets hot enough. Unlike an intercooler, where cooler is ALWAYS better, letting the engine oil stay too cool is not good for the engine.

 

[tongsli]

Racer...got it. Effective, yes I agree /images/graemlins/smile.gif I also agree that too cool is not good, but it theoretically would never get cooler than 190 degs and would probably stay as you say withing the 190-210 Normal operating window.

Bottom line is...as folks keep piling on the mods: 11mm pump, injectors, chip, etc,etc, this really needs to be on the list as well. I'd certainly do this before I'd put on a different fuel filter.

L

 

[Rammstein]

Then would you put a kind of blanket on the oil cooler during winter to keep it warm (so the oil temp doesn't go too low)?

 

[Kennedy]

Look at the picture again...
It's not an oil/air cooler. It's an oil/water cooler. The engine coolant passes over a heat sink that the engine oil passes through. The COOLING is performed by the coolant, not the air.

Now blocking the grill to limit airflow to the radiator would keep the engine warmer in the winter, something many truckers do, but not sure how much to limit on the TDI.

 

[dieselgus]

I would immagine that the oil/coolant being in such close proximity with one another, heat loss through air/aluminum convection would me pretty much a moot point. The flow rate through the heat excanger (remember, it's job is to keep oil temp and coolant temp as closely matched as possible) should be enough that any cooling provided by air would be minimal. Now, if the oil heat exchanger was something like a transmission or power steering cooler, and was a liquid to air cooler (think : radiator) then yes, cold air would be an issue. On a stock TDI, the stock heat excanger would be fine, for someone heavily modified, then the bigger exchanger is the way to go, no doubt about it. The closer in temp the internal fluids are in a motor, the more efficiently it will work. Also, the oil should be subject to less thermal degradation than usual, I would imagine. I know my mechanic commented the first time he had the hood up in a TDI that the coolant/oil heat exchanger is one of the best ideas he's seen come factory on a motor in a long time... gave it a big thumbs up. He runs one on the car he races with for the reasons listed above. It does make sense.

Gus

 

[Rammstein]

Got it thank you. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[hpc]

Will it fit an '02 NB TDI with the top-load cartridge
filter which is mounted atop of the cooler?

 

[Kennedy]

[ QUOTE ]
Will it fit an '02 NB TDI with the top-load cartridge
filter which is mounted atop of the cooler?

[/ QUOTE ]

Will fit any MKIV TDI, (need to confirm the PD, but 99% sure).

 

[tongsli]

The big oil cooler is from the 2.0L Passat TDI(PD). Not sure if it'll fit the Jetta, Golf and NB TDI(PD)

 

[dieselgus]

Looks to me as the PD oil heat exchanger is exactly the same as the ALH, so I would imagine it will fit beautifully.

Awesome!
Gus

 

[tongsli]

That also means the coolant hoses from the 2004 may also fit. I just cut the elbows off mine, but some people may be more anal /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Lito

 

[dieselgus]

The coolant hoses showed the same part# for the 2004 1.9PD and the ALH 1.9L. (I ordered another when I did Circ. heater). Now... how possible would it be that the hoses are different on the 2.0PD? That would be interesting.

Gus

 

[tongsli]

Gus, are you sure the 1.9PD and the 2.0PD oil cooler's are identical? You can't go by the picture in ETKA. That's not reliable.

The 2.0L Passat's comes in from the TOP and not the side. So, the only logical explanation for the 1.9L PD having the same part numbers for the hoses(with the ALH non-PD) is that it's either the same oil cooler, or it's a different oil cooler with side mounted in/out nipples.

L

 

[dieselgus]

ooops... my bad.... heh. The ALH 1.9 and the BEW1.9L take the same hose. I would immagine the 2.0PD will be different geometry wise as its is a longitudinally mounted motor vs. the transverse in the A4 platform (I would think, anyways). According to ETKA, the PD 1.9 and the ALH 1.9 are using an identical cooler, hoses, etc. Terribly sorry for the confusion.... brain farts have been known to occur around here recently /images/graemlins/crazy.gif. But yeah, the 2.0 and 1.9 PD coolers are very different..... good thing I'm going golfing today instead of working.

 

[A4turbod]

What are those? oil pumps? or andwich plates.
thats not waht i call an oil cooler.
well what i mean is the opil cooler on my race car is like radiator but for oil and it mounts up front.
Those things in the picture look like pumps or sandwich plates

 

[VelvetFoot]

They're water cooled.

 

[Birdman]

[ QUOTE ]
What are those? oil pumps? or andwich plates.
thats not waht i call an oil cooler.
well what i mean is the opil cooler on my race car is like radiator but for oil and it mounts up front.
Those things in the picture look like pumps or sandwich plates


[/ QUOTE ]
Also air cooled I had one on my Diesel rabbit after i put a turbo on it. I am working on a kit for the big one. will take a few days as the phones are still a problem from Impex ( www.vwparts.com)to me are still a problem. will post prices in the forsale section when finished.