Oil Change Interval

bigb

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Oil Change Interval EA-288

I heard some people like to change the oil every 5K instead of the factory recommended 10K, (even my local VW indy said 5K) what is the general consensus here? My plan is to send a sample to Blackstone around 5-6 K and pay for the TBN test as well, just to see where it is at. I suppose the type of driving will matter too, longer highway trips with less cold starts vs a lot of shorter trips. I used to change my oil in the Powerstroke every 5K like the factory recommends but after sending in samples the oil was still fine at 7,500, probably could go even longer. It makes a difference on the Powerstroke holding 15 quarts and a $35 bypass filter.
 
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IndigoBlueWagon

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10,000 mile intervals are more than frequent enough for these cars. They go a lot longer between changes in other markets. In my opinion changing any more frequently than 10K miles is a waste of money and resources.
 

Lightflyer1

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Many tests have been done both here and at Bob is the oil guy showing 10k changes are just fine. Some of the cars in Europe have a sensor built in them and can go up to 30k miles without a change or when the sensor dictates. Changing at less than 10k miles is just wasteful financially and in a practical sense. Read up here if you don't believe as there are many posts such as yours that don't seem to believe the owners manual.
 

35 Yr Dsl Veteran

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I routinely changed my '98 Jetta TDI's oil every 20,000 miles per oil analysis and using high quality full synthetic oil, and that was back in the day of higher sulfur diesel, which meant oil did not last nearly as long as now. Said TDI still runs great at about 270,000 miles.

I also changed fuel filter every 40,000 miles instead of "recommended" 20,000 miles.
 

bigb

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Many tests have been done both here and at Bob is the oil guy showing 10k changes are just fine. Some of the cars in Europe have a sensor built in them and can go up to 30k miles without a change or when the sensor dictates. Changing at less than 10k miles is just wasteful financially and in a practical sense. Read up here if you don't believe as there are many posts such as yours that don't seem to believe the owners manual.

I like to be in the know about things, which is why I will do analysis. I am sure the 10K interval will be more than enough as you say but I still want to see how the oil fares, it's my fun. I don't play golf. I'd rather hang in the shop all day, that's my fun.
One thing I do know, some of the extended life fluids like lifetime transmission fluid and 100K coolant were partly from EPA pressure on the automakers. The Ford diesel engines started out with 100,000 mile coolant for example, but after problems with egr coolers clogging from silicate dropout on the 6.0 they suddenly issued a TSB changing the interval to 50K with no explanation and no admitting the 100K was a mistake on their part, just a coincidence that egr coolers were failing.
 

adjat84th

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10,000 mile intervals are more than frequent enough for these cars. They go a lot longer between changes in other markets. In my opinion changing any more frequently than 10K miles is a waste of money and resources.
Exactly, waste of money and resources. I've done some UOAs with stellar results on both my cars. No need to worry about 10k
 

GreenLantern_TDI

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Well yeah do the UOA and report back so we can all gain some knowledge from this thread. Maybe do an analysis at 10k and then again as Blackstone recommends and really see what ya got. But do us all a favor and actually come back and post the updates.
 

CheapBastard

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Is it diesel mechanics that makes oil last longer, you often hear of Peterbuilts and other big rig tractors going a million miles, what makes the workings of the Diesel engine so easy on components?
 

15TDICommuter

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Is it diesel mechanics that makes oil last longer, you often hear of Peterbuilts and other big rig tractors going a million miles, what makes the workings of the Diesel engine so easy on components?

For starters, the RPMs in a diesel tend to be on the lower side when compared to a unleaded fueled system. Less rotations should mean less wear.

'Power' is nearly off idle on a diesel, where some unleaded engines have to rev out to 3k and then pull all the way through 6K-7.5k to be in peak power. Majority of diesels quit around 4-5k at the highest, majority on the lower side of 4000rpms.
 

sloinker

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10k miles is what I run but I don't use the factory fill faux synthetic Castrol. I'm using 100% synthetic for peace of mind and that 10k interval. I remember doing that 3k 3 month interval for so many cars for so long that it feels alien to me to go 10k miles or whenever the OCI lights up on my other vehicles.
 

codyayrton

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Many tests have been done both here and at Bob is the oil guy showing 10k changes are just fine. Some of the cars in Europe have a sensor built in them and can go up to 30k miles without a change or when the sensor dictates. Changing at less than 10k miles is just wasteful financially and in a practical sense. Read up here if you don't believe as there are many posts such as yours that don't seem to believe the owners manual.
This is the first I've heard of these sensors. Googled them and they are interesting. If VW TDIs have these sensors, I would like to know where these sensors are installed in the vehicles. Screwed into the block or pan somewhere or inline? Is it a feasible aftermarket addition? Maybe not expensive and even a clean install if the USA cars already have provisions built in? Added to the MFD with VCDS?
 

sloinker

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What oil is that?
This oil which is VW 504/507 approved and can go up to 50000km in certain cases. It is made in Germany where the labeling requires that only 100% synthetic base oils can call themselves full synthetic as opposed to the rest of the world where hydrocracked class III oils can be called synthetic. That being said. Many people use and have no problems with class III oils. I like the added margins a true synthetic lend even if not really called for. This oil is expensive and your best bet is to order through blauparts.com when they have a sale and free shipping.

https://www.ravenol.de/en/products/usage/d/Product/show/p/ravenol-vmp-sae-5w-30.html

https://www.blauparts.com/ravenol-motor-oil-5w-30-vmp-5l.html

https://www.ravenol.de/fileadmin/content/documents/pdfs/RAVENOL_USVO_Presentation_.pdf
 
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IndigoBlueWagon

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Wow, that is expensive. And I don't know if I'd call $0.25 off on a $60 bottle of oil a sale. But I'm also a fan of full synthetics: L-M has some of these, too, here's one: https://www.idparts.com/liqui-moly-longtime-high-tech-5w30-liter-p-3849.html. That one isn't 504-507 certified, however.

I wonder if full synthetic with our kind of use (pretty gentle) and relatively short change intervals is really worth the expense. I've got a B4 with nearly 300K on it, and my son has an MKIV ALH with close to 400K on it. Other can routine cam replacement these cars have required no engine work. That's with correct spec synthetic (end product) oil and 10K intervals. There are lots of members here with similar longevity.
 
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35 Yr Dsl Veteran

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Is it diesel mechanics that makes oil last longer, you often hear of Peterbuilts and other big rig tractors going a million miles, what makes the workings of the Diesel engine so easy on components?
I had two Volvo big rig trucks. I bought both at around 500K miles, and sold or traded them in at over 1M miles. Like I said in a previous post, I went 130,000 between oil changes once (even though standard oil change interval was 20,000 miles using dino oil) using high quality fully synthetic heavy duty diesel oil and oil analysis. The ONLY parameters I looked at were TBN # and soot level to determine when to change.

The main reason diesels last so long, is diesel fuel is actually a lubricant, as opposed to gasoline which dilutes oil. So cylinder walls, pistons & rings are much better lubricated vs. gasoline engines.
 

Lightflyer1

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This is the first I've heard of these sensors. Googled them and they are interesting. If VW TDIs have these sensors, I would like to know where these sensors are installed in the vehicles. Screwed into the block or pan somewhere or inline? Is it a feasible aftermarket addition? Maybe not expensive and even a clean install if the USA cars already have provisions built in? Added to the MFD with VCDS?
None of the USA cars have them to my knowledge. There are some threads here where people tried to retrofit them. I can't remember how successful they were though. Mounted in the oil pan IIRC. Seems there was a place for them but not cut out or machined in for the USA cars. Try a search.
 

Lightflyer1

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I like to be in the know about things, which is why I will do analysis. I am sure the 10K interval will be more than enough as you say but I still want to see how the oil fares, it's my fun. I don't play golf. I'd rather hang in the shop all day, that's my fun.
One thing I do know, some of the extended life fluids like lifetime transmission fluid and 100K coolant were partly from EPA pressure on the automakers. The Ford diesel engines started out with 100,000 mile coolant for example, but after problems with egr coolers clogging from silicate dropout on the 6.0 they suddenly issued a TSB changing the interval to 50K with no explanation and no admitting the 100K was a mistake on their part, just a coincidence that egr coolers were failing.
I don't know why you would post here and ask then. There are already thousands of posts on this very thing. If you wanted to just do the testing, it seems like you would have done it and then posted your results. Many, many tests already done though and reading those would tell you what you want to know, instead of reinventing the wheel. But it is your money and time so do as you please. Please post your results though as asked before. Might as well add another data point to the long list of them.
 

bigb

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I don't know why you would post here and ask then. There are already thousands of posts on this very thing..
Well sorry I didn't see any of the 1,000s of posts you refer to, that's why I posted. In fact this forum seems a little deserted most of the time, I check in every day and see very little activity. Is there something wrong with trying to drum up a little conversation with members who have similar interests?
 

turbobrick240

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The vast majority of tdi owners simply follow the factory specified maintenance schedule and forego analysis. There really aren't any lubrication related issues that I'm aware of. So there's that. But if you feel the need to do 3000, 5000, or 7000 mile intervals, the car isn't going to care. Whatever it takes to get a good night's sleep. :)
 

Bob S.

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The Ford diesel engines started out with 100,000 mile coolant for example, but after problems with egr coolers clogging from silicate dropout on the 6.0 they suddenly issued a TSB changing the interval to 50K with no explanation and no admitting the 100K was a mistake on their part, just a coincidence that egr coolers were failing.
IMHO, the Ford PSD 6.0 is a poor example. Relatively new 6.0 trucks were blowing their oil coolers with well under 50K on the odo. The fact that Ford quickly redesigned the oil cooler (& other changes) & the durability of the bullet proofed 6.0s indicated the Ford totally erred on the 6.0 design & roll out. Never again will I own another Ford! & this is from someone that put over 300K on a Pinto.

10,000 mile intervals are more than frequent enough for these cars. They go a lot longer between changes in other markets. In my opinion changing any more frequently than 10K miles is a waste of money and resources.
Sage advice from the guy that sell soil & filters.
 

35 Yr Dsl Veteran

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The vast majority of tdi owners simply follow the factory specified maintenance schedule and forego analysis. There really aren't any lubrication related issues that I'm aware of. So there's that. But if you feel the need to do 3000, 5000, or 7000 mile intervals, the car isn't going to care. Whatever it takes to get a good night's sleep. :)
The POINT of oil analysis is not to check it sooner than recommended change interval (VW has undoubtedly done that extensively), but WELL BEYOND recommended interval, such as 15,000 miles, 20,000 miles, etc. To see which one is ideal for your driving & climate conditions, in order to not waste time & money superfluously on dumping perfectly good oil.
 

Lightflyer1

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Well sorry I didn't see any of the 1,000s of posts you refer to, that's why I posted. In fact this forum seems a little deserted most of the time, I check in every day and see very little activity. Is there something wrong with trying to drum up a little conversation with members who have similar interests?
Well you stated in your second post "I like to be in the know about things, which is why I will do analysis.", which kind of defeats the purpose of asking as you will already have definitive proof of that which you ask. VW hasn't changed its recommended oil change interval at least since 2005 when I came on board. It has always been 10k miles at least since then and your manual states this, as well as thousands of posts here. Many oil tests have been done and posted on these and other similar oils and they all have life left after 10k miles use, unless something is wrong with the car itself. Bob is the oil guy, is another resource for info of this nature as well. Good luck with your testing and do post up your results please.

Should I change my oil early and what oil do I use are probably two of the most asked questions ever here.
 
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turbobrick240

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IMHO, the Ford PSD 6.0 is a poor example. Relatively new 6.0 trucks were blowing their oil coolers with well under 50K on the odo. The fact that Ford quickly redesigned the oil cooler (& other changes) & the durability of the bullet proofed 6.0s indicated the Ford totally erred on the 6.0 design & roll out. Never again will I own another Ford! & this is from someone that put over 300K on a Pinto.



Sage advice from the guy that sell soil & filters.
The 6.0 Powerstroke sure was a problematic design, but it was Navistars design. I guess Ford may have made some alterations that worsened the problems. The 6.0 fiasco is largely why Ford ditched Navistar and designed the 6.7 completely in-house.
 

Bob S.

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The 6.0 Powerstroke sure was a problematic design, but it was Navistars design. I guess Ford may have made some alterations that worsened the problems. The 6.0 fiasco is largely why Ford ditched Navistar and designed the 6.7 completely in-house.
Agreed. From what I read (online of course, so take it with a grain of salt :rolleyes:), the changes that Ford made to the Navistar block were the ones that gave the problems. The way Ford handled the issue is worse than their original problem.
 

bigb

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VW hasn't changed its recommended oil change interval at least since 2005 when I came on board. It has always been 10k miles at least since then Good luck with your testing and do post up your results please.

.
Being my first ever VW I did not know this, I figured it was something new.
I will post my results, I want to be active in the forum and try to give back as much as I can in return for the free knowledge I get here.
 

Lightflyer1

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It seems slow now here since all the whining and crying is over for those who couldn't wait to sell their cars back to VW due to VW's lie. Now we are just back to those who like their cars, for the most part.
 

sloinker

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I haven't heard any issues with the 10k mile OCI or use of the cheapest available approved oil. Some people prefer to go a different route. Different strokes they say. Do what makes you happy and meets the manufacturers minimum requirements and you are probably good to go. In extreme environments or use, it may be advisable to shorten the OCI and/or use a different oil.
 
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