Official list of HPFP Failures

turbovan+tdi

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Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
what do you think the % of cars is which will have a failure of the HPFP?
Sure, tell that to the owners. Its not that rare, some owners have had 2/3 of them, so yeah, its rare. :rolleyes:

You can spout percentages till the cows come home, doesn't change the fact its a high risk item to fail and it wouldn't be so bad if it didn't take out the whole fuel system. ;)
 

tdiatlast

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Location
Fort Worth, Texas
TDI
2009 Sportwagen (boughtback); 2014 Passat TDI SEL (boughtback)
Nope...not even close to "high risk" to fail, if it's under 3,4 or even 5%.
Problem isn't failure rate, but catastrophic damage of each and every "rare" failure.

And meerschm, I'll yank your chain and answer your question: How about 100%, given enough time/mileage??? (sorry...couldn't resist!)
 

kjclow

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 26, 2003
Location
Charlotte, NC
TDI
2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
Sure, tell that to the owners. Its not that rare, some owners have had 2/3 of them, so yeah, its rare. :rolleyes:

You can spout percentages till the cows come home, doesn't change the fact its a high risk item to fail and it wouldn't be so bad if it didn't take out the whole fuel system. ;)
I understand all that but those people that multiple failures typically reported the second failure within a short period of time after the first repair. Leading to the speculation that the garage did not get all the crap cleaned out of the fuel system. At least one poster on here had a second (or wsa it third) failure while the mechanic was doing the test drive.

And I will agree with tdiatlast, since the fuel pump is a wear item, sooner or later, 100% of them will have to be replaced. I just wish I knew when to replace it before it fails. I also wish I were comfortable enough with the replacement pumps being better built than the oem pumps.
 
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meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
I really am unconvinced that these are wear related items.

sure, they wear, but will that wear cause the expensive failure on all pumps? who knows?
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
Its still a high failure rate, its an item that can't be trusted. Lets go back to the good old ALH, where pumps CAN fail around 100K but most make it 250K and beyond and when it does, it usually lets you drive, which makes the HPFP failure even worse. Even if it is 2%, which I bet its not as OE's don't recall or do extended warrany's for 2% failure.

Another example, back in the day when I worked at GM, the Quad 4 came out, great engine, lots of testing we were told but after 2-3 years, the head gaskets started going, you could spout the 2% crap but it was a lot more. It was like the HPFP, it got bad enough that GM did an extended warranty. So to recap, other cars didn't have head gasket issues, that one did, ditto for the HPFP. If it wasn't such a problem, why does this thread exist? :p
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
We have totally abused the purpose of this thread. I would be happy if an admin could cut all the commentary out and dump in another thread.

lets just say as humans, we are not very good at reacting to risk in a rational way.

folks are afraid to fly, even as the danger driving to the airport is higher,

we accept heart disease, auto accident deaths and firearms deaths, but go bat sh*t for a virus which is easy to contain with basic public health measures.

HPFP failure is expensive, and we have seen reported here several hundred cars (what is the count, anyway)

but no qualitative comparison with DPF cracking or turbo failures. or DMF failures or oil pump shaft failure, or accessory belt shredding and taking out the timing belt for that matter.

I know it is an issue, but like to have the numbers, if at all possible. there is nothing posted here that says a HPFP is more likely (or less likely) to fail between 100k and 200k than between 0 and 100k miles. (or 200k to 300k)

there is also no way to compare if you would be better off if you put a new HPFP in before it fails, (and a few stories of failures likely induced by too much messing around with the fuel system)

it does suck, esp if it happens to your car.

but for most of us, (should I knock on wood?) this is more likely to be a non-issue, even if we keep it for 15 years and put 300,000 miles on the car.

KBB on my JSW right now is around $5k. it also has a slightly cracked DPF. in the unlikely event the HPFP crapped tomorrow, I could spend $5k and still have a $5k car with a cracked DPF.

anyway, even if it is 2% or 5%, or even 7%, I would not fight with someone who wanted to call it rare..

if you want to call that high, I don't have any problem with that either. (but somehow felt the need to ask for a number when you thought you needed to question the residence of a fellow member)

I just wanted to stick up for Matt, who was making a couple valid points (as it seemed to me)


there is a concept known as expected value, where you multiply the probability by the cost. (this is how insurance companies make money)

if the failure rate was 2% per year, and the cost was $5000, the expected loss would be $100. (per year) so if these were the rates, it would be a profit center for someone to sell HPFP insurance for over $100 per year, plus whatever admin costs are.
 

pvanbavel

New member
Joined
Dec 10, 2015
Location
Austin Tx
TDI
jetta sportwagen
HPFP failure

failure date 11/2015
build date:2010
Jetta Sportswagen
engine 2.0TDI
transmission DSG
millage 95,000 miles
fuel source Buccee's ( VW test showed fuel is perfect)
Dealer Charles Maund VW, Austin TX
engine failed after pulling out of Buccee's in Giddings TX. required tow to Austin
dealer mechanics reported catastrophic failure of the entire fuel system due to cascading metal particles from failed pump. They replaced the entire fuel system except the tank. Total bill $7000 which was completely paid for by VW and the dealer. Silver long term warranty would have paid for just the pump( $800). 120,000 mile extended warranty program( letter from VW) may have covered it; except I did not have the mis-fueling guard installed.
At this point have 12/months or 12,000miles warranty on the repair! after that the car is junk.
 

kjclow

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 26, 2003
Location
Charlotte, NC
TDI
2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
Glad to see they covered it without the misfuel guard in place. Some on here have reported that left them high and dry.
 

jeffnpcola

Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2016
Location
Florida
TDI
2013 Passat
2013 Passat HPFP failure

Year: 2013
Build Date: ??
Make/Model:passat TDI
Tranny: DSG
Mileage: 33,262
Diesel Fuel Source: Shell
Additives: None
Problem:HPFP failed; dealer claims "bad fuel"
Dealer: Pete Moore VW/Lee VW Northwest FL
Status: Getting the shaft

Failure happened on Nov 21, fuel analysis results returned on Dec 9.... wear scar diameter of 547. Appealed to VWoA to have second fuel analysis run. Denied. Began process with Shell, dealer took their time supplying fuel analysis and sent an estimate with the labor hand written in. The dealer contacted my on Jan 15 and demanded authorization to fix the car to the tune of $5,240.61, or have my vehicle towed back home. As I had not heard anything from Shell....I had the vehicle towed home at my expense. A week(Jan 22) later I have settlement from Shell, have vehicle towed back to original dealer and gave authorization. Was told vehicle would be ready by "the first of next week". Contacted dealer on Tuesday Jan 26. and was told that they were still waiting on "a fuel line" and that the car would be finished 2-3 days after the part arrived. Frustrated, I appealed back to VWoA to allow me to have another dealer diagnose the vehicle. Reluctantly Customer Care associate told me that if I had the vehicle towed at my expense that they would authorize another diagnostic at the new dealer. Next morning had vehicle towed 50 miles to Lee VW in Ft Walton Beach. This dealer ordered the fuel sample kit, only to have VWoA deny. I was called by VWoA Region Coordinator "Eric" and told that the Customer Care Associate did not have the authority to grant a second fuel analysis and VWoA considered this issue resolved. Meanwhile, the new dealer provides a quote that is $800 higher than original dealer. When provided information from the previous quote the dealer said that they may be able to shave $150-$200 off. Both dealers have tried to pressure me to trade the vehicle in, as VW will buy it back from them if they can't sell it in 60 days. At this point, I am willing to pay the original quote, but not a single penny more. Reached back out to VWoA Rep "Eric" as it was at their direction that my vehicle ended up at the second dealer. I have yet to have a single individual representing VW live up to their word or provide anything that might be considered customer service. My thoughts are why put $6,000 into a vehicle that I probably won't own in 6 month, it seems as though VW is not concerned about a lawsuit, they already have hundreds of them.

Are there any out here who have had a 3rd party replace the fuel system? Is replacement of all the fuel lines absolutely necessary? Anything that I can do to reduce the cost of the repair would help greatly. I have talked to 2 separate attorneys, they were only interested in me joining a class action suit....
 

C3156

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2013
Location
CONUS
TDI
All sold
Are there any out here who have had a 3rd party replace the fuel system? Is replacement of all the fuel lines absolutely necessary? Anything that I can do to reduce the cost of the repair would help greatly.
To answer your question, yes you can get a third party to repair the vehicle. And no, you don't have to replace all the fuel lines, just flush them out good.

I did my own HPFP repair after baulking at the dealer cost (VWoA denied any assistance). Total out of pocket for me was about $1800 + downtime on the car. 1,000 miles and counting with no issues.
 

stennyboy

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
Location
Tennessee
TDI
06 Jetta
To answer your question, yes you can get a third party to repair the vehicle. And no, you don't have to replace all the fuel lines, just flush them out good.

I did my own HPFP repair after baulking at the dealer cost (VWoA denied any assistance). Total out of pocket for me was about $1800 + downtime on the car. 1,000 miles and counting with no issues.
^ This! We have to stop running to the dealer and letting them screw us over like this. That's a ridiculous price to have a dealer fix a car.
 

jayp111

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Undisclosed location
TDI
n/a
To answer your question, yes you can get a third party to repair the vehicle. And no, you don't have to replace all the fuel lines, just flush them out good.

I did my own HPFP repair after baulking at the dealer cost (VWoA denied any assistance). Total out of pocket for me was about $1800 + downtime on the car. 1,000 miles and counting with no issues.
Besides HPFP, lift pump what else did you replace/have rebuilt?

Injectors?
 

Paulman

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2013
Location
North Carolina
TDI
2013 Jetta TDI (buyback at 109,000miles) 2014 Jetta TDI 59,000miles
Well, it's happened to me but it was caught early, apparently.

I had the fuel filter replaced today as per the 80,000 service. The tech, a local Guru, Everything Euro in Lexington, NC, found metallic particulates in the bottom of the fuel filter unit and showed it to me.

He reassured me that they haven't reached the HPFP yet because it looked clean, in his opinion. The Guru said they'll replace the in-tank pump as warranty service

I am scheduled for an inspection on Monday afternoon at the local Dealer, Flow of Winston Salem.

I was assured by the Guru (who knows the Service Manager at my Dealer) that it will be covered by the 120,000 mile warranty extension.

Any comments? Should I be concerned? Should I not drive it anymore this weekend? Should I not drive it anymore and have it towed to the Dealer on Monday?

Paul
 

Smokin_Joe

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2011
Location
Surrey BC
TDI
2011 Golf TDI Highline returned for refund
Just my two cents

Not taking credit away from anyone that has said this before just letting you know how I feel.

I agree with those that the failure rate is not HIGH...just sudden and can be without justification. Often without any warning.
(We have had two fuel system failures, second one the result of not properly doing the first one)
And...
Costs are ridiculous due to the extensive damage that is the result of a fuel system failure.

Both should have been resolved a long time ago by VW.


PS...Good luck to all who have to suffer the pain of dealing with a failure.
 
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roostre

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2012
Location
Puget Sound, WA
TDI
2012 Golf TDI DSG
.....
fuel filter replaced today as per the 80,000 service
......
found metallic particulates in the bottom of the fuel filter
....
Guru said they'll replace the in-tank pump as warranty service
.....
scheduled for an inspection on Monday afternoon at the local Dealer
.....
assured by the Guru (who knows the Service Manager at my Dealer) that it will be covered by the 120,000 mile warranty extension.
.....
Sorry, I can not answer your specific questions, hopefully someone else can.

My belief is that you may have difficulty convincing VW to replace the in-tank fuel pump under warranty assuming you have ~80,000 miles on your TDI.

The comments below apply to the normal VW factory warranty and do not apply to any third-party warranty you may have purchased.

My understanding is that the VW warranty extension for the HPFP only applies to 2009 thru 2012 TDIs. I received a letter in the mail from VW concerning this warranty extension after the NHTSA closed the HPFP investigation. It stated the warranty on my 2012 TDI’s HPFP was extended to 120,000 miles or 10 years, whichever came first.

My understanding is that for 2013 TDIs and on, the HPFP is covered only during the factory powertrain warranty of 60,000 miles or 5 years, whichever comes first.
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
Besides HPFP, lift pump what else did you replace/have rebuilt?

Injectors?
IIRC, pump, injectors, lift pump, injector fuel lines and flush out the tank and fuel supply lines.

Any comments? Should I be concerned? Should I not drive it anymore this weekend? Should I not drive it anymore and have it towed to the Dealer on Monday?

Paul
Do you feel lucky, well do yah, punk! :D
 

C3156

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2013
Location
CONUS
TDI
All sold
Besides HPFP, lift pump what else did you replace/have rebuilt?

Injectors?
Due to size of particles, I replaced all the injectors (Found them for $125 ea on ebay). Cleaned / flushed all of the common rail lines, supply and return lines from the tank, and the tank itself. I cleaned the in tank pump but replaced the aux pump in the engine bay. Cleaned the fuel filter housing too.

Although not necessary, I replaced the common rail pressure regulating valve and the injector return line because it has a back pressure regulator that I was not sure how to clean effectively. Now is also the time to replace a TB if you need to.

All in all it was not a hard repair, just very frustrating after having read about the HPFP failures. I will tell you that there will be fine metal particles everywhere in the fuel system. Bring some patience because it takes a while to clean it all out.
 
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hughessey

New member
Joined
Jan 22, 2016
Location
Tyler, Tx
TDI
2014 TDI Passat
2014 Passat TDI HPFP Failure

HELP!

Year: 2014
Build date: ?
Make/model: Passat TDI
Mileage: 31K
Diesel Fuel Source: Exxon
Additives: None

Car died around 10 miles after filling up on 1/17/2016. Car was towed to dealership, HPFP failure. VW is claiming bad fuel. I attempted to file an insurance claim, but my insurance company claims fuel is fine. I have copies of both fuel test results.

VW test result show a flashpoint of <40 / <104 and a water content at .0941%.

My insurance company says the water content was < .05%. Still awaiting what they say the flashpoint was.

If anyone could please advise me as the best course of action to take! I am dumbfounded and extremely angry. I did nothing wrong and have a VW TDI with 30K miles and am looking at a $6500 repair bill!?!

Thank you all so much. If anyone would like to see the test result PDFs let me know. Thanks!

Sam
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
Yep, this never happens, its not a problem, only 1%. Sigh!
 

Smokin_Joe

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2011
Location
Surrey BC
TDI
2011 Golf TDI Highline returned for refund
HELP!
Year: 2014
Build date: ?
Make/model: Passat TDI
Mileage: 31K
Diesel Fuel Source: Exxon
Additives: None
Car died around 10 miles after filling up on 1/17/2016. Car was towed to dealership, HPFP failure. VW is claiming bad fuel. I attempted to file an insurance claim, but my insurance company claims fuel is fine. I have copies of both fuel test results.
VW test result show a flashpoint of <40 / <104 and a water content at .0941%.
My insurance company says the water content was < .05%. Still awaiting what they say the flashpoint was.
If anyone could please advise me as the best course of action to take! I am dumbfounded and extremely angry. I did nothing wrong and have a VW TDI with 30K miles and am looking at a $6500 repair bill!?!
Thank you all so much. If anyone would like to see the test result PDFs let me know. Thanks!
Sam
Whatever you do remain calm.
Think about your resources and your best plan of attack.
This is going to cost you money. VW has dropped the ball and you now have to deal with it.
2micron has been offering a hpfp conversion kit and since you need to repair your car it might be an option.
Make sure you take a fuel sample to an independent lab.
If your insurance says that the fuel is fine then they may be obligated to help get restitution from VWoA.
Don't panic until you do research.
Allot of people have been able to get satisfaction talking directly to the district rep for VWoA
Good luck
 
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kjclow

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 26, 2003
Location
Charlotte, NC
TDI
2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
I would also talk some more to your insurance company and find out how to get them to help you get it fixed. Not saying that they have to pay for it but maybe they can apply the right pressure to VW.
 

CFlo

New member
Joined
Feb 17, 2016
Location
Torrance, CA
TDI
2010 JSW TDI 6-spd
Year: 2010
Build Date: Dec. 2009
Make/Model: Jetta Sportwagen TDI
Tranny: 6M
Mileage: 90422
Diesel Fuel Source: Irrelevant in this case, although we have kept every fuel receipt since Day 1 in case HPFP ever failed, to prove that it was never filled with gasoline.
Additives: Stanadyne
Problem: HPFP failed while driving up CA-303 towards Big Bear on Feb. 14th 2016 (happy Valentine's day!). Loss of power, would not go faster than 10mph uphill until a turnout was reached. Engine then died and would not restart. "Engine Control Malfunction" message + glow plug lamp illuminated.
Dealer: Pacific VW, Hawthorne, CA
Status: Dealer diagnosed code P0087 (low fuel pressure), removed N280 valve to check for metal, performed fuel analysis and found no problem with fuel. Repaired / replaced fuel system under extended warranty & TSB 2041063. No cost out of pocket (except for ~1/2 tank of diesel fuel they used). Mechanic did not install upper timing belt cover correctly and spilled diesel fuel under filter when filter & housing were replaced. We are happy that VW covers the HPFP in this case but not so excited about the dealer's sloppy work and not replacing the fuel used in the process.
 
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billdrah

New member
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Location
San Diego, CA
TDI
2012 JSW DSG
Year: 2012
Build Date: Unknown
Make/Model: Sportwagen
Tranny: DSG
Mileage: 56,xxx miles
Diesel Fuel Source: various southern California fuel stations
Additives: No
Problem: Car lost power, warning light came on, wife pulled over to read manual advice on that light, car would not restart and was towed to dealer. Deal said HPFP failure, no problem, covered by extended warranty just need to have fuel analysis done and he's never seen one fail that test. 8 days later analysis came back poor lubricity VW will not cover. They advised me to call my insurance. I guess next step is to call VW customer assistance. Saying I am pissed off is the understatement of the year.
Dealer: Mossey VW Escondido, CA
Status: impass
 

kjclow

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 26, 2003
Location
Charlotte, NC
TDI
2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
Follow the previous failure routes and have them send the fuel to an outside testing lab. Get a sample yourself and get the test done. Also contact the last place you got fuel and see what they will do for you.
 

CEaton

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 21, 2014
Location
Frederick, MD.
TDI
2014 VW Sportwagen TDI DSG
Year: 2014
Build Date:
Make/Model: Jetta sportwagen
Tranny: DSG
Mileage: (actual miles at time of problem or when problem began) 30628
Diesel Fuel Source: (Shell, Exxon, etc.) various high volume, last fill up was from nearly empty at a shell right off highway.
Additives: (Yes/No) no
Problem: (HPFP failed, fuel canister rusted, etc. Give as much factual data as you can.) symptoms tell tale of hpfp failure, glow plug light on, sudden loss of power, abrupt shutdown, will not start. Friend and I pushed into parking lot from local highway, awaiting road side assistance to tow in morning.
Dealer: Russell VW Baltimore, md.
Status: pending. Suspect of fuel being that it happened under 60 miles from a full fill up. Have a feeling this will be a drawn out battle.

Update 3/1/2016: Fuel sample failed "barely" one of two tests at the dealer, they are sending a sample out to VW Corp for analysis, I'm told it will take over a week...they have no loaners and VW is pushing back on getting me a rental car, so I'm stuck. I called the fuel station...they were dumbfounded, haven't heard of any complaints, they are very high volume, Shell station right off a busy interstate, they get multiple deliveries a week, they just got one last night, so going up to get a can of it will do me no good. I have a case open with VW demanding that they get me out of this car, I've had enough I can take from it.

Update 3/22/2016: Fuel sample "failed" according to VW, I got the test results back, wear scar diameter was a 420....which should be a pass....I've sent over the bosch documents stating that this should be a pass, waiting to hear back.

Just had intercooler icing leave me stranded last month.
 
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meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
23 15 05
August 25, 2015
2041063 *Supersedes Technical Bulletin V231503 dated June 24, 2015 to update procedure text and part table numbers.*



is posted in alldatadiy.com for my 2009.
 

D.Eightch

Active member
Joined
Sep 25, 2015
Location
ND
TDI
11 Jetta Wagen TDi
Just had my 2nd pump that git replaced in December fail.

Good bye jetta, I will be getting rid of it after this fix.
 

mr_y82

Veteran Member
Joined
May 19, 2013
Location
Western NC
TDI
Used to have... '11 Golf, 6-spd, 2-door
^can't blame you, esp. with diesel-gate looming.. Best wishes and sorry about your bad luck (if you can even call it luck...).
 
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