No longer existing features

CMB430

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2008
Location
HQ of "get nothing done"
TDI
2009 Jetta TDI
I agree with some of these points. Acura is offering a TSX Wagon in 2012. I really like the body design as they did it right. The seats are great and the space is nice...almost like a Passat. But the driver's area is like a 747. There are so many buttons and switches...it requires 40hrs of training before safe driving is possible. The price point is much higher than a similar gas powered Sportwagen. The point is that each company does what they think will sell. VW pushes out many more diesels than BMW or MB because they do not put a $6,000 or higher price tag on their diesel engines. They also do not fill it with useless stuff that for almost 100 years men have not needed to take trips. Options are nice, but it is also more stuff to break. The most bullet-proof vehicle I ever had was a 1999 Silverado 1500. It was a 4x4 with manual EVERYTHING. The only option was AC. Nothing broke and I beat that truck (younger years).

I too find the interior of the 2011 sedans cheaper than my 2009. That is why I am strongly considering buying a 2011 Sportwagen before it is further decontented. The newer cars will probably be just as nice. But the old adage goes, "you can't miss what you never had". Since we have had the nicer cars, we look at the new as crap. But to those who drove a Civic or a Rav4 or a Prius or Focus, it is a step up. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

For the record, my trunk hinges have never given me any issues. And I would not mind a manual recline so that I can do it at my pace and not move at the speed of a hospital bed...though precise positioning is a real plus on long hauls.

As for the gauges...Subaru has used red and blue lights for many years. Their cars are not overheating all the time. On the 2011, VW could have placed the outside temp display on the MDF or the rear-view mirror like many other cars have...but they opted not to. Is that the deal breaker for most people...no.

And for seating...it would be really nice if VW offered the Sportwagen TDI in cloth. IIRC the Golf is offered in cloth. But with a reduction of over 40% hauling capacity inside, it is not a worthy trade for one looking at space due to hobbies or kids or dogs.

And I now digress. :)
 
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Morescratch

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Location
Vancouver
TDI
2010 Golf Wagon TDI Highline
The new Jetta is an abomination. My only hope is that it fails miserably and VW learns the lesson that following is for lame, ignorant and clueless sheep. The new Jetta is the reason why I own the last VW I will ever (and that is a long time) buy. I had to go to the dealer to believe what I read on other forums and was blown away by how pathetic the product has gotten. Even the salesperson looked at me and sighed. Sad indeed. On the upside, I have two friends (one Honda die-hard and one Toyota die-hard) that can't wait to buy one. Not to be overly critical but doesn't that say everything? Sigh.
 

Pyke

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2010
Location
Texas
TDI
2011 Jetta TDI--- DSG
The new Jetta is an abomination. My only hope is that it fails miserably and VW learns the lesson that following is for lame, ignorant and clueless sheep. The new Jetta is the reason why I own the last VW I will ever (and that is a long time) buy. I had to go to the dealer to believe what I read on other forums and was blown away by how pathetic the product has gotten. Even the salesperson looked at me and sighed. Sad indeed. On the upside, I have two friends (one Honda die-hard and one Toyota die-hard) that can't wait to buy one. Not to be overly critical but doesn't that say everything? Sigh.
Honestly, what real DIFFERENCES are there except for the hard plastic vs whatever they had before? I think the car is a wonderful price for the money.


 

mo_focus

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2002
Location
stouffville, Ontario, canada
TDI
84 944
The new Jetta is an abomination. My only hope is that it fails miserably and VW learns the lesson that following is for lame, ignorant and clueless sheep. The new Jetta is the reason why I own the last VW I will ever (and that is a long time) buy. I had to go to the dealer to believe what I read on other forums and was blown away by how pathetic the product has gotten. Even the salesperson looked at me and sighed. Sad indeed. On the upside, I have two friends (one Honda die-hard and one Toyota die-hard) that can't wait to buy one. Not to be overly critical but doesn't that say everything? Sigh.
Except the couple of plastic parts and gauges the cars are the same. Take it for a spin and see what you are missing. Someone on this site said it best, VW used to be people's car and everyone had one in their homes. They lost that once they started going high tech and high price with their models. They are just going back to their roots and frankly most ppl on this site and other sites love the new car. There will always be a few that complain, but then again they will complain about anything and everything.

The new Jetta is priced lot lower than the previous model and this will allow lot of people to buy them. They might lose 1% hardcore fanatics but they will gain lot more new customers that have gone after civics and corolla’s. I have recommended this new car to few family members since it came out and one of my cousin’s just recently purchased a Jetta 2.0+ last week and he likes it. As for myself I was looking for a new car and had to be diesel. Wife purchased the Golf in 2010 and it’s a great car, but has two issues, small trunk and small back seat. So I decided to get the Jetta highline TDI. 2010 Model was 31500$, I picked a 2011 for 27000$ so do I care if it has hard plastic on the dash no? Do I care if the rear suspension is not IRS, no! I do mostly highway driving and the ride doesn’t feel any different than my 2006. Actually the car feels better with the 17’s. Right now I have the 16 snows on.

So don’t hold your breath if you think the new VW path is going to fail. You want an upscale car then get an Audi if you want to keep it in the family! You want something affordable and practical then get a VW. This is the way Toyota/Lexus and Nissan/Infiniti have been doing it for year.
 

jeepinjason

Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2011
Location
St. Louis, MO
TDI
2011 Jetta TDI
Why would someone that enjoyed their vehicle wish for a company to fail because that company is trying to increase sales and production?

I am obviously into Jeeps, people wished the same thing for Jeep when they started making cars and advertising on MTV. However, the increased sales of non-traditional styles created more production and income for the brand and in turn they started to make new models that they would not have been able to make without the extra money. They came out with a 4 door Wrangler and just announced that they would make a pickup which is something brand loyalists have been asking for forever!

I can only imagine that if VW finds North America a better market than it has been in the past they will eventually follow suit and build additional models and even special models like the CUP edition for current vehicles.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
These are great cars, they had a LOT of attention at NAIAS, as well as the new Passats. Volkswagen is going to sell a lot of them. When you can buy a 2.0L/5sp Jetta for only a couple grand more than a dolled-up Kia Rio sedan, that means good sales. And THAT is what they are after.

People who are whining really should go drive one... then look at the price tag. I am really astonished how good of a value they are. And yes, they have a solid beam rear axle (not even a twist-beam). So did the last generation Maxima and its gussied-up stablemate Infiniti I30, and those models not only sold well but nobody complained about the suspension.
 

dashbarron

Veteran Member
Joined
May 25, 2010
Location
Michigan
TDI
Jetta 2010
Oilhammer or the like, can you go in detail what you were talking about with the old temperature gauges and on...what model car, exactly? The Golfs?
 

Morescratch

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Location
Vancouver
TDI
2010 Golf Wagon TDI Highline
Except the couple of plastic parts and gauges the cars are the same. Take it for a spin and see what you are missing. Someone on this site said it best, VW used to be people's car and everyone had one in their homes. They lost that once they started going high tech and high price with their models. They are just going back to their roots and frankly most ppl on this site and other sites love the new car. There will always be a few that complain, but then again they will complain about anything and everything.

The new Jetta is priced lot lower than the previous model and this will allow lot of people to buy them. They might lose 1% hardcore fanatics but they will gain lot more new customers that have gone after civics and corolla’s. I have recommended this new car to few family members since it came out and one of my cousin’s just recently purchased a Jetta 2.0+ last week and he likes it. As for myself I was looking for a new car and had to be diesel. Wife purchased the Golf in 2010 and it’s a great car, but has two issues, small trunk and small back seat. So I decided to get the Jetta highline TDI. 2010 Model was 31500$, I picked a 2011 for 27000$ so do I care if it has hard plastic on the dash no? Do I care if the rear suspension is not IRS, no! I do mostly highway driving and the ride doesn’t feel any different than my 2006. Actually the car feels better with the 17’s. Right now I have the 16 snows on.

So don’t hold your breath if you think the new VW path is going to fail. You want an upscale car then get an Audi if you want to keep it in the family! You want something affordable and practical then get a VW. This is the way Toyota/Lexus and Nissan/Infiniti have been doing it for year.
Incorrect. More than just different suspension, electronics, interior, engines, trunk hinges, seat recliners, fabrics, sheet metal, I can go on and on... You may want to read this: http://www.insideline.com/volkswagen/jetta/european-jetta-to-the-us-in-2014.html

Even the industry insiders think it's a joke.
 

Morescratch

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Location
Vancouver
TDI
2010 Golf Wagon TDI Highline
These are great cars, they had a LOT of attention at NAIAS, as well as the new Passats. Volkswagen is going to sell a lot of them. When you can buy a 2.0L/5sp Jetta for only a couple grand more than a dolled-up Kia Rio sedan, that means good sales. And THAT is what they are after.

People who are whining really should go drive one... then look at the price tag. I am really astonished how good of a value they are. And yes, they have a solid beam rear axle (not even a twist-beam). So did the last generation Maxima and its gussied-up stablemate Infiniti I30, and those models not only sold well but nobody complained about the suspension.
Everyone his different. I look at the back and underside of everything I buy. If there is reasonable evidence of pride and quality I buy it. Consequently, I don't buy Toyota's because there is no substance to them once you peek under the covers. So is the case with new Jetta.
 

snakeye

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2009
Location
Montreal, Canada
TDI
2003 Jetta and Wagon, GLS 5sp
Except the couple of plastic parts and gauges the cars are the same. Take it for a spin and see what you are missing. Someone on this site said it best, VW used to be people's car and everyone had one in their homes. They lost that once they started going high tech and high price with their models. They are just going back to their roots and frankly most ppl on this site and other sites love the new car. There will always be a few that complain, but then again they will complain about anything and everything.

The new Jetta is priced lot lower than the previous model and this will allow lot of people to buy them. They might lose 1% hardcore fanatics but they will gain lot more new customers that have gone after civics and corolla’s. I have recommended this new car to few family members since it came out and one of my cousin’s just recently purchased a Jetta 2.0+ last week and he likes it. As for myself I was looking for a new car and had to be diesel. Wife purchased the Golf in 2010 and it’s a great car, but has two issues, small trunk and small back seat. So I decided to get the Jetta highline TDI. 2010 Model was 31500$, I picked a 2011 for 27000$ so do I care if it has hard plastic on the dash no? Do I care if the rear suspension is not IRS, no! I do mostly highway driving and the ride doesn’t feel any different than my 2006. Actually the car feels better with the 17’s. Right now I have the 16 snows on.

So don’t hold your breath if you think the new VW path is going to fail. You want an upscale car then get an Audi if you want to keep it in the family! You want something affordable and practical then get a VW. This is the way Toyota/Lexus and Nissan/Infiniti have been doing it for year.

Thing is people weren't buying VWs because of:

1) poor reliability
2) poor dealer service

And when you have a car that's #1, you see a lot of #2.

If VW would have taken care of those two things, they would have built themselves a great reputation and their badge would have been a symbol of something completely different. Imagine an MK4 Jetta and all the things that make it so great, with the reliability of a Honda and a great dealer network.
 

~Jb

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2011
Location
immaturCity
TDI
the blinding one
couldent agree more Mo. Will the diehard VW enthusiast hate the fact that the Jetta is not a poor mans Audi A4 anymore, probably. Again like Mo said diehard VW enthusiast make up less then 1% of sales, heck I will give you 10%.

I myself love my JTDI6, the price I paid for the quality and fit/finish I got was worth every penny, and I paid LESS then 25k USD for my JTDI6. That is, in case you are wondering, over 10k LESS then the A3 TDI!

Its not all bad for you though Morescratch, the good news is in a couple years you can pay $10k+ more then I did to get the same motor, but all the "different suspension, electronics, interior, engines, trunk hinges, seat recliners, fabrics, sheet metal, I can go on and on..." you just couldn't live without!


~jb :cool:
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Everyone his different. I look at the back and underside of everything I buy. If there is reasonable evidence of pride and quality I buy it. Consequently, I don't buy Toyota's because there is no substance to them once you peek under the covers. So is the case with new Jetta.

Exactly. And that makes you and I a minority in this market, precisely why Volkswagen is changing things up. How does one outsell a Camry? Build a better Camry.
 

Morescratch

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Location
Vancouver
TDI
2010 Golf Wagon TDI Highline
From my point of view I believe that VW used to stand for something; I can't put my finger on it exactly but I know that that "something" no longer exists. This is how brands die.
 

Morescratch

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Location
Vancouver
TDI
2010 Golf Wagon TDI Highline
couldent agree more Mo. Will the diehard VW enthusiast hate the fact that the Jetta is not a poor mans Audi A4 anymore, probably. Again like Mo said diehard VW enthusiast make up less then 1% of sales, heck I will give you 10%.
I myself love my JTDI6, the price I paid for the quality and fit/finish I got was worth every penny, and I paid LESS then 25k USD for my JTDI6. That is, in case you are wondering, over 10k LESS then the A3 TDI!
Its not all bad for you though Morescratch, the good news is in a couple years you can pay $10k+ more then I did to get the same motor, but all the "different suspension, electronics, interior, engines, trunk hinges, seat recliners, fabrics, sheet metal, I can go on and on..." you just couldn't live without!
~jb :cool:
And I would happily pay it for a quality engineered product that was designed for drivers and not passengers.
 

snakeye

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2009
Location
Montreal, Canada
TDI
2003 Jetta and Wagon, GLS 5sp
From my point of view I believe that VW used to stand for something; I can't put my finger on it exactly but I know that that "something" no longer exists. This is how brands die.
That something no longer exists in your Wagon?

For the Jetta that something used to be German engineering at an affordable price. Now it's just a Camry competitor at an affordable price. The Golf family is still pretty decent, though.
 

compu_85

Gadget Guy
Joined
Sep 29, 2003
Location
La Conner, WA
TDI
... None :S
Guys, I just realized something. A base 1985 Jetta stickered at $7995. VW sold a lot of those cars. Guess how much that is in 2009 dollars? $15,700. That car didn't have power steering, aircon... and it might not have even had a radio!

It may not be as technically advanced (not even having a twist beam in the rear is a sore point for me) but it is priced right, and it's not a bad car.

-J
 
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oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
The '85 Jetta was a HUGELY popular car here, in fact it almost overnight made the Jetta the top seller here for Volkswagen. In fact, it remained a good car all the way until the end in 1992 here, but the other VW models were so horrible that it drug the whole brand down. The B3 Passat and Corrado were really, really bad. :(
 

verylongdrive

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2005
Location
HSV
TDI
Golf,2001
I think anyone knocking the new Jetta sedan should take one for a spin, they are really a nice car.

LOL, I forgot about the 'rando-sieze' trunk hinges on the older Jettas and Passats, probably why they totally changed them.

Eh? I thought these were so high-tech, sophisticated, and thus expensive that they had to go to save cost? Seizing?

I've never owned a car of such sophistication, and was rather looking to get away from the into-the-trunk hinges. Is there enough room in the valleys outside of the trunk seal to perhaps retrofit them from another car? (I was searching for pictures of that kind of mechanism and found that several whoop-de-do cars do not have them, the current Malibu and even the previous-gen Mustang do!)
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Yes, siezing and binding.

TSB Group 55, number 05-02, covers A4 platform Jetta sedans 1999 to 2005 and B5 platform Passat sedans 1998 to 2005. Part change to improve the condition (original part number suffix is 'A', new part is 'B'). Need to be painted to match.
 

ShawnG

Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Location
Lebanon, PA
TDI
2011 Jetta TDI
Interesting gripes and opinions.

2011 is my first VW. I traded a 2009 Infiniti G37x for the Jetta TDI.

Now, I know a 2009 Infiniti G37x is no previous generation Jetta (Sarcasm) but I actually enjoy my drive more in the TDI. The seats are more comfortable and the seat warmers cook up my bum in shorter time than the G did.

The one thing I miss is the 328 Horsies paired with a 7 speed auto, but when going from a $42,800 car to a $23,000 car, we will have this.

I'm reminded of years ago (when I was much younger) when friends of mine would gripe and complain when their favorite "underground" band was played on the radio. "OMG They're Selling Out!!!"

All in all--we can pick one that VW lost as a customer, and replace with me--a New customer.

I can fully understand frustration, but in no way shape or form can someone logically be angry for their favorite auto company growing and making money/expanding into new markets. Just get a 2010 and wait for the next "good one". Right? :)
 

snakeye

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2009
Location
Montreal, Canada
TDI
2003 Jetta and Wagon, GLS 5sp
Interesting gripes and opinions.

2011 is my first VW. I traded a 2009 Infiniti G37x for the Jetta TDI.

Now, I know a 2009 Infiniti G37x is no previous generation Jetta (Sarcasm) but I actually enjoy my drive more in the TDI. The seats are more comfortable and the seat warmers cook up my bum in shorter time than the G did.

The one thing I miss is the 328 Horsies paired with a 7 speed auto, but when going from a $42,800 car to a $23,000 car, we will have this.

I'm reminded of years ago (when I was much younger) when friends of mine would gripe and complain when their favorite "underground" band was played on the radio. "OMG They're Selling Out!!!"

All in all--we can pick one that VW lost as a customer, and replace with me--a New customer.

I can fully understand frustration, but in no way shape or form can someone logically be angry for their favorite auto company growing and making money/expanding into new markets. Just get a 2010 and wait for the next "good one". Right? :)
Ok well then enjoy riding in your 2011 Jetta listening to American Idiot.

Just kidding... just felt like saying that lol :p

That's a good analogy, but it didn't have to be this way. VW could have cleaned up their dealers' reputation and the car's reliability issues instead of dumbing down the car, which is now less German. You can't go around popping your hood showing off the great German engineering that went into the car while holding the hood up with a prop rod, and at the same time finding out that your washer reservoir is empty. :D
 

ShawnG

Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Location
Lebanon, PA
TDI
2011 Jetta TDI
Ok well then enjoy riding in your 2011 Jetta listening to American Idiot.

Just kidding... just felt like saying that lol :p

That's a good analogy, but it didn't have to be this way. VW could have cleaned up their dealers' reputation and the car's reliability issues instead of dumbing down the car, which is now less German. You can't go around popping your hood showing off the great German engineering that went into the car while holding the hood up with a prop rod, and at the same time finding out that your washer reservoir is empty. :D
Woah Woah, hold on here. A little less Green Day and a little more Celine Dion, wouldn't you agree? ;):p

I heard that reliability issues were mostly with the gas vehicles, not the diesel? (by no means an expert here) Makes a bad name for the TDI. It is completely dependent on the owner--as is every complaint--and their reason for ownership.

Me: I now own a VW because it's the most affordable Diesel I could have in the US, I want great mileage, and I liked the feel when I was in the driver's seat.

Others: They want to have (as you mentioned) German engineering, that "something different" factor that's unavailable on Japanese/Korean cars, and to do as you said and pop the hood to admire/show off/tinker with.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
I dunno, the "something different" factor rings loud and clear on cars like the Cube, the Juke (barf!), the xB, the xA, the xD, the Soul, many Subarus, and probably something else I cannot think of.

And the "something ugly" pretty much describes everything at the Nissan dealership now, and everything at Infiniti save for maybe the G coupe and some of the rear-drive sedans. Does anyone think the Infiniti EX or FX is attractive? :eek:

Maybe the French influence is just too great on the modern Nissans, I dunno. But I think a 1990 Stanza is better on the eyes than a 2011 Maxima.
 
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leicaman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Location
Sheboygan, Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2005 TDI GLS, RIP
Yeah I was at the VW dealer this am buying some stanadyne and Brian I see what you mean. The dealer is a nissan/vw dual franchise. Some of those new nissans are certainly strange looking beasts. Makes it easy for them to sell VWs as they look so sleek as compared to the nissans. Although what sells some of the Nissans is the price. Versa for example.
 
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