NHSTA ends investigation...

South Coast Guy

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Location
Mattapoisett, MA
TDI
2009 Jetta TDI wagon
This. My 2010 has 149,000 on it...I laughed when I got the letter. VW has to know that people who buy these cars generally rack up a lot of miles, so it seems pretty lame to me that they only went to 120,000 miles on the extension.
New-car warranty is for 3 years and 36K miles. This extended warranty is for 120K miles and 10 years. Posters here complained that VW never put any warranty in writing while offering "good will" repairs for free. Now VW offers a written warranty and posters complain it isn't long enough!
 

YukonLT

Veteran Member - TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Location
N/A
TDI
2010 Golf TDI 6MT
New-car warranty is for 3 years and 36K miles. This extended warranty is for 120K miles and 10 years. Posters here complained that VW never put any warranty in writing while offering "good will" repairs for free. Now VW offers a written warranty and posters complain it isn't long enough!
I'm not complaining, I could care less about the warranty. I'm just stating the fact that with the number they picked, they had to have known that a good majority of TDI owners would be over the mileage. Slick move on their part so they won't have to fix many issues that might arise.
 

starjays

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Location
Nebraska
TDI
2000 NB 5MT
anybody think they'll "officially" engineer something like the 2micron downstream filter kit I've read so much about on here? I don't know much about it but it seems like the way to go for the cars with the original hpfp that are out of the extended warranty mileage
 

Lightflyer1

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 13, 2005
Location
Round Rock, Texas
TDI
2015 Beetle tdi dsg
2microns kit is an excellent idea in my opinion for those who worry about this happening to them. I am trying to get him to make one for the Passat as well, just in case. The only complaints I see SCG are those that have already passed the mileage mark after 5 or so years have already passed on this issue. Not VW's fault for that (NHTSA) but they are giving an extended warranty that really has no meaning for the high mileage driver, that normally buys these cars. I would have liked to see them come out with a 250k mile, 10 year, prorated, to the original owner instead. Some people would have burned through that warranty in 2 or 3 years.
 

ezshift5

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2003
Location
West Coast
TDI
2013 JSW TDI (Enroute BB).......2017 Jetta 1.4 turbo 5M ....................
I would have liked to see them come out with a 250k mile, 10 year, prorated, to the original owner instead. Some people would have burned through that warranty in 2 or 3 years.

No offense LF.........

(but people in Hell want ice water)

My 2013 was not addressed (but then again...............................)

ez
 

GoFaster

Moderator at Large
Joined
Jun 16, 1999
Location
Brampton, Ontario, Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI
anybody think they'll "officially" engineer something like the 2micron downstream filter kit I've read so much about on here? I don't know much about it but it seems like the way to go for the cars with the original hpfp that are out of the extended warranty mileage
There is NO chance of anything of that sort being built in at the OEM level at this point. The engines and fuel systems involved are now obsolete (2015 = new EA288 engine). I know it's short-term thinking (because it doesn't account for ticked-off customers who leave and never come back) but VW would rather you buy a new car than keep your old one going past the bare minimum that they can get away with.

'Course, we all know that the 2015 redesign STILL uses that infernal Bosch CP4 injector pump. Which means, from my own point of view, it needs to prove itself for at least a couple of years before I will buy one.

I have gone away from TDI (in fact, away from VW) and I am quite content to be free of worries about HPFP, DEF/SCR, EGR, turbo, timing belts, and the like. Plain ordinary non-turbo port injected gasoline engines with chain driven DOHC and no EGR. That technology is well-proven.
 

El Dobro

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
NJ
TDI
2017 Bolt EV, 2015 Spark EV
I have gone away from TDI (in fact, away from VW) and I am quite content to be free of worries about HPFP, DEF/SCR, EGR, turbo, timing belts, and the like. Plain ordinary non-turbo port injected gasoline engines with chain driven DOHC and no EGR. That technology is well-proven.
Ditto. :D
 

YukonLT

Veteran Member - TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Location
N/A
TDI
2010 Golf TDI 6MT
I have gone away from TDI (in fact, away from VW) and I am quite content to be free of worries about HPFP, DEF/SCR, EGR, turbo, timing belts, and the like. Plain ordinary non-turbo port injected gasoline engines with chain driven DOHC and no EGR. That technology is well-proven.
Too bad, I wonder what boring car you get to drive now :(
 

geoman

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Location
woodstock ontario canada
TDI
2009 tdi jetta wagon
as a jsw guy, I don't find this to really be an issue lol! go faster, I may have missed it, but what was the straw that broke the camel's back for you? I don't think you could have suffered an hpfp problem. I am personally frustrated by vw's disinterest in bringing the gsw alltrack in tdi form & even if they did, it wouldn't totally ease my hpfp anxiety since it would have the same offending component. I have learned to live with this fear to the point that I'm more concerned about other peoples driving skills & parking lot mishaps far more than personally replicating eldobro's unfortunate experience probably because I've travelled so many kms without incident.
 

geoman

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Location
woodstock ontario canada
TDI
2009 tdi jetta wagon
The fuel pump isn't faulty. Our diesel sucks.

Shall I post the bosch powerpoint on wear scar and resulting internal damage to a pump?
^^^this^^^ particularly in the states I'm afraid southern neighbours:eek:
it is miraculous that there are not more hpfp issues considering the quality of our diesel(us & Canadian)
 

GoFaster

Moderator at Large
Joined
Jun 16, 1999
Location
Brampton, Ontario, Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI
Too much new tech all at once started the "don't buy the first model year" call, HPFP failures and VW of Canada not paying for them continued the "don't buy" call, and EGR flapper valve seizures and intercooler freeze-ups have furthered the cause. No new-technology diesels for me, and specifically no Bosch CP4 injector pumps, until this technology gets proven out.

Besides which, the current-generation VW lineup doesn't do anything for me. The Jetta was cheapened and looks ho-hum (I realize that they have partially reversed course on this and improved some things), the Passat looks like a last-generation Impala (If I wanted a car that looked like an older Impala, I'd buy an older Impala), and I had a Beetle (gas engine) as a rental car and found it delivered poor mileage, felt huge, had little in the way of luxuries, and just did nothing whatsoever for me.

I'm on a business trip right now; the rental car is a Ford Focus, and I rather like it.
 

geoman

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2010
Location
woodstock ontario canada
TDI
2009 tdi jetta wagon
focus st 's are pretty hot. I even like the fiesta but it is tiny. I'd have 1st model year jitters too. def gelling cold start issues are what I'd anticipate w/mk7 tdi's in addition to ongoing hpfp concerns but for someone piling on hwy miles tdi's are still tough to top provided you can get started @ -20c or worse! def is rated @ -12c I've been told.
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
There is NO chance of anything of that sort being built in at the OEM level at this point. The engines and fuel systems involved are now obsolete (2015 = new EA288 engine). I know it's short-term thinking (because it doesn't account for ticked-off customers who leave and never come back) but VW would rather you buy a new car than keep your old one going past the bare minimum that they can get away with.

'Course, we all know that the 2015 redesign STILL uses that infernal Bosch CP4 injector pump. Which means, from my own point of view, it needs to prove itself for at least a couple of years before I will buy one.

I have gone away from TDI (in fact, away from VW) and I am quite content to be free of worries about HPFP, DEF/SCR, EGR, turbo, timing belts, and the like. Plain ordinary non-turbo port injected gasoline engines with chain driven DOHC and no EGR. That technology is well-proven.

Amen. :D

I now have a pre-emission, sort of ALH for a commuter, have my no emission diesel van for trips and hauling crap and have my soon to be 500+ whp Caravan for fun, with no emissions, just boost and fuel, :eek: :cool:
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
anybody think they'll "officially" engineer something like the 2micron downstream filter kit I've read so much about on here? I don't know much about it but it seems like the way to go for the cars with the original hpfp that are out of the extended warranty mileage
No, they will not. They will not spend R@D money to fix something they consider isn't broken plus they redesigned it for 2015.
 

Borsig

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 22, 2009
Location
va
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2015 GSW SEL (buyback), 2011 JSW (sold)
I'm sure they have forums for them too...just saying.
This.

I am personally sick of the very, very vocal minority that continues to come here, and squawk, and bash VW. If you don't like it, or have anything positive to contribute, move on. Either discuss facts and solutions, real data, or failure and prevention analysis.

If you don't own a VW, and don't like their cars, why are you here?

Also - how long is long enough? 120K obviously isnt. is 150K? I've seen people mention wanting warranties to 250K. Really? A mechanical part, you want warrantied to 250,000 miles?

While I understand the concern for a high repair bill / vehicle life ending expense, the fact is, no manufacturer, not VW, MB, Chevy ford, toyota or anyone, will warranty a mechanical part like a fuel pump to 250K miles. While I feel 150K would have been a more reasonable number, at what point do we say it's enough, or isn't?

The problem isnt the pump taking a crap at 150K miles, its the damage it does to the fuel system afterwards, and the associated cost with repairing it. The failure is catastrophic from a monetary standpoint. This is a poor design, where failure wasn't taken into account. There should be / should have been some filter system (like the 2 micron) that catches the carnage before it finds its way into everything. There isn't. There won't be. No company is going to spend R&D money on such a thing for a previous generation vehicle, across 4 model years (or so).

If you don't like that, sell the car. If you don't like VW and their new models don't "excite", buy something else. If youre willing to take the 0.5-1.0% risk that this is shown to be, then drive the car.

Do your jurisprudence, add lubricity additives, and whatever else you feel you need to.

What would actually be helpful? A Mileage tracker for CR TDI's 09-14 (and beyond) with documented trouble free miles, coupled with data on what breaks , and when, at 120K and beyond. This way we could generate our own failure analysis (bathtub curve) and what to expect, and as a community, develop our own preventive maintenance suggestions.

I'll start. I drove my 2011 DSG JSW for 116K miles. I had no problems, other than a single glow plug. Traded it in on a 2015, becasue I liked and wanted it. High mileage data is important to understanding failures at 120k, and beyond.
 
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CastIronJSW

Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Location
Lake Havasu City, AZ
TDI
2010 Jetta SportWagen TDI DSG (Buyback 1/2017); 2015 Jetta SEL TDI 6M (1st Stage Fix 2/2017)
What would actually be helpful? A Mileage tracker for CR TDI's 09-14 (and beyond) with documented trouble free miles, coupled with data on what breaks , and when, at 120K and beyond. This way we could generate our own failure analysis (bathtub curve) and what to expect, and as a community, develop our own preventive maintenance suggestions.

I'll start. I drove my 2011 DSG JSW for 116K miles. I had no problems, other than a single glow plug. Traded it in on a 2015, becasue I liked and wanted it. High mileage data is important to understanding failures at 120k, and beyond.
Bravo, Borsig! I agree with your perspective.

My 2010 JSW DSG is just short of 5 years and 100,000 miles. I'd like to keep it for at least 3 - 4 more years, so I know that I'll have a timing belt job and a couple more DSG services (I wish they were less expensive!)

Problems so far: (1) the panoramic moon roof track was misaligned when I bought the car. It was replaced under warrantee and has worked well since then. (2) this summer, the air conditioner has not worked as well as normal. It has been a hot summer (> 110 degrees F most days) and I'll have my local mechanic work on it next week. (3) the front passenger side amber parking light has burned out. Nothing else has failed. The only other maintenance has been DSG services, oil changes, fuel filters, air filters, and tires. In my opinion, the performance, reliability, and maintenance experience has been great.

I have thought a lot about the potentially catastrophic nature of an HPFP failure - and I understand why some people fret about it - but the overall performance and reliability of my VW TDI has really been excellent and the relatively small percentage of failures has not made me decide to get rid of my car.
 

ezshift5

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2003
Location
West Coast
TDI
2013 JSW TDI (Enroute BB).......2017 Jetta 1.4 turbo 5M ....................
I have thought a lot about the potentially catastrophic nature of an HPFP failure - and I understand why some people fret about it - but the overall performance and reliability of my VW TDI has really been excellent and the relatively small percentage of failures has not made me decide to get rid of my car.[/QUOTE]


I agree with CastIronJSW (but would sure appreciate a little more - if possible - specific failure rate.

However, if a 'relatively small percentage' is the only information out there - I guess I'll shut up, quit worrying and have another Crown Royal............)


ez
 

LRTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2002
Location
Red Sox Nation
TDI
RIP 16 GSW... Just the LR diesel now
Agreeing with Castiron5 and ezshift5. This story has run. No manufacturer has a 100% record on any vehicle. My wife's last two cars Volvo and Honda have both historically had transmission problems. We waited for the fix, and fuss to die down. Both have been fine. In fact the Honda has 200k on it.

I think the same is happening here. The hysteria is over. The problems if there were any with the vehicle rather than owner or gas (!) station errors seemed to have gone away.

The NTSA story has closed. This thread should be closed as well.
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
This.

I am personally sick of the very, very vocal minority that continues to come here, and squawk, and bash VW. If you don't like it, or have anything positive to contribute, move on. Either discuss facts and solutions, real data, or failure and prevention analysis.

If you don't own a VW, and don't like their cars, why are you here?

Also - how long is long enough? 120K obviously isnt. is 150K? I've seen people mention wanting warranties to 250K. Really? A mechanical part, you want warrantied to 250,000 miles?

While I understand the concern for a high repair bill / vehicle life ending expense, the fact is, no manufacturer, not VW, MB, Chevy ford, toyota or anyone, will warranty a mechanical part like a fuel pump to 250K miles. While I feel 150K would have been a more reasonable number, at what point do we say it's enough, or isn't?

The problem isnt the pump taking a crap at 150K miles, its the damage it does to the fuel system afterwards, and the associated cost with repairing it. The failure is catastrophic from a monetary standpoint. This is a poor design, where failure wasn't taken into account. There should be / should have been some filter system (like the 2 micron) that catches the carnage before it finds its way into everything. There isn't. There won't be. No company is going to spend R&D money on such a thing for a previous generation vehicle, across 4 model years (or so).

If you don't like that, sell the car. If you don't like VW and their new models don't "excite", buy something else. If youre willing to take the 0.5-1.0% risk that this is shown to be, then drive the car.

Do your jurisprudence, add lubricity additives, and whatever else you feel you need to.

What would actually be helpful? A Mileage tracker for CR TDI's 09-14 (and beyond) with documented trouble free miles, coupled with data on what breaks , and when, at 120K and beyond. This way we could generate our own failure analysis (bathtub curve) and what to expect, and as a community, develop our own preventive maintenance suggestions.

I'll start. I drove my 2011 DSG JSW for 116K miles. I had no problems, other than a single glow plug. Traded it in on a 2015, becasue I liked and wanted it. High mileage data is important to understanding failures at 120k, and beyond.
They will get bashed because they made a piece of sh8t fuel system and got caught with their pants down. GM did the same thing back in the day and actually covered the 6.5 injection pump- "
This special policy covers the condition described above for a period of eleven (11) years or 120,000 miles (193,000 km)". I am glad you are happy but come back when it fails and how much you paid to have it fixed.

It woudldn't be so bad IF the failure didn't take out the whole bloody fuel system, simply brilliant on their part. When it fails, if it was a $1500 repair bill, it wouldn't be such a hard pill to swallow but its catastrophic failure. I'll still with my old tech, its reliable and cheap to fix.
 

turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
This.

I am personally sick of the very, very vocal minority that continues to come here, and squawk, and bash VW. If you don't like it, or have anything positive to contribute, move on. Either discuss facts and solutions, real data, or failure and prevention analysis.

If you don't own a VW, and don't like their cars, why are you here?

Also - how long is long enough? 120K obviously isnt. is 150K? I've seen people mention wanting warranties to 250K. Really? A mechanical part, you want warrantied to 250,000 miles?

While I understand the concern for a high repair bill / vehicle life ending expense, the fact is, no manufacturer, not VW, MB, Chevy ford, toyota or anyone, will warranty a mechanical part like a fuel pump to 250K miles. While I feel 150K would have been a more reasonable number, at what point do we say it's enough, or isn't?

The problem isnt the pump taking a crap at 150K miles, its the damage it does to the fuel system afterwards, and the associated cost with repairing it. The failure is catastrophic from a monetary standpoint. This is a poor design, where failure wasn't taken into account. There should be / should have been some filter system (like the 2 micron) that catches the carnage before it finds its way into everything. There isn't. There won't be. No company is going to spend R&D money on such a thing for a previous generation vehicle, across 4 model years (or so).

If you don't like that, sell the car. If you don't like VW and their new models don't "excite", buy something else. If youre willing to take the 0.5-1.0% risk that this is shown to be, then drive the car.

Do your jurisprudence, add lubricity additives, and whatever else you feel you need to.

What would actually be helpful? A Mileage tracker for CR TDI's 09-14 (and beyond) with documented trouble free miles, coupled with data on what breaks , and when, at 120K and beyond. This way we could generate our own failure analysis (bathtub curve) and what to expect, and as a community, develop our own preventive maintenance suggestions.

I'll start. I drove my 2011 DSG JSW for 116K miles. I had no problems, other than a single glow plug. Traded it in on a 2015, becasue I liked and wanted it. High mileage data is important to understanding failures at 120k, and beyond.
They will get bashed because they made a piece of sh8t fuel system and got caught with their pants down. GM did the same thing back in the day and actually covered the 6.5 injection pump- "
This special policy covers the condition described above for a period of eleven (11) years or 120,000 miles (193,000 km).
I am glad you are happy but come back when it fails and how much you paid to have it fixed.

It wouldn't be so bad IF the failure didn't take out the whole bloody fuel system, simply brilliant on their part. When it fails, if it was a $1500 repair bill, it wouldn't be such a hard pill to swallow but its catastrophic failure and a huge repair bill, sometimes more than the car is worth. I'll still with my old tech, its reliable and cheap to fix.
 

Smokin_Joe

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2011
Location
Surrey BC
TDI
2011 Golf TDI Highline returned for refund
Love or Hate VW

Just between you and me ...
I thought I would share somethin
When I decide to overpay for a fancy econo box, one that runs on diesel, with a fancy transmission and leather interior based on a few cute little touches that make it stand out....things other people might define as quality....
I get upset to find out that this little (over priced) investment is unreliable and susceptible to failures that will make its ownership worthless....
That is right...worthless...
I get upset...
It is an overpriced econo box that isn't stepping up to the plate.
It becomes a failure to provide the basic necessities....and
I have a perfect right to get upset.
When I buy something I expect it to last longer than its warranty....
econo or otherwise.
Either it is up to standard or it is substandard.
Period....
 
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turbovan+tdi

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
Location
Abbotsford, BC.
TDI
2003 TDI 2.0L ALH, auto, silver wagon, lowered, Colt stage 2 cam, ported head,205 injectors, 1756 turbo, Malone 2.0, 3" exhaust, 18" BBS RC GLI rims. 2004 blue GSW TDI, 5 speed, lowered, GLI BBS wheels painted black, Malone stage 2, Aerotur
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