newbie with a w8 cluster question

Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
So, first off, new to the forum, and im glad to be here, read some great info so far.....


now my questions are very basic questions, but with prob very complex answers, so any help you could give me, would be amazing....

So I have a 00 vrt i built from almost shell up... but i decided I wanted to add an FIS cluster into the car, so i ended up with one from a w8, and I have the jetta maf stalks already, also have the
2 x 000 979 008 -- instrument cluster repair wires
2 x 000 979 133 -- wiper stalk repair wires
1 x 000 979 131 -- temperature sensor connector repair wires
1J0 919 379 A -- outside temperature sensor
1J0 973 702 -- temperature sensor connector
1J0 971 845 E -- clip for outside temperature sensor
two ring terminals (for ground connections)
about 15 feet of electrical wire (no thinner than 0.5mm cross section)

now what i basically need to know is what i need to do to make this cluster work, and work right in my car....

I know the basics where i need to program it and have the skc's and such, but im talking about the parts past there, getting all the wonderful things to work, like mpg, distance to empty, doors open display etc...


any and all help would be greatly appreciated.

Also I did read the tons of diff things on vortex and here, and have seen 15 versions of the same answer, so I figured 1 post, 1 set of legit helpful answers, and a completed project that I can endlessly thank you all for.

Cheers!
 

silverbox

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2005
Location
Halifax Nova Scotia
TDI
jetta wagon 2003 silver
Hello kneedragin,
I don't remember seeing any threads on the W8 cluster but there is a long thread on the MF cluster.
There are some very knowledgable and helpful members here. I'm sure if anyone has done this conversion and sees your post that they will help.
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
Thanks for a normal answer thats not bashing that im putting it in my vrt....

im hoping that someone will have an answer... i saw the post on http://www.gti-tdi.de/board2/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=2305&pageNo=2&49d08819

and saw that a member on there is on here as well.... so i hope he will chime in, as most of that site is in german or another language.

Also its nice to be able to say have a straight forward diy for this, if it turns out i can get mine working, then ill post that up, so everyone can use this info for them selves
 

Steve99

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2009
Location
Langley, BC
TDI
04 Golf TDI, 04 R32
I have done several cluster swaps but haven't used a W8 one myself.

The info you need is posted here in various threads, but it will likely take some digging. As you mentioned a MKIV is a MKIV, TDI or not.

What year is your car and what is the part # of the cluster you're planning to install?
 
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Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
ya seem my ny doesnt seem to grasp that concept....

and the car is a 00 and the part # off the cluster is... well all the info off the lable is

vwz7z0A4604980 01.10
100101 11:18:36 V09 06.90

thats all thats on the lable... i dunno if it helps at all, i know its an immo3 cluster and i have an immo2 car, so i know that part of it will work... but the rest thats past getting my skc and such is where im at. I noticed how you need to add/remove some resistors to make the temp work
 

Steve99

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2009
Location
Langley, BC
TDI
04 Golf TDI, 04 R32
You can use an immo3 cluster with an immo2 car but it will take some hacking to make it work from my experience, you will need a tool to read/write the eeprom in both clusters. VagTacho2.5 will do the job for you.

The outside temp is as simple as running two wires from the cluster to the temp sensor which should be mounted on the front of the car, usually behind the lower left grill.

I haven't had to deal with adding/changing the stalks but the info is posted here, as are the details for the outside temp sense.


ya seem my ny doesnt seem to grasp that concept....

and the car is a 00 and the part # off the cluster is... well all the info off the lable is

vwz7z0A4604980 01.10
100101 11:18:36 V09 06.90

thats all thats on the lable... i dunno if it helps at all, i know its an immo3 cluster and i have an immo2 car, so i know that part of it will work... but the rest thats past getting my skc and such is where im at. I noticed how you need to add/remove some resistors to make the temp work
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
ya the tacho software my buddy has, so thats no prob to get the cluster/immo defeat done, and program my keys... on that other site in germany, it shows what you have to solder/remove off the cluster, but its so spread out and its not crystal clear on which/what to do... which is what im hoping to get...

i also have the mfa stalks already, and i believe you have to run the 2 wires into the green plug for the temp sensor, but again i will check....

the biggest thing was to make all the wonderful things of the fis to work, like when ur doors are open, trunk is open, distance to empty and all those things... thats what im looking forward too
 

fitzski

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2004
Location
Ottawa
TDI
Uh... hmm... Well, none...
the biggest thing was to make all the wonderful things of the fis to work, like when ur doors are open, trunk is open, distance to empty and all those things... thats what im looking forward too
All those things should already be enabled in the cluster (so no EEPROM tweaks required), because they work in the W8 (I have one, I know), but can't tell you if your car will have the necessary connections already wired - the hood open indicator, for example, may need to be wired up for your car.
 

blizzard60

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Location
Vancouver, BC
TDI
2004 Jetta Wagon
Welcome to tdiclub.

1) What wiring harness do you have? Did you buy or is it custom build? Year/model/engine would be helpful

2) No North American MKIVs have the hood switch wired up to the stock, AFAIK. Having said that, an '00 SHOULD have this going to the radio. It is the brown/red wire going to T8/1. You can tap that and send it to T32a/22 on the cluster.

3) Check out this post, it sounds like if you just dump the eeprom from a VR FIS cluster onto the W8 one you'll be golden.

4) I **THINK** I remember reading somewhere that the immo3 and immo2 door open options are slightly different. This is the only thing that I'm not sure about. Everything else on the cluster should just work. It get's mpg, etc, etc from k-line, which your car already has, so it will just work. The temp it will obviously get when you plug in the OTG. You will certainly get all the options that are available on a MKIV

5) Some of the options that may or may not have been available on a W8 passat you might not get. For example, did the W8 have bulb monitor? If so, that is a LOT of work/wiring to get.

I hope that helps somewhat!!
-Chris
 
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danielhf

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2007
Location
Seattle, WA
TDI
None anymore...
If I remember correctly, there is some issue with any Passat cluster's coolant temperature gauge. I remember when I did the swap to FIS a few years back that I ran over a couple of threads with people complaining specifically about that issue when using W8 clusters in the MKIV platform. It is entirely possible that some magic with VAG Tacho may fix the issue, but I am not sure, as I have not personally dealt with it. Can't wait to see what you find out. Welcome to TDIclub, and good luck!
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
most of the info that i seem to find, talks about how you have to solder parts to the board and take them off etc.... that sorta thing is NOT something i would try and do, as i can weld, and solder, but not something so small on the board, and dont want to risk messing it up....

I do know a guy who does computer repair, so if i can get a for sure answer on where/what needs to go and come off, ill take it to him with that website link or info, and he can do it for me.

The other thing i seem to see, is that in order to have the door display work, you might need to upgrade to 04+ door sensors and some one mentioned something about window motors as well.. for what reason i am not totally sure.


but there are lots of diff pieces of advice out there, and i just was hoping that once it all comes together in this thread, we can edit it, and have it as a reference for others who would like to have this in an mk4 platform
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
Welcome to tdiclub. I'm sorry that you got a bit of a harsh welcome here - that is certainly not normally the case here. It is very un-vortexish here and I would say that people in general are interested in their platform of car, somewhat regardless of engine. After all, you did post in the "not tdi engine related" forum! Also, maybe someone with a tdi will want to do this come day!
maybe that guy needs to be banned... i mean there is no reason to act like that, when we all share the same base car platform


1) What wiring harness do you have? Did you buy or is it custom build? Year/model/engine would be helpful
I have a stock wire harness that came in my car, 2000 jetta vr6

2) No North American MKIVs have the hood switch wired up to the stock, AFAIK. Having said that, an '00 SHOULD have this going to the radio. It is the brown/red wire going to T8/1. You can tap that and send it to T32a/22 on the cluster.
I have an avic z3 in the car, so the radio issue doesnt bother me at all, as for the hood switch.... maybe if i can find an easy way to wire it up, i will, other wise no big deal

3) Check out this post, it sounds like if you just dump the eeprom from a VR FIS cluster onto the W8 one you'll be golden.
problem is finding someone with the eeprom from a vr fis... it would have to be a euro cluster, and i dont think there is many ppl who have them, or are willing to share one to get the coding off it.

4) I **THINK** I remember reading somewhere that the immo3 and immo2 door open options are slightly different. This is the only thing that I'm not sure about. Everything else on the cluster should just work. It get's mpg, etc, etc from k-line, which your car already has, so it will just work. The temp it will obviously get when you plug in the OTG. You will certainly get all the options that are available on a MKIV

5) Some of the options that may or may not have been available on a W8 passat you might not get. For example, did the W8 have bulb monitor? If so, that is a LOT of work/wiring to get.

I hope that helps somewhat!!
-Chris

the headlight thing being out of not, again im not to sure, i know the w8 my cluster came from is the top of the line passat, so if vw offered it, this car had it.
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
Not sure why you are on this guy. He asked what I thought was a legitimate question (seems others agree). You seem to be the only guy with the problem.

it has to be because he is from NY... in 20 years of dealing with ppl in the car world, seems only ppl from NY have a chip to pick with everyone....

also i wonder if he feels stupid now, after his comment....

People on here typically dont mod for looks aside from MAYBE some wheels or a diff gauge cluster

when the title of the thread states newbie with a w8 CLUSTER question... hence gauge cluster....


maybe you need to learn to read before you go barking off at someone.... just a thought!
 

SLVVR6

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 22, 2009
Location
Utah
TDI
2000 Jetta
Hopefully, you get some answers here. The reason I frequent this forum is I got tired of people like this on the Tex.

As mentioned, there are some smart people on here and I am sure with their help, you can figure it out. There actually is a post on the Tex that might help. Let me look for it and will post the link.

EDIT: Here is that link:

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?1921113-DIY-MFA-to-FIS-cluster-swap

Not sure if it will help, but it might?
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
Aurora, on
TDI
mk4
ya ive seen that, as mentioned i have looked at prob most of the threads around, and im just hoping that in making this one, i will be able to put all the right proper advice together and make sure its all a 100% success...

if it is, i will do a diy with pics and steps for anyone/everyone else to do, if they choose to go that path
 

SLVVR6

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 22, 2009
Location
Utah
TDI
2000 Jetta
Cool...well, again, sorry for the cold welcome to TDIClub. "Most" people are helpful.
 

firehawk618

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Location
Marysville, WA
TDI
2011 Golf TDI, 2dr, M6, Stock
I just did a W8 to TDI cluster swap. The most challenging thing for me was the following:

Since I have a TDI I didn't want to use the W8 tachometer, so I ended up swapping out all the faces back to my TDI ones. *yeah I know, what a waste* But I like the tach to be accurate. Since the W8 speedo goes to 180mph and my TDI one only goes to 140 mph my speedometer was WAAAYYYY off.

I finally figured out what lines of hex to edit in the eeprom I had used to correct this. One nice side effect is that my speedometer is spot on now! Not that 5+ mph at speeds over 60. It's on the money! It was quite a pain to figure this all out though.

Other than the speedometer issue, the rest isn't very hard coding wise. The hardest part is finding someone to help with editing the EEPROM.

If you need help with the code email me at firehawk618@gmail.com and I'll do the best I can.
 

Birdman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 7, 1999
Location
Near Hagerstown MD.
TDI
Jetta 2001 Died by Truck one snowy day. Jetta 2003
Also, you have probably seen this thread, but if not, it's probably the best thread ever created on this subject: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=48366.
Not sure if that thread will help as it was written for installing a stock Euro Imob.3 cluster into an 00-01 car at the time. It was well written at the time just not sure it will apply to a W8 cluster install. good luck
 

firehawk618

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Location
Marysville, WA
TDI
2011 Golf TDI, 2dr, M6, Stock
I know the basics where i need to program it and have the skc's and such, but im talking about the parts past there, getting all the wonderful things to work, like mpg, distance to empty, doors open display et...
If you use an EEPROM dump from a MK4 with full FIS then most of those functions will work by default.

The only things you MIGHT have to enable via hex editing are:

Distance to empty
Welcome Message
Illuminated needles "definitely have to hex edit for these"
Linear temp gauge "sits on 190 degrees from approx 160 to 210 degrees by default"

I don't remember off the top of my head anything else you'll have to do.

Keep in mind, my experience is with IMMO3 cluster cars, since I believe yours is IMMO2 it might be different.
 

jetta 97

Vendor
Joined
Dec 25, 2008
Location
Dallas (McKinney) ,TX ,USA
TDI
2 X Jatta MK5 2006
Full FIS in useless in 2000-2001 cars unless you do conversion of Radio for single din to double din, CCM and all door motors form 2002.

Means all function with door and radio in LCD display will not work unless you do conversion.
 

firehawk618

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Location
Marysville, WA
TDI
2011 Golf TDI, 2dr, M6, Stock
Full FIS in useless in 2000-2001 cars unless you do conversion of Radio for single din to double din, CCM and all door motors form 2002.

Means all function with door and radio in LCD display will not work unless you do conversion.
My wife's car, 2001.5 didn't need any of that stuff done and it works fine.
 

kd7iwp

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2009
Location
Abbotsford, BC, Canada
TDI
2002 Golf GLS
Yes, my 2002 Golf worked fine with the doors/hood/trunk opening showing on my FIS cluster as soon as I installed it. There were no other modifications or programming things I had to do in order to get that part functioning.
 
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