New JSW buyer and I’m panicking

[tdmsurfguy]

Slightly panicing. I’m looking at getting a 2012-2014 JSW with <66k miles on it. I have a couple in the area on is private party with 62k another is a CPO car from a dealership with 37k. The CPO car has a Pano sunroof (don’t really want a sunroof but if it has a warranty for two years). I’m panicking because both trusted mechanics I talked with said as soon as the warranty is done take out the DPF and tune it. I don’t want to do this due to ethical reasons and local inspections. I’m worried that the long term effect on the DPF’s with VW “fix” is still slightly unknown. I don’t want to be in the shop every other month. The car will be driven 60% hwy 40% in town. Can anyone help with my panicing!?

 

[rocky raccoon]

I have a '14 JSW and let me set you at ease. I bought it about 6 mos ago with 87000 miles and it is one of the most trouble-free cars I have ever had. Keep in mind that no-one posts in an automotive maintenance forum unless they are having a problem that they can't handle. There are many thousands more that are simply enjoying the ride with no issues.

That said, at 120k miles it will be time to change the timing belt. Looks DIY-able, certainly easier than changing the timing chain on my old Benz.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Don't worry, just drive the car. Your emissions system is relatively simple (no adblue) and with the updated emissions hardware has been lasting pretty well.

 

[kjclow]

I'm just under 150k on my 10 JSW. Only major issue was with the mectronics (tranny) unit. One of the seals had failed, so VW took back most of my emmisions payout. I've had no issues with the DPF or the HPFP. If your local gurus are telling you that the only way to keep it on the raod is to mod, then perhaps you need to find different gurus.

I'd base my decision on which car has the most maintenance records but still plan on changing oil, oil filter, and fuel filter before putting many miles on either one. The CPO sounds more interesting due to the warranty, but it's still been sitting somewhere for at least 5 years.

 

[oilhammer]

We have them in here almost daily with the MIL on. I am not sure I'd "panic", but the push to delete/tune it is justified. They went from fragile to, well, something slightly worse.

But you can see how it plays out, and how much the warranty gets called upon (and how well you and your car get treated with it) and see how it goes.

The intake manifold issues we already knew about, and there is an updated unit for that, as well as an aftermarket "band-aid" kind of fix which does work most of the time.

The DPF cracking still happens, only now it happens more often AND they took the low pressure EGR filter tube out for the "fix" so now when it cracks instead of just clogging that filter up and setting an EGR insufficient flow DTC it just sends all the soot right into the inlet side of the turbo... where it gets compressed and slowly builds up a black filth inside the entire charge air tract. Oh, and the DPFs go on national backorder every few months or so.

The intercooler icing is even worse now, too, because this is a direct result of the low pressure EGR operation, and when the fix was applied, it was done to lower NOx... well the only way to lower NOx without adding SCR is to run an even MORE aggressive EGR duty cycle. And they (VoA, dealers) still seem to keep their head in the sand over the cold weather intercooler kit availability (there is a TSB about this).

No change in the rest of the stuff really. Turbochargers fail more often than the older cars, but not as bad as the CKRA in the Passat, and I think with some reasonably smart driving they are not horrible. I've just seen engine harness #2 on one, but that (like the other) were in excess of 250k miles, which isn't anything different than the BRM cars before them (other than a more expensive harness and more labor intensive to replace).

The CJAA does not seem to have the post-fix oddities that the CKRA seems to have, though. I am not sure I would want to depend on one of these every day though. I'd have a backup plan. That sucks to say that, and I am a huge fan of the brand, but....

I will say this though, the cars that get driven a lot... long highway miles, no short trips, tend to be much less problematic. Of course, a delete/tune makes 90% of the issues vanish AND the car runs better (more power) and the fuel economy improves.

FWIW, I would not do anything until you experience it for yourself. You may find it works perfectly just as it is.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

One thing I would suggest after the warranty expires is a tune, leaving the emissions hardware in place. Most tuners can take the emissions duty cycles back to pre-court order status, which is still pretty damn clean, and it is far less stressful on the hardware. And it will pass inspection fine.

 

[JELLOWSUBMARINE]

One thing I would suggest after the warranty expires is a tune, leaving the emissions hardware in place. Most tuners can take the emissions duty cycles back to pre-court order status, which is still pretty damn clean, and it is far less stressful on the hardware. And it will pass inspection fine.

100% agree. My CPO 2011 emissions portion timed out before the miles (10 years). I got a 69k (basically new) 2011, 6m. I used it on EVERYTHING possible and made sure of doing a NON delete tune to save the car (see next paragraph). It had new DPF, egr, ex flap, 100% brakes & tires, battery, fresh service. Still 4 other various warranty coverage for up to 2 more years. Clock spring, ex flap ect...

IMO one of the worse/expensive/common issues can be a plugged/loaded DPF. The "fix" amplified soot production to bring down NOx. My compromise was FIX everything possible via warranty. Felt the car out first and felt secure in its condition. Put a Kermit NON delete tune on. I can ez switch back. I never looked back. 8 months and it runs so clean, better mpg, and went from double digit soot % numbers to next to nothing single digit soot production. Active regens are mileage set similar to VW fix but disappear as quick as 1 minute. Im smog check area so when its due Ill pretest 1st. If its all good... If say NOx is out of range then "fix" tune.

Be certain the DSG had 40k services or rethink it. Many prefer the 6m for this reason

cpo imo!

 

[oilhammer]

The best software changes in my opinion that leave all the equipment physically intact are the low soot/high NOx versions. These will greatly reduce the need for DPF regens, and often the passive regen is sufficient to keep the differential pressure sensor values where the ECU wants them, and in turn essentially turns both EGR systems off save for maybe some dynamic map for the high pressure side to aid in engine and cabin warmup in cold weather, as well as retaining the intake flap to smooth shut downs. A friend has this type on his Ecodiesel Ram and it is incredible. That big ox can tag 30 MPG rolling down the highway. And it never takes a sip of DEF anymore, LOL.

Just remember, "clean" as defined by the EPA targets NOx as a seemingly most important pollutant, while forcing the engine to produce much more PM and consume more fuel than it otherwise would. If they would just let diesels do what diesels do best, and run super lean, they'd get incredibly good fuel economy and the PM would be so low that the DPF would hardly ever be taxed to the point of clogging up within a reasonable lifespan of the car let alone cracking and leaking internally.

This is in part why the "cheating dirty illegal" TDIs have tailpipes so clean you can swipe a white glove inside of them, yet the DI gasser VAG sells right alongside of it has a heavy layer of black in its tailpipes.

And EPA's own data collection shows CO2 has gone UP since 1980, but NOx has gone DOWN. This was (and is) a red herring as it relates to what is in the grand scheme of things a handful of cars, all of which were working to LOWER CO2 and NOx was going to continue to drop as it has been since 1980. I am not saying I agree with VAG's subterfuge here at all, but the underlying issue was unfounded. And if it so important for diesels to meet the same criteria for NOx as gasoline cars, then why isn't there a cry for gasoline cars to drop their HC, CO, CO2, PM, etc. down to where diesels are? When clearly THAT would do more to improve overall air quality? Nope, not gonna see that. They've banned our access to fun, driveable, albeit perhaps fragile 45+ MPG cars but rest assured you can still go out and buy all the 12 MPG Suburbans and Expeditions you want.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

My '15 was tuned with 875 miles on the odometer, and it regularly returns 45 MPG in mixed driving. It's only got 14K miles on it, but I've yet to add any Adblue. And the power delivery is amazing: great torque down low, no lag, and very smooth. When I first drove the car post-fix I was disappointed, especially on tip in from idle. Not diesel like at all. Now it's great: not as much torque as my modified rotary pump TDI, but it's close.

 

[tdmsurfguy]

Thanks for all the good information! I’m feeling better about purchasing one now. From what I’m learning three things I should do to keep reliability if I don’t want to delete the DPF are (this is besides your standard maintenance):

Tune from Kerma, Malone, or RC
Diesel Geek P2015 manifold fix
Try not to do short around town trips.

Anything I’m missing?

 

[tjg]

It might be worth keeping an eye out for good prices on used DPFs. I just sold 2 working ones on ebay for $350 each. Keeping one in your parts stash would be useful if there's an extended backorder. Then you can swap it out yourself and when the new DPF arrives, trade the bad one to the dealership for it.

 

[oilhammer]

I have a couple, too. Actually I have a couple entire exhaust systems that had no issues prior to removal.

 

[tjg]

I have a couple, too. Actually I have a couple entire exhaust systems that had no issues prior to removal.

totally worth throwing up on ebay... though I did have one bozo return it because "it didn't fit my passat". I guess the part number, vehicles it fits, engine codes it fits, and vehicle it came off of weren't hint enough.

 

[oilhammer]

I don't do eBay anymore, the scamming and nonsense has just become too much, not worth the effort. Besides, I really have no desire to sell these just yet as they may be worth more later on once they are totally obsoleted and you cannot get them again.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

once they are totally obsoleted and you cannot get them again.

Our local dealer recently told us there are rumors to that effect floating around now. Seems unlikely, however.

 

[oilhammer]

They'll be serving themselves an even bigger turd sandwich if they start making replacement parts for these cars unavailable so soon after they "fixed" them. But hey, just last week found out they have obsoleted the 01M's internal ribbon wire harness and A5 Jetta sedan trunk harnesses AND the late "updated" door harness for those same Jettas. This was found out all in one week.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Try and get lines from fuel filter to IP for an ALH. Odd item to obsolete. They only obsoleted it for the B4 a couple years ago. But it could be worse. You should try and get parts for a Jeep Liberty CRD. A recent, and painful obsolete part is the harmonic balancer. Totally gone. I had a shop on the phone today who asked, "what do we do now, junk it?" I didn't have a good answer.

 

[oilhammer]

Which is odd, because didn't they sell a lot of those (they were still called Cherokees) in Europe with the VM diesel?

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

That engine has been around for a long time in many applications. They sold about 12K libertys in NA (US and Canada) but more in Australia and New Zealand. But the manufacturer stopped making the balancers and there's no aftermarket supplier.

 

[oilhammer]

Well you can actually have the dampers rebuilt, if it came down to it.... assuming it is like most other pulleys where there are two pieces of steel mated with rubber. www.damperdoctor.com

 

[murphyslaw]

I have a '14 JSW TDI manual with nav/pano. The Pano rails were replaced under the 36k warranty due to it going all wonky. But other than that there have been zero issues(until last weekend when the driver rear spring broke). The engine has been trouble-free, with no emissions issues or anything. I am nearing 120k miles now. Will do a timing belt change here in a few months and the plan is to go stage 2 upgrades in the spring with possible DPF delete. But like I said, so far No DPF issues at all.

 

[tdmsurfguy]

Here’s a question for you mechanics and body work folks. I found a local 2014 JSW with low miles 25k but the car fax says it had and accident when it was about a month old. The current owner (owns a Custom diesel Shop and took the JSW in on trade). The title is showing clean but the accident was enough to deploy the airbags. Everything else about the car looks clean and no sunroof. Thoughts?

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• tdmsurfguy
• Oct 8, 2020

Carfax

 

[oilhammer]

Really surprised it was not totalled with SRS deployment. That usually means not only was the damage severe, but the cost of SRS repair alone was too much. I guess it just depends, but lots of cars when the passenger side bag goes, the whole dash needs to be replaced. Add in the various crash sensors, ABS module that itself gets automatically bricked, and the pyro seat belt tensioners, you could be looking at several grand JUST FOR THE SRS repairs. I'd want to take a really good look at that car, and I'd expect to pay way less than market value.

 

[tdmsurfguy]

That’s what I’m thinking but the problem is the car is located 5 hrs north from me and I’d have to find a local guru in the seattle area. Might be to much of a hassle for me. I’ll look and see if there are any guru’s in the Seattle area that could possibly take a look.

 

[tjg]

If you get it for the right price, I'd imagine it would be an easy profit parting it out. (provided you have the space and time).

 

[tdmsurfguy]

I too am surprised to the car wasn’t totaled. Looks like it’s been driven for 24k miles since the accident happened.

 

[tdmsurfguy]

Or another option is a Local CPO JSW with 38k but it has a pano sunroof. Sunroofs in Oregon are dumb!

 

[Matt927]

I would go with a CPO car any day of the week. Two years with bumper to bumper and unlimited mileage is a nice perk.

 

[prsa01]

I would go with a CPO car any day of the week. Two years with bumper to bumper and unlimited mileage is a nice perk.

Although... If you are like many in current circumstances, you may not be not be putting many miles on until things change. I know I've been putting a fraction of my normal miles on the jsw since March.

Just another thing for consideration.

 

[Matt927]

Why not get a free warranty if one is available to you?