NEW BOSCH T-4 Nozzles

[Sbeghan]

All right, I'm convinced. Frank, you'll have a set of those nozzles in a year when I have money and get chipped and swap my nozzles and IP? If not, make sure to hold me a set

 

[Brent_B]

it was great talking to you on the phone yesterday Frank, very informative! Thanks for your time
Brent

 

[kooyajerms]

Frank, thank you for setting me straight. After losing my vintage Landuytg balanced R520's to the runaway, I'm happy that I got my injectors done by you. I already knew it, but I'm gonna stay away from Bosio for sure! Ridiculous.

If only Bosch offered a plentiful supply of even larger nozzles than the DSLA150P1019/764, would you have the big turbo guys all over you.

My DSLA150P1019/764 are going to flow like R520's, and evenly? Love it.

 

[Franko6]

Kooyajerms,

I've set them more 'stock', based on what Matt seemed to be headed for on the rebuild. Although they can be pushed to equal R520's in my opinion, I've not done that with this set.

As comparisons go, Bosch are sometimes more expensive, but quite honestly, worth it. What you pay for in reliability, repeatability and just plain QUALITY is worth it. If I can find any vendor that meets that criteria, I'm in...

When it comes to the big nozzles, the pricing seems to be out of line with what they should actually cost. Big nozzle holes really aren't harder to make.

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Of the ones of these I have installed, only an IQ tweaking was needed. <snip...> they have all been otherwise stock 5sp ALHs. <big snip>.

Hey guys, newbie here, although have been lurking for about a year... 5 months ago, got my 1st TDI, a 2003 New Beetle GLS 5spd. LOVE the car, but would like a bit more power. Would like to upgrade nozzles 1st, due to the fact that my original nozzles (stock) have 142,000 miles on them and are probably nearing the end of their useful life. Possibly tune later.
Until I read this thread, I was under the impression that T4's were too much for a stock ALH. Not worried much about clutch issues, will replace if necessary. I'd like to keep my fuel economy and don't want a bunch of smoke. So, is this really attainable with just an IQ tweak?

 

[manual_tranny]

You can keep your fuel economy and run without smoke if you get tuned right. In order to keep you smoke free with T4 injectors, you'll need a new clutch and a RC3 tune (or equivalent). I'm still not tuned smoke free at full throttle with RC2 and T4 injectors because there isn't any point in adding boost... my stock clutch is already slipping in 4th and 5th gears. Keep in mind that RC3 or equivalent is pushing your stock turbo close to its limit, so you may eventually want an exhaust temperature and boost gauge and/or a bigger turbo. (VNT 17/22 seems to be one the most powerful "plug and play" turbo, but there are other, crazier setups out there. Of course at this point, you'll want to install a FMIC to get a little more air cooling/flowing. Then you'll want a ported head and a modified intake, because that will be a restriction. If you're not broke yet, you'll need new suspension and axles and a lowered compression ratio, not to mention new tires.

Sorry for the speech, just warning you about the potential for TDI modification addiction. It's a real thing, ask around...

I'd recommend that you first install and break in a clutch (Get one much stronger than you want to go because you will soon be addicted adding power!) ... then find a GTG with a tuner that can give you RC3 or equivalent. It can be annoying to spend 2-3 years modifying only to find out that you need an even stronger clutch. Some of the strongest clutches available have a nice lightweight feeling, while the VR6 'upgrade' is both heavier and weaker. I've heard good things about southbend clutches but I haven't any experience with them yet. Good luck, have fun!

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Uh, think I'm already addicted, but don't have enough money for too many frills. lol
Don't get me wrong, I don't mind a little smoke, say at WOT, just don't want to look ridiculous.
So, would .205's be a better choice for a stock car vs. the T4's? And, I'd prefer to stay with Bosch nozzels, just my personal preference.

 

[manual_tranny]

I'd still get T4's, but perhaps stick with a very light tune like RC1 if you don't want to buy a new clutch. Perhaps oilhammer's suggestion to tweak IQ settings would help out too. If you don't mind springing for a clutch first, (pun intended), then T4s and RC3 should be reliable (RC3 is a tune for maximum allowed psi for VNT15 which is the stock turbo).

I should have mentioned that it is a good idea to do early maintenance before you begin modifying to ensure that everything is working correctly to begin with. Timing belt should be somewhat recent and if the dealer or a non-TDI specialist did the job you might want to verify your cam/crank/injection pump timing before modifying and tuning. Check, clean, and/or replace: Vacuum lines, air and fuel filters, intake manifold/egr, snow screen, tires/shocks/alignment, camshaft.

 

[Wingnut]

There is no reason why you can't install some T4 injectors and call it a day. No need for a chip if you are on a budget. You will get a nice noticable increase in power for a very reasonable price. If you get excessive smoke after the install, a simple vag-com adjustment can alter the injection quantity to reduce the smoke.

I say go for it and be happy.

 

[schwarze Käfer]

I'd still get T4's, but perhaps stick with a very light tune like RC1 if you don't want to buy a new clutch. <snip>

I should have mentioned that it is a good idea to do early maintenance before you begin modifying to ensure that everything is working correctly to begin with... <snip>

Thanks for the info and good advice, M_T! I wussed out on the T4's for now and for my temporary fix, I ordered a set of Sprints (I know...) from BleachedBora (nozzles only). Clutch has < 30k miles on it, but was able to speak to PO's mechanic today. Mechanic told me it was a NAPA replacement clutch and he did not touch the original DMF. So, I decided to err on the side of caution, and take your advice on the clutch.

TB looks good via visual check, has 40k on it, is clean, dry with no signs of wear. VAG-Com reports timing just slightly retarded (barely below center line on TDI timing). However, I'm gonna go ahead and do a complete TB job now, because I can't verify that the tensioner, rollers and WP were changed, or if they were, with what from where... (C.R.A.P., NAPA, NAPA CRAP ??? Who knows.... would be stupid to chance it.)

I recently put Bilstein TC's on and replaced the strut mounts, suspension bushings, sway bar bushings, brake pads (rotors were perfect). Checked wheel bearings, tie rods and ball joints, all tight... Put on an Evo Atlas skidplate, new CRAP headlights (swapped CRAP projectors out with the factory BOSCH) and threw in an HID kit. Had a sick horn and replaced them with an Airhorn (can you hear me now?) Lol

Just received EGR gaskets, intake manifold bolts and gaskets from Peter @ IDParts so I can clean the EGR and intake. Already replaced all filters, cleaned the MAF, and pulled and cleaned out the IC.

I'd like to eventually get my car to about 150-175hp and around 250-300 ft-lbs of torque, shooting for a 7-8 sec. 0-60 time. In the mean time, I'll do some baby-steps and not tempt fate, too much. lol

I really appreciate your help and I love this forum. This forum convinced me to buy a TDI, a 2003 ALH, specifically, and I have zero regrets.
I'm a gearhead and a 30 year + self-wrencher. I knew nothing about TDI's until about a year ago, but thanks to folks like you, I've found a new passion.
Thanks again,
James

 

[vwjettadsl]

You can keep your fuel economy and run without smoke if you get tuned right. In order to keep you smoke free with T4 injectors, you'll need a new clutch and a RC3 tune (or equivalent). axles and a lowered compression ratio, not to mention new tires.

I agree with Wingnut, T4's and a stock tune you will get a little smoke but not much more than stock nozzles.

Sorry to disagree with you manual_tranny, but there is absolutely no need for a new clutch with T4's, or T4's + tune. I tune customers cars with a Malone Stage 1.5 "Clutch Saver" tune fairly often with T4's. Stage 1.5 is a nice smoke free tune, gives you an extra 32 HP, but limits your torque to 34 ft lbs. By doing this you can run with a stock clutch for a long time with no issues. No need for axles or lowered compression ratio.

I'd recommend that you first install and break in a clutch (Get one much stronger than you want to go because you will soon be addicted adding power!) ... then find a GTG with a tuner that can give you RC3 or equivalent.

Again no need for a clutch first. I recommend to my customers all the time to get new nozzles and have their injectors rebuilt and pop tested before they do anything else. Its better to have the engine performing at optimum than to have a stronger clutch or a tune installed.

Hope I have not offended you manual_tranny, just sharing my first hand experience.


Cheers

 

[manual_tranny]

Wingnut, good point. I really need to sit down and learn to use my vag-com...

schwarze Käfer, you're way ahead of me on maintenance! No worries, boraparts and idparts are great vendors too. If there is any trouble with tdiclub, it is that we have so many good vendors that it's difficult to choose one over another. Your sprints are a good value and should cover your performance goals eventually, while taking care of the timing belt now is a good idea as the P.O. already installed a NAPA clutch. Hope all goes well, if you need to borrow tools for the TB let me know.

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Thanks for the reply, Wingnut. I went ahead and ordered Sprints 520's this afternoon. BleachedBora has them for $175, and that's not bad. From everything I've read here, they should give me a nice little boost, and since I'm not too sure about my clutch, they should be a little easier on it. I got this car on the cheap, just under $6k, it's an easy 8 outta 10, and I budgeted about $2k for maintenance and improvements. So far, I've only spent about $1k on it, and am about to spend $550 or so on TB and metalnerd TB tools, along with just over $200 for the nozzles and slide hammer. I can afford to do the clutch now, but would prefer to wait until spring when the weather is warmer. And if I can milk 6 months outta it, all the better, right?

 

[manual_tranny]

I agree with Wingnut, T4's and a stock tune you will get a little smoke but not much more than stock nozzles.

Sorry to disagree with you manual_tranny, but there is absolutely no need for a new clutch with T4's, or T4's + tune. I tune customers cars with a Malone Stage 1.5 "Clutch Saver" tune fairly often with T4's. Stage 1.5 is a nice smoke free tune, gives you an extra 32 HP, but limits your torque to 34 ft lbs. By doing this you can run with a stock clutch for a long time with no issues. No need for axles or lowered compression ratio.

No worries! It does turn out that schwarze Käfer has a NAPA clutch, and I'm not sure how many ft/lbs they hold, but perhaps a 1.5 tune with T4s would be asking a lot of it. Maybe not. I do know I need a new clutch to hold the T4s and the RC2 tune as my clutch started slipping the first time I tried full throttle in 5th gear. Shwarze sounded like he wanted a pretty noticeable gain in power, and now he's stated his final goals are a minimum of 150hp. I'll bet he'll need a clutch before long...

As far as axles and lowered compression ratio, I was not being literal as much as I was joking about the tendency for this modifying thing to get out of hand. I think schwarze Käfer got the joke, if not I did mention in my next post that proper maintenance needs to be a priority.

Again no need for a clutch first. I recommend to my customers all the time to get new nozzles and have their injectors rebuilt and pop tested before they do anything else. Its better to have the engine performing at optimum than to have a stronger clutch or a tune installed.

Hope I have not offended you manual_tranny, just sharing my first hand experience.


Cheers

No offense taken, I mostly agree!

Cheers!

 

[vwjettadsl]

No worries! It does turn out that schwarze Käfer has a NAPA clutch, and I'm not sure how many ft/lbs they hold, but perhaps a 1.5 tune with T4s would be asking a lot of it. Maybe not. I do know I need a new clutch to hold the T4s and the RC2 tune as my clutch started slipping the first time I tried full throttle in 5th gear.

Yeah if you have a RC2 + T4's then your stock clutch will slip.

Still way behind you with MPG, my best mileage so far with my T4's is 51 MPG, average of 48-49 MPG. Can't seem to slow it down enough to see what kind of mileage car is capable of, having too much fun enjoying the performance!

Cheers

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Thanks for the offer on loaning the tools, Manual_Tranny, but since I'm stuck in the middle of Nowhere and BFE, I'm gonna get the tools so I'll have them if and when I need them. I'd just like to say that you guys ROCK! I'm learning from you, everyday, and without you, I wouldn't know shxt!
This forum is the best.

 

[schwarze Käfer]

And yes, M_T, I got the joke! Lol I am concerned about the NAPA clutch, as well as the TB job the same mechanic performed. I'd prefer to err to caution and reliability as to the unknown, hence the decision to go with the sprints for now and a complete TB replacement. Besides, if I can get an extra 10-20hp and ft-lbs outta it, all is good, plus, the sprints may work great with a tune after a new clutch!

 

[Growler]

s_K do yourself a favor and have Aaron send your Sprints to Franko6 for mounting and balancing. the $130 or so it will cost you will be money well spent to get a perfectly working set of nozzles. just swapping the nozzles onto the bodies will work, but if you are after ultimate performance out of your money, the balancing will be worth the effort in the long run.

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Yeah, I'll probably kick myself for not doing that, Growler.
It's all BleachedBora's fault! He got me with the price and free shipping! haha
If they're too far out, I'll get ahold of Frank06 and see if he can fix me up. From what I read here, I bet he can!

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Update: Received the Sprints by lunch today. (BleachedBora is awesome with his shipping, ordered Thurs. afternoon - Got them in 2 days! With free shipping!!)
Got the nozzles installed by 5pm today. Took the car out and beat on it, hard... Turns out that I can't make my NAPA clutch slip with the Sprints, so the clutch probably would've handled the T4's as well. Very nice performance boost... but, anybody looking for nozzles for a stock car... I'd say listen to these guys and go with the T4's!!!

 

[manual_tranny]

don't worry schwarze, the Sprints and the T4s are only a mild performance boost unless you're getting them alongside a tune of some kind. Just save up for for a #3 tune and a clutch, or settle for a #1.5 lowered torque tune. Either way the nozzles are a good idea. (Although you may consider having Frank work on them some time at a GTG...)

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Hey M_T, don't get me wrong, I'm very pleased with the Sprints... was definately overdue for nozzles! Very inexpensive, easy and worthwhile upgrade!
Note to anyone thinking about changing nozzles:
1. Buy, borrow or steal a Metalnerd injector removal tool! Worth every penny!
(or make your own from a slide hammer)
2. Same recommendation for a vise. (I had one, don't try it without one!)
3. You'll also need a 15mm deep socket, 13mm socket, 6-8" extension,
17mm open end wrench - 17mm offset flare nut wrench is even better,
and a torque wrench.

And I agree M_T, I'm sure I need a Franko6 injector job. I'll start watching for GTG's in my area. Maybe I can get a new, stout clutch installed prior to that and get my injectors balanced and a good tune while I'm there! Looking forward to my 1st GTG, I know I'll really enjoy it, not to mention learn greatly from it.

 

[Franko6]

I really do like to do the GTG's. First, people like to see what is up with the nozzles and setting them up. Second, they see what a difference setting nozzles makes. Third, they see what quality injector nozzles are all about.

I can see making a trip to TX. As a matter of fact, I have plans to make it to Beaumont sometime in the next few weeks to do a BRM cam replacement. If a GTG were to be in the works, I'd make it a twofer trip.

 

[schwarze Käfer]

Hey Franko6! I've heard lots of good things about your work!
Believe it or not, I'm 1 1/2 hrs closer to Lockwood than Beaumont! I'm telling ya, I live smack dab in the middle of Nowhere and BFE!
Because of this, scheduling difficulties, and being a single, full-time parent... I'm looking to scare up a spare set of injector bodies, and can probably score them relatively cheaply out here. (There are few enlightened TDIers in West Texas)
Scored my NB GLS (super clean & fully loaded) for just under $6k and probably could've gotten it for $5k, but didn't want to chance missing out on it.
If it were a Powerstroke, RAM or DuraMax, it'd be a different story...

 

[algirdas]

Thanks Frank! I'm luvin' these.

Just installed T4s(1019/955) from Franko6. Engine is smoother at all rpms, Mo' Powa' & less smoke than Sprint520s.
The added torque has done in the clutch(was used from a big turbo 1.8T), lasted me a year.

Next stop, South Bend Clutch, then twist its arms with a GT1749vc, 11mmIP and some RC magic.
PS: (Your tappet bore repairs on that ALH cylinder head rebuild, AMAZING!)

 

[Franko6]

Thanks, Chuck. I will keep you guys at Dubwerx in mind for my Cinnci customers' head work.

The T-4's are fun, eh? If I can get the next size up, you'll be in Nirvana.

 

[Nash_TDI]

Thanks, Chuck. I will keep you guys at Dubwerx in mind for my Cinnci customers' head work.

The T-4's are fun, eh? If I can get the next size up, you'll be in Nirvana.

I want to be in Nirvana too!

 

[chudzikb]

Ok, I finally got off my A$$ and pulled away from the couch and installed my T-4's into my 03 Jetta sedan. What a huge difference! Really smoothed out the motor and gained significantly in power and torque. At least according to my A$$ dyno.

Frank, I hope you give a discount for repeat customers, as I am sending another set to you soon. As soon as I figure out which kid to sell into slavery to afford the next set!

Many thanks!

 

[AlanH70]

Hello Everyone!!
Nozzle wars going on for sure!! Anyway Does anyone know what Franko6 website is? I wanted to get a set of injectors and nozles for my 98 VW Jetta TDI which is all stock and I am not sure which I should get. Of course I would like a power upgrade but getting better fuel mileage and reliability are my main concern...I may chip the car in the future but for now I really just wantto use the instant gratification method.....Please keep in mind my car has 275K and never had injector/nozzle work yet!!! Any ideas?

 

[Growler]

Frank doesn't have a website. his phone number and email is in his signature and public profile.