Need help - converted to Single Mass Flywheel

[Henrick]

Hello everyone.

I have attempted a conversion from Dual Mass Flywheel setup to single mass.
The car in question is Golf Mk6 2011 year with 1.6 TDI engine, code CAYC.

I installed a second-hand flywheel, VW part number 037 105 273 C.
I also installed clutch and pressure plate from G60, Sachs part number 3000 332 001.
While I was there, I also replaced master and slave clutch cylinders as I do a lot of city driving.

However, upon reassembling everything back, I faced a problem - I was unable to start the car.
Cluster kept showing message "Depress Clutch".
I realised that the clutch pedal doesn't reach very bottom. There is about 2 cm distance left from the lower stop.
If I press really hardly on the clutch pedal, the car starts.
It shifts and drive fine....

What I did wrong? Is my single mass setup wrong? Could anyone please give some ideas as at this point I'm deseperate...


Thanks

 

[MukGyver]

did you measure the smf stackup, with clutch, and compare against your original dmfw setup? if the new setup is greater it could explain the pedal not be reaching the depression switch. stepping on it hard may not be the best thing either. I could be off. some others may know the part numbers. Is there an adjustment to the slave/ rod?

 

[turbobrick240]

Not sure if the same issue exists with the 1.6 tdi, but over here the 2.0 tdi's equipped with the 02Q transaxle are lucky to last 10k miles when swapped to SMF. The steel synchro rings break apart and chew things up inside. If the same thing happens with the 1.6, your best bet is to switch back to a DMF setup.

 

[MukGyver]

Above is true. I've heard the same and unless you switch out steel synchros for yellow the vibration tears them up in no time. Did you switch over to brass synchros?

 

[Henrick]

No, unfortunately I didn't measure the stack up. Yes, I know it was my mistake. But I've read that some people have converted to single mass using same setup....

And No, I didn't change the synchros either. Not sure which ones my transmission has. I think it's 0A4, code LHW. Any ideas on that one?

 

[MukGyver]

most likely steel synchros in that 0A4 since it came with dmf . you'll likely be eating those babies up in short order tho.. run penzoil synchromesh gear lube for sure... and maybe someone can verify if the part numbers work together you gave in your post. I suppose you could always wire your switch closed but that's a messy fix.

 

[turbobrick240]

It's a 5 speed? If so, you're probably fine with the SMF arrangement. Maybe you got some wrong parts though.

 

[Mongler98]

Dont. It's not worth it. Go dmf

 

[Henrick]

most likely steel synchros in that 0A4 since it came with dmf . you'll likely be eating those babies up in short order tho.. run penzoil synchromesh gear lube for sure... and maybe someone can verify if the part numbers work together you gave in your post. I suppose you could always wire your switch closed but that's a messy fix.

Is there any way to check it for sure? I have a friend who's got access to ETKA and ELSA but I need to know what to look for.
Also, I've heard that during first year of this model the CAYC engine came with SMFs for Golf. Same engine is used in Polo, Audi A1 and Skoda Fabia and Roomster I think. They have SMF out of the factory....

It's a 5 speed? If so, you're probably fine with the SMF arrangement. Maybe you got some wrong parts though.

Yes, it's a 5-speed. The only wrong parts may be of course the clutch disc and pressure plate but I need a second opinion on this, based on the symptoms described.

Dont. It's not worth it. Go dmf

Any arguments on that? I've had my DMF clattering for past 100k km (currently 155k km on the clock). I really don't want to hear and feel that clatter anymore...

 

[Henrick]

Anyway, I found out that for certain markets those particular engines (CAYA/CAYB/CAYC) were fitted with SMF straight from the factory.

For some small (Seat/Skoda and VW Polo with 1.6 TDI engine) cars the flywheel is the famous "G60" one, having part number "037 105 273 C" stamped on it. Cross referencing to 028 105 269 B It is supposed to be coupled with Sachs 3000 950 956 clutch kit.

Others (including the Golf/Passat/Caddy/Beetle/Octavia/Touran... all with 1.6 TDI engine) are supposed to have 038 105 269 D flywheel and Sachs 3000 950 734 clutch kit.

The only difference between those clytch kits is pressure plate. The clutch disc is the same p/n. I ordered them both and will compare. I guess height is different.

Also, I googled for 038 105 269 D flywheel, however, I could not visually see any difference from "037 105 273 C" (G60) one. I guess maybe the weight is different and/or shape/height differs.

I will be re-doing the clutch job next week.

 

[ted_dj]

Hello everyone.

I was about going the same way as Henrick.
The car is VW Jetta VI 2011 77kW , CAYC, BlueMotion with Start-Stop system, mileage 208k km.
The clutch started slipping recently on steep hills on 1st gear. Reading through the forums, I was somehow convinced that flywheel 037 105 273 C/ 028 105 269 B / Sachs 3021 600 294(all the same) + Sachs 3000 332 001 Clutch Kit will be spot on. But not anymore...

A local parts dealer claims that 3000 332 001 is not available anymore and is superseded by 3000 951 605.

I'll be changing the clutch in a week. Actually I don't know yet whether it's DMF or SMF originally. My goal is to switch to SMF and if possible to increase torque bearing capacity. Some are claiming up to 400Nm with the aforementioned parts, but I personally have some doubts that it is so high.

What I've found(flywheels):
3021 600 294 - Sachs 028 105 269 B — VW - SMF for older models(G60 and many others)
3021 600 290 - Sachs 038 105 269 D — VW - SMF for 1.6tdi without start-stop
3021 600 288 - Sachs 03L 105 269 / 03L 105 269 B/ 04L 105 269 — VW - SMF for 1.6tdi with start-stop

All three flywheels look almost identical. Only 3021 600 288 looks a bit different on the crankshaft side, thinned for weight reduction?

As Henrick wrote, Sachs 3000 950 734 Clutch Kit mates with 3021 600 290 Flywheel. I suppose this Clutch Kit also mates with 3021 600 288 Flywheel for start-stop equipped cars.
I think the 3021 600 290 Flywheel + 3000 950 734 Clutch Kit is the correct SMF combination for 1.6tdi and would go for it, but I'm looking for torque increase.

I am looking forward to the results of the height measurements from Henrick. Your help will be appreciated.

P.S. The clutch is already disassembled. It turned out to be SMF originally.
The gearbox code is 0A4 301 107 L.

On the flywheel can be seen "038D/03L". The clutch disc is quite worn. There are also signs of wear on the flywheel. I'll change everything.
I ordered SACHS 3021 600 294 (flywheel) + 3000 951 605 (clutch kit) and 3021 600 290/3021 600 288 (flywheels) + 3000 950 734(clutch kit). They should be here in a couple of days.

 

[Henrick]

Hello everyone.
Better late than never.

So I had to re-do the entire clutch+flywheel job. Learn from my mistakes - go wtih 038 105 269 D flywheel for 1.6 TDI (CAYA/CAYB/CAYC/CAYE). This _is_ the right SMF, not the 037 version (which has a bit different height profile and a less weight).

I didn't measure any heights. I just purchased used but good 038 105 269 D flywheel and brand new clutch kit from Sachs. I lost the papers on which exact clutch kit it was but if someone needs, please send me a PM, I'll try to dig it up and find. But it was NOT 3000 332 001 for sure - this kit has super light pressure plate (clutch pedal feels very light) and a few mm narrower clutch disk which results in less torque it can handle. The latter kit, I think, is intended for Gol MkIII and other cars of that era built on G3 platform.

So as mentioned, I replaced the flywheel and clutch kit, car started right up without any problems. Fast forward 2 years and around 40'000 km, everything works excellent. No noises, no vibrations, no broken synchros (wow, how's that?)

What I have noticed: 037 flywheel is a bit lighter, so while I was driving 2 weeks with it, I've noticed that car accelerates a bit faster than it used to do with DMF setup. Throttle response is better.
With 038 flywheel, as it is heavier, the effect is gone. It behaves more or less same like DMF in aspect to acceleration.

Hope this helps