Need advice from diesel fans

[Carfreak09]

Ok, so I'm new here and need some advice on whether a TDI would work for me. Forgive me for the long message but I want to make sure I spell out what I need in order to make the right decision.

When I heard that 2015 TDIs were coming up for sale, I got pretty excited as I almost bought a Golf S TDI manual a few weeks before the scandal broke. I didn't buy it mostly because of price. Now that there are big rebates and great financing, I thought it might be plausible again. So let me give the background on what I would be using the car for. I own and operate a food delivery service and drive about 34k a year. These miles are mostly at suburban speeds with some light highway use. I currently use a 2016 Fiat 500X turbo with a 6 speed manual. It's rated at 26/34 and I average 28-29mpg on premium in the spring/summer and 30-32 in fall/winter. The Fiat is comfortable, fun to drive and I love the ease of getting in and out. So far, it's been reliable and maintenance is easy (super easy spark plug change although it's required every 30k, synthetic oil changes at the dealer only cost $50 every 7.5k). However, when I bought it, Fiat did not offer any options if you wanted a stick so it lacked basic stuff, like Bluetooth, backup cam (added aftermarket), nice stereo, alloy wheels. I desperately need Bluetooth for work as answering the phone and shifting through suburbia is NOT fun. The aftermarket separate unit didn't work well and ran out of battery fast. The only way to add it would be to upgrade to an aftermarket radio at over $600, possibly losing my steering wheel controls in the process.

Now to the TDI...I'm leaning to a Golf wagon with a stick. There were a few around me. I've never owned a diesel and know nothing about their upkeep, although I did peruse the maintenance schedule on this site. Since I drive for a living and diesel is cheaper in my area then 89 octane, the good gas mileage and long range are pluses for me. I currently fill my Fiat up literally every other day and it's super annoying to have such little range. So I guess my questions boil down to this....what kind of mileage could I expect in a TDI at suburban speeds? How much do oil changes cost at the dealer and at what interval? How much do the fuel filter changes cost? Any other common expensive maintenance I should calculate into my thoughts? How good is the AC in the wagon? My Fiat has lovely ice cold air which is a huge plus in Florida.

Basically I'm wondering if it's worth taking the financial hit on trading in the Fiat? I'm upside down on the loan but the generous rebate takes care of that and with the 0% financing, my payment would likely go down by $50 or so. What started all this was me thinking, wow, I could get a brand new car with more features, more luxurious interior, and better mileage for less money! But then the practical side said, I like my Fiat, it's been reliable and watch you get a VW nightmare in return. So if you were me, would you take the plunge?

Also, is it possible to add factory fog lights to an S easily?

 

[kjclow]

Even at 34k miles a year, it sounds like you do a lot of stop and go driving. This is not the best option for a diesel. They like to stretch their legs and run long miles. With that driving, your mileage is probably not going to be substantially better than mid to upper 30s. The 15 GSW only has a 12 gallon tank.

Oil changes at the dealer are about $150 (IIRC) every 10k miles.

As for Bluetooth, buy an speaker/transmitter that plugs into the cigarette lighter. I have one that works just fine and hold charge for a couple of days.

 

[Carfreak09]

Even at 34k miles a year, it sounds like you do a lot of stop and go driving. This is not the best option for a diesel. They like to stretch their legs and run long miles. With that driving, your mileage is probably not going to be substantially better than mid to upper 30s. The 15 GSW only has a 12 gallon tank.

Oil changes at the dealer are about $150 (IIRC) every 10k miles.

As for Bluetooth, buy an speaker/transmitter that plugs into the cigarette lighter. I have one that works just fine and hold charge for a couple of days.

A lot of my customers live down rural style roads where I can go 50-60 so I spend a lot of time in 5th and 6th gears. There are stoplights and signs, but not like congested city driving so I don't do constant starting and stoping. My Fiat also only has a 12 gallon tank which is why I fill up so much. I figured a diesel would love loafing along at such low rpms and maybe get me 42-45 but at 35, it wouldn't make much sense.

I did try a Motorola RoadPro Bluetooth unit that goes on my sunvisor. It worked ok on my old Android phone but terrible with my iPhone6s. It won't stay connected, the voice commands don't work 80% of the time, and people can't hear me half the time so I gave up on using it.

A Chevy Volt or Bolt would work best in my situation but neither offers a manual or any modicum of fun driving which is why VW and the TDI sparked my interest.

 

[surfstar]

A GSW TSI is a great choice.

If you buy a 2017 Sportwagen you get the newer infotainment system, which has Android Auto / Apple Carplay. You can use it to provide Google Maps route to your destination and bluetooth, along with many other features.

With a decent amount of highway driving, I average 37mpg in my '16 GSW 5MT. I only paid $18,425 for it.

BUT

since its for a business, you should look into leasing a 2015 TDI - as they get the $8500 discount and leases are business write offs...
That might be a better deal financially.

If the TDIs could easy upgrade to AA/AC stereo, I'd be more excited about them. You can get an aftermarket unit for $500+, I guess.

 

[Carfreak09]

A GSW TSI is a great choice.
If you buy a 2017 Sportwagen you get the newer infotainment system, which has Android Auto / Apple Carplay. You can use it to provide Google Maps route to your destination and bluetooth, along with many other features.
With a decent amount of highway driving, I average 37mpg in my '16 GSW 5MT. I only paid $18,425 for it.
BUT
since its for a business, you should look into leasing a 2015 TDI - as they get the $8500 discount and leases are business write offs...
That might be a better deal financially.
If the TDIs could easy upgrade to AA/AC stereo, I'd be more excited about them. You can get an aftermarket unit for $500+, I guess.

Wow, that's a sweet price! What kind of mileage you get around town though? I've found turbo gas engines struggle to get over 30mpg around town. Prior to my 500X, I had a 2015 Hyundai Sonata Eco with a 1.6 turbo and 7 speed dual clutch auto. It was rated 28/38. I never saw over 33 on the highway and consistently averaged 28 around town so I was a bit disappointed. The jerky/confused around town shifting turned me off of dual clutch autos permanently so I will only go for a manual.

Yea, the old school tech integration of the 15 models gives me pause.

I claim miles driven on my taxes. With a lease, can you still claim that AND write off the purchase?

 

[surfstar]

Around town, I could get about 30mpg if the engine was warmed up. Cold start cycles and short drives, more like 25.

Not sure on tax details, but seems worth looking into. Leasing a TDI might be the best bet for ya... (nice warranty on the '15s too)

 

[kjclow]

A lot of my customers live down rural style roads where I can go 50-60 so I spend a lot of time in 5th and 6th gears. There are stoplights and signs, but not like congested city driving so I don't do constant starting and stoping. My Fiat also only has a 12 gallon tank which is why I fill up so much. I figured a diesel would love loafing along at such low rpms and maybe get me 42-45 but at 35, it wouldn't make much sense.

I did try a Motorola RoadPro Bluetooth unit that goes on my sunvisor. It worked ok on my old Android phone but terrible with my iPhone6s. It won't stay connected, the voice commands don't work 80% of the time, and people can't hear me half the time so I gave up on using it.

A Chevy Volt or Bolt would work best in my situation but neither offers a manual or any modicum of fun driving which is why VW and the TDI sparked my interest.

The clarification makes the diesel option look better. In my 2000 Beetle diesel, I got the best mileage right at 56 mph. Motor was turning just a hair under 2000 rpm. My JSW, however, likes to cruise at 74 mph for miles on end. According to the display, that gives me the best mileage at about 44. I've never gotten that high with pen and paper, nor have I ever run a complete tank at that high of speed. That's darn near impossible for where I live.

 

[billc508]

2015 gsw

I do about 32K a year for business with my diesels, I have had four.
Currently have the golf sportwagen tdi and I average overall 46 to 48, around town stop and go is about 37 to 42 and flat out on hi speed hywy is closer to 51mph. I use the rotella t6 synthetic 5w40 oil and the dealer changes it out for me around 7K for about $40 including the filter, cost of the oil is around 21 to 27$ per gallon, so an oil change is under $100. AC has never been a problem in the VWs.
Stop and go is not a problem for the modern diesels unless this is the only kind of driving you do and the car is rarely used. If you get it out on the road at least once a week for a good run at operating speed for twenty miles or so, this is sufficient to keep dpf system functioning. I have removed and replaced DPF systems and SCR units and had them cleaned so I have some experience with them, do not recommend this by the way as they are not designed to be cleaned and it is only about 60% effective. My experience with this system is not to worry about it, you do not have to flog the cars like an Indy racer to keep them working. You can run any quality oil made for diesels with a low ash endorsement, VW in Europe recommends the 5w40 it is a Fuchs Titan GT 1 not available in this country.
There is no "magic" oil that will extend the life of the DPF another 100K miles. Buy the car if you can find one, you will like it, drive it like a sane person and it will go the distance.

 

[ZippyNH]

The size of the fuel tank, and the better MPG was what made me pick the Jetta back in 2015...
It does everything I need it to do, does it in comfort, and gets great mpg. No issues and I am still a happy camper.
Yes...I would have preferred the golf, but back in 2015 the $$ difference was simply too much for me to justify it.
The number of stick shift 2015 Cars must be getting very low...know when I picked the DSG (wife prefers an auto) that the sticks were pretty limited even when new.
The DSG has fine...better than a traditional auto, and usually pretty good.
Sweet spot seems to be 72 mph on the highway (done 45+, even a few 50 with 4 seats, full bags, ac on), but on 45 mph state roads have seen some GREAT mpg alone, just not a full tank to verify.
HONESTLY, with the great warrenty being given to cars as they are fixed, it would make it close to a no-brainer imo if you can find a car you like.
Both the golf and the Jetta get great mpg, a better ride, and I have a SE with the tech pack/aka connectivity pack, and the Bluetooth and HD radio is GREAT.

 

[Miss_Athanatos]

From reading your posts in this thread, I think a 6MT TDI is exactly what you want. I'd recommend that you get it before phase 2 of the "fix" and definitely OPT OUT of the settlement! If you can find someone who will reverse phase 1 of your fix, that would definitely work in your favor, as well. It doesn't sound like from the way you plan to drive the car that you will make it produce much NOx anyway. As long as you get it up to highway speeds (50+) at full warm-up temperature for 20 minutes every few hundred miles, or once a week if you get to the point where you're not putting many miles on it, then it should serve you fine. That should keep your DPF clean.

Oil changes and service are best priced by the person you plan to use to service the vehicle. I take my TDI to the dealer for service and haven't yet paid anything due to my extended warranty.

I would definitely do it if I were you.

I don't know about the OEM fog lights. It may require re-wiring or swapping modules.

Fahrvergnügen.

 

[unidenscan]

Miss A, not sure what you mean, "OPT OUT" of the setttlement. As a new 2015 tdi owner, are we entitled to $$$$??

 

[kjclow]

I think she is suggesting to not get the phase 2 of the fix, which no one knows yet how it will effect the performance.

 

[Miss_Athanatos]

Miss A, not sure what you mean, "OPT OUT" of the setttlement. As a new 2015 tdi owner, are we entitled to $$$$??

To my knowledge, after you purchase your phase 1 "fixed" vehicle, you will have a period in which you have to either opt out of the settlement or accept that you're going to turn in your car for the phase 2 "fix".

The only reason that I suggest opting out and having the phase 1 software changed is longevity of the car. The phase 1 software is going to make your emissions components work a lot more than what they were designed for, which typically boils down to unpredictable failures. The EPA has judged the cars "safe and legal to drive" without the "fix", so I wouldn't worry about not having it.

If you accept the car under the terms you're going to turn it in for phase 2, they have to give you the remaining third of the recall incentive, to my recollection. Just remember, no one knows how phase 2 will affect you, either to your car's detriment or benefit. Phase 2 does not yet exist and will have very little R&D (maybe months if we're all lucky) compared to the three-year production cycle R&D of the stock car.

-- Nicole

 

[acrossthepond]

I do about 32K a year for business with my diesels, I have had four.
Currently have the golf sportwagen tdi and I average overall 46 to 48, around town stop and go is about 37 to 42 and flat out on hi speed hywy is closer to 51mph. I use the rotella t6 synthetic 5w40 oil and the dealer changes it out for me around 7K for about $40 including the filter, cost of the oil is around 21 to 27$ per gallon, so an oil change is under $100. AC has never been a problem in the VWs.
Stop and go is not a problem for the modern diesels unless this is the only kind of driving you do and the car is rarely used. If you get it out on the road at least once a week for a good run at operating speed for twenty miles or so, this is sufficient to keep dpf system functioning. I have removed and replaced DPF systems and SCR units and had them cleaned so I have some experience with them, do not recommend this by the way as they are not designed to be cleaned and it is only about 60% effective. My experience with this system is not to worry about it, you do not have to flog the cars like an Indy racer to keep them working. You can run any quality oil made for diesels with a low ash endorsement, VW in Europe recommends the 5w40 it is a Fuchs Titan GT 1 not available in this country.
There is no "magic" oil that will extend the life of the DPF another 100K miles. Buy the car if you can find one, you will like it, drive it like a sane person and it will go the distance.

Good advice although pretty sure Fuchs Titan GT1 5w40 doesn't have VW 507 approval here which is required for DPF diesels.

 

[ZippyNH]

Thank you guys are totally wrong on the phase 2 fix
Car will still meet the same emissions standards as it did after phase 1 fix...
The reason for phase 2 is questions if the installation that was factory could last under the new requirements for the time required under the emissions longevity requirements for ALL CARS...
Even a slight increase in emissions would result in VW being in violation of the agreement....the actual emissions is close to what the equipment can do in good newish condition, no reduction due to age and wear....
Most systems have more "headroom" to allow the emissions to get more dirty as they age...
The change is essentially a second set of more if the same...maybe reengineering will be done to make it last longer, or simply cheaper...it was a part that VW thought would be a lifetime part in most installs...so there is a lead time to build more....
Once you are "fixed" stage one, you cannot opt out.
New 2015 have an agreement to get it done...
Older 2015 have the $$ in the second check, and the fact the warrenty is actually in TWO PARTS...
The first runs out unless you get the second fix.
But getting a second DPF for free puts off the day you might need to pay for a new one...
Good low Ash oil help, but reality is they last if they don't crack for a finite time...
So if we get new ones at 80,000 miles, most folks will be fine for another 100,000+ maybe longer, meaning most owners will never need to "Delete" or replace the system unless they go very high miles...more than the majority of owners ever will.