Mt. Washington New Hampshire

DieselJeff

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2003
Location
Nashua, NH
TDI
'10 Jetta 6MT & '11 Jetta DSG
I'm taking the family up Mt. Washington tomorrow morning. I haven't been up the mountain in a few years and never been in a car, always gone up on a motorcycle. We'll be taking the baby 2010 Jetta TDI that only has 900 miles on it. Since I'm still well within the breakin period should I do anything in particular.....low or high RPM's or just drive as I normally would?
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I'd keep it in the 2000-2500 rpm range, that'd be 2 or 3rd. I've never been up either, but I'd like to.

btw take the Kanc over to Conway, if you time it right you can make good time, if not you'll be stuck behind a motor home doing 20. Leave it in gear coasting down the other side, watch you're consumption climb.
 

White Crow

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Location
Maine
TDI
2002 gls tdi
Don't get too upset if it smokes a bit coming back down in a lower gear mine did last time I was up there lot of unburnt diesel. Going up was fun you'll love the torque. Hope it's good and clear for you the views are fantastic take a warm jacket it will be very cold up there this weekend.
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
I'm taking the family up Mt. Washington tomorrow morning. I haven't been up the mountain in a few years and never been in a car, always gone up on a motorcycle. We'll be taking the baby 2010 Jetta TDI that only has 900 miles on it. Since I'm still well within the breakin period should I do anything in particular.....low or high RPM's or just drive as I normally would?
Just drive it normally but follow the Auto Road's instructions. First gear is the ONLY gear you should be using and keep the RPMs around 2500-3000 RPM. Anything above 3000 RPM is a waste and you'll feel the torque fall off. Anything below 2500 RPM is a lot harder on it. 2500 RPM as you climb in first gear is the torquey sweet spot.

In late August I took my 2010 JSW TDI up Mt. Washington. It handled it great with its 6-speed manual transmission and low-end TORQUE. As for break-in I assume your following Drivbiwire's break-in guidelines, right? Basically don't baby it, don't use cruise control for the first 5k miles, drive it like you stole it by practicing frequent and firm application of power over the RPM range. The important thing is to regularly get on the power and LOAD the engine, not just get the RPMs up with a light load on the engine.

As for driving up the Mt Washington Auto Road in your new Jetta TDI, it will be good for it because it will keep the engine loaded on the way up. With my manual tranny, I found staying in first gear as recommended during the climb works best. Maintain around 2500-3000 RPM and you'll be at the recommended speed of 15-20 MPH. What I also do is crank the heater and fan controls to full HOT and max fan speed for extra cooling system capacity. I regulate my own temperature with the windows. When you get to the top and get parked, let it idle for several minutes before shutting it down because it will be thoroughly heatsoaked from a half hour of steady climbing at 15-20 MPH.

On the ride down, I leave it in first gear and stay off the brakes entirely except in a few spots where I briefly get on them hard and come almost to a stop before a major curve. I then let off the brakes and let the car slowly pick up speed again on its own. If I've got somebody coming down a little faster than I am, I use one of the turnouts along the way and let them pass. I'm not in a hurry at all. I once had somebody in a Honda Pilot SUV on my butt and I could smell his very hot brakes :eek: when I pulled over to let him go by. I could tell that driver doesn't know how to drive on the Mt. Washington Auto Road.

Manual trannies are best for the Mt.Washington Auto Road. :cool: My brakes weren't hot at all when I got to the bottom.

For anybody who has never driven up Mt. Washington before, the road is a steep, narrow, winding mountain road with no guardrails and steep dropoffs near the edge of the road. Rapidly changing weather and road conditions at different elevations also part of the driving experience. The drive is not for the faint of heart if these things bother you or if you're afraid of heights. Guided tours are available. The total length of the drive is just under 8 miles.

Mt. Washington Auto Road site: http://www.mountwashingtonautoroad.com/

I'm thinking about going up there tomorrow too! I'm watching the weather and summit forecasts carefully. Maybe we'll meet up. :cool:

Mount Washington Observatory site: http://www.mountwashington.org/
Current summit conditions and forecast: http://www.mountwashington.org/weather/conditions.php
 
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n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
Don't get too upset if it smokes a bit coming back down in a lower gear mine did last time I was up there lot of unburnt diesel. Going up was fun you'll love the torque. Hope it's good and clear for you the views are fantastic take a warm jacket it will be very cold up there this weekend.
It's actually not unburned fuel if your decelerating in gear since no fuel is injected whenever the engine is in an over-run condition like when engine-braking down a hill. Since there's no boost and the intake is somewhat under a vacuum during engine-braking, some oil inevitably gets past the turbo seals and accumulates in the intercooler. Some oil also gets past the turbo seals and into the exhaust system on the exhaust side of the turbo.

When you finally get out onto the main road (Route 16), you need to get on the power and accelerate at WOT up to ~ 4000 RPM in each gear to blow the excess oil out of the intercooler and intake. The combination of boost and high airflow will atomise the oil as it passes thru the intercooler before it reaches the engine. With an older TDI (prior to 2009), expect to see a lot of smoke behind you in your rearview mirror when you get on the power. Since the engine has been essentially *OFF* for a while (no fuel injected) due to engine braking while descending the mountain, the entire intake system will be nice and COLD and you'll love the extra power you'll have during the hard run at WOT. :cool:

So don't be afraid to get on the power when you get back onto Route 16 after coming down the mountain. It's a part of doing TDI preventive maintenance. :cool:
 
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DieselJeff

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2003
Location
Nashua, NH
TDI
'10 Jetta 6MT & '11 Jetta DSG
We'll be loading up and leaving at 9am. Maybe we'll see you up there. Look for a '10 Jetta Sedan Graphite Blue.
 

White Crow

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Location
Maine
TDI
2002 gls tdi
It's actually not unburned fuel if your decelerating in gear since no fuel is injected whenever the engine is in an over-run condition like when engine-braking down a hill. Since there's no boost and the intake is somewhat under a vacuum during engine-braking, some oil inevitably gets past the turbo seals and accumulates in the intercooler. Some oil also gets past the turbo seals and into the exhaust system on the exhaust side of the turbo.

When you finally get out onto the main road (Route 16), you need to get on the power and accelerate at WOT up to ~ 4000 RPM in each gear to blow the excess oil out of the intercooler and intake. The combination of boost and high airflow will atomise the oil as it passes thru the intercooler before it reaches the engine. With an older TDI (prior to 2009), expect to see a lot of smoke behind you in your rearview mirror when you get on the power. Since the engine has been essentially *OFF* for a while (no fuel injected) due to engine braking while descending the mountain, the entire intake system will be nice and COLD and you'll love the extra power you'll have during the hard run at WOT. :cool:

So don't be afraid to get on the power when you get back onto Route 16 after coming down the mountain. It's a part of doing TDI preventive maintenance. :cool:
OK let me ask this the pump at idle asks for the RPM's to be 903 you force it to a higher RPM doesn't the pump still want to inject enough fuel to keep it at idle? I just don't get how it will shut off all the fuel.
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
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Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
OK let me ask this the pump at idle asks for the RPM's to be 903 you force it to a higher RPM doesn't the pump still want to inject enough fuel to keep it at idle? I just don't get how it will shut off all the fuel.
Search "defueling" or "de-fueling".

All fueling goes to zero whenever the engine is in an over-run condition and is controlled by the ECU. The quantity adjuster (QA) collar inside the pump is able to cut fueling totally off when the ECU requests it. The engine is essentially "off" and MPGs are "infinite" as zero fuel is being injected when decelerating in gear while RPMs are above idle and your foot is off the pedal.

Fear not, as the pump still has plenty of lube by fuel in the high pressure stage when "off". Fuel still moves inside the pump even if all fueling has been cut off. The collar in the QA mechanism is used to expose or block an internal "short circuit" exit path from the high pressure stage as the plunger moves during each injection event. When maximum fueling is requested (at WOT for example under load), this exit path remains blocked by the collar as the plunger moves and the maximum quantity of fuel is forced out to an injector. For zero fueling, the exit path remains exposed all the time so all fuel simply gets returned inside the pump instead of being forced out to an injector. In between zero and max fueling like in normal driving, the QA collar is positioned somewhere in the middle of its range so the exit path gets exposed after the plunger has moved a certain amount. As the plunger continues to move, the remaining quantity of fuel gets returned inside the pump instead of being forced out to an injector. The end result is a precise amount of fuel is pushed out to an injector during each injection event ranging from none to max and controlled by the ECU.

Bottom line is all fueling goes to zero whenever the engine is in an over-run condition at any RPM.
 
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n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
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2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
We'll be loading up and leaving at 9am. Maybe we'll see you up there. Look for a '10 Jetta Sedan Graphite Blue.
I checked the summit forecast late last night and early this morning and decided to postpone our trip until Sunday. It looks like you're in the clouds now. The summit forecast for Sunday says it will be in the clear under mostly sunny skies. It will still be windy and cold. I've found from experience that the observatory's summit forecast tends to be VERY accurate however it's only a 1 day forecast so I check it often and right up until the last minute before heading out.

On a totally clear day you can see into 4 states (ME, NH, VT, NY) and Canada. The tops of buildings in Portland ME are visible. The Atlantic Ocean can be seen to the east and the Adirondacks in NY 130 air miles away can be seen to the west. :cool: You feel like you're on top of the world there with the 130 mile 360 degree panaoramic view. :cool: I normally bring my ham radio gear with me and play radio on the 2 meter and 440 bands while I'm up there. :cool:
 
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veedubyoo

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2010
Location
Page, AZ
TDI
96 Passat TDI Variant
Search "defueling" or "de-fueling".

All fueling goes to zero whenever the engine is in an over-run condition and is controlled by the ECU. The quantity adjuster (QA) collar inside the pump is able to cut fueling totally off when the ECU requests it. The engine is essentially "off" and MPGs are "infinite" as zero fuel is being injected when decelerating in gear while RPMs are above idle and your foot is off the pedal.

Fear not, as the pump still has plenty of lube by fuel in the high pressure stage when "off". Fuel still moves inside the pump even if all fueling has been cut off. The collar in the QA mechanism is used to expose or block an internal "short circuit" exit path from the high pressure stage as the plunger moves during each injection event. When maximum fueling is requested (at WOT for example under load), this exit path remains blocked by the collar as the plunger moves and the maximum quantity of fuel is forced out to an injector. For zero fueling, the exit path remains exposed all the time so all fuel simply gets returned inside the pump instead of being forced out to an injector. In between zero and max fueling like in normal driving, the QA collar is positioned somewhere in the middle of its range so the exit path gets exposed after the plunger has moved a certain amount. As the plunger continues to move, the remaining quantity of fuel gets returned inside the pump instead of being forced out to an injector. The end result is a precise amount of fuel is pushed out to an injector during each injection event ranging from none to max and controlled by the ECU.

Bottom line is all fueling goes to zero whenever the engine is in an over-run condition at any RPM.
I noticed this with my VagCom when checking my IQ...it goes to zero everytime you let up on the gas on the overun, pretty neat.
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
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Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
I noticed this with my VagCom when checking my IQ...it goes to zero everytime you let up on the gas on the overun, pretty neat.
I forget which measuring block it's in but if you look at fuel consumption you'll see it go to 0.00 L/hr whenever the engine is in an overrun condition.

Anyway, back to thread topic, a drive up the Mount Washington Auto Road in a TDI is a road trip worth taking. :cool:
 

White Crow

Veteran Member
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Mar 21, 2007
Location
Maine
TDI
2002 gls tdi
OK thanks it is done by the ECU afraid my injector pump knowledge is limited to tractors idle stop w.o.t stop pretty simple. I can see Mt Wash from my window as long as the high pressure holds should be nice tomorrow too be sure to take a warm jacket freezing tonight in the foot hills damn cold on the summit!
 

DieselJeff

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Joined
Nov 16, 2003
Location
Nashua, NH
TDI
'10 Jetta 6MT & '11 Jetta DSG
It was a nice clear day up there. The temp was about freezing with a crazy wind chill. We didn't spend much time outside. There was another silver Jetta TDI up there as well. Not sure if he's on this forum but was wearing a green sweatshirt.
 

n1das

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Joined
Jun 11, 2002
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Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
It was a nice clear day up there. The temp was about freezing with a crazy wind chill. We didn't spend much time outside. There was another silver Jetta TDI up there as well. Not sure if he's on this forum but was wearing a green sweatshirt.
How did the new Jetta TDI like the drive? Is it a 6-speed manual or a DSG auto?

My g/f and I took care of stuff today so we're free to go up there tomorrow.
 

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
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Location
Nashua, NH, USA
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2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
It was a beautiful day up there today (Sunday 10/4). Lots of people up theire enjoying the summit. Visibility was 120 miles. A little bit of haziness and a few clouds prevented having the ideal picture-perfect 130 mile visibility. The Atlantic Ocean cold be seen on the horizon to the east-southeast (about 95 miles away). Temps were around 37F with windchill making it feel like 20F. Winds were relatively calm, just a gentle breeze with occasional brief gusts.....very rare up at the summit of Mt. Washington for winds to be so calm.

The 2010 JSW TDI loved the ride up. On the way down, I got stuck behind a white knuckled driver in an Acura MDX big arse SUV that crawled down the steep narrow dirt portion of the road while riding their brakes the whole way. :mad: That driver definitely did NOT know how to drive on the Mt. Washington Auto Road. :mad: It occasionally made me use the brakes more than I would have otherwise. :mad: Eventually they pulled into a turnout to cool their *HOT* brakes. I could smell their hot brakes as I went by.

When I got to the bottom and out onto Route 16 northbound, I applied WOT and went at WOT up to 4000 RPM in each gear to get excess oil out of the intake system. I got a little bit of grey-white smoke at WOT for a few seconds and then it cleared up.
 
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740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
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2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
if it's illegal to do it on the auto road due to the snow-cat, than you can always do it on tuckermans, well worth it, crampons are a must.

Also many ski mountians are great for sleding, just don't get caught, half pipes are usually the best.
 
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ChippedNotBroken

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Dec 29, 2004
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Pocono\'s, NYC
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Jetta A4 1999.5 Green
if it's illegal to do it on the auto road due to the snow-cat, than you can always do it on tuckermans, well worth it, crampons are a must.

Also many ski mountians are great for sleding, just don't get caught, half pipes are usually the best.
Tuckermans at night? That would be suicide even with a parachute.
 

Abacus

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Nobleboro, Maine
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See signature for TDI's
It's not too bad, so long as the moon is out, I've hiked up many times in the dark without a headlamp. The snow reflects the light so it's really bright.

The Cats don't run at night up the auto road, which is why we sled at night, but it is "discouraged" by the park service (ok, they hate it), but it's so much fun. Tucks is not as exciting as it's all straight line sledding, and the ranger there gets really mad too.
 

veedubyoo

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Feb 18, 2010
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Page, AZ
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96 Passat TDI Variant
I got to ride the snowcat one year on an Alpine Photography course which included an overnight stay at the top in February...pretty wild experience...look forward to taking my TDI up there soon.
Dave
 

BrentRN

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New London, PA USA
TDI
Used to have many. Now a Golf TSI.
Had a nice run up Mount Washington yesterday. Stayed in 1st or 2nd all the way up without a hitch. The car felt like it was being pulled up the hill with no strain. The way down was mostly in 1st and only needs a tap of the brakes on the sharp turns. 2nd gear has a lot less engine braking, which sounds better, but required too much braking. There is a 12% grade in some spots. On the way up near the base I could smell the burning brakes of someone coming down.

The view was clear until the peak where clouds frequently obstructed the view. The temperature at the base was 76, at the peak it was 45 with a 40 mile an hour wind. Very cool...literally.

It would be great to have a TDI run to the top. They seem to be made for mountain climbing. The Minis do it every June. It took about 30 minutes to reach the peak. The record is an Subaru Impreza WRX in 6 minutes and 12 seconds. I don't think I would want to be in that car.
 

Red Sox Nation

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Feb 22, 2011
Location
NH - ND - WA
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'11 manual Jetta Sedan
I miss my home state of NH, and driving up north. I did drive up Mt Rainier, here in WA, on Monday though. The TDI LOVED it! Mt Rainier is 14,000+ feet. The feel of Mt. Washinton's auto road is missing from it though
 

Scenic Driver

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Orange County, NY
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You should try and go for the sunrise openings they do in the summer. Driving up in the pitch black at 4am is interesting, especially when there is fog.



 
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