Richard55
Vendor
thank you very much, that sure helps and lets me know in which direction I would like to also go. Again many thanks for all the info.
Mini Bixenons in my New Beetle!
- Thread starter schwarze Käfer
- Start date
Richard55
Vendor
Will the fX-Rs fit in our NB housing?
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
I wont be sure till I try, but I have ordered a set to try!
I know it can be made to work, but my concern is will it be as versatile & easy as the Mini retrofit - that's what I'm shooting for.
With the Mini projector, I use the stock reflector "carrier" (bracket), which allows for the retrofit to be performed by simply screwing everything together. (No hacking up the headlight and no gluing things together)
More benefits of this method include:
1. Stock headlight adjusters work.
2. Could use stock VW headlight range motor system, if desired.
3. Easy to put headlights back to stock.
4. Easy to swap retrofit to new headlight if yours becomes damaged.
I'm hoping that in order to make the FX-Rs work, all that will be necessary is to design a new mounting ring/plate. If that works out, the FX-Rs should be the way to go due to their better performance and ability to run 50 watts. Not to mention that the cost of an FX-R setup is virtually the same as a Mini setup.
James
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Richard55
Vendor
I've hooked up with "theretrofitsource.com" thru my TV channel and will be filming the entire process for broadcast. That should be interesting. Waiting to see which setup to film
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
Cool! Talk about a how-to!
Richard55
Vendor
yes it should be good, I have access to both the mini and the fx-Rs, waiting for you to give your stamp on which to go with. lol then I will get that one and do the how to on film. cant wait lol Matt and the guys at the retrofit source are really good people.
Richard55
Vendor
keep trying to get into the New Beetle.org and it wont let me in to see your photos with captions. pissed off lol. took my headlight out and cant seem to see how to get the reflector out once I get the front cover off. Help lol
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
You may have to register on Newbeetle.org to get at the photos?
I've got pics on here, too. Just haven't added captions.
http://pics.tdiclub.com/showgallery.php?cat=5285&page=3
Got to take the black back cover off, too. There'll be one screw (if it's OEM Bosch) then it should just unclip at the top.
Then you remove the range motor blank. (where the range motor would go)
WARNING: The range motor blank has a ball on the end that fits into a socket that is part of the plastic reflector carrier. Got to finesse that out, else it can break.
I try to tip the motor blank either up or down to slide it out of the socket.
It's no giant big deal if it breaks... You can glue it back together with JB Weld Epoxy.
Next step... You have to gently pop the ball on the white carrier bracket loose from the headlight housing. Again, you have to be semi-easy. Old Bosch plastic tends to become brittle from age & heat... I try to use a flat screwdriver to gently pry the wings of the socket apart as I push on the carrier from the backside of the housing.
This photo show the ball & socket after I had already separated them.
Then, you can remove the carrier/reflector assembly out of the headlight housing.
To remove the projector and separate the reflector from the carrier bracket - just remove the screws.
Removing screws holding the halogen projector to carrier bracket
Removing screws holding reflector to carrier bracket
All Disassembled!
Just remember - easy on the muscles! And JB weld fixes almost anything! lol
Seriously, I keep JB Quick epoxy on hand when working on my headlights!
And if something does break, I reinforce it with a piece of metal like a washer or screw when I epoxy it, for added strength.
How do I know? If you must ask, I broke one, too!
There's a piece of cut-off screw under the epoxy for added strength.
BTW, that's the socket for the range motor. On the DJ Auto lights, it's flimsy, and I'd recommend reinforcing them when you have your lights apart.
Hope this helps you!
James
I've got pics on here, too. Just haven't added captions.
http://pics.tdiclub.com/showgallery.php?cat=5285&page=3
Got to take the black back cover off, too. There'll be one screw (if it's OEM Bosch) then it should just unclip at the top.
Then you remove the range motor blank. (where the range motor would go)
WARNING: The range motor blank has a ball on the end that fits into a socket that is part of the plastic reflector carrier. Got to finesse that out, else it can break.
I try to tip the motor blank either up or down to slide it out of the socket.
It's no giant big deal if it breaks... You can glue it back together with JB Weld Epoxy.
Next step... You have to gently pop the ball on the white carrier bracket loose from the headlight housing. Again, you have to be semi-easy. Old Bosch plastic tends to become brittle from age & heat... I try to use a flat screwdriver to gently pry the wings of the socket apart as I push on the carrier from the backside of the housing.
This photo show the ball & socket after I had already separated them.
Then, you can remove the carrier/reflector assembly out of the headlight housing.
To remove the projector and separate the reflector from the carrier bracket - just remove the screws.
Removing screws holding the halogen projector to carrier bracket
Removing screws holding reflector to carrier bracket
All Disassembled!
Just remember - easy on the muscles! And JB weld fixes almost anything! lol
Seriously, I keep JB Quick epoxy on hand when working on my headlights!
And if something does break, I reinforce it with a piece of metal like a washer or screw when I epoxy it, for added strength.
How do I know? If you must ask, I broke one, too!
There's a piece of cut-off screw under the epoxy for added strength.
BTW, that's the socket for the range motor. On the DJ Auto lights, it's flimsy, and I'd recommend reinforcing them when you have your lights apart.
Hope this helps you!
James
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schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
BTW, the headlight in the photo is an aftermarket DJ Auto unit, so it will be slightly different in appearance than a Bosch.
Also, the wires coming from the back cover are from my HID kit that I installed last year into the stock halogen projector.
Also, the wires coming from the back cover are from my HID kit that I installed last year into the stock halogen projector.
Richard55
Vendor
Thanks for all the help friend
Richard55
Vendor
James it appears that the adapter for the fx-r will be super simple to make up this should be a real easy mod and a super on once installed on our NBs. Went back to the retrofit source and Matt showed me a real easy way to get the projector level the first time. I love this mod.. Matt said they have real good results with "fastset anchoring adhesive" by Sika for any repairs or just to keep it all together once everything is adjusted. Don't think I will completely set it, when I'm done, but who knows now.
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schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
Hey Richard,
I'm still waiting on my FX-Rs, but I did take some measurements today and used TRSBrad's measurements of the FX-Rs. I think it will just fit using the same method I used for the minis. You have to remember, with the mounting ring, the projector will actually sit up out of the carrier bracket by ~ 1/2". With the taper of the bowl, I think it will clear the carrier bracket, just... lol
Are you talking about affixing the projector directly to the carrier bracket?
If so, it might work, too. The only concern would be heat on the plastic bracket anywhere the projector contacts it.
James
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
I'm sure you're not going to be disappointed with the retrofit. Even with just the minis @ 35 watts, I'm very pleased! Like I told you on the phone, I'm enjoying driving at night again!
And if the FX-Rs live up to their reputation, I'll just about guarantee that you won't be able to outdrive your lights, even with your ride!
And if the FX-Rs live up to their reputation, I'll just about guarantee that you won't be able to outdrive your lights, even with your ride!
Richard55
Vendor
Im looking forward to lighting up the night. lol I am going to mount the fx-r in front of the mounting ring not behind like the oem projector. Is that the way you were thinking of doing it? very simple mounting adapter that way. I think I will try it directly to the mounting bracket with small adapter. Don't think with the fx-r there will be a problem with heat. Might even try two separate mounting arch type mounts instead of just one round one.
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
The FX-R has to be elevated above the carrier bracket, otherwise it won't fit, horizontally. (the bowl is a couple of mm too wide at the flange)
I plan to use the same ring & mounting method I used on the mini, only the cut-out for the projector will be sized for the FX-R. With the taper of the bowl, it should just fit. On the vertical axis, there should be plenty of room.
Mini mounting method (FX-R will be similar):
Don't be too sure about the heat! The mini @ 35 watts gets well over 250 degrees F at it's mounting flange and will melt plastic. I suspect the FX-R @ 55 watts will be near 300 degrees F.
James
Richard55
Vendor
that is hot, hope it will be ok. and on second look you are mounting to the front of the adjuster sweet. Mounting base for the fx-r is way wider, real close to the stock points.
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schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
The heat is a concern, and even though it's <= to the heat of oem halogens, it's being concentrated in an entirely different location in the housing. It's become obvious to me that the oem reflector's design is as much a heat shield as a reflector.
Yeah, without hacking up the headlight, the FX-R is going to be a tight squeeze, for sure.
Yeah, without hacking up the headlight, the FX-R is going to be a tight squeeze, for sure.
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
FX-Rs & shrouds scheduled to arrive tomorrow. New headlights to arrive Monday.
Shot some driving video of the minis last night... Camera mount ordered... lol
Plan on shooting & posting video of the Mini H1, FX-R @ 35 watts & 55 watts.
That should help everyone decide which way they'd like to go.
Shot some driving video of the minis last night... Camera mount ordered... lol
Plan on shooting & posting video of the Mini H1, FX-R @ 35 watts & 55 watts.
That should help everyone decide which way they'd like to go.
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
FX-R (generation II) projectors & shrouds have arrived!
I believe fitment isn't going to be too much of a problem, however, this is as big as we can go without hacking up the headlight - i.e. without custom one-offing it.
First Impressions (on strictly eyeballing the FX-R):
Much higher quality and more robust construction than the Mini.
Bowl plating looks good - smooth & uniform. - better than the Mini.
Looks like much greater value for the money vs the Mini.
Overall, I'm very impressed with the FX-R.
We'll have to wait & see if it's performance is as good as it's looks.
I should have my new headlights on Monday!
James
I believe fitment isn't going to be too much of a problem, however, this is as big as we can go without hacking up the headlight - i.e. without custom one-offing it.
First Impressions (on strictly eyeballing the FX-R):
Much higher quality and more robust construction than the Mini.
Bowl plating looks good - smooth & uniform. - better than the Mini.
Looks like much greater value for the money vs the Mini.
Overall, I'm very impressed with the FX-R.
We'll have to wait & see if it's performance is as good as it's looks.
I should have my new headlights on Monday!
James
Richard55
Vendor
sweet James my same thoughts going to be great
Pat Dolan
Veteran Member
Since you have been careful to try to get it right, please let me just catch a few extra notes. ALL projectors use a D1S (ballast on bulb) or D2S (separate ballast). D1R/D2R are reflector bulbs (capsules in HID speak) - the "R" stands for reflector. Yes, there ARE genuine reflector HID lights, and man, do they put out some serious illumination.
The reason you can't just "drop in" and HID "conversion" to a reflector lamp of any kind is that the geometry is based on a tiny, hot coil of wire emitting the light, whereas an HID capsule has a big globe of glowing gasses, 2 to 3 times the size of the halogen element. The allowable tolerance is a few thousandths of an inch, not something double or tripple the size! This is why projectors are even more intolerant of "drop-in" - their optical surfaces are much smaller and therefore less tolerant of geometric errors.
I have trouble believing that the "Mini H1" is a competently designed light. NO OEM would make something using a rebased bulb, since there are NO standards for such abberations, and the aftermarket is notoriously bad at coming anywhere close to anything - after all, how could they when there is no such thing as a reflector and lense designed for H1, H3, H4, H7, 9004, etc. that has the correct geometry for an HID capsule - so there is no standard dimension to make them work in ANY housing of any kind.
Do yourself (and everyone coming at you on the road) a HUGE favour and do your retrofits with OEM projectors and capsules. You WILL notice the difference (and, as you are probably aware, there are OEM projectors and there are OEM projectors).
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
Well now, I'm not sure of your intentions, but I do find many of your comments offensive.
You come across as nothing more than a wanna-be know-it-all troll, and, I doubt that you have any personal experience with the Mini H1 projector. I do have such personal knowledge.
Further, I'm confident that I've researched the topic sufficiently to not need to be "schooled" by a jackleg such as yourself.
With that said, if you have something constructive to add, and learn to use the appropriate "tone", I would personally welcome such advice. However, negative, baseless criticism is not welcome.
Perhaps you are just too stuck on yourself to realize what an insulting a$$ you can be.
Excuse me folks, I'm normally very nice, but I'm not going to be a doormat for a trolling idiot.
Mr. Jackleg's personal feelings aside, the Mini H1 is as good as, and better than most "OEM" HID projectors. That includes the uber-expensive VW option for the New Beetle. Very few "OEM" projectors have a better controlled or cleaner cutoff line - or beam spread for that matter, including "OEM" VW.
Yes, there are a few "OEM" projectors that are better - by a small margin, but there are absolutely none anywhere near as inexpensive - and even fewer that would fit into the New Beetle headlight housing.
The Mini H1 is fine, and a great value for the money. And, if it is adjusted properly, will not glare or blind oncoming vehicles - at all.
Now, that said, I'm researching the FX-R projector. As it's only a few dollars more than the Mini H1, and has a reputation for better performance and quality; I'm about to retrofit it into a brand new set of headlights so that I will have the personal knowledge and experience to share with you. I do believe that it has the potential for being the best "fit" for our New Beetles and remain an inexpensive mod. In a week or two, it will no longer be a belief, I will know which is best.
That's the whole point of this thread - to share my personal experience & knowledge with this forum as has been shared with me.
James
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Pat Dolan
Veteran Member
do not confuse cutoff with quality of lighting. It is the light distribution within the pattern that defines good optics, and you can only get that if you know where the light source is - which is impossible with a rebased bulb unless the same company makes the bulb - or in some alternative universe has it made accurately to their specs. That doesn't mean the MiniH1 is NOT a good light, it's just very, very unlikely to be OEM quality optics.
Something else you will find on your next retrofit: the larger reflector in the FX-R will collect a lot more light from the source than your Minis do.
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
The Mini H1 is fine- it even works great with my $15 rebased DDM tuning H1 bulbs. The Mini D2S sucks, even with the "OEM" Philips bulb the D2S can't hold a candle to the Mini H1. That's why I went with the Mini H1 instead of the Mini D2S, in the first place. The other reason I originally went with the Mini H1 was because I was reasonably sure it would fit.
Duh, ya think? If you've been following my posts, you'd know that's the reason I've already acquired the FX-R.
Pat, you're missing the whole point. If I, or most of the other folks interested in this had an extra $1800 burning a hole in our pockets, we still wouldn't blow it on "OEM" headlights. That's just ridiculous.
Perhaps if VW had put decent "OEM" headlights in the New Beetle to begin with instead of pure-dee-hell junk, this would all be a moot point.
If money were not the object, few of us would be driving Beetles.
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
Here's a link to a couple of short video clips.
As these are poor quality, I hadn't intended on posting them.
However, I feel the need to defend the quality of the Mini H1 and my $35, 1yr old DDM tuning 35 watt HID kit.
I do plan on shooting clips of the Minis & FX-Rs for comparison purposes.
Form your own opinion of the performance of the Mini H1. I personally think they're pretty darn good. And btw, they are aimed conservatively LOW.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fqhuehqwdr0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grLKpYmEWgE
A few notes about the video clips:
Shot with an Olympus Stylus digital camera-auto settings, handheld (obviously), 65mph.
The road appears brighter than it really is, off to the sides appears darker.
You can easily see 80 feet+ into the ditches that appear dark in the video.
In the second clip, I saw the deer easily a full second before you can in the video.
(You can tell when I saw the deer - I hit the zoom button on the camera...)
I deliberately have the headlights aimed low, (and to the right), for residential street driving.
For highway driving, I could easily adjust the beams up for an additional 50' + of reach without blinding oncoming drivers.
This is the reason I'm also going to pursue a home-spun headlight range motor system.
(The headlights will be adjustable from inside the car, while driving down the road)
BTW, the white dashed stripes are 10' long - the empty space between is 30'.
(each dashed stripe represents 40')
Once my windshield mount arrives, I'll make better clips.
As these are poor quality, I hadn't intended on posting them.
However, I feel the need to defend the quality of the Mini H1 and my $35, 1yr old DDM tuning 35 watt HID kit.
I do plan on shooting clips of the Minis & FX-Rs for comparison purposes.
Form your own opinion of the performance of the Mini H1. I personally think they're pretty darn good. And btw, they are aimed conservatively LOW.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fqhuehqwdr0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grLKpYmEWgE
A few notes about the video clips:
Shot with an Olympus Stylus digital camera-auto settings, handheld (obviously), 65mph.
The road appears brighter than it really is, off to the sides appears darker.
You can easily see 80 feet+ into the ditches that appear dark in the video.
In the second clip, I saw the deer easily a full second before you can in the video.
(You can tell when I saw the deer - I hit the zoom button on the camera...)
I deliberately have the headlights aimed low, (and to the right), for residential street driving.
For highway driving, I could easily adjust the beams up for an additional 50' + of reach without blinding oncoming drivers.
This is the reason I'm also going to pursue a home-spun headlight range motor system.
(The headlights will be adjustable from inside the car, while driving down the road)
BTW, the white dashed stripes are 10' long - the empty space between is 30'.
(each dashed stripe represents 40')
Once my windshield mount arrives, I'll make better clips.
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Richard55
Vendor
Go Brother, Go Must be some kind of salesman from north of the border. lol and remember never try to improve anything and vote to the left always. lol James your research is great, keep it up.
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schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
Hey Lonnie!
Not too shabby for $200, eh? Glad you like them.
And honestly, the camera (or camera operator) doesn't do them justice. I promise to work on my cinematography skills!
Barring any hiccups, I figure about 10 days to have the FX-R retro done and pretty well tested. I'm really liking the FX-R projector!
Still, I honestly don't think anyone would be disappointed with the Minis,
but I can't wait to get the FX-Rs installed to see what they can do!
If I understand correctly, doesn't the instrument panel dimmer/range motor combo switch just replace the stock dimmer? (fit in same hole) ?
James
Pat Dolan
Veteran Member
Yeah, finally got a chance to look through other posts, see you are onto the size does matter thing. When you get to a pair of Lightforce 240s with 50 watt HIDs you will be up to speed.
When I say OEM, I dont mean neccessarily OEM to THAT car. As I said (and as you know) there is OEM and there is OEM. Could not agree more that the supplied projectors are not that good. I have been forced due to business and liability constraints to deal only with legally compliant hardware and installations, but I am soon to be free to play with retrofits and impatiently waiting for the time to do so (have a lot of hardware laying around). First to fall prey will be my wifes MkIV wagon (Hella bi-x hi-low, 90mm D2R modules for driving (extra high) and micro DE fogs (may do Optilux HID instead).
schwarze Käfer
Veteran Member
Not so much the bigger is better thing, but the option to run 50 watts, if desired, without cooking the projector bowls. With an FX-R setup only around $20 more than the Mini H1, it'd be silly not to try it.
I would have originally used the FX-R, but I didn't think it would fit.
Now that I have the FX-Rs, looks that they'll fit with almost 1mm to spare.
(yes, it's that tight)
Now mind you, I could do a one-off retrofit - hack up & glue job and put virtually anything into the Beetle housing. But, that's not my goal.
My goal is to make an easy retrofit with no cutting, no gluing - simple screw together construction- that is easily reversible to stock and all the while, affordable. All this and something your average guy can DIY.
The Mini H1 fits that bill and works very well. I'm confident that the FX-R
is going to work as well and also be a bit more reliable & versatile.