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MikesTDI letter from VW timing belt interval

leicaman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Location
Sheboygan, Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2005 TDI GLS, RIP
I am posting this re the benefit of MikesTDI. He asked me to post this for him.

He asked VW specifically about the timing belt change interval and VW responded to him with the an 80k interval. I've talked to Oilhammer who says its okay to 100k. Can you gurus chime in and let us all know your opinions on this. I've changed his name on the correspondence to his handle fyi.

---------------

Reference # 808106419
Dear Mr. MikesTDI:
Thank you for your e-mail requesting information regarding the maintenance on your Passat. I can understand you wish to take the best possible care of such an impressive car, and I appreciate the opportunity to respond.
We recommend the timing belt to be replaced at 80,000 miles on your Passat. The oil recommended to be used in your engine is VW 505 01 quality, fully synthetic oil. I am happy to clarify this information for you. For any further questions regarding the technical aspects of the maintenance on your car, please contact your local Volkswagen service facility.
As a valued member of the Volkswagen family, your questions are important to us. Again, thank you for your e-mail. If I may be of future assistance regarding this, or any other matter, please don’t hesitate to contact me again by e-mail at www.vw.com, or through our Customer CARE Center at (800) 822-8987. If I am not available one of my colleagues will be able to assist you.
Sincerely,



Gabrielle De Land
Ext. 43544
Customer CARE Advocate
*Please do not reply to this e-mail, as we currently are unable to accept replies. Thank you in advance for your understanding.
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
it's interesting if they're officially backing away from the 100k interval. Personally, I don't think it's a bad idea based upon failures we've seen over the past few years. It's a risk simply not worth taking.

Take care, G!
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
I have yet to see a single PD engine, or a single later ALH engine (2003) that has had any issues before 100k miles. I note the position of things, like the tensioner indicator, and how far 'off' the cam is before the lock pin will slide in, and in every case the PDs all still look like new.

Of all the ALH engines that have simply NEGLECTED the belt, the original one from the factory, but remained untouched otherwise, I have seen failures as low as 117k and as high as 196k. The later (textured style) belts that all the 100k mile ALHs get, which is the same material all the PDs already have, seems to hold up really, really well.

In fact, 99% of every timing belt or timing belt related issue I see on any VAG diesel engine is from neglect, or doing the job incompletely and/or improperly. And trust me I see PLENTY of that, as do others.
 

leicaman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Location
Sheboygan, Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2005 TDI GLS, RIP
Thank you for clarifying this Oilhammer. I will have mine inspected at 80k by a guru and then move on from there.
 

leicaman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Location
Sheboygan, Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2005 TDI GLS, RIP
Here's what VW says on their very own website re 2005 Passat TDI as of Nov 8, 2008:

Items to be serviced:

Engine Oil - change


Engine Filter - change


Timing Belt - check


V Belt/Ribbed Belt - check tension/condition


Air Cleaner - replace filter


Water Separator - drain


Fuel Filter - replace


Windshield Washer Fluid - check level


Automatic Shift Lock - check operation


Brake System - check damage/leaks, pad thickness, fluid level


Wheels - rotate from front to rear


Battery - check electrolyte level


Engine - check for leaks


Pollen Filter - replace


Cooling System - check level


Transmission - check for leaks


Tires/Spare - check condition


Driveshaft - check boots


On Board Diagnostics - check Diagnostic Trouble Code memory


Door Hinge - lube


Headlights - check and adjust if necessary


Exhaust System - check for damage and leaks


Sunroof Frame - clean and lubricate


Road Test - check system functions during and after


Power Steering - check fluid level


Automatic Trans. Fluid and Differential - Check for leaks / level. Add if necessary


Front Axle - check dust seals, ball joints, tie rods
 
Last edited:

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
My stealer and my manual both say: visual inspection at 144,000 km (90,000 miles), and if all is well, you can motor on to 160,000 km (100,000 miles) where definitive replacement is required.
 

volkswagendude

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2004
Location
Canada
TDI
None for now...
^^^^+1. My manual writes the same.

Regardless of that, I had mine changed at 141000 km (87613 miles), even though visual inspection looked good. Overkill to say the least, but with RC2 and a heavy foot once in a while, it made sense in my world.
 

dhuddleson

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2007
Location
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
TDI
2012 Jetta Highline TDI sedan
I have to agree with what you see in the printed manual, however the printed manual cannot dynamically update itself....

I have the DVD eBahn (Bentley) repair manual, and of course it includes the Maintenance Schedules. You get 1 year of electronic updates with the electronic manual, and I checked about once per month for updates and applied them all. The schedules were last updated May 16, 2008, and the 1.9 and the 2.0 PD diesel engine schedules are both revised with Timing Belts replacement (no, not check) at 80K miles (128K kms). Hey, I am not making it up, it's there in black & white. I also recently asked the local dealer when I need to do the Timing Belt, and they also want to do it at the same mileage. So, this is a fairly recent change, and maybe has not been widely published....

Perhaps VW is just erring on the safe side.... even if experience in the field shows that belts look good at over 100K miles.
 

johnboy00

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2000
Location
Bridgewater,Ma.,USA
TDI
2005 Passat Wagon, 2004 Jetta, 2003 Jetta wagon
If VW changed the interval and didn't inform me, doesn't that make them liable if my belt fails between 80,000 and 100,000 miles?
 

leicaman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2004
Location
Sheboygan, Wisconsin
TDI
2015 Golf TDI SE, 2005 TDI GLS, RIP
johnboy00 said:
If VW changed the interval and didn't inform me, doesn't that make them liable if my belt fails between 80,000 and 100,000 miles?
Wouldn't that make it a safety drivability issue and thus under the NHTSA control?
 

pepitotdi

Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2008
Location
San Antonio TX
TDI
VW Passat TDI 05
Advice San Antonio TX

My 2005 VW Passat gls TDI is 90k and needs its timing belt to be replaced. I quote the local VW shop and they are asking for a handsome ammount of money for timing belt change. Is anyone aware of a good VW garage here in San Antonio TX, that will do the same for a more sensible ammount??

Thanks


Antonio
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
pepitotdi said:
My 2005 VW Passat gls TDI is 90k and needs its timing belt to be replaced. I quote the local VW shop and they are asking for a handsome ammount of money for timing belt change. Is anyone aware of a good VW garage here in San Antonio TX, that will do the same for a more sensible ammount??

Thanks


Antonio
Not sure what you mean by sensible amount, but in addition to the nearly $900 worth of timing belt you need, you should also read this thread:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=223941

The timing belt kit at our shop retails for about $350, the labor is 5 hours, plus $25 worth of coolant.
 

ymz

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 12, 2003
Location
Between Toronto & Montreal
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI Wagon, 2003 Jetta TDI Wagon
pepitotdi said:
Is anyone aware of a good VW garage here in San Antonio TX
Todd Herman at www.dieseltoyz.com is good with the older engines... I don't know if he's up to date on the later ones, but it doesn't hurt to ask... 210--683--9663

Read what's in Oilhammer's link... (and you could point Todd to it as well...)

Yuri.
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
Manuals says 100k (US) and I will start planning when at 90 based on time of year, use patterns, and how it works out for us (basically not to get caught out going past about 98k).

VW has to notify if that changes and I suspect like the oil, not all reps know or are looking in the right place. The new belts are new and improved.

I have seen some of that at work (we use the same type belt on conveyor drives). The old ones are being replaced by new ones that are 1/3 the width. Technology does change. In this case they went to carbon fiber material, and that's incredibly strong (its the same stuff they are making the new Boeing 786 fuselage and wings out of).
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
Manuals says 100k (US) and I will start planning when at 90 based on time of year, use patterns, and how it works out for us (basically not to get caught out going past about 98k).

VW has to notify if that changes and I suspect like the oil, not all reps know or are looking in the right place. The new belts are new and improved.

I have seen some of that at work (we use the same type belt on conveyor drives). The old ones are being replaced by new ones that are 1/3 the width. Technology does change. In this case they went to carbon fiber material, and that's incredibly strong (its the same stuff they are making the new Boeing 786 fuselage and wings out of).
 

Lug_Nut

TDIClub Enthusiast, Pre-Forum Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 20, 1998
Location
Sterling, Massachusetts. USA
TDI
none, 2014 Chevy Volt, 1988 Bolens DGT1700H
Going by the owner's manual as it was printed, when it was printed, is nonsense.
The 1996 1Z engine does not have a timing belt replacement interval at all, just a periodic inspection and button it back up if it looks OK.:confused:
If there is a reduction in life of such an important component as a timing belt I'd like to know of it, Claiming that the old information is still valid despite new evidence to the contrary is silliness.
But, is there any other claim or evidence that the interval has indeed been reduced?
 

senez

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2007
Location
Raleigh, NC
TDI
15 Passat DSG
I think the major problem here is that VW has not notified every owner this would effect. It's not up to us to keep up with the latest information VW puts out if they're not making a concerted effort to let us know about it.
 

CsTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
Location
Baltimore, Maryland
TDI
'10 TouaregTDI, '15 JettaTDI
Is there agreement in VW for an 80k change? I wonder if VW would second that change letter in a separate signed letter/email?

If correct, what does this new information say about the replacement belts? Have they gone back to the older belts? Are replacement belt also going to be 80k?
 

johnboy00

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2000
Location
Bridgewater,Ma.,USA
TDI
2005 Passat Wagon, 2004 Jetta, 2003 Jetta wagon
If the interval has changed, shouldn't there be a TSB that references the change? How else can VW inform their dealer network about the change?

If the e-mail is the only thing to go by, and no additional information referencing the change exists, I would venture to guess that VWs customer service people are about as useful as their dealer service network.
 

johnboy00

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2000
Location
Bridgewater,Ma.,USA
TDI
2005 Passat Wagon, 2004 Jetta, 2003 Jetta wagon
Someone at VW knows about the balance shaft chain problem. Or maybe it was a penny pincher who realized VW could reduce the number of stocked parts if it replaced the chain with a gear system.:eek::eek::eek:
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
oilhammer said:
You guys realize you are talking about the same people that have NO IDEA about the BHW balance shaft chain issue, right? :p
I guess we just keep hoping!

Point taken, but would also think references to a TSB in the letter if it was true.

It would not be the first time someone threw out stuff that they thought they knew (including me from time to time!)

Certainly keep up on it, but my suspicions are its information taken from the wrong sources and passed on.
 

mparker326

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2005
Location
Knoxville, TN
TDI
Golf 2002 Gray
I've looked on European forums before and looked for TB change intervals for TDI's and the maximum change interval I've seen is 80k.

Don't know if everything is apples to apples.

My OM, says change at 90K & 100K. Second replacement is probably to fix what the dealer screwed up at 90k;)
 

BadMonKey

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Location
Colorado
TDI
2013 Focus ST
oilhammer said:
Until I see a single problem with a PD timing belt before 100k, I am still going to tell everyone 100k miles...stick or automatic.
OH; have you changed the TB in your 04? Isn't there a time line limit to TB changes like 100K miles or #years?
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis (where it's safe)
TDI
There are just too many to list....
No, I have not. I would say 8 years maybe? 6? I dunno really. These newer style belts seem to always look like new when you take them off, but as of yet the oldest PD here is only about 5 years old now.
 

CsTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
Location
Baltimore, Maryland
TDI
'10 TouaregTDI, '15 JettaTDI
well VW sent me this yeterday. Sorry about the sloppyness in the transfer. The original spelled everything correctly but somehow in the transfer obviously some things got jumbled and misspelled.

Bottom line, I personally will come close to but not over 100k for the original belt and feel very comfortable taking it up to 100k with feedback from folks like very experienced gurus like Oilhammer as well as I believe that VW thinking had to be confident and bold when they raised it from 80k to 100k but I think for the replacement I will probably go back to 80k.

IMO, either the reduction back down to 80k had an issue or real concern that caused them to question their liability for engine repair/replacement caused by snapping belts- but yet they did not put out a TSB or Safety recall... In this economy, people are at least thinking twice about keeping their cars longer with purchased used vehicle numbers "up" and new vehicle numbers "down". I am looking more to suspect that if you are thinking about it in terms of "keeping the Passat up and running for many more miles to come", irrespective of the owner, you are going to pay the "Balloon" payment for the replacement belt. If you can't, you are going to trade the car in before the 100k extended warranty runs out. However, if you are on the other side, there is nothing worse for VW "certified" image or non-certified than buying a used dealer Passat with high 90k on the odometer (traded in right before the 100k extended warranty expires) only to find out that as the new owner you have to spend another $500.-$1200. (one dealer in my area several years ago quoted $1200. ) right away on top of the car purchase and if you don't it could very well be the death of the car you just got. If the belt interval is 80k, procrastinators that want to keep the car will get it done in plenty of time, those turning it in may go for the trade much earlier, say around 80k, which would give new buyers a little breather vefore the belt replacement --just my opinion worth 2 cents




Nov. 19. 2008 2: 49PM
No. 0521
P. 2







RE:
Case:
VIN:
2005 Volkswagen Passat
-----------.~
.~ ;,.
Anna Maria Ghidro Name Customer CARE Advocate Title Volkswagen Customer CARE Depanmem Ext. 43024 Phone
Fax
www.VW.com E-Man
November 19, 2008 DOle







Dear M:t
Thank you for contacting us with your questions about the timing belt inspectlon and replacement schedule for your car. Per our conversation on November 18'h, I om glad to provide you with the following information regarding your car's timing belt.
Currently, the recommended scheduled maintenance calls for an inspection of the timing belt every 40,000 miles and a replacement of the timing belt every 80,000 miles. As the timing belt is an integral component in your car's engine, we want to continually ensure it is in excellent condition. I hope this information is helpful, as we understand that proper timely maintenance can keep your Passot up and running for many more miles to come.
As a member of lhe Volkswagen family, your questions are important to us. If I may be of further assistance regarding this, or any other matter, please don't hesitate to contact me again bye-mail atwww.vw.com. or through our Customer CARE Center at (800) 822. 8987. If I om not available one of my colleagues will be able to assist you.
Sincerely,
A~fh~~
Anna Mario Ghidro ~
Customer CARE Advocate
Volkn"OS91l 01 America, Inc. Customer CARE
34?9 Wesl Hamlin Rd. Rochesler Hills. MI 48309 Phone +1 eoo B22 e987 Fox +1248 754 6504
.WWW.vw.com



 

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
Interestingly I just got a letter from VW this week about the timing belt replacement interval update to the manual.... for my 2.0T. Actually it's to correct a misprint, the manual said replace at 180,000 km or 120,000 miles whereas it really meant 180,000 km or 110,000 miles.
 
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