Mercedes E250 Bluetec

[ssamalin]

GDI cars have unproven reliability. Diesels are super reliable and durable. Gassers have 30% more greenhouse gasses. I appreciate not having to rev to 15k every time the light turns green, in my traffic stop and go all the time x 1000. Torque power is completely different than horsepower in terms of the quality of driving. I don't drag race from corner to corner for some thrill. I just get smooth starts and merging response exactly when I need it.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Sir, you're entirely welcome to drive a diesel for whatever reason you choose. It's a free country. There's no need to prove it's better than a similar gasoline engine car, or that it's better suited to your needs.

I drive diesels first and foremost because I like them. I do happen to drive a lot of miles, and I also keep my cars a fairly long time...longer now that I'm driving TDIs. And I like filling up less frequently. But those are preferences of mine, not needs.

Enjoy the Mercedes. And keep in mind that even though you like yours, it's not for everyone.

 

[ssamalin]

The last post asked me why I drive a diesel so I answered his question. Sharing info is the whole idea, right?

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Yes, but your data is entirely wrong. GDI engines last a long time, perhaps as long as diesel. And modern turbocharged gasoline engines have torque curves very similar to diesel, often making peak torque below 2000 RPM. Plus they have much higher rev limits and make more horsepower.

In terms of day-to-day driving there isn't a lot of difference between diesel and turbocharged gasoline these days. Fuel economy for the diesel is still better, but it costs a significant premium to get it. So unless you drive a lot you're going to pay more for a diesel powered car.

 

[ssamalin]

You left out known issues:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/02/pros-and-cons-of-direct-injection-engines/index.htm

I doubt GDI operates like new (diesel-like torque, etc.) much after leaving the show room when its engine gets this carbon crud and it's fuel system gets clogged. Then you go to the dealer with stalling and limping and they don't cover it. If they have one of the TSBs they tell you to avoid ethanol and use engine cleaner. Good luck with that. I trust proven diesel reliability, not GDI which for now is hyped as "reliable and performs like diesel" despite that fact that evidence to the contrary is mounting.

 

[PeteZ06]

You left out known issues:

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/02/pros-and-cons-of-direct-injection-engines/index.htm

I doubt GDI operates like new after leaving the show room. I trust proven diesel reliability, not GDI which only now is being touted as reliable. We'll see.

I don't doubt that a diesel engine will outlast a gasoline engine.

But it doesn't seem like you keep your cars long nor drive without a warranty, so any longevity problems with the GDI wouldn't even effect you.

And even if its solely because you enjoy the tq vs hp feel then I totally get that, makes sense.

I'm glad you've been posting about the E250.. I'm pretty sure that will be my next car.

 

[ssamalin]

I traded in my previous car a 2006 Jetta TDI after putting more than 20k/year on it for 8 years, and only because it's crash tests were obsolete. I like having diesel road chops even if I'm more settled for now. Who knows what the next chapter brings. 2015 E250BT will be coming off lease this August. There are some of them on Cargurus now for low 40s. Get at least a late built 2015, it has important unibody safety upgrades not found on the 2014.

 

[PeteZ06]

Locally I found a 2015 E250 AWD, 5K miles for $36K

 

[ssamalin]

Locally I found a 2015 E250 AWD, 5K miles for $36K

I highly recommend this car. A+. I wanted RWD because the handling is better than AWD. I'm not in any bad weather, if I was, I'd be a lot more AWD like. As for the best deal, as I said, they will be plentiful at dealers soon, but the deal you mentioned sure sounds good. Other factors are "certified", extended warranty, pre-paid maintenance, lease or buy, loan terms etc. My understanding is the radar braking is mostly standard on the
15, whereas the 16 has the driver assistance package and more of that stuff in it. I didn't really want the LED light package on the 15, it didn't seem good. I got the white with the black wood trim, beige seats. Hope to hear about your impressions of the car soon. Also I ditched my run flats right away, bought a spare and a jack, and got Michelin Primacys, (Mercedes Only - MO) That cramps my trunk space. I don't recommend the E350 since it is a 6cyl (understeers and is just dead weight)

 

[Drivbiwire]

Well, here is my latest fuel economy. I've been doing quite a bit of driving and have noted VERY consistent fuel economy numbers.

I have a flat range of road ideal for checking stable fuel economy.

Thus far Here are my consistent averages:

65 mph with AC on, 57.4 mpg
70 mph with AC on, 50.1 mpg

Keep in mind, this is the 4Matic E250 (All wheel drive).

I did a road trip in my 2013 Passat, and the Passat despite 2 wheel drive and a lighter car is very close to what the Mercedes accomplishes in terms of fuel consumption.

Regarding GDI, the term for German cars is FSI (Fuel Stratified Injection), and it's been in use for well over 20+ years. Its extremely reliable, but not tolerant of poor quality gasolines. Use low grade gasoline without high quality detergents and your will cause SEVERE damage to the systems.

When using high quality premium gasolines, they are very reliable and efficient.

The Japanese have struggled with durability because of owners in this price point disregarding the requirements for premium gasoline, and these are the same owners that use conventional oils instead of synthetics due to perceived savings.

 

[ssamalin]

Fantastic numbers, way over spec. And the handling/driving?

 

[IFRCFI]

So, no more E class Bluetec for 2017? It looks like the only diesel is a GLE.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Skipping a year because of the new platform launch. They've got a new 4 cyl diesel they're supposed to have in the E-Class in 2018.

 

[ssamalin]

I think they are working to get their below 55 degree emissions down for 2018 since that's what they recently were outed for. No need to wait for it though the 20015/16 are excellent. I doubt I'd trade in unless maintenance is high after warranty.

 

[ssamalin]

Tire rotation at the dealer was switching front and back, not switching sides. Service guy told me that switching sides used to be done when the spare was rotated in. I'm not sure what the best rotation is now. I also may get a doughnut instead of the full size spare I bought. I wish the dealer had said I could get a doughnut when I dumped my run flats. The doughnut and wheel is about $450.

 

[ssamalin]

I test drove the 2017 E300 gasser. The 9 speed smooths out the gasser, would have to try it on the diesel to see if it makes any difference. Otherwise, I prefer the more retro look on my 15 dash. I will see if the rather bad voice command on my 15 is improved on my next test drive. The car's look is slightly less eccentric, and maybe more boring. Just what the world needed another indistinguishable blob shaped car.

 

[ssamalin]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/auto.../ar-BBu67AW?ocid=mailsignout#image=BBu6c1E|29

Wow this certainly backs what IndigoBlueWagon is hearing about the E Class. I can only add that this review is based on the 4matic which has degraded handling over the RWD since it is quasi FWD. I certainly like the handling of my RWD Eclass. This review is also makes the case that the suspension, braking and steering are unsporty but otherwise sound. I feel the dips and holes in the road at first and then they magically are gone. It's description of the $12000 option package as unavoidable is also queasy-making. I have a hard time reading where C&D is liking this car, am I too tired to read between the lines here?

 

[ktr]

Sounds like C&D is not thrilled about the base gas engine. It is a noticeable downgrade in the performance department. Everything else is typical E-class (i.e. comfortable cruiser, pricey options, etc.).

 

[ssamalin]

I sure don't feel that way about my car. I don't know about the E350, but I think you should test drive the handling on the E250.

Have you seen this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9tYgykD4R0

I sure don't think my car doesn't have sporty handling for a larger sedan. Like you say maybe they need to run a diesel test drive.

 

[ktr]

I was referring to the E300 gas engine in C&D's test drive, not a E250.

I have driven the E250 Bluetec. It has a great engine, but I like the E350 Bluetec more.

Mercedes has a E350 Bluetec on the new W213 platform, 9G-tronic and all, in Europe. Sadly it will not come state side. US market is getting the E220d sometime in 2018. There are already reviews on the E220d.

http://tools.mercedes-benz.co.uk/current/passenger-cars/e-brochures/new-e-class-saloon.pdf

 

[ssamalin]

http://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/mercedes-benz/e220d-amg-line-auto-4dr/first-drive

http://www.topgear.com/car-news/insider/qa-can-mercedes-new-engine-save-diesel#1

The first I'm reading about the new diesel engine on the road. Thanks. Once again it concludes with denouncing it's numb handling. I admit I don't get it. Maybe I need to spend some serious time driving a Bimer. The new engine means diesel will survive the defeater era though.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

Mercedes have always been known for vague steering, soft suspension, and numb handling. The E-Class is, at least in NA, primarily a luxury car. Precise handling isn't one of its objectives.

 

[Drivbiwire]

Unless you have the Sport package in which case it out handles the performance Audi's.

Combine that with the 4-Matic and its game on!

Steering feel is programmed since its an Electrical power steering system, artificial feel if you will like an airplane. With the lane control it even gives wheel feedback pulses when you are getting near the lanes border (Car can see the lines on the road), it will then simulate rumble strips despite perfectly smooth pavement.

The handling is almost unnatural in terms of grip and cornering capability.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GVc3MBtB6w

We are planning on bringing E250 to the TDI-Fest along with our travel coach.

 

[ssamalin]

Unless you have the Sport package in which case it out handles the performance Audi's.

Combine that with the 4-Matic and its game on!

Steering feel is programmed since its an Electrical power steering system, artificial feel if you will like an airplane. With the lane control it even gives wheel feedback pulses when you are getting near the lanes border (Car can see the lines on the road), it will then simulate rumble strips despite perfectly smooth pavement.

The handling is almost unnatural in terms of grip and cornering capability.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GVc3MBtB6w

We are planning on bringing E250 to the TDI-Fest along with our travel coach.

Hope you enjoy your road trip. Let us know how your E250BT does. I find it to be a combination of big cat and rocket sled and luxury liner. Thanks for explaining about electrical power steering. I guess that's why the car both handles excellently and is relentlessly called numb steering by car reviews. The reviewers are stuck in the hydraulic only mentality, like manual trans only heads, and refuse to even acknowledge things have moved on and today there are choices with different pros and cons. Electric steering is also computerized steering. I'll take a computers help in maneuvering a 4000+ lb car at high speeds with all the high and texting I have to share with. Thanks Mercedes.

 

[TDINJ]

I'm really gaining an interest in the E250BT, and may consider one as a replacement for my Passat. I thought I read somewhere that the 2015 is far better than the 2014, but not sure. Either of these two years CPO would be likely for me.

Should I avoid the 2014?

Also, any opinions on the 2008-2009 E320 Bluetec?

 

[ssamalin]

The IIHS Good score for small offset front collision test for the 2014/2015/2016 is identically IIHS Good, the top score.

 

[ktr]

I'm really gaining an interest in the E250BT, and may consider one as a replacement for my Passat. I thought I read somewhere that the 2015 is far better than the 2014, but not sure. Either of these two years CPO would be likely for me.

Should I avoid the 2014?

Also, any opinions on the 2008-2009 E320 Bluetec?

There is no significant difference between 2014 and 2015 model years. As for your second question, the W212 is a substantial upgrade over the W211 when it comes to build quality and driving dynamics. Unless you are getting a sweet deal on a 2008-09 E320BT, I would avoid them.

 

[ssamalin]

The significant difference between 2014 and 2015 is that IIHS began crash testing the 2015 for small offset crash and it passed with a Good score. Nobody knows if the 2014 would pass.

 

[ssamalin]

I'm really gaining an interest in the E250BT, and may consider one as a replacement for my Passat. I thought I read somewhere that the 2015 is far better than the 2014, but not sure. Either of these two years CPO would be likely for me.

Should I avoid the 2014?

Also, any opinions on the 2008-2009 E320 Bluetec?

Let us know how your shopping goes. I assume this is the time to start looking for a 2015 since they are coming off lease. I would like to hear what these cars are going for. Do you use autotrader or some other online search?

 

[Perfectreign]

Just read though this thread - still wanting that 1990 560SL....