Malone Stage 1 or 1.5?

[kennethsime]

So far, my 2004 BEW Wagon is basically stock. I did the ventectomy, upgraded the steelies to long beaches, and will soon bypass the EGR cooler so that I (hopefully) stop loosing coolant into the exhaust. It's only at about 135k miles, and the engine is in good shape.

Long-term, I think I'd like to upgrade the turbo and clutch to support a Stage 2+, but since there's only so much money you can spend on a car, and this year I'm upgrading the suspension, I'm thinking of doing an initial tune, and following up with a more powerful tune after making those mods at a later date. I'm most-interested in Dynamic Idle & EGR for quicker warmup, and a little more power. In talking with Malone, they mentioned having to watch high boost with a Stage 1.5.

What do you think - 1, or 1.5? The extra increase in power would be nice, but I don't want to risk my turbo.

 

[Nero Morg]

Stage 4 party wagon.

 

[jmodge]

Go big rocket Man

 

[Andyinchville1]

I got stage 1 and i'm still at stage 1 even after adding mods.

Getting a tune is huge increase in performance / ecomomy and I would recommend it even if it's just a stage 1 and even if you just stay there after adding mods ( see signature)

Andrew

 

[kennethsime]

I got stage 1 and i'm still at stage 1 even after adding mods.

Getting a tune is huge increase in performance / ecomomy and I would recommend it even if it's just a stage 1 and even if you just stay there after adding mods ( see signature)

Andrew

Man reading your signature I would REALLY like to see your car. I hope to build my wagon into something pretty darn similar.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

BEW with stock turbo I'd stick with stage 1. That turbo does tend to overboost more easily than the stock turbo on the older MKIVs, especially if you live or drive at higher altitudes. We used to sell a lot of replacements to a shop in Colorado Springs, where they'd frequently fail even on stock BEWs.

VNT-17 with a Stage 3 tune is a really nice upgrade on a BEW. Those stock injectors have a lot of headroom for increased fueling electronically, so you really don't have to do anything else. A 2.5" downpipe is nice to reduce exhaust restriction, but your Smog testing my not like that. And you will need a clutch.

 

[kennethsime]

BEW with stock turbo I'd stick with stage 1. That turbo does tend to overboost more easily than the stock turbo on the older MKIVs, especially if you live or drive at higher altitudes. We used to sell a lot of replacements to a shop in Colorado Springs, where they'd frequently fail even on stock BEWs.

VNT-17 with a Stage 3 tune is a really nice upgrade on a BEW. Those stock injectors have a lot of headroom for increased fueling electronically, so you really don't have to do anything else. A 2.5" downpipe is nice to reduce exhaust restriction, but your Smog testing my not like that. And you will need a clutch.

Thanks IBW! That's the plan. Suspension this year, big power next year.

 

[Nero Morg]

Thanks IBW! That's the plan. Suspension this year, big power next year.

If that's your plan, wait to tune until next year then. Trust me, do it all at once.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

If that's your plan, wait to tune until next year then. Trust me, do it all at once.

Good advice, if you're upgrading the turbo.

 

[Nevada_TDI]

I would take IBW's advice, he has been at this a long time.

 

[kennethsime]

Well, I went for the 1.5 last week, before all the advice came in. I'm going to order & install a boost gauge (and maybe an EGT gauge) to watch the high-end boost.

Got the flashzilla last night and got the tune installed, but didn't have a chance to drive until today. I did not select the option to limit high-end boost yet, because I'm using the stock exhaust and they only recommend it for modified exhausts.

Aside from the power increase (especially over 3,000 rpm), the car starts quicker & smoother, and warms up quicker. They had a few optional fixes I didn't know about, including the coolant temperature sensor in the expansion tank being too sensitive - this might've been what was causing my coolant light to go off until recently - it could've been that the shop pressure testing the system cleared some gunk out of the sensor also.

I will say that while I enjoyed the vroom vroom on my freeway on-ramping today, I don't really think I need that much power for most of my driving. I may do a larger turbo in the future for reliability at altitude, but I'm not sure I'll buy another higher-end tune. We'll see how my mind changes over the next year or so!

 

[joevh]

Well, I went for the 1.5 last week, before all the advice came in. I'm going to order & install a boost gauge (and maybe an EGT gauge) to watch the high-end boost.

Got the flashzilla last night and got the tune installed, but didn't have a chance to drive until today. I did not select the option to limit high-end boost yet, because I'm using the stock exhaust and they only recommend it for modified exhausts.

Aside from the power increase (especially over 3,000 rpm), the car starts quicker & smoother, and warms up quicker. They had a few optional fixes I didn't know about, including the coolant temperature sensor in the expansion tank being too sensitive - this might've been what was causing my coolant light to go off a few months ago.

I will say that while I enjoyed the vroom vroom on my freeway on-ramping today, I don't really think I need that much power for most of my driving. I may do a larger turbo in the future for reliability at altitude, but I'm not sure I'll buy another higher-end tune. We'll see how my mind changes over the next year or so!

I have the identical wagon as yours, with 315k miles on the clock. My son also has an identical one, pushing 300k. Let me know if you ever want to sell yours.

About 6 years ago I put a Malone stage 1.5 tune into it. One year ago my clutch slippage got bad enough that I had a SouthBend stage 2 daily driver installed. Then I tore the entire front end apart to replace all of the suspension system. After I removed the steering rack after discovering a problem with it, I was staring at the turbo and thought, well, might as well do that as well. I put in a a VNT-17, removed the EGR cooler, and had Malone up the tune to stage 4. The turbo seems a bit laggier, so overall it's not drastically more snappy, but I can sure tell it's got a lot more solid, continuous pull to it. Malone tuning uses the entire throttle throw for a linear power rather than focus all the power in the first half, which I like. With these mods, I'm glad I went with stage 4 and not less. Now I wish that I had upgraded the downpipe and exhaust to 2.5" at the time as well. I was going to do that this year, but am not sure how much it would help, and am very reluctant to create a drone in the exhaust sound. If anyone has any input to that, I would appreciate it.

 

[kennethsime]

I have the identical wagon as yours, with 315k miles on the clock. My son also has an identical one, pushing 300k. Let me know if you ever want to sell yours.

About 6 years ago I put a Malone stage 1.5 tune into it. One year ago my clutch slippage got bad enough that I had a SouthBend stage 2 daily driver installed. Then I tore the entire front end apart to replace all of the suspension system. After I removed the steering rack after discovering a problem with it, I was staring at the turbo and thought, well, might as well do that as well. I put in a a VNT-17, removed the EGR cooler, and had Malone up the tune to stage 4. The turbo seems a bit laggier, so overall it's not drastically more snappy, but I can sure tell it's got a lot more solid, continuous pull to it. Malone tuning uses the entire throttle throw for a linear power rather than focus all the power in the first half, which I like. With these mods, I'm glad I went with stage 4 and not less. Now I wish that I had upgraded the downpipe and exhaust to 2.5" at the time as well. I was going to do that this year, but am not sure how much it would help, and am very reluctant to create a drone in the exhaust sound. If anyone has any input to that, I would appreciate it.

I appreciate your offer, but my plan is definitely to drive this baby until it doesn't want me any more. I was lucky enough to be the second owner, and with only 130k on it. It's got some minor body damage unfortunately (passenger rocker panel, the girl smacked a tree stump pulling out of a parking lot), but otherwise very clean for an 18-year-old car. I almost created a new username, "balticgreenwagon" in homage to our venerable leader IBW - I plan to keep it going.

I'm doing the suspension soon (as soon as the shop gets back to me - hopefully this week!). Then come new tires, and then a skid plate. Then a roof basket and a hitch, I think. I think I'll be happy for quite awhile after that, but I do want to look at a VNT-17 in the next year or two, and I'll probably have to do the clutch at the same time.

I am glad to hear that your stock clutch was ok with the 1.5 for 5 years - that seems pretty great. I'd be ecstatic if mine lasts that long!

 

[Andyinchville1]

If you drive your car "normally" or like before you got the tune you will probably see an MPG increase from the tune alone ..... it's kind of like the icing on the cake and you STILL have the extra power if you want to play.

Just be careful not to slip the clutch too much through excessive use of power if the clutch is weak and you shuld be ok for a really long time

Andrew

 

[kennethsime]

If you drive your car "normally" or like before you got the tune you will probably see an MPG increase from the tune alone ..... it's kind of like the icing on the cake and you STILL have the extra power if you want to play.

Yea, that sounds like the bee's knees basically. I think I'm going to reset my fuelly to figure out what my MPG is - 27.4 seems incredibly low, even for city driving. If it's still low, maybe I have stuck brakes or something.

We have a few particularly-steep hills nearby, and we drove up one last night in 2nd & 3rd gear - holy fudge what a difference. My TDIs have always been good on hills, but it felt like the hill wasn't even there. I'm quite stoked.

 

[UhOh]

kenneth, look into Koni Active shocks. I put them on my wife's 2003 Golf and they're awesome: very smooth ride, probably better than stock; and when you push it the "active" part does its thing and you actually have very good performance. Additionally, I've installed Koni STR.Ts and Koni Reds, also had a Golf with Bilsteins, so I have a fair bit of exposure to shocks on these cars. My Golf has STR.Ts and they're a really crisp shock (work great on the roads that I drive), but after driving my wife's Golf with the Actives I would certainly install them on my car if I ever have to do a suspension refresh.

 

[kennethsime]

kenneth, look into Koni Active shocks. I put them on my wife's 2003 Golf and they're awesome: very smooth ride, probably better than stock; and when you push it the "active" part does its thing and you actually have very good performance. Additionally, I've installed Koni STR.Ts and Koni Reds, also had a Golf with Bilsteins, so I have a fair bit of exposure to shocks on these cars. My Golf has STR.Ts and they're a really crisp shock (work great on the roads that I drive), but after driving my wife's Golf with the Actives I would certainly install them on my car if I ever have to do a suspension refresh.

That's exactly where I'm going. Special Actives, the ID Parts lift springs, and a full rubber refresh. Hopefully don't have to touch the suspension for another 5 years!

 

[justin71105]

Wanting to do the stage 1.5 to my car after this winter. Just wanting a little more pull through the gears like my MK7 TDi had especially 3rd gear.

 

[kennethsime]

Wanting to do the stage 1.5 to my car after this winter. Just wanting a little more pull through the gears like my MK7 TDi had especially 3rd gear.

I'm pretty stoked one it, personally. Definitely need to watch the turbo, as folks mentioned up above here. If you're considering a VNT-17 at all, it would be worth doing that first and then going to a stage 2. Will also need an upgraded clutch at that point.

 

[justin71105]

I'm pretty stoked one it, personally. Definitely need to watch the turbo, as folks mentioned up above here. If you're considering a VNT-17 at all, it would be worth doing that first and then going to a stage 2. Will also need an upgraded clutch at that point.

Have a south bend stage 2 daily clutch kit already installed by previous owner. Do not want to upgrade turbo so will likely stick with stage 1 or 1.5....but I have been reading about the different turbos. Don't want to give up any low rpm trq.
Will be a little while before I oull the trigger still need fo install steering/suspension/brakes and fix up interior more.

 

[SMPMASTERMIND]

Did a Malone Stage 2 right off the bat. Stock Turbo. SB Stage 3 endurance. Boost, Oil Pressure, EGT gauges.

Stage 2

• Dynamic Idle 1100RPM
• Dynamic EGR
• Glow Plug Extension
• P0128 Coolant Fault Code Fix
• VNT Smart Actuator (Sensor) Delete
• O2 (Oxygen Sensor) Delete
• Boost Creep Reduction for Stock Turbo and Modified Exhaust
• Hot Start Fix

Love it so far. Still have stock exhaust but doing 2.5 inch straight pipe in a couple days to open it up more. Also why I did the boost creep reduction until I get some more money to upgrade Turbo.

 

[justin71105]

I'm pretty stoked one it, personally. Definitely need to watch the turbo, as folks mentioned up above here. If you're considering a VNT-17 at all, it would be worth doing that first and then going to a stage 2. Will also need an upgraded clutch at that point.

Any issues with the stage 1.5 and boost creep people talk about with stock turbo. Does it still make good low rpm power as well as above 3k.

Thinking I'm going to order on black friday and try it out during my time back from Europe.

Reading its what the car should have been from factory. Mine is soo weak compared to my buddys MK6 Golf.

Think his is 140hp/236tq, stage 1.5 looks to get the MK4 pretty close to that.

 

[Nero Morg]

I had a stage 2 with a stock turbo, no issues of boost creeep, I wouldn't sweat it.

 

[SMPMASTERMIND]

I had a stage 2 with a stock turbo, no issues of boost creeep, I wouldn't sweat it.

Same haven't had time to put new turbo in. But running stage 2 with modified exhaust with the tune listed above and no creep. Much more fun to drive!! I did add boost creep reduction as a safety because I am running 2.5 inch straight no cat or muffler

 

[jmodge]

Stage III on two vehicles with stock turbos, no boost creeping

 

[kennethsime]

Any issues with the stage 1.5 and boost creep people talk about with stock turbo. Does it still make good low rpm power as well as above 3k.

Thinking I'm going to order on black friday and try it out during my time back from Europe.

Reading its what the car should have been from factory. Mine is soo weak compared to my buddys MK6 Golf.

Think his is 140hp/236tq, stage 1.5 looks to get the MK4 pretty close to that.

I haven't actually installed a boost gauge yet, but my car drives fine and is plenty fun. It took some getting used to at first, but no regrets at all. I think my clutch will give out before my turbo. May be worse for the turbo if you're at elevation - I'm down by the water for the most part.

 

[justin71105]

I'm pretty stoked one it, personally. Definitely need to watch the turbo, as folks mentioned up above here. If you're considering a VNT-17 at all, it would be worth doing that first and then going to a stage 2. Will also need an upgraded clutch at that point.

After debating more and more think I have decided on a turbo.

The Xman GT1752 for £500 ($640 shipped) and a stage 4 tune.

Even looking at just the regular VNT17 he offers, only £450 even with shipping they are half what a locally sourced turbo would be. Have only heard good things from people ordering from his sight. Been researching both turbos to see which one to go with, email him and told him what I was wanting to do and he recommended the 1752 for a pretty much bolt on upgrade.

From reading it looks to make power at a lower rpm than then the regular 17, would like to be around the power my MK7 Tdi was for passing and just get up and go power. Don't know how worn the turbo is on my car really.

Engine was replaced with a used unit at 270k miles, used engine had 103k miles on it when installed and currently have 368k. So if he used the turbo on that car its at 165k miles.

The ones available in the US they are roughly 1000-1700 plus tune and stuff.

Going the Xman route its only about $1200 all in, turbo and tune. Already have both brand new oil lines that go to and from turbo, gasket and manifold studs I want to replace.

The main thing for me is for it to be a direct bolt on using my stock inter cooler piping.

 

[Nevada_TDI]

I haven't actually installed a boost gauge yet, but my car drives fine and is plenty fun. It took some getting used to at first, but no regrets at all. I think my clutch will give out before my turbo. May be worse for the turbo if you're at elevation - I'm down by the water for the most part.

I am at 4600' and run a 17/56 hybrid. I have more than enough turbo to run 24 PSI actual w/o stressing the turbo.
Or did I miss your point?

 

[justin71105]

Flashzilla will be in today and I am going to download the Malone 1.5 and see what its like.

Will order my turbo spring of next year and step up to the stage 2 and then the stage 4 later on after I get over the newness of the turbo and stage 2.

 

[justin71105]

Well, I went for the 1.5 last week, before all the advice came in. I'm going to order & install a boost gauge (and maybe an EGT gauge) to watch the high-end boost.

Got the flashzilla last night and got the tune installed, but didn't have a chance to drive until today. I did not select the option to limit high-end boost yet, because I'm using the stock exhaust and they only recommend it for modified exhausts.

Aside from the power increase (especially over 3,000 rpm), the car starts quicker & smoother, and warms up quicker. They had a few optional fixes I didn't know about, including the coolant temperature sensor in the expansion tank being too sensitive - this might've been what was causing my coolant light to go off until recently - it could've been that the shop pressure testing the system cleared some gunk out of the sensor also.

I will say that while I enjoyed the vroom vroom on my freeway on-ramping today, I don't really think I need that much power for most of my driving. I may do a larger turbo in the future for reliability at altitude, but I'm not sure I'll buy another higher-end tune. We'll see how my mind changes over the next year or so!

This is definitely how the car shiuld have felt from the factory. Stage 1.5 have it some good pep over stock, went ahead and put the stage 2 on the loader for when I get my turbo out on.