Loose IP Mounting Bolt Need Opinions

[mudduck]

I determined that one of my IP mounting bolts had backed out and was contacting the back side of the IP pulley. There is no way to get to the bolt except by pulling the timing belt and the IP pulley off. What I was able to do is put some locktight on the end of the bolt that protrudes through the IP mounting bracket and tighten it the best I could with locking pliers.

I was wondering if anyone else has encountered this issue and how they fixed it. It's only been 50k since the new timing belt and I dont really want to pulll it all apart again. I tried to post a picture but had some issues.

thanks,
SS

 

[Nero Morg]

It's going to be a ticking time bomb of when it may back out again. You're probably going to be better off doing it right.

 

[KLXD]

Isn't there hole's in the sprocket that'll allow access to the mount bolts. Used to be standard procedure on the AHU's.

 

[Nero Morg]

There are, but they're a lot more narrow, can't fit a socket or wrench through.

 

[mudduck]

Thanks for the replies it seems to be holding. I'm gonna keep a close eye on it.

 

[Metal Man]

Are there threads sticking out (that you haven't mangled with vice grips)? Maybe thread a nut on it and tighten it down so the bolt doesn't back off. I would think the locktight should keep it from backing out, but this is always going to be a worry until it's fixed right.

 

[mudduck]

That's a good idea I may give it a try.

 

[KLXD]

The other thing to fink about is if one's loose are the others properly torqued? Bolt, meet sprocket...

 

[burn_your_money]

Make sure that the bolt head hasn't worn enough meat off the pulley to compromise it.

 

[mudduck]

I heard it make noise pretty much immediately. I stop at my gate twice a day to open with the car running heard something new right away. There were just a few flecks of metal to be seen when I pulled the TB cover off to look.

The other two bolts are still tight and the threadlock is holding so far.

Thanks

 

[BobnOH]

You may be fine, but you know it's risk. Were you able to torque down a nut on the back?

 

[mudduck]

Not yet, gonna try it this weekend.

 

[BobnOH]

If you can get at it, carefully remove (hacksaw, sawzall) the damaged bit at the end (or true it up with a die) sos you don't damage the new nut. You may need to touch it up with a file after you cut it. You may even be able to counter-hold the head of that bolt with a big screwdriver or something.

 

[KLXD]

What I'd do is take the belt and sprocket off, fix it right and reinstall the belt properly.

If you don't want to do that what I'd do is have the torque wrench ready, put the motor at TDC, mark the sprocket bolt/sprocket, remove sprocket bolts, remove sprocket keeping the belt engaged and snug, torque the pump mounting bolts, and put the sprocket back in place. Install sprocket bolts line up the mark and torque them. That will get the timing close enough to start it and adjust with VCDS.

The tensioner is set the same, cam timing is the same, only thing that was disturbed is the injection timing.

 

[ymz]

About 10 years ago I put a (used) pump in a used engine and found out I couldn't torque one of the bolts... so I drilled out the hole in the pump and put a regular bolt and 2 nuts from the hardware store down the street... it's still there, and the engine's run over 341700 km with it... (can't tell exactly, as the car has over a million km on it...)

 

[mudduck]

What I'd do is take the belt and sprocket off, fix it right and reinstall the belt properly.

If you don't want to do that what I'd do is have the torque wrench ready, put the motor at TDC, mark the sprocket bolt/sprocket, remove sprocket bolts, remove sprocket keeping the belt engaged and snug, torque the pump mounting bolts, and put the sprocket back in place. Install sprocket bolts line up the mark and torque them. That will get the timing close enough to start it and adjust with VCDS.

The tensioner is set the same, cam timing is the same, only thing that was disturbed is the injection timing.

Using this process am I going to be able to remove the IP sprocket while the belt is still under tension!?

Thanks,
SS

 

[Metal Man]

I don't see any way that could work.

 

[wonneber]

Using this process am I going to be able to remove the IP sprocket while the belt is still under tension!?

Thanks,
SS

You could remove it, yes.
I can't see how you would get it back together correctly.
You will need the locking tools for the pump & cam to get it back together and VCDS to set the timing.

 

[Metal Man]

Your basically doing the complete belt replacement procedure without touching the motor mount and stopping short of removing things you don't have to such as the rollers.

 

[KLXD]

The tensioner doesn't really load the belt that much. The belt would maintain the crank/cam/pump sprocket timing if he held it snug and the pin would get the pump timing close enough. I think he could pull the sprocket back into place.

Like I said, I'd take it apart and do it right but the OP's looking for shortcuts.

 

[wonneber]

Like I said, I'd take it apart and do it right but the OP's looking for shortcuts.

Isn't the shortcut always the hardest & longest way to do something?

 

[Genesis]

Using this process am I going to be able to remove the IP sprocket while the belt is still under tension!?

Thanks,
SS

Not in a way you will want to.

The proper way to do this is to put the engine at TDC, lock the cam and pump, jam a screwdriver in the bellhousing to lock the crank, relieve the tensioner, break free the cam sprocket and then do the job and tension it up the proper way and check it for interference. If done PROPERLY while you might want VCDS to fine-tune the timing if you're careful it will be very, very close to bang-on the middle line.

You definitely do not want to pull the sprocket off the IP with the engine in an unknown place and not be able to put it back on.... now you have a mess and whatever SMALL amount of time you were going to save just went down the drain.

Do it right.

 

[BobnOH]

Yes, and even if you do get back in the same position you will find it all but impossible to get the pulley back to the fastener holes. Best advice is to only use a tensioner once, but I would (have) risk it.

 

[Genesis]

I have no fear of releasing and resetting the tensioner for the remainder of its expected service interval provided it is not damaged (e.g. tensioned with the blade not in the hole and thus bent or cracked, tensioned backward, showing evidence of seal failure around the bearing, etc.) IMHO if you have reason to (for example) change an IP out doing the entire timing belt and the other components under the cover "just cause" is silly unless you are quite close to the interval in which case you've lost very little since you were shortly going to have to do it anyway.

 

[mudduck]

I just did it the right way. All three bolts were loose but threads were good so I locktighted the threads and re torqued.

I also discovered that the green mounting bolt below/behind the hard fuel lines is missing. Would anyone know the specs of that bolt so I can try to source locally.

Thanks for all the comments.

SS

 

[Metal Man]

They really didn't want that pump to stay in there. The bolt is your basic 8X1.25 probably about 40 to 45mm long.

 

[Genesis]

That missing one is PROBABLY why the other backed out as it would serve to stabilize the pump against the ordinary vibration that comes from its operation (and that of the engine.)

 

[KLXD]

Glad you did it right.

Do you have the correct nut for that bolt under the fuel pipes? It's a fancy tapered nut that mates with a split sliding bushing in the mount.

#17 In this pic: https://www.jimellisvwparts.com/showAssembly.aspx?ukey_assembly=739566&ukey_product=5150826

Also, are those greenish bolts the one timers?

 

[mudduck]

M8X1.25 about 1.5 inches long worked just fine. Sources it at the local Ace Hardware

 

[mudduck]

Glad you did it right.

Do you have the correct nut for that bolt under the fuel pipes? It's a fancy tapered nut that mates with a split sliding bushing in the mount.

#17 In this pic: https://www.jimellisvwparts.com/showAssembly.aspx?ukey_assembly=739566&ukey_product=5150826

Also, are those greenish bolts the one timers?

#14 in the pic referenced above.