Looking to install TDI in 84 Volvo 760.... advise and help please...

[omish007]

Please steer me to the better choices for this project. Donor engine year and model, parts upgrades, etc. Thank you.

 

[omish007]

Starting off, the Volvo 760 is a rear wheel drive, 2.4 turbo diesel, with zero compression & doesn't run. Which version of the TDI would be a better choice?

 

[Straypoet]

according to Wikipedia, your stock engine produced:

Power output	109 hp non intercooled
Torque output	205 NM

Which tells me that you could do an ALH with a mild tune and a little larger injectors, and you would save weight and have equal or a little greater power.
You will likely have to do a one-off adaptor though. I am unfamiliar with that engine bolt-pattern.

 

[oilhammer]

The VAG 6 cyl diesel that Volvo used is the same setup as the VAG 5 cyl of the same era. Pretty much everything is identical, just one is one cylinder longer. There was a gas version, too (the LT vans used these engines). Volvo bolted them mostly to a 4sp ZF-sourced automatic, although a few were manuals but mostly the non-turbo 240.

The 7's engine bay is large, it'll take whatever 4 cyl TDI you want. Lots of info on RWD adapters and transmissions here, really could use whatever is easily matched up. There are already adapters existing to use the Mazda-supplied Ford 5sp from either the 3.0L Vulcan Ranger or the 4.0L Cologne Ranger (the Aerostar, Bronco II, Mazda Navajo and 1994+ B-truck used them, too).

It would also seem to me that the manual from the OHC 4.0L Cologne Mustang would be a great choice, and I am pretty sure the bolt pattern for those transmissions is the same... I think all the Cologne V6s are. Plenty of Mustangs out there with chucked chains (although most were slushboxes).

 

[PickleRick]

If going Mtdi toss in an ALH mated to a 700r4 (a trans the om617 guys love).

They came behind the gutless 6.2 so you have plenty of stall options for the converter.

If you want to keep it electric tdi you won't have the kick down cable the 700r4 needs so you'll need a transmission that can communicate with the tps(pedal)

For that I'd contact faast automotive and see what common gm/yota/jeep slush box he has experienced with matcing the tdi tps with via a stand alone trans controller.

The bhw 2.0 tdi motor will get you the best bang for the buck with power and torque with only a tune.

There are other tuners/wiring gurus on here that will hopefully chime in. I have personal experience with David at faast and can vouch for top notch customer service for well over a year after purchase. My 4 runner diesel swap/semi restoration is going....slow.

 

[Mozambiquer]

Being as it's the turbo diesel one, I believe that was a VW engine. Wouldn't the bell housing be the same? I'm sure you'd be able to sell the engine afterwards, even with no compression, as a rebuilder.

 

[oilhammer]

As stated above, it IS a VAG engine, and the 5/6 cyl has a slightly different bolt pattern than the 4 cyl.

 

[Mozambiquer]

As stated above, it IS a VAG engine, and the 5/6 cyl has a slightly different bolt pattern than the 4 cyl.

Ok, that's good to know. I wasn't sure.

 

[oilhammer]

The I6 engines are from the LT:

Although technically they came a few years after the LTs were already in production. Early LTs used a 2.0L SOHC gas engine that we saw in the Porsche 944, the early Audi 100LS, and (oddly enough) some AMC vehicles... mostly postal Jeeps. Early LTs also got an outsourced diesel engine. But then VW/Audi designed the 5/6 cyl engines (using the same per-cylinder geometry as the I4, same valves, lifters, pistons, rods, etc.) to be used in various applications. We never saw the LT here, so the only place we ever saw the I6 was under the hood of some Volvos.

There are gas, diesel, and turbodiesel versions of these I6s. When the LT went to the rebadged Sprinter, the I6 went away. The later updated I5s made more than enough power... and now those have been dropped in favor of the twin-turbo I4 TDI in the current Crafter.

The I6 is fundamentally the same setup as the early VAG I5. So if you are familiar with any of those (we had gas, diesel, turbo gas, and turbo diesel variants here), then you'd know your way around the I6. Water pump in block, used to tension the timing belt, oil pump driven directly off crank on the front of the engine, injection pump (on the diesels) run off the cam at the BACK of the engine via its own little toothed belt, vacuum pump run off the middle of the cam in the head, distributor (on gas) run directly off the back of the cam.

 

[omish007]

If going Mtdi toss in an ALH mated to a 700r4 (a trans the om617 guys love).

They came behind the gutless 6.2 so you have plenty of stall options for the converter.

If you want to keep it electric tdi you won't have the kick down cable the 700r4 needs so you'll need a transmission that can communicate with the tps(pedal)

For that I'd contact faast automotive and see what common gm/yota/jeep slush box he has experienced with matcing the tdi tps with via a stand alone trans controller.

The bhw 2.0 tdi motor will get you the best bang for the buck with power and torque with only a tune.

There are other tuners/wiring gurus on here that will hopefully chime in. I have personal experience with David at faast and can vouch for top notch customer service for well over a year after purchase. My 4 runner diesel swap/semi restoration is going....slow.

What is the wiring harness mods like, and what donor most likely had this engine?

 

[PickleRick]

I don't know much about the alh. The BHW is found in the 2004 and 05 passat. Easy to find cheap because of transmission issues.

As for wiring mods, I sent the request harness parts, gauge cluster and ecu to faast forward and they mailed back a stand alone set up ready to install. I'm using the passat cluster on my 87 4 runner so I have a working tach.

After looking at the harness, it wouldn't be hard to make myself but it would be very time consuming. I much prefer being on the water vs playing with wiring spaghetti so it was easier to send him money.

 

[PradoTDI]

The ALH is found in Mk4 Jettas and Golfs from 1999.5-2003. I can't really comment on how easy the wiring is either, as I bought my engine with the harness already converted to standalone use. It doesn't look too bad though, especially if you get all the deletes (immobilizer, ABS, EGR, etc.).

 

[TPW]

My 5 cylinder diesel from 1983 bolted up to 016 and then 01E, so the BHW engine should be able to bolt up to the Volvo transmission. I'm not sure much the 1984 Volvo automatic had to electronically communicate with the engine though. It might be easier to do what Oilhammer suggested and get a good Manual.

 

[omish007]

My 5 cylinder diesel from 1983 bolted up to 016 and then 01E, so the BHW engine should be able to bolt up to the Volvo transmission. I'm not sure much the 1984 Volvo automatic had to electronically communicate with the engine though. It might be easier to do what Oilhammer suggested and get a good Manual.

Please pardon my ignorance, but what is 016 & 01E ?

 

[TPW]

016 is is 5 speed Manual transmission used in many gasoline powered Audis (mostly Quattros, but some front wheel drives) O1E is commonly a 6 speed used in later models of Quattros. It would be nice if you could locate a manual transmission that was geared properly for a rear wheel drive diesel. (Maybe in Swedish salvage yard).

 

[oilhammer]

The 016 and 01E (like most of the longitudinal FWD transaxles) have dual bolt patterns, to fit various engines.

 

[d24tdi]

We never saw the LT here, so the only place we ever saw the I6 was under the hood of some Volvos.

The US military owned a few D24T engines in Pinzgauer 718 6x6 trucks too. Must have made their 6.2L Humvees feel like hot rods by comparison.

My 5 cylinder diesel from 1983 bolted up to 016 and then 01E, so the BHW engine should be able to bolt up to the Volvo transmission. I'm not sure much the 1984 Volvo automatic had to electronically communicate with the engine though. It might be easier to do what Oilhammer suggested and get a good Manual.

No. Unlike those Audi transmissions, the Volvo trans (both of them -- the auto and the manual) are drilled only for the 6cyl pattern. BHW or any 4cyl TDI definitively will not bolt up to them. The Volvo is a fully mechanical ZF trans if it's an autobox, but you can work with that, hook the kickdown cable to the accelerator in the cabin if you're going electronic, etc. The shift points would be a little high for a TDI coming from the prechamber engine that likes to rev more, but not bad. The diesel automatic Volvos had 3.91 axle gearing so you could help it there with a TDI by swapping to a 3.54 or 3.31.

IMHO the obvious first choice if you wanted a TDI in place of fixing the stock engine in the Volvo RWD platform would be a 2.5L 5-cylinder TDI from a Euro market C4 Audi or T4 van. Easy to get one imported, QGAP in CA has them on the shelf and Frans can ship them also, probably others. Simple older engines with simple wiring so it'd be easy to adapt for electronic control, and if you got an engine out of an Audi you'd have it already laid out in longitudinal format, or you could have an m-pump built, it's been done both ways. The engine is configured in a highly similar way to the stock D24T engine as Oilhammer described earlier, so it would go together with much less head scratching and adaptation than a 4cyl would.... things like front engine accessories, plumbing, etc would be in many cases a direct fit. The back end of the engine would bolt right up to whatever you have now -- bellhousing, flywheel or flexplate and TC, etc. Shorten the oil pan and pickup tube you already have from your stock engine by cutting sections of both out, and it bolts right up, giving you the necessary rear-sump setup ready to go and no challenges with crossmember clearance. It's not quite a drop-in job, still have to come up with mounts and some other adaptations, but pretty close. And you get the extra power and calmer NVH of the 5cyl engine, in an engine bay with plenty of room for it. Better than a 4cyl in every way, and much easier. Look around, it's a relatively common Volvo swap overseas in your exact situation.

Probably cheaper too -- of course getting a 4 cylinder TDI donor car would be cost less upfront than getting the 5cyl engine, but with the 4cyl, you then need to also source a transmission, adapter plate, adaptations at the driveshaft, transmission mounting and shift linkage, oil pan rework for crossmember clearance (IF you can resolve this conflict at all with the ALH or BHW style where the pump is hung low at the front of the engine right where the crossmember wants to be -- AHU or 1Z with oil pump set back towards the rear would be easier on this but have their own shortcomings, and keep in mind that on a Volvo 7/9 series the steering rack mounts INSIDE the engine crossmember so xmember modifications are out of the question).... and a million other little nickel and dime pieces to make it all work in the car. Bolting up to the factory trans and making use of as many factory fitment solutions as possible is a different world not just in effort but also in cost.

Or fix the stock 6cyl. They are great engines too, as long as you don't overheat it or blow the front timing belt. Extremely smooth and quiet runners with great power and sound. Keep in mind that moving from the inline six to a TDI 4cyl, in a longitudinal mounted platform, will mean adding a very large amount of vibration. The car will be less pleasant to use. The 5cyl would be less of a sacrifice.

 

[PickleRick]

I am waiting on someone to bring out a custom rear sump pan/pickup for our tdi motors, the ones for the om617 are nice.

 

[oilhammer]

I would just like a nice bellhousing to use one of the Tremec manuals you can buy. I mean, they are not "cheap", but they are available and have lots of gearing options and are good units that should last forever with a 4 cyl TDI.

A nice oil pan to match that bellhouse would be great, too.

 

[omish007]

Thank you, everyone. This is great information!

 

[Mozambiquer]

I would just like a nice bellhousing to use one of the Tremec manuals you can buy. I mean, they are not "cheap", but they are available and have lots of gearing options and are good units that should last forever with a 4 cyl TDI.

A nice oil pan to match that bellhouse would be great, too.

There's a place in the UK that makes bell housings for a bunch of different transmissions to t5, nv3500, and a few others. Not sure what their quality is, but I thought it was interesting. I'll have to look it up again.

Edit: here it is https://www.rwdmotorsport.com/product/vw-audi-1-8-litre-to-borg-warner-t5-bellhousing/

 

[PickleRick]

Does the chevy t5 fit the same sbc bell an sm465 would? If so that adapter would open you to a world of chevy transmissions and chevy compatible transmissions.

It's been a while since I looked into it but I believe the nv4500 (chevy) is a bolt in swap to an sm465 on the input shaft end.

 

[d24tdi]

There is also this bell out there, for 4 times the price. It is dual drilled (like a VAG trans!) for the 4cyl and 5/6/8cyl patterns and adapts to a range of old school domestic type transmissions. Though this would likely require a lot of homework and effort for pilot centering alignment given the big slots to mount to the gearbox, and figuring out clutch package and actuation etc.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/qti-rm-4082

OP, is your Volvo an automatic or standard trans / what kind of trans are you hoping to have in it? If you have auto and want to stay with auto, then maybe none of these bellhousings are relevant to you..... the tdconversions kits, AFAIK, can mate a TDI to the front of some small automatics too. Toyota automatic would be an easy swap into a Volvo since the gasser Volvos used an Aisin Warner trans closely similar to what would come out of a similar era RWD Yota pickup. Stock gasser shift linkages etc and maybe even the tailshaft housing and flange could swap in. TC stall speed and trans shift points again might not be ideal but they might be pretty close, the old Toyota 22RE was not a high rev engine anyway.

 

[d24tdi]

There's a place in the UK that makes bell housings for a bunch of different transmissions to t5, nv3500, and a few others. Not sure what their quality is, but I thought it was interesting. I'll have to look it up again.

Edit: here it is https://www.rwdmotorsport.com/product/vw-audi-1-8-litre-to-borg-warner-t5-bellhousing/

That is a nice looking setup and amazing cheap for such a big chunk of custom machined aluminum.

 

[Mozambiquer]

That is a nice looking setup and amazing cheap for such a big chunk of custom machined aluminum.

I asked about it on the TDI swapped trucks group on Facebook. Once guy said he used it on his Volvo 240 swap, but the worst part is that it's setup for vertical, and took a bunch of modifications to tilt it to 20°

 

[TPW]

I've seen a few videos and a write up on Motorgeek where people have converted Audi AWD cars to RWD by welding up the gears in the center diff of 01E. They did this so they could go drifting. I don't know how long the trannys lasted after that.

 

[oilhammer]

It wouldn't be the transmission that suffers, it doesn't care where the power goes after the output shaft. It would be the rear driveshaft and rear differential and rear axles that would suffer. Although unlike most other manufacturers, VAG cars seem to make this rear stuff pretty beefy. Unlike Honda and such that have rear axles that literally look like they were sourced from the ATV parts bin.

 

[omish007]

I would like to stay with the stock automatic transmission, but don't know anything about the gearing or if I'd even be able to gain mileage over rebuilding the original 2.4 turbodiesel...?

 

[d24tdi]

If you currently have the stock ZF automatic then there are not many options for how to adapt a different engine to that. You are pretty much limited to the Audi 5cyl bellhousing pattern that your existing D24T engine uses. AFAIK there is no adapter out there that goes from that pattern down to the 4cyl VW pattern used by the 4cyl TDIs.

You could switch to a different autobox if you want to stay automatic but are open to using a different trans. A good example as mentioned above would be the Aisin-Warner AW7x series transmissions that were used behind the gas engines in most Volvo 700 series cars. They are decent transmissions, strong and generally long lasting although they have a couple common problem areas (tailshaft bushing, overdrive solenoid) and don't shift as smoothly or efficiently as the ZF boxes that came behind the turbodiesels. They are highly similar to transmissions used in similar era Toyota trucks. You could start with a Volvo trans (which bolts right into the car using factory mounting provisions) and then convert the front end of the trans to a Toyota setup (bellhousing, TC etc) and then use an adapter kit from tdconversions to mate a 4cyl TDI to that transmission.

If that sounds high effort and high cost, yes it is. And then you would still face the fact that the TC stall speed and trans shift points are calibrated for a gas engine rather than a diesel (Toyota and Volvo gas engines respectively). Plus most of those AW7x transmissions do not have lockup converters so you would need to search hard for one that does: AW70L (though these are weak), AW71L, or AW72L (this one is designed for Volvo 16V engine with shorter gearing so probably less ideal for TDI power band). AW71L is the strongest version with lockup but only came in late era 940 Turbo cars so are hard to find.

All would be a much more difficult path than rebuilding the existing 2.4L or, if you wish to swap, using a Euro market 2.5L TDI 5cyl that bolts right up to your existing automatic. This has been done many times successfully.

In any outcome, if you want to play with gearing you have many options since an advantage to the RWD Volvo setup is you can choose from a wide range of ring and pinion ratios for the rear axle. 3.31 is the tallest from the factory but would be a nice bolt-in swap from the stock diesel/auto 3.91 axle you have now. You can go even taller than 3.31 if you wish using aftermarket gears for the Dana 30 axle. Many options for lockers and limited slip setups too. But if you stick with the stock 2.4L prechamber engine that likes to rev, the factory gearing is actually pretty well suited, the ZF trans has a good overdrive ratio.