If there is a Buyback..What would it take for you get out of your TDI?

[pparks1]

But nobody knows what a retrofit actually entails. Just a relash, adding urea to cars without it, upping urea dosing rates, etc.

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[30Bones]

My 2012 JSW has been paid for for a while now and to force me to sell it would take me getting into something without a payment. Plain and simple. What would that be? No idea and since this won't be happening anyway I am not sweating it.

I'd rather keep the car, get the "EPA reflash" that will net me less mpg and get a phat check from VW for the mpg loss. Again, that won't happen.

Maybe this was asked, what about getting a malone tune and exhaust after all this is in the rear view? No emissions where I am at, but will there be??

 

[oldhifi]

A new Volkswagen Amarok

 

[Got Haggis?]

Maybe this was asked, what about getting a malone tune and exhaust after all this is in the rear view? No emissions where I am at, but will there be??

yeah, that is one thing that gives me pause. Does this mean my state will now start emissions tests on diesels?

 

[30Bones]

yeah, that is one thing that gives me pause. Does this mean my state will now start emissions tests on diesels?

That's my thoughts. If they want to adapt a urea system to my car, I better get the option to have it bought back. Ain't nobody got time for that!

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

I agree that housing market comparisons are irrelevant. I only mentioned it because it points out the fickle nature of the value of hard assets.

And I'm not sure why intent should affect VW's response. How do we know whether or not other manufacturers looked the other way and installed faulty components. All we do know is that VW owned up to it.

If the fix includes adding Adblue to the cars owners may get an engine with equal or better performance and better fuel economy than before. Could be a win for customers.

 

[tjsadler]

And I'm not sure why intent should affect VW's response. How do we know whether or not other manufacturers looked the other way and installed faulty components. All we do know is that VW owned up to it.

Intent is a VERY important factor. I'm about to go get coffee. If I accidentally lose control and run over someone on the sidewalk, it is a tragedy, but my insurance will pay and that will be the end of it. (apart from my lifelong guilt and horror) If I intentionally swerve and run someone over, I'm going to prison for many, many years.

If I go buy a lawnmower and it breaks due to a manufacturing defect, then I get to exchange it. If the defect caused harm to someone then they still might get sued. If it is found that they intentionally sold it to me with a bad part because it saved them money and they designed it that way from the start knowing full well that the part would fly off and hurt people, then they are in for a world of hurt/lawsuits. That is what has happened here.

 

[turbobrick240]

Intent is a VERY important factor. I'm about to go get coffee. If I accidentally lose control and run over someone on the sidewalk, it is a tragedy, but my insurance will pay and that will be the end of it. (apart from my lifelong guilt and horror) If I intentionally swerve and run someone over, I'm going to prison for many, many years.
If I go buy a lawnmower and it breaks due to a manufacturing defect, then I get to exchange it. If the defect caused harm to someone then they still might get sued. If it is found that they intentionally sold it to me with a bad part because it saved them money and they designed it that way from the start knowing full well that the part would fly off and hurt people, then they are in for a world of hurt/lawsuits. That is what has happened here.

No, that's what happened with GM's faulty ignition cover-up. People died as a direct result of GM's failure to address the issue they were aware of for years.

 

[kevin_in_idaho]

looks like its a retrofit

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/aut...w&hootPostID=e00a5de529618fa51c2a4c830360cc94

They'd have to do more than that for me to be happy. This will be an extra expense on my TDI and they better provide it free. I bought my car because it didn't need the Adblue. If it means I get less mpg, etc. they better figure that out too.

If it means they are going to "re-fit" with a new engine, that's kind of bogus too as my car only has 35k miles on it. I could have bought a TDI with 100k miles for half the price and then get a new engine.

The 'devil is in the details' as they say.

 

[Philpug]

They'd have to do more than that for me to be happy. This will be an extra expense on my TDI and they better provide it free. I bought my car because it didn't need the Adblue. If it means I get less mpg, etc. they better figure that out too.
If it means they are going to "re-fit" with a new engine, that's kind of bogus too as my car only has 35k miles on it. I could have bought a TDI with 100k miles for half the price and then get a new engine.
The 'devil is in the details' as they say.

While they say it now, our happiness is not their concern. Their only concern is complying to the EPA and their shareholders. We will be lucky to get a free oil change out of this (if we supply the oil and filter and pay for the labor).

 

[dmarsingill]

I think I have lost quality time being sucked into reading and responding to this thread. You guys are delusional. Just drive the car and stop worrying so much. They are not going to make any of you happy. I don't feel cheated in any way. I get the stated MPG, it pollutes a lot less than the car it replaced in 2011, it has plenty of power, it is comfy for 4 on long trips, and it has never left us stranded. It has done everything I've paid for.

Donald

 

[ATR]

I think I have lost quality time being sucked into reading and responding to this thread. You guys are delusional. Just drive the car and stop worrying so much. They are not going to make any of you happy. I don't feel cheated in any way. I get the stated MPG, it pollutes a lot less than the car it replaced in 2011, it has plenty of power, it is comfy for 4 on long trips, and it has never left us stranded. It has done everything I've paid for.

Donald

This thread isn't that bad..... you should see the thread in the emissions forum. I replied once early on... but it got to a point where any time I checked it it there was 4-10 new pages worth of posts

 

[rambalu80]

http://www.wsj.com/articles/volkswa...emissions-rigged-vehicles-says-ceo-1443525496

“[This will be] the biggest service action in the company’s history,” said Christian Buhlmann, Volkswagen’s spokesman for technical issues, although the company has yet to determine how many vehicles need refitting.
The refitting will involve a change of software and possible hardware changes, too, Mr. Buhlmann said. The software change can be performed quickly, and hardware changes will take “at most a few hours,” he said.
As part of servicing, the software that controls the engine has to be updated. Volkswagen expects that carbon dioxide emission and fuel consumption will rise as a result of the software switch, but only minimally, and still within environmental standards.
In some cases hardware changes will also be necessary. In vehicles with 1.2-liter and 1.6-liter engines, which aren’t sold in the U.S., a hardware change will likely be necessary because a fuel injection pump has to be replaced to ensure a smooth ride, Mr. Buhlmann said. In Europe, vehicles with 2-liter engines will only need a software update, but it isn’t clear whether that would suffice in the U.S. due to different standards.

 

[Slothy]

Not sure how I feel about this......
If adblue is required to be retrofitted they better be providing it for the life of the car. Also if it takes away any cargo/spare tire space.....they better get ready for some ****. Cause I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one that bought the golf for hatch space


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[pknopp]

I just hope we are left with the option of doing nothing.

 

[roostre]

…..
If the fix includes adding Adblue to the cars owners may get an engine with equal or better performance and better fuel economy than before. Could be a win for customers.

I hope so too. But I am not interested in this option. I’m out.

In 2012, I would never have purchased a TDI with AdBlue.
Now that I know more, I would not purchase a TDI without AdBlue.

I do not want a TDI that has been converted to use AdBlue.
I want a TDI that has been designed and built to use AdBlue.

Considering the issues with TDIs, maybe I don’t really need one.

 

[roostre]

I just hope we are left with the option of doing nothing.

I hope so too.

 

[Vidgamer]

I hope so too. But I am not interested in this option. I’m out.
In 2012, I would never have purchased a TDI with AdBlue.
Now that I know more, I would not purchase a TDI without AdBlue.
I do not want a TDI that has been converted to use AdBlue.
I want a TDI that has been designed and built to use AdBlue.
Considering the issues with TDIs, maybe I don’t really need one.

Why, what is so different about AdBlue where it needs a whole redesign? As I understand it, it just works on the exhaust. Would this get rid of some of the other junk, like the "regen"? It sounds like the existing technology just can't get rid of enough nox and the Adblue method should, so I'm not surprised if this is the solution.

I did a quick search and found an Audi brochure which said that Adblue is supposed to last between 10,000 mi. maintenance periods, which doesn't sound too bad. Hopefully it would be the same on the Golf?

My concern is that it would get worse mileage or even performance, after the changes. If it were a software-only change, I can understand how they might have to cut back on the performance, but would Adblue perform as well or better? Why not better?

I'm sure they'd be happy to trade me up to a GTI. ;-)

 

[CraziFuzzy]

We had been toying around with the idea of getting into the new golf sportwagen in a couple years, if for nothing else, than to try to avoid yet another fuel system replacement on our '09. Was not looking forward to the car payment though. At this point, I'm really not sure what I'd even be interested in. I still enjoy the way the car performs, and my biggest worry would be the 'fix' degrading that. Also very concerned about the actual value of the vehicle if it is or is not fixed. I figured it was worth about US$8k 2 weeks ago - no idea now.

Might end up going into a proper hybrid - would love pure electric, but wife pushes the range on some days.

 

[Pokey151]

Blue book good condition

 

[30Bones]

I just hope we are left with the option of doing nothing.

Don't hold your breathe. This IS the .gov here, we need them in our business to carry on with day to day life. ?


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[Vidgamer]

I have not found hybrids or electrics to be too interesting, unless we're talking about the unobtainable Tesla.

I'm hoping to keep this car for a while longer....

 

[texsize]

13 jetta TDI DSG

For me they would have to pay off the loan first. I have 70K miles on it and am upside down on the loan. So if they pay off the loan and give me 4K off sticker on a new car I would take it.
I would like the chance for a " do over" cuz I would like to go with a manual transmission. The DSG works just fine but the Maintenance cost is too much. I would also like to get a wagon because I have stuff (exoctic birds) I would like to be able to move around and there cages take up alot of room.
If the TDI is out of the picture I realy don't know what I would go with. The TSI uses premium fuel so the fact that the gas MPG is good does not help when you have to spend so much $$ to fill the tank.
For the same reason the hybrid is also not a $ saver.
My biggest reason for buying the TDI in the first place was for distance travled on a tank of fuel. I would have to look over all the other options.
texsize

 

[ATR]

For me they would have to pay off the loan first. I have 70K miles on it and am upside down on the loan. So if they pay off the loan and give me 4K off sticker on a new car I would take it.
I would like the chance for a " do over" cuz I would like to go with a manual transmission. The DSG works just fine but the Maintenance cost is too much. I would also like to get a wagon because I have stuff (exoctic birds) I would like to be able to move around and there cages take up alot of room.
If the TDI is out of the picture I realy don't know what I would go with. The TSI uses premium fuel so the fact that the gas MPG is good does not help when you have to spend so much $$ to fill the tank.
For the same reason the hybrid is also not a $ saver.
My biggest reason for buying the TDI in the first place was for distance travled on a tank of fuel. I would have to look over all the other options.
texsize

The new 1.8TSI uses regular gas. Premium is NOT required for the 1.8... only the 2.0 TSI requires premium gas.

 

[roostre]

Why, what is so different about AdBlue where it needs a whole redesign?
…..

The AdBlue system is comprised of multiple components integrated with other components and systems. Adding and fitting an AdBlue system into an existing vehicle design after the fact is not an easy task and very different from designing it in from the beginning. It will not be the same physical design even though it functions similarly.

My fear is that this will be a quick-and-dirty unrefined alteration to my vehicle that will be difficult to install and have future reliability and repair issues.

Search and read about the issues members on this forum have had with the existing AdBlue system.

If VW could pay a fine to the EPA and leave the car as is, these vehicles would have an acceptable resale value. But this will probably not happen and most likely the desirability of these vehicles will be less after any “fix”.

 

[Philpug]

VW has done a lot wrong here but now some are asking them to pay off cars they are upside down with. Why should VW pay for your poor financial decision? If you owed just $100.00 on a 2014 would you expect VW to give you just that amount for the car? What you owe and what VW does are mutually separate situations.

 

[texsize]

Paying off the loan + 4K would be ~ the purchas price of the car.
If I can't have the car I paid for and am still paying for ( MPG + 600 miles between fil lups + a full sized spare tire) then the least VW can do is give me a re-fund.
That is what this thread is about "If there is a Buyback..What would it take for you get out of your TDI?

 

[HJWII]

VW has done a lot wrong here but now some are asking them to pay off cars they are upside down with. Why should VW pay for your poor financial decision? If you owed just $100.00 on a 2014 would you expect VW to give you just that amount for the car? What you owe and what VW does are mutually separate situations.

I respectfully disagree. Many people bought the product based on advertisement and claims that it was "clean" and good for the environment and met all legal emission laws and standards. What they got was not the product they were told they were buying.

I don;t know, think of it as buying Diet Coke because you want to lose weight (Yeah, I know, it's all bad, but work with me). Diet Coke claims to be no calories and sugar free, hence a far better alternative that regular Coke. But, then you find out Diet Coke was just repackaged Coke, full of sugar and 100 calories. If that's the case, you've been misled, lied to. You;re going to want your money back. You're going to demand damages to be paid. Granted, there is a big difference between a $1.75 bottle of Coke and $10,000 left on my car.

But, this is what Volkswagen has done. They didn't sell the car they said they were selling. The broke the consumer's trust. They broke their confidence. They now have to make the necessary reparations to retained those customers, whether it be the tree huggers or people like me who bought the car for the milage (I drive 200 miles a day).

I will gladly buy another VW if they forgive my note and offer a sizable "loyalty" rebate. But, I will not be happy if I have to pay off the car, and then be burdened with the lost of cargo space/spare tire/performance while incurring an additional maintenance expense along with paying the 50 cent more per gallon for diesel while getting the same milage as a gas VW.

Waitaminute... did I misunderstand the post I quoted? Oh well... had to rant a bit..

 

[VWWV]

VW ought to want to do more than just make its car's owners "whole." They need to repair brand damage and restore owner trust in the company and brand. If any re-flash diminishes the value and performance of the vehicles below the specifications on new sale or resale, an alternative should be offered:
--buyback at 125% FMV, or
--trade-in credit at 200% FMV (up to replacement vehicle MSRP) toward any new VW car or SUV.
That would be a reasonable offer.

Who's to say that VW wouldn't FLIP any"buy backs" in China, Mexico, India, Indonesia, etc.? They likely could recoup any forthcoming fines. OTOH, VW might offer to install a fuel injector in the exhaust system to burn off pollutants? That would be a cheap fix. They did that in 1996 and it blinded the EPA "EXPERTS" then and likely would do so again. Chances are, however, that VW will install a Gary Larson Transmogrifyer chip which will, on demand, change your JSW into a Ferrari.

 

[roostre]

…..
Many people bought the product based on advertisement …..

The next ad campaign may sound like a Dos Equis commercial.

“TDI, the most interesting car in the world.”