HydroDiesel

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
If you’re looking to get the most out of your diesel engine, then try running HydroDiesel in your vehicle.
http://trillion.energy/en/

I first learned about HydroDiesel a year ago from a YouTube video where the guy on Warped Perception put a Kohler Turbo Diesel engine in a go-kart. After building the go-kart he ran two different types of fuel, with one being straight diesel and the other one being an all new fuel called HydroDiesel.

What got my attention was that it burned quite a bit cleaner than standard diesel, which is pretty important to me when I run my TDI powered VW R32 at the track for High Performance Driver Education (HDPE) a.k.a. track days. I usually get black flagged for the "excessive" amount of exhaust coming out of my car, which ruins that session since I’d have to come into the pit lane and explain why my car is smoking so much compared to the gas cars out on the track. It sucks losing out on one of the sessions, since you only get 5 or 6 twenty minute sessions in a day and when each track day costs anywhere from $280 to $310, I wanna get the most out of each track day.

I’m hoping that I’ll be dynoing my car in a month or so with both fuels to see what the difference in power is along with the difference in exhaust output is.

If you wanna give HydroDiesel a try contact John Leonard at jleonard@trillion.energy
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
No, this stuff looks to be a diesel/water emulsion. Probably works great as long as the water stays in emulsion. I wouldn't want to store quantities of it for very long though.
 

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
No, this stuff looks to be a diesel/water emulsion. Probably works great as long as the water stays in emulsion. I wouldn't want to store quantities of it for very long though.
You hit the nail on the head. When I spoke with John, He explained to me that it was an emulsion with very little water in it. I forgot the percentage of water in it, but if you wanna learn more about, send John an email. :) (y)
 

QuickTD

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2002
Location
SW Ontario
TDI
2003 Audi A4Q 5spd 2.0 TDI 2056VK R783, 2006 Audi A4Q 6spd 2.0 TDI, 2007 A4Q 6spd 2.0 TDI
I've seen the pics from your track days. You should fix the tune. It is disgusting. That will do more for the smoking (and reliability) than anything else. Tire fire smoke does not make much extra power. I bet you could pull 10-15mg and not notice a difference in power. It's just going out the tailpipe...

If you are above the 200hp level and not tuning yourself you are going to have trouble getting it right. A tuner will never be able to trim it to a powerful smoke free tune over email. I am on revision 28 of my tune and it is still not perfect. A wideband (or at least a rear view mirror), some tools and education will solve your problems.
 

[486]

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Location
MN
TDI
02 golf ALH
Water in diesel... Dunno man, seems like something I'd avoid.
It is way easy to just run a normal water injection setup, and you get additional charge cooling as a benefit.

If you are above the 200hp level and not tuning yourself you are going to have trouble getting it right. A tuner will never be able to trim it to a powerful smoke free tune over email. I am on revision 28 of my tune and it is still not perfect. A wideband (or at least a rear view mirror), some tools and education will solve your problems.
100% agreed on this

according to my changelogs I'm 189 revisions into the tune on my golf (this is including all three compound turbo setups and 4 sets of injectors and 3 injection pumps) and it still isn't dialled in all that good, but that's what I get for stubbornly refusing to ditch the MAF

element, your maps are already doubtless set up for MAP based fuelling, and just need the easy smoke maps trimmed down for your unique setup
really you don't have much to lose by downloading the vagedcsuite software and buying the $20 silver cable to start playing around in your ecu
 

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
I've seen the pics from your track days. You should fix the tune. It is disgusting. That will do more for the smoking (and reliability) than anything else. Tire fire smoke does not make much extra power. I bet you could pull 10-15mg and not notice a difference in power. It's just going out the tailpipe...

If you are above the 200hp level and not tuning yourself you are going to have trouble getting it right. A tuner will never be able to trim it to a powerful smoke free tune over email. I am on revision 28 of my tune and it is still not perfect. A wideband (or at least a rear view mirror), some tools and education will solve your problems.
Thanks for all of your constructive criticism negative nancy. :rolleyes:

Maybe you should read through my build thread before you comment. 😉 If you had read through my build thread, you would realize that I had to put a new engine in the car from too much fuel melting down cylinder 4, so I was already well aware of it being over fueled, so thank you for your comment captain obvious.




I believe the car only makes 50AWHP and 75 lb-ft of torque, so I should be all set. 🤣

I really, really wish I was able to tune the car, but unfortunately I'm unable to, so I've had to get help with tuning the car. I'm well aware that the tune needs some major tweaking to get the smoke under control and still keep the power up.


I've made some hardware changes as well to help the engine breath much more than it had previously with the original engine, so the new 3" TIP instead of the PD150 TIP and GTB2362VKLR replaced the GTB2262VKLR. Both have helped clean up the smoke even before any tweaks to the tune.

A water/meth kit is also being added to the car to help keep EGTs in check and should allow the tune to be leaned out some more without the risk of melting the engine down again.

If you wanna come and help me tune my car, I'll take all the help I can get. (y)😊 I'm not as big a dick in person I promise, I just get defensive when people call my car disgusting without knowing the background on the car or the owner. 😉
 

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
Water in diesel... Dunno man, seems like something I'd avoid.
It is way easy to just run a normal water injection setup, and you get additional charge cooling as a benefit.


100% agreed on this

according to my changelogs I'm 189 revisions into the tune on my golf (this is including all three compound turbo setups and 4 sets of injectors and 3 injection pumps) and it still isn't dialled in all that good, but that's what I get for stubbornly refusing to ditch the MAF

element, your maps are already doubtless set up for MAP based fuelling, and just need the easy smoke maps trimmed down for your unique setup
really you don't have much to lose by downloading the vagedcsuite software and buying the $20 silver cable to start playing around in your ecu
The car gets used from the end of April until the early part of November, then it sits in a heated shop the rest of the time, so I'm not too worried about a small amount of water being in the fuel. Even still a water/meth kit is getting installed before I hit the track with the car again.

See above about me being able to tune my own car. I really, really wish I could tune my own car, but it's physically not possible.

If you wanna come help me tune my car, I'll take all the help I can get. (y)😊
 

QuickTD

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2002
Location
SW Ontario
TDI
2003 Audi A4Q 5spd 2.0 TDI 2056VK R783, 2006 Audi A4Q 6spd 2.0 TDI, 2007 A4Q 6spd 2.0 TDI
It's not personal, I just hate any sort of coal rolling antics. It gives diesel a bad image and is not necessary. I have watched the build of the car and I am aware of your situation. You still don't get a pass on the coal rolling. I am also not a dick in person and if you were closer and the border not closed I would gladly help out.

It appears you have way more than the necessary components for a solid track car. The solution to the smoke and EGT problems now lie in the software, not anywhere else.

I believe your situation puts you in a good position to tune your car, assuming you are computer literate and physically able to use a computer. I can't count the number of times I've wanted to be the tuner in the passenger seat. It's difficult to monitor things while also safely operating the car. I end up using logging combined with video, it is cumbersome...

I would encourage you to learn all you can about diesel tuning, it isn't as difficult as it is made out to be. I would suggest reading the threads on tuning in the performance section as well as signing up on some tuning forums, ECUconnections is quite good. Your car is running EDC15, so you can tune with freeware EDCsuite which is incredibly simple to use for general tuning. Since your MAP scaling and some other difficult bits are done, EDCsuite can finish the job.
 

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
I'm not a fan of rolling coal either, so it's not ideal when my car is one of the worst offenders. :cry:

Yeah, I'm happy with where the hardware is going to be at once the shop it's at replaces some parts and installs the water/meth kit. I just wanna dial in the tune and enjoy it from this point forward.

Sounds like I'll have to look into tuning my own car in the future, since I have plenty of time to figure things out with the software. Besides a laptop, VCDS cable, and getting a new ECU to load the tune onto, what else do I need to do my own tuning?

I appreciate your offer to help with tuning if you were closer. I didn't realize that the border was still closed between Canada and the USA.🤷‍♂️

You'd hate the entire group on Facebook called TDI Scumbags. They're all about rolling coal and hood stacks. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️
 

[486]

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Location
MN
TDI
02 golf ALH
Sounds like I'll have to look into tuning my own car in the future, since I have plenty of time to figure things out with the software. Besides a laptop, VCDS cable, and getting a new ECU to load the tune onto, what else do I need to do my own tuning?
silver MPPS cable off ebay, comes with the software to read/write the binary off the ECU
you don't need a second computer, it flashes through the obd2 port, you just pull the gauge cluster fuse and it'll read and write without even needing to open the hood
 

3L3M3NT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Location
Sturgeon Bay, WI
TDI
04 Jetta GLS TDI, 04 RTDI
silver MPPS cable off ebay, comes with the software to read/write the binary off the ECU
you don't need a second computer, it flashes through the obd2 port, you just pull the gauge cluster fuse and it'll read and write without even needing to open the hood
Thanks for the info. I'll look more into this when I get my car back hopefully at the end of the month.
 

QuickTD

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2002
Location
SW Ontario
TDI
2003 Audi A4Q 5spd 2.0 TDI 2056VK R783, 2006 Audi A4Q 6spd 2.0 TDI, 2007 A4Q 6spd 2.0 TDI
I had a MPPS cable with the silver box, it worked good until I dragged it through a water puddle flashing a car outside... I now have another ebay mpps cable, V18. It's just a black box on the OBD end, it also works great, cost $30. I don't think you can really miss on the cable.

If you get a cable and download the file from the car, I'd be willing to take a look and make some suggestions.
 
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