Help with insurance adjustor?

[Mozambiquer]

Believe me, you can fight it. A lot of people don't know that, but the insurance company is wanting to get by the cheapest they can, whereas they are supposed to give you your car's value. They want you to just accept it and shut up, and don't want you to know you don't have to accept it. Obviously, you can't replace your car with a comparable car for what they're offering, and they don't care. That's why you fight.

 

[BuckeyeMan71]

Hell if it was such good condition do what I did. I bought mine back and fixed it up myself and I don’t regret it one bit

 

[CleverUserName]

You're just wasting your time. They won't give you anymore than that.

My mother had a very nice 2003 Jetta GLS Sedan 5MT w/255K that had $7000 of work done in 2021 including a $2,000 Pioneer Multimedia Navigation system w/ Backup Camera, G60/VR6, Malone State II, New Wuzetem .216 Nozzles, Full Timing Belts service, Accessory Belt, Bora Glass Lenses, ETC... It was beautiful and the interior was in excellent condition as well.

We had multiple comps in the $6K-$8K from Cragslist, Autotrader, Etc.. and the most we could get is $4600 for it. We had all the receipts as well but they didn't care.

 

[csstevej]

Maybe it’s your insurance company….
You couldn’t by the car back and part it…… sounds like you could’ve made bank stripping it ….

 

[Mongler98]

I guess the way it should be put is this.
If you need $ then take it. If you dont need the $ then fight it.
Few people who own cars that are this cheap have more than a paycheck to paycheck lifestyle. Getting the value of the car to go find a replacment and keep working is usually the way to go if you dont have means to other transportation.
To me. I can use the $ more than I can wait for it. I usually float CC debt or can do more with the money at the time. Waiting 4 to 6 months for a wish and a prayer on a grand is IMO for my lifestyle a bad move. Bird In the hand and all that jazz.

 

[DonL]

I would write to the at fault driver and let him know you are filing a suit against him. That is who you sue, not his insurance company. He will panic and call his insurance. Then his insurance company will be forced to defend him, at great cost. They will raise their offer, unless they are complete fools.

 

[Mozambiquer]

I guess the way it should be put is this.
If you need $ then take it. If you dont need the $ then fight it.
Few people who own cars that are this cheap have more than a paycheck to paycheck lifestyle. Getting the value of the car to go find a replacment and keep working is usually the way to go if you dont have means to other transportation.
To me. I can use the $ more than I can wait for it. I usually float CC debt or can do more with the money at the time. Waiting 4 to 6 months for a wish and a prayer on a grand is IMO for my lifestyle a bad move. Bird In the hand and all that jazz.

And there's one of the differences between me and you... I have no debt at all, and don't live paycheck to paycheck, and would rather wait if it means a better settlement.

 

[hskrdu]

My .02:
The standard process seems to be that the insurance company makes and initial "fair" offer, based on as little research and effort as possible (time is money), and hopes/expects that the customer will take it because some/many people aren't willing to make the small counter effort. Of course, there are also the people who will tell you your car is old and not worth much (and these people aren't always the ones working for the insurance company). The customer then either accepts the initial offer, or makes the small effort to counter the offer by doing a little research and talking to the adjuster or agent. This process either continues (effort and patience on behalf of the customer), or ends when the customer is happy with the offer- or determines the effort isn't "worth" it. No one else can tell you what that value is to you, nor should they try. For some people it's about a sense of fairness, for others money, and others like (or hate) the fight.

Personally, a little internet research from home and some phone calls/emails is easily worth it. As said, create a good list of TDI sales. Yes, the comps are often out of market, which is tough when CA prices are higher than elsewhere, but that's all you have to go on. Use all the internet engines and VW F/S sites to collect a dozen prior sales, followed by some F/S ads so the agent can see what it would cost to replace. Some engines allow you to search historical sales, which can also be super helpful.

I can't speak to "insurance companies" as a class, or generalize past this story to counter the inaccuracies stated in the posts above, but our friend's 2003 Jetta TDI 5M was hit at a stop light from behind, just prior to COVID. The car is perfect mechanically, but had 225,000mi and some exterior wear. The insurance company offered $2900. He eventually received just under $5000. Effort? Work? Just an internet search and some phone calls or emails. His comps included Jettas and Golfs, older TDIs (but not newer), and cars from all over the country.

No, they won't pay you for modifications, fancy stereo installs, or care about receipts for maintenance, but if you can make a good argument for market value, you'll typically see an appropriate response.

Oh, and he kept the car, we replaced the trunk and rear bumper cover, and it now has a happy 250,000 miles on it and is going strong.

 

[Mongler98]

And there's one of the differences between me and you... I have no debt at all, and don't live paycheck to paycheck, and would rather wait if it means a better settlement.

Hows the weather up there on that high horse your on?
You dont know me!
I said I float cc dept. Not that I have it.... well any that I pay interest in and I have been doing well enough. I simply stated that most people dont have this luxury to not have a running car for work!

 

[Rrusse11]

"Hell if it was such good condition do what I did. I bought mine back and fixed it up myself and I don’t regret it one bit" Buckeyeman
Fight the insurance company for more money. Take it and buy the "wreck" back. Fix it if it's really minor damage.
You'll be way ahead if you can find the right body shop and or mechanic.

 

[Abacus]

no insurance ever will or ever will do that. its a payout. not a used car lot with 20+ year old cars.
unless it states replacement in your statement, then no, guess you got lucky.

Once again, you’re completely wrong.

Many people have done this, myself included just last summer.

This is a game insurance companies play to not pay out as much. Don’t play their game and make them face reality.

 

[Mongler98]

Once again, you’re completely wrong.

Many people have done this, myself included just last summer.

This is a game insurance companies play to not pay out as much. Don’t play their game and make them face reality.

Referring to what the insurance policy states and that they dont care about the mods you put on the car is 100% accurate. Unless you have "hotrod" insurance most providers will tell you to pound sand about your seemingly worthless mods that were not declared prior to the accident. I didnt mean that they all wont' just that it's about the policy.

 

[Abacus]

No one was referring to anything ‘hot rod’. They are referring to being able to argue the payout price and not settle for the first offer.

 

[CleverUserName]

You can insure a car for the money you put into it. Unfortunately it is significantly more expensive to do this and is cost prohibitive.

After my mothers $10K 2003 Jetta was totaled, she luckily found a super nice 2006 Jetta TDI with only 96K miles. It is a manual and has the option package 2 so came with the automatic climate control (Climatronic?) and leather. It had bunch of upgrades like a new Frank06 camshaft and EGR cooler, new Luk clutch, Malone Stage II, etcetera... I think the seller was someone who was on this forum at one time because he knew about all the upgrades to do on the BRM but for some reason it was listed on Craigslist.

She paid $12k for it about 6 months ago and afterwards she looked into the cost of insuring it for what she paid. It was over 2x as expensive for the policy with custom coverage. Over $2000 per year was her quote from Farmers. She decided against it but you can do it if your not willing to take the risk and pay it every year instead.

 

[MarsBar]

Memorize the "Fair Claims Settlement Act" on the Dept of Ins website. Quote it chapter and verse to the adjustor and stand firm. Make a list of the comps that YOU find on CraigsList according to the Act and put it in table form with your car in the first column. I went through this exact thing 3 years ago with my B4V in California. Ended up having to go to Small Claims Court, but I was awarded Fair Market Value for my totaled car by knowing the FCSA and being very organized. Good luck! You're in for a long and frustrating battle, but you can make them play by the rules.

Feel free to PM me if you need an ear that's dealt with it in Calif.

 

[MarsBar]

Then why is this an issue?

It's an issue because the insurance companies most often refuse to play by the rules of the State of California.

 

[Mongler98]

No one was referring to anything ‘hot rod’. They are referring to being able to argue the payout price and not settle for the first offer.

Modifications are only usually covered under a hot rod clause or policy.

 

[Abacus]

Modifications are only usually covered under a hot rod clause or policy.

Once again, who cares. No one but you is bringing up the modifications. What is being mentioned is the fair market value for the car, a car that is becoming more rare due to so few of them around. Like RevKev found out, they will bring up comparables that are not comparable since they’re usually gassers and not diesels. Reject their offer if they are not true comparables, you don’t need to accept it, tell them why, and watch the offer increase.

 

[Mongler98]

Once again, who cares. No one but you is bringing up the modifications.

yea, thats not correct and instead of ripping on me just to do so, you could... you know... read the thread and not jump to conclusions. OP is very amendment that this car is worth more from them and others tend to agree or disagree.
once again, jump right in and kick my sides just to do so. i can take it especially when im correct.
I would think that close to 10% of the posts (not including me) so far talk about the mods and why or why not the insurance may or may not cover it.
its pointless to argue if they do because OP does NOT have a "hot rod" clause or policy. thats all that matters, what the policy says. every one may have a different policy and thus why some have better luck with getting an actual decent payout!
OP cant find decent comps to compare the car to and thats all that matters.

Tell the insurance company to find a replacement vehicle of same make , milage and condition as yours…..along with any mods or replacements parts done, ie tires , clutch , brakes etc….
I will bet they cant and should raise the payout to you.
I went through this with wife’s van that got T-boned in a parking lot by some teenager cutting through a double space and texting….. they totaled the van….van had high milage around 240,xxx miles but was in very nice shape ( 2005 Toyota Sienna xle awd limited ).
Made them look around for a replacement, after about a week or two of searching they couldn’t and coughed 2 grand more than the first offer.
Stick to your guns……
The comps people here will help , as stated look outside your area for other TDI’s and use them……

Maybe it’s your insurance company….
You couldn’t by the car back and part it…… sounds like you could’ve made bank stripping it ….

My .02:
The standard process seems to be that the insurance company makes and initial "fair" offer, based on as little research and effort as possible (time is money), and hopes/expects that the customer will take it because some/many people aren't willing to make the small counter effort. Of course, there are also the people who will tell you your car is old and not worth much (and these people aren't always the ones working for the insurance company). The customer then either accepts the initial offer, or makes the small effort to counter the offer by doing a little research and talking to the adjuster or agent. This process either continues (effort and patience on behalf of the customer), or ends when the customer is happy with the offer- or determines the effort isn't "worth" it. No one else can tell you what that value is to you, nor should they try. For some people it's about a sense of fairness, for others money, and others like (or hate) the fight.

Personally, a little internet research from home and some phone calls/emails is easily worth it. As said, create a good list of TDI sales. Yes, the comps are often out of market, which is tough when CA prices are higher than elsewhere, but that's all you have to go on. Use all the internet engines and VW F/S sites to collect a dozen prior sales, followed by some F/S ads so the agent can see what it would cost to replace. Some engines allow you to search historical sales, which can also be super helpful.

I can't speak to "insurance companies" as a class, or generalize past this story to counter the inaccuracies stated in the posts above, but our friend's 2003 Jetta TDI 5M was hit at a stop light from behind, just prior to COVID. The car is perfect mechanically, but had 225,000mi and some exterior wear. The insurance company offered $2900. He eventually received just under $5000. Effort? Work? Just an internet search and some phone calls or emails. His comps included Jettas and Golfs, older TDIs (but not newer), and cars from all over the country.

No, they won't pay you for modifications, fancy stereo installs, or care about receipts for maintenance, but if you can make a good argument for market value, you'll typically see an appropriate response.

Oh, and he kept the car, we replaced the trunk and rear bumper cover, and it now has a happy 250,000 miles on it and is going strong.

You can insure a car for the money you put into it. Unfortunately it is significantly more expensive to do this and is cost prohibitive.

After my mothers $10K 2003 Jetta was totaled, she luckily found a super nice 2006 Jetta TDI with only 96K miles. It is a manual and has the option package 2 so came with the automatic climate control (Climatronic?) and leather. It had bunch of upgrades like a new Frank06 camshaft and EGR cooler, new Luk clutch, Malone Stage II, etcetera... I think the seller was someone who was on this forum at one time because he knew about all the upgrades to do on the BRM but for some reason it was listed on Craigslist.

She paid $12k for it about 6 months ago and afterwards she looked into the cost of insuring it for what she paid. It was over 2x as expensive for the policy with custom coverage. Over $2000 per year was her quote from Farmers. She decided against it but you can do it if your not willing to take the risk and pay it every year instead.

 

[turbodieseldyke]

close to 10% of the posts so far talk about the mods and why or why not the insurance may or may not cover it

Mod #1: TDI instead of gasser
Mod #2: Inflated used car values

They have to cover those mods, like it or not.

 

[Nero Morg]

Mod #1: TDI instead of gasser
Mod #2: Inflated used car values

They have to cover those mods, like it or not.

Gotta be careful with what you bring up, if it's power mods, it can be taken as emissions mods, and in a testing state that's super strict, other issues can arise. Just saying. Anytime we uprate heavy duty diesels we have to update the engine data tag otherwise the epa will be up our.... Yeah.

 

[csstevej]

As far as mods I was stating….not everyone does all kinds of power mods because you do , the mods I was talking about are none power mods…. ie larger tires , aluminum rims , bigger brakes , better fuel filtering system , a in tank pump if not equipped , better headlights , leather seats if not originally equipped…etc……espically if they are going by the vin number and what the car originally came with……

 

[Mongler98]

As far as mods I was stating….not everyone does all kinds of power mods because you do , the mods I was talking about are none power mods…. ie larger tires , aluminum rims , bigger brakes , better fuel filtering system , a in tank pump if not equipped , better headlights , leather seats if not originally equipped…etc……espically if they are going by the vin number and what the car originally came with……

You might be able to get most of that covered under maintenance. As long as you just state it as such. The wheels..... probably not.
Paperwork is paramount. I hope you get the most and best case out of this. I just and non of the people I know directly ever get that. I always get screwed out of things like this.

 

[yeeet]

Forget lawyers and forget all this nonsence. It's a old car that's not very safe from today's standards and not worth much. Take the $ and run. Sucks but you might be able to get a bot more if you push but you will get less by paying an attorney.

Insurance companies will always try to payout as little as they can..I've seen amazing things happen when people get lawyers involved

 

[Mongler98]

Insurance companies will always try to payout as little as they can..I've seen amazing things happen when people get lawyers involved

Yes. For a car worth 10x what this one is!

 

[Abacus]

yea, thats not correct and instead of ripping on me just to do so, you could... you know... read the thread and not jump to conclusions. OP is very amendment that this car is worth more from them and others tend to agree or disagree.
once again, jump right in and kick my sides just to do so. i can take it especially when im correct.
I would think that close to 10% of the posts (not including me) so far talk about the mods and why or why not the insurance may or may not cover it.
its pointless to argue if they do because OP does NOT have a "hot rod" clause or policy. thats all that matters, what the policy says. every one may have a different policy and thus why some have better luck with getting an actual decent payout!
OP cant find decent comps to compare the car to and thats all that matters.

Ripping on you? Not hardly. And that’s laughable considering some of your posts.

I merely pointed out that you are the one constantly bringing up the mods, not others. Even of the 4 quotes you posted, only one pertains to mods, the others reference the value of the car and comparables, which is what the rest of us are talking about.

If the insurance company won’t pay out what the OP feels it’s worth, then it’s up to him to haggle with the insurance company until they are satisfied. It has been documented MANY times on here that the insurance companies don’t put forth the effort to find cars like the one totaled to determine a fair price. They come up with gas cars, other models, and whatever else they can with the *hopes* the minimal effort put in by them and lowball offer will be accepted. Sometimes a simple letter from a law firm will straighten them out.

And it doesn’t matter what the cost of the car, like your erroneous “…car worth 10x what this one is” post above. Fair is fair and the insurance companies don’t play fair, they play the numbers, so you have to MAKE them play fair and sometimes that takes some time and effort.

I had to battle with the insurance company recently on my own car when the bikes blew off driving across the country. It was no ones’ fault but the weather and the insurance company wanted to total the car for mere cosmetic damage. I had to argue with them for over a month but they finally agreed to repair the car and did. And this wasn’t some car worth “10x its value”, it was a 2014 Kia Optima with almost 90k on it.

It’s up to the OP to determine if they are agreeable with the settlement amount, and if not, they can choose to do something about it or not. They were just asking for input, which they have received and then some.

Does this look like almost $9k worth of damage? I didn't think so either but it was. Times have changed as to the value of cars.

Then again, most people wouldn't think this is $12k worth of bikes either.

 

[MarsBar]

My .02:
The standard process seems to be that the insurance company makes and initial "fair" offer, based on as little research and effort as possible (time is money), and hopes/expects that the customer will take it because some/many people aren't willing to make the small counter effort. Of course, there are also the people who will tell you your car is old and not worth much (and these people aren't always the ones working for the insurance company). The customer then either accepts the initial offer, or makes the small effort to counter the offer by doing a little research and talking to the adjuster or agent. This process either continues (effort and patience on behalf of the customer), or ends when the customer is happy with the offer- or determines the effort isn't "worth" it. No one else can tell you what that value is to you, nor should they try. For some people it's about a sense of fairness, for others money, and others like (or hate) the fight.

Personally, a little internet research from home and some phone calls/emails is easily worth it. As said, create a good list of TDI sales. Yes, the comps are often out of market, which is tough when CA prices are higher than elsewhere, but that's all you have to go on. Use all the internet engines and VW F/S sites to collect a dozen prior sales, followed by some F/S ads so the agent can see what it would cost to replace. Some engines allow you to search historical sales, which can also be super helpful.

I can't speak to "insurance companies" as a class, or generalize past this story to counter the inaccuracies stated in the posts above, but our friend's 2003 Jetta TDI 5M was hit at a stop light from behind, just prior to COVID. The car is perfect mechanically, but had 225,000mi and some exterior wear. The insurance company offered $2900. He eventually received just under $5000. Effort? Work? Just an internet search and some phone calls or emails. His comps included Jettas and Golfs, older TDIs (but not newer), and cars from all over the country.

No, they won't pay you for modifications, fancy stereo installs, or care about receipts for maintenance, but if you can make a good argument for market value, you'll typically see an appropriate response.

Oh, and he kept the car, we replaced the trunk and rear bumper cover, and it now has a happy 250,000 miles on it and is going strong.

EXACTLY!!! Liberty Mutual's first offer for my B4V, in prime condition, was $2600 -- using a gasser sedan and a wagon with a blown tranny for "comps". Fair Market Value at the time, going off the real comps that I found in the Western US was $6300. It took from June to the following February and going to Small Claims Court, but I won a judgment of $6100 (prices had lowered a bit during the interim). It took damn near memorizing the CA Fair Claims Settlement Act and rules for Fair Market Value, but it was worth it. The Act favors the plaintiff. Fair Market Value is book or comps, whichever is GREATER.

EDUCATE YOURSELF, BECAUSE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES HAVE ZERO INTEREST IN PLAYING BY THE RULES. That's all I wanted to happen, not get every penny I could, but to get what was correct according to the rules.

 

[turbodieseldyke]

EXACTLY!!! Liberty Mutual's first offer for my B4V, in prime condition, was $2600 -- using a gasser sedan and a wagon with a blown tranny for "comps". Fair Market Value at the time, going off the real comps that I found in the Western US was $6300. It took from June to the following February and going to Small Claims Court, but I won a judgment of $6100 (prices had lowered a bit during the interim). It took damn near memorizing the CA Fair Claims Settlement Act and rules for Fair Market Value, but it was worth it. The Act favors the plaintiff. Fair Market Value is book or comps, whichever is GREATER.

EDUCATE YOURSELF, BECAUSE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES HAVE ZERO INTEREST IN PLAYING BY THE RULES. That's all I wanted to happen, not get every penny I could, but to get what was correct according to the rules.

If their worst case outcome = they end up paying the fair price, and they never get hit with punitive damages, then they have no incentive to pay a fair price, and every incentive to rip you off. Every single time.

 

[pkhoury]

My 5 speed 02 ALH Golf w/307k miles on it got hit by a negligent driver. I'm in Southern California and they're offering me $3200 to total out the vehicle, my car was in excellent condition cosmetically and mechanically and I feel like this is low based off of limited sales of junkers with these cars getting up in age and people lying to the DMV in order to not pay tax.

Problem I'm having is finding any point of reference to argue the point as I can find virtually no mk4s TDIs, much less nice ones listed currently in the area or any reference for sold vehicles recently.

I know a lot of people are on point with all things car and car dealings here, so I thought I might ask if anyone has advice or can point me to any resources to use while negotiating with the insurance company? Any help appreciated and picture of vehicle attached for reference (slightly older but car was still in the same condition as pictured)

That's VERY VERY VERY low.

So my 2003 Golf TDI, which I converted to a 5 speed, was also a California car (flew in one way to ONT, got a bunch of parts from a donor car I met via the seller and drove back a week later). Anyways, a negligent old lady pulled in front of me in her F-150. I beyond totally my car, and probably her crappy truck. My insurance said $4752 just for the car, and with my aftermarket parts endorsement, came out to about $11000-ish, minus $560 for salvage value, and $500 deductible (which I just got the rest of New Years Day, thanks to subrogation). If it helps, mine had about 200K at the time of loss (I think I bought it with like 192K).

My replacement actually looks a lot like yours, and along with being the same year, it came from Audi of Calabasas (supposedly a trade-in). Photo is at the Southern California Railway Museum in Perris, where I stay when I'm visining So Cal.

 

[pkhoury]

good luck with your efforts but I ewou;ld think 3200 is a fair offer

I disagree. You can't even find a good condition Golf that cheap. I bought my 2002, same color, same transmission, and from So Cal, for $4500 out the door. I think $4000-5000 is a better valuation, but it depends on the insurance company, and whether it's his carrier, or the other person's.

Forget lawyers and forget all this nonsence. It's a old car that's not very safe from today's standards and not worth much. Take the $ and run. Sucks but you might be able to get a bot more if you push but you will get less by paying an attorney.

Sorry dude, but I call BS on this post about safety. I hit an F-150 doing 55mph this past April and my Golf saved my life. Didn't even have a chance to really brake or downshift. When DPS came to do the report, they said that based on witnesses and marks on the pavement, I really was doing 55. I've seen newer cars, like the Kia Sorrento, fare a lot worse in similar accidents, but my Golf sacrificed itself, and yet, it's a 20+ year old platform/design.

As for an attorney, yeah, that's a waste of money. I hired a company in the past that did independent appraisals. If you're using our OWN insurance, you have the right to invoke the appraisal clause, in which an independent appraiser is used (at your expense and at the insurance company's expense). Then you don't have to worry about those crap CCC-one reports with gasser comps and more errors than Swiss cheese. But if you're using the other party's insurance, this is no longer an option, and you will ALWAYS get screwed. The other company in my case wanted to shell out $3900 for my car, take repossession, and not give me any money for aftermarket upgrades. I told them to kiss my behind.