Help, need advice.

[stuartcnc]

I bought a 2006 Jetta TDI around september with 158,000 miles on it. I aquired no maintainence records (big mistake). About a month after buying it I noticed it shudder as I was passing another car under heavy acceleration. The next morning on my way to work after near completion of my 90 mile commute It started making an awful noise and shaking badly. I watched a video on youtube and decided after reading and talking to a few people that it was the turbocharger. I bought a turbo from a member on here and swapped my existing turbo out. After finally getting the turbo swapped out, I fired up the car and not a thing changed, still sounds terrible, one of my friends who has a extensive experience with diesel motors stopped in and listened to it, he is confident that im not hitting on one of my cylinders. we pulled the fuel filter out and it looked horrendous, filled it up with diesel and it held it in like a cup. I replaced the fuel filter and I still have the same problem. I dont know of any TDI gurus in the area, and I'm not sure which steps to take next. I'm sure I haven't provided enough information to pin-point anything but hopefully its a start.

 

[mctdi]

Welcome to the club.

The 2006 is a "PD" series engine. Check under the valve cover for cam shaft / lifter wear. Do a search in the forums for "PD camshaft".

How clean is the intake manifold?

Is the car a 5-speed? The dual mass flywheel breaking up?

Try sending a PM to "franko6". { "Private Messages" under "User CP" }

 

[stuartcnc]

It has the dsg. It makes the noise at idle also. big loss of power. I didn't personally take any thing under the hood apart so I don't really know what the intake manifold looks like. I don't have much time between work and my rediculous commute to tackle anything serious on my own. Should I even consider taking it to a stealership?

 

[05_new_jetta]

Is it smoking while u experience loss of power?

 

[mctdi]

From here I can't be of more help than this set of first thoughts. Hopefully, I am wrong with these. Maybe it is something simple. As they are bigger issues that I have listed. And I understand with that commute there isn't a lot of time to look at things on weekdays.

Is there anyone near you with VagCom, to check things out?


Pre-PDs had intake manifold & soot issues. PDs can soot up the intake too, but not as often. http://pics2.tdiclub.com/gwillie/VW/Sballintake/INTAKEMAN101b.htm Chunks can also come off and get stuck in the valve(s), bending them.

The DSG does have a dual mass flywheel [ DMF ] that can go bad. So far there are only a few of these posted.

 

[A5INKY]

Please do not take it to a dealership unless you are feel the need to punish yourself.

Step one is a VCDS scan for anything obvious (to the ECU anyway). Step two is a cam inspection. Once they get bad enough they can make some pretty bad noises and cause a power loss.

Try posting in the regional section for a nearby VCDS owner if you don't want to lay down the $250-300 for your own (you really should consider buying one). The VC can be pulled in 15 minutes with common tools and a cam than has failed enough to cause what you describe will be obvious to even a less experienced mechanic.

 

[A5INKY]

I would forget the intake clogging idea. PDs run on ULSD do not clog enough to cause any running issues. This is an issue from yesteryear.

 

[Ol'Rattler]

What you did by changing the turbo is what we refer to "shot gunning parts" or taking a WAG about what is wrong and then replacing something and hoping the problem is fixed.

On the PD motor, a very good place to start is to remove the valve cover and inspect the cam and lifters for wear. These motors can wear a cam and lifter out in as little as 80K miles and cause drivability problems.

Before you spend money on anything, learn how your motor works and how to diagnose problems. Go to the 101 and DYI sections both here and on the My Turbo Diesel Forum and get a good working understanding of how your motor functions and the issues that are common to it.

 

[Ol'Rattler]

Please do not take it to a dealership unless you are feel the need to punish yourself.
Step one is a VCDS scan for anything obvious (to the ECU anyway). Step two is a cam inspection. Once they get bad enough they can make some pretty bad noises and cause a power loss.

With his miles, I would probably reverse the steps................

Totally agree with the dealer statement though. Dealers are usually the most expensive option and they to tend to "shot gun Parts" rather the diagnosing problems.

 

[A5INKY]

With his miles, I would probably reverse the steps...

Yes, cam issue is highly likely for the OP. I always start w/ VCDS as a matter of principle anyway. It can provide quick and easy clues and sometimes help guide better diagnostics. Plus it takes all of 5 min. and you don't have to even dirty your hands. Simple stuff first.

 

[stuartcnc]

Yes, I'm getting a lot of smoke. It has smoked a little under acceleration and start up since I bought it. I didn't notice it right away but after a week I started to. This is probably going to make me sound like a fool, but what is a VCDS and where can I get one. Me and my old boss both have tdi's his is an 02 will the VCDS work with both as he is having problems also and will probably go in half with me.

 

[A5INKY]

http://store.ross-tech.com/shop/VCHUC.html

This one will work for both your '06 CAN car and your bosses older '02 HEX car. VCDS will not exactly tell you what to replace to fix your car, but it is the best way to find out what the car "thinks" it is having issues with. Sometimes what the car "thinks" is nothing more than reporting of a symptom, good mechanic diagnostic skills are still needed. It is just a really good idea to start by querying the cars ECU and various controllers first.

EDIT: Since you do not yet have VCDS, I have to add that Ol'Rattler is probably right, sounds like your cam may be completely trashed. Due to the nature of that failure VCDS may report nothing even though it is causing the running issue. Physical inspection is still the best way to check the cam.

 

[stuartcnc]

I will pull the valve cover off and get some photo's. I think I will go ahead and see what he thinks about investing in the VCDS though. Seems like it will make life easier for us both.

 

[05_new_jetta]

http://store.ross-tech.com/shop/VCHUC.html

This one will work for both your '06 CAN car and your bosses older '02 HEX car. VCDS will not exactly tell you what to replace to fix your car, but it is the best way to find out what the car "thinks" it is having issues with. Sometimes what the car "thinks" is nothing more than reporting of a symptom, good mechanic diagnostic skills are still needed. It is just a really good idea to start by querying the cars ECU and various controllers first.

EDIT: Since you do not yet have VCDS, I have to add that Ol'Rattler is probably right, sounds like your cam may be completely trashed. Due to the nature of that failure VCDS may report nothing even though it is causing the running issue. Physical inspection is still the best way to check the cam.

The cam may be bad, but a loss of power doesn't happen overnight with a cam I wouldn't think. When my lifted collapsed and lost some power i didn't notice it besides just a bit of noise and I could hear it through the exhaust popping. Def not a bad i idea to check the it though due to the lack of records.

 

[mctdi]

I will pull the valve cover off and get some photo's. I think I will go ahead and see what he thinks about investing in the VCDS though. Seems like it will make life easier for us both.

Here are some pics from my car: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=216617&highlight=cam

When putting the valve cover back on, the rubber gasket is reusable. But you will need a little dab RTV for the corners by the end camshaft bearing caps.

 

[stuartcnc]

I haven't gotten the chance to pull the valve cover off due to me being out of town this week, however I did want to add that my battery tested bad and needs to be replaced. I'm not sure if this could be related or not, I just wanted to throw that out there for the gurus to decide.

 

[stuartcnc]

I towed the car to a mechanic shop where a "knowledgable diesel mechanic" I was referred to works recently, They hooked up my car to some diagnostics system that they said was "the exact same one used by the VW dealer". The diagnostics didn't throw any codes or show any problems. The mechanic refuses to just tear into my motor and start doing guesswork therefore informed me that I needed to come pick my car up and take it somewhere else. Now I have no idea what to do from here.

 

[nord]

Let me understand...

You complain about excess smoke and a loss of power. The odometer shows well over 100k miles and the PD engines are known for cam wear, along with associated components. And your "mechanic" refuses to look under the valve cover? You actually pay this guy???

Any mechanic worth his salt knows that a worn cam will not set codes. He also knows that removing the valve cover is easy and quick. It's also the very best way to diagnose a cam problem.

So puzzle me this... Why would any decent mechanic refuse to perform a cheap and simple diagnostic procedure which would ELIMINATE guesswork? This makes no sense to me.

Perhaps the problem is that you're confusing a computer techie with a real technician/mechanic. The former somehow believes that his computer knows all and tells all. This type should probably best be employed at Radio Shack. The latter uses his brain first and his tools (computer included) later. He's aware of what his computer can share and just as aware of what it can't. Thus, a look under the valve cover would be a necessity for this type of person as it would either confirm or eliminate a possible condition unable to be detected positively any other way.

The one thing your present "mechanic" and I agree upon is his advice to take the car elsewhere. Fact is, if I were you I couldn't do it fast enough! Hopefully you'll find a fellow TDI owner nearby who is either knowledgeable about the PD and able to twist a wrench, or knows of someone who can. Just remember that a fancy computer, a Snap-On tool cabinet, and a sign over the door does not make a real mechanic.

 

[stuartcnc]

I really think the guy just didn't want anything to do with it. He didnt charge me anything and I picked it up immediately. I got a little time off this week for thanksgiving. I'm really hoping to be able to take that valve cover off then.

 

[CARTMATT]

Reading OP sounds like fuel filter to me! Ever get it fixed and what was it?

 

[stuartcnc]

I changed the fuel filter after the problem occured. It was completely wasted, it honestly looked like it could have been the original fuel filter. Several people have told me to try putting some injector cleaner in it. Would that be something to try?

 

[mctdi]

Look at these:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?p=823760

http://dieselgiant.com/jetta_tdi_diesel_maintenance_tip.htm

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=60705&highlight=diesel+purge

 

[stuartcnc]

I will definitely be doing this as well as taking off my valve cover and taking a peek. It would seem strange to me for it to be the cam though, the car went from driving great consistantly, to running like complete crap consitantly. There was no gradual change of condition. But then again thats my opinion, and I'm definitely no mechanic.

 

[stuartcnc]

I took the valve cover off last friday, looks like the cam is worn a bit. I'm not fully convinced this caused the sudden change from running on all four cylinders to running on 3. Is there any way to trouble shoot the injectors on this car?

 

[onebadaxe]

The timing belt probably has not been replaced and without maintenence records you wouldn't know. Based on what you said about the fuel filter, I wouldn't doubt if the TB has not been changed. So, there is a possibility that the TB has slipped and the car is out of sync. This would cause your issues. Looking at the TB is easy and there are numerous links on here to guide you. If you decide to switch out your TB, do the cam shaft also. As you read through the forumns, you will see that these cars have a few common issues including headliner coming down, dual mass flywheel(will cause car to shutter but doesn't lose power until it fragments), cam shaft(not hardened and wears down), and wiring harn(frayed wires inside loom). A VagCom would definitely be the tool for you, especially if your going to keep the car.

 

[stuartcnc]

Honestly that makes more sense to me. VCDS would definitely indicate if this is what happened correct?

 

[onebadaxe]

Yah, I have been having issues with my 06 Jetta TDI and have easily put 50 hours into researching things. The Vag Com will let you know things like the torsion value which is the correlation between the cam shaft and crank shaft. It will also tell you about the injection quantity for each of injectors. It will let you know of any trouble codes which a basic scanner wouldn't. The best investments you can make are the Vag Com and a Bentley manual. If you can borrow, that is even better. There is also a link on TDI club that lets you know who might have a Vag Com in your area to assist you. If your mechanically inclined, this website has all of the information you will need to DIY.

 

[D-Cell_Mekanick]

I took the valve cover off last friday, looks like the cam is worn a bit. I'm not fully convinced this caused the sudden change from running on all four cylinders to running on 3. Is there any way to trouble shoot the injectors on this car?

If you have a lifter worn through the valve might not be opening or closing all the way making low compression on that cylinder. Very possible its a worn cam issue.

 

[jsrmonster]

I replace cam's on 06's regularly. The will stumble when you rev them to 3000rpms. You can pull the inlet off the manifold (unclip) and if you hear pop-pop noise, its an intake valve/lobe worn out. Put your ear down to exhaust while idling, and a bad exhaust lobe will pop-pop out the exhaust.

If you keep driving it you may drop a valve and trash your motor. Lot's of pics posted with holed lifters with this same problem, if you search.

Jeff

 

[stuartcnc]

It runs, but isn't drivable as is, I crank it up from time to time to let someone that thinks they know what their talking about listen to it. Everyone of them says "oh thats trash in an injector for sure". I have found someone that lives near me with VCDS, maybe over christmas break we can get something figured out.