Hard Start / No Start - Is your intercooler frozen? Check Here!

[itchytweed]

Just sent an email to VW on their website, and printed the pages as well for record, requesting information on TSB 2011-06 / 2025464. I also included that the HPFP (the other good issue) is starting to tick like a cheap watch clearly heard inside the passenger compartment.

 

[740GLE]

HPFP ticks?

I'm don't think the HPFP gives any audible signs of distruction. I'm sure you're hearing more of the injectors firing (has it been colder in the mornings) than the HPFP.

 

[itchytweed]

HPFP ticks?

I'm don't think the HPFP gives any audible signs of distruction. I'm sure you're hearing more of the injectors firing (has it been colder in the mornings) than the HPFP.

The ticking starts when the engine comes off idle, either in Park or in Drive. I had my son hit the go-pedal (miss an honest throttle body) and the ticking was coming from the HPFP black area where the discharge line is going to the rail. I had the foam cover off at the time. If I put my hand around the black cover, the noise dies off. I could not hear any noises coming from the injectors that was abnormal and I could not detect any odd shaking or vibes coming from the engine when I had my hand on the HPFP. I would suspect increased or odd vibration coming from the engine if an injector was flaking out.

The area of the most noise appears to be the intake valve area, as described on page 33 of TDI Self Study guide 826803.

No reply from VofA to my email except the auto-reply. But I have a copy of the email and the TSB number so I can set up service at the stealership.

 

[740GLE]

well you'd be the first to link a sound to the HPFP, what has you're fuel filter looked like recently?

 

[itchytweed]

well you'd be the first to link a sound to the HPFP, what has you're fuel filter looked like recently?

Can't check it tonight. Do have a spare filter in the car. Now for a clean bottle and funnel (check), a video camera (check), rubber gloves (check), gallon ziplock bag for filter element (check).

Still no reply from VofA on my inquiry...

 

[740GLE]

I got the cold weather kit installed yesterday, I was at the dealer at 1:15 and on my way home at 5:15. Before install, I asked to check out the new IC, the tech was very kind and brought out an original IC and the updated IC kit, saw the vacume activated flapper on one side. After install, I popped the hood and noted the extra vaccum lines in the engine compartment and the new intake piping.

My only real concern was on my way home, I was 4 miles from the dealership and hear a slight pop and hiss that lasted maybe 20 seconds. No dash lights, no change in drivability. I pulled over and popped the hood while running to check everything, couldn't see anything that'd make me concerned. I shut the car off and started it twice, everything seemed fine, I continued to 30 miles to back home, got on full boost a couple times noting happened I wasn't expecting. Entire trip was as if they had performed no work been preformed on the car. This morning, fired up as normal, drove 15 miles no issues. So I don't know what the heck the pop and hiss was, but I'm going to continue to listen for it and check the vaccum lines when i rotate the tires next week.

I was thinking of a way to know the system is working or not. If you tapped into the vacume valve actuator, I imagine it's 12v, and wired up an LED with a current limiting resistor, you'd have an indication of when the IC is restricted and when it's not.

 

[RebelTDI]

Give us an update after a tank or 2 of fuel. It will be interesting to hear if you notice any changes in performance or mpgs.

 

[B25guy]

I had mine installed earlier this summer and so far there have been zero effects on performance or MPGs, in fact MPGs might be edging up slightly but I'll attribute that to breaking in...now at around 22k (kit was installed at ~18k IIRC).

Marc

 

[rickcrna1]

Here is my dilemma...perhaps others can chime in with suggestions.

I have a 2010 JSW and experienced the "no start" phenomenon over 2 days last February. Experienced cold weather and humidity changes etc, etc. At that time, the car had about 28,000 miles on it. Called the VW dealer in Vancouver, WA and spoke with the service manager who advised that I try to start the car again in a day or two. She said she had had two or three other similar complaints that day as well. After a couple of days of the car sitting in the garage, I went to start the engine and finally turned over. All has been well since that time.

Now my car has 42,000 miles on it and with the winter coming near, I wanted to have this intercooler problem addressed citing the recent TSBs. As many of us do, I rely heavily on my car for my employment, and I want to minimize the risk of IC problems this winter and the associated down time.

Any suggestions on how to handle this situation now that the car is officially out of warranty? I don't think that my conversation with the service mgr last February was documented on their end.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

 

[740GLE]

Give us an update after a tank or 2 of fuel. It will be interesting to hear if you notice any changes in performance or mpgs.

Oh I will, I have 45K on the clock now, and have been very happy with MPG's even with the latest and greatest ECU update.

BTW the new IC flapper valve is sprung so that the full IC is open, similar to original IC, so if a vaccum line fails or actuator fails, MPG or heat transfer of the IC should be as if the kit isn't installed.

 

[TwoTone]

Here is my dilemma...perhaps others can chime in with suggestions.

I have a 2010 JSW and experienced the "no start" phenomenon over 2 days last February. Experienced cold weather and humidity changes etc, etc. At that time, the car had about 28,000 miles on it. Called the VW dealer in Vancouver, WA and spoke with the service manager who advised that I try to start the car again in a day or two. She said she had had two or three other similar complaints that day as well. After a couple of days of the car sitting in the garage, I went to start the engine and finally turned over. All has been well since that time.

Now my car has 42,000 miles on it and with the winter coming near, I wanted to have this intercooler problem addressed citing the recent TSBs. As many of us do, I rely heavily on my car for my employment, and I want to minimize the risk of IC problems this winter and the associated down time.

Any suggestions on how to handle this situation now that the car is officially out of warranty? I don't think that my conversation with the service mgr last February was documented on their end.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

I'm not trying to be rude, but good luck. Your first mistake was accepting a dealer telling you to wait a few days to try and restart your new car.

That was unacceptable and I'm really surprised you went for it. You should have told them it won't start, come pick it up and fix it.

 

[El Dobro]

The big test for the I/C update will be this Winter.

 

[itchytweed]

Can't check it tonight. Do have a spare filter in the car. Now for a clean bottle and funnel (check), a video camera (check), rubber gloves (check), gallon ziplock bag for filter element (check).

Still no reply from VofA on my inquiry...

My apologies for the cross-post but

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=3553339&postcount=209

My ticking HPFP is the same model as in this thread.

Service date for the car is October 8. This Saturday will be interesting.

I did receive a reply back from VWofA on my inquiries. Interesting reading.

 

[740GLE]

what was their response?

 

[itchytweed]

what was their response?

My initial letter to them was via their website comment box. Basically mentioned two issues: 1) The TSB on the FMIC modification, and 2) the HPFP ticking.

Their reply and my response:

John,

Thank you for the reply.

With regards to the scheduled service, it is set up for 8 October 2011, 9 am at Ernie von Schledorn VW, Menominee Falls, WI and this was set up earlier today.

I have requested the following services to be performed on my JSW TDI:

30,000 mile service
Service with regards to TSB 2011-06/2025464 (FMIC icing modification)
Service with regards to HPFP noise. HPFP model number is Bosch/VW 03L-130-755-A

Thank you for the offer of assistance and followup. That would be greatly appreciated.

Best Regards,

Richard Polivka


VWoA Customer CARE wrote:


Reference # 811005741

Dear Mr. Polivka:

Thank you for your e-mail in regard to the concern you have experienced with the high pressure fuel pump of your Jetta SportWagon. I apologize for the inconvenience you have experienced. I understand you are wondering if your vehicle is being effected by a Technical Service Bulletin, and I appreciate the opportunity to respond.

Technical Service Bulletins are resources for the service departments of our dealerships to repair specific concerns. I do not have access to these bulletins nor do I have the ability to diagnose your vehicle provided its symptoms. I encourage you to contact your local VW dealership for an appointment at your earliest convenience to have this concern addressed appropriately. I cannot comment on whether or not the symptoms are in relation to the experience described in any particular Technical Service Bulletin as I do not have the document and am not factory trained.

Please know I am sorry I cannot be of direct assistance in this matter. If you do get an appointment at a VW dealership and would like me to contact them to ensure they have utilized all of the technical resources at their disposal in the diagnosis and repair of your vehicle, please respond with the date of the appointment and which dealership you will be utilizing. I would be more than happy to follow up with you on their findings.

Thank you for allowing me to document the concerns you have shared. Volkswagen has spared no expense in ensuring our dealerships are the best at maintaining, diagnosing, and repairing our vehicles. I am confident a dealership is in the best position to address your Jetta SportWagon’s concern.

If I may be of further assistance regarding this, or any other matter, please don’t hesitate to contact me again by e-mail or through our Customer CARE Center at (800) 822-8987. If I am not available, one of my colleagues will be able to assist you. In addition, you will soon be receiving a Volkswagen Customer Care satisfaction survey. Please take a few moments to complete this. Your feedback is important for it will allow us to serve you more effectively in the future.

Sincerely,

John B.

Customer CARE Advocate


I will keep all informed on all fronts. Looking at this, I forgot to mention that the dealer is informed about the engine oil dipstick having a radial crack in the plastic measurement tip at the apparent end of the metal rod.

Poor Gretchen...

P.S. I will be printing out a copy of the suit listed by wreck111 today. "Knowledge is Power."

 

[XLexusTech]

Anyone know if the TSB applies to 2012 or if they fixed it then?
I am headed in for a 1k mile check up and if this applies to me living in NH i want to get it fixed.... anyone recommend a good service department in NH?

Also would the coolant heater help to prevent the ice?

 

[740GLE]

Tulley of Nashua has performed it on Roosters.

Baranger of Rochester performed mine, they said they've done 4 previous cars and have the work pretty down.

 

[MayorDJQ]

FYI MajorDJQ,

Arrogant remarks like yours make you look like a big man......I am 6 feet tall and got 31 mpg in the outback I just purchased over the past week putting on 1500 miles.

The majority of posters on this site have respect, but some like you are just clowns and that is pretty sad

My remarks may have been slightly condescending, but I didn't throw in any personal insults.

In the ten plus years I've been a member here I would wager that 97% of my comments have been helpful. Such as: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=321736

I may have under-predicted the mpg capabilities of the Outback, but based it on my Subaru experiences. I briefly owned an '04 Outback wagon. I got 28mpg from it once on a long highway trip in the late fall when a/c wasn't needed. Typical highway mileage was 23-24 and town mileage was 20 if I was lucky. The engine was anemic, at best. At 55 in 5th gear it was cranking away well over 2,000 rpm but needed downshifting to pass or to maintain cruising speeds on even slight uphill grades.

At 5'11" I couldn't put the seat far enough back to be comfortable. My knees were jammed under the dash even with the seat all the way back. After as little as an hour in the car my back would be sore to the point that I'd have to stop and stretch. I was 28 at the time with no history of back problems. I've never been sore while driving a VW, even after 12 hour shifts in the seat.

That said, I'll send up the olive branch for my smart @ss comments. Maybe this weekend I'll test drive an Outback just for the hell of it to see if they've improved at all.

 

[terrapin]

The new outbacks are so much better and bigger than the old style with legroom etc. Night and day compared to the 2007 legacy wagon my wife had

Nice grab on the link... No big deal, sorry for the jab and comments on my end.

 

[Virgilstar]

I will back up the negative view of Subarus here, since I just got rid of one in favor of a JSW TDI...

2004 outback sport, bought new, put on it only 45k miles in 7 years.
- OEM tires dead after 15k. The AWD system burned through new tires every 15k miles, even with rotations every oil change.
- Heater core dropped out in the middle of winter... a 5hr drive home from NYC in minus 20 temps, followed by 3 week repair job because dealer ordered the wrong part.
- Rattling heat shields everywhere, all the time. Clamped some, removed others, never solved the problem. Always something resonating under there during acceleration.
- Trunk floor collapsed.
- Rust on all bolts attaching front seat rails to the floor. Bad design for use in a salty climate (i.e. Northeast roads in winer)
- Coolant leak at 1 year.
- "New" battery after 5 years (not unusual), but then would not hold a charge. Stealership replaced for free after 3rd time getting towed/jump-started.
- Both head gaskets blew out at 40k miles. Big $$ to replace. Downside of the boxer engine design is twice as many head gaskets!
- Left front lower wishbone rusted through. Heard a clunking noise one day, and wishbone was snapped in half Thankfully this didnt happen on the highway!
- Radio broken at 35k miles. $600 for a replacement head unit! (found one on eBay for $40).
- Burned through headlight bulbs every year or so.

Bottom line, Subarus are just not built to last. Add in HUGE reported costs when the AWD transmission finally conks out, and I'm very glad to be out of this car. The bigger Subies may be better made, but the Impreza based outback sport is a POS in my book.

 

[740GLE]

BTW i now know what that pop and hiss i noticed a few miles after driving away from the dealer after having this kit installed.

I now have no AC. I imagine on reconnecting the condensor something wasn't 100% and came loose. Either way I've tried multiple different times since notice it last night. AC would regularly blow 40 degree air, now it get ambient temps.

I'm going to call and see when they can fit me in next week. I'll let you guys know.

 

[eddif]

BTW i now know what that pop and hiss i noticed a few miles after driving away from the dealer after having this kit installed.

I now have no AC. I imagine on reconnecting the condensor something wasn't 100% and came loose. Either way I've tried multiple different times since notice it last night. AC would regularly blow 40 degree air, now it get ambient temps.

I'm going to call and see when they can fit me in next week. I'll let you guys know.

Kinda reminds one of the glow plug replacement problems. I do, however, thank you for getting the kit installed. If there are not enough kits installed the testing will be limited.

Those with enough strength to get the kit are still encouraged to press on and ask for an installation.

We will wait to find out just what happened to cause the AC failure (seal, overcharge, etc).

Thanks for the information.

eddif

 

[740GLE]

I'll find out monday morning at 8:30! I'm thinking of bringing in a box of Munchkins as good faith effort and Baranger has always been good to me and I know stuff happens.

Fingers crossed it was just something wasn't snugged down tight enough and no damage was done to the compressor or anything vital.

 

[Mainely Diesel]

I installed a factory steel skid-plate on my 2011 JSW DSG TDI last weekend and detached the rubber hose from the IC to gain needed access to the skidplate mount points on the passenger side. I was surprised to have 2-3 oz of water come trickling out (on my forehead, of course!).

I live in the mid-coast region of Maine and have not driven the car here in winter weather yet (purchased in June) but based on the amount of condensation collected during 12.5k miles of mostly summer commuting, this is something I will be checking this winter.

A couple of questions: my car lives in a heated garage so will this lessen or worsen the condition? Also, what is the typical customer cost to have the update done to the IC by the dealer?

Thanks to all for the valuable info. Living up here in northern NE, this will certainly affect me in a couple of months!

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

 

[Onefast66nova]

Is there any way to tell if my vehicle needs this kit installed? I looked on vw website on recalls and put in my vin and it said no recalls. I also called my service dept and they said there was nothing for my vehicle. It is starting to get cold and I am just trying to prevent a problem before it starts. I have a 2011 Golf TDI of course lol. Thanks Bill

 

[740GLE]

There's no recall associated with this TSB, VW is treating it as a band aid after the fact. Once you notice you have a problem, bring it to dealers attention then they determin if you qualify.

@Mainly- The water that you saw is the issue this is suposed to correct. Will you have a non start issue because of it, who knows. My uneducated guess, every CR Diesel VW has sold has water/condensation in the intake, it's how much water accumulates and how it thaws affects if you have a non start problem.

You could try and talk to the dealer now or state you've "had" non start issues soon as temps drop and was wondering if you could get it. If it was mentioned to the dealer multiple times you should have good luck.

 

[740GLE]

What doesn't look right to you? Wow I can't believe I missed this when I popped the hood the first time. I guess I was just looking at vaccum lines.

I dropped it off at the dealer yesterday pointed it to them, with hopes they'll get it back to me tomorrow with a new hose and new belt. I won't be too happy if they don't replace the belt. In the meantime driving a rental 2010 civic stripper model, wow def nothing worth while, with only 29K on the clock, the thing looks like hell, tons of scratchs all over it and smells like an ashtray.

 

[Conan]

I wonder how that happened... If they didn't add bigger serp pulleys or replace the A/C line, how did they end up in the same place?

I'm no A/C guy, but isn't it likely that your whole A/C system is full of air now? Will a replacement hose take care of it?

 

[740GLE]

Looking at the bend radius of the hose (might be a bit hard to notice in the pic), looks like they placed the hose on the wrong side of the radiator connection, causing an "S" type of bend. It was the heat of the friction on the serpentine belt that caused the metal fitting to transfer the heat to the rubber hose and that was the weak link. I'm actually impressed the tech was able to fit it like that as if it's on the other side, the flow of the hose will probaly be pretty much straight down.

I'll post a picture of the replaced hose when I get it back.

I only ran the compressor (AC) button for a matter of 10-20 min max. So I'm hoping the compressor's fine and all it will need is a recharge and this will be behind me.

 

[P2B]

I only ran the compressor (AC) button for a matter of 10-20 min max. So I'm hoping the compressor's fine and all it will need is a recharge and this will be behind me.

The AC system has been open to the atmosphere for days, and needs a vacuum pulled to remove all moisture before being recharged. The receiver/dryer will have accumulated moisture, you should insist it be replaced.

Simon