Well, that sucks-I had hoped that I was wrong.
Not much of an incentive for VW/Audi to get the fix "right" by their customers. $500 is chicken feed.
Gen II 3.0 speculation(s).
- Thread starter psd1
- Start date
Not much of an incentive for VW/Audi to get the fix "right" by their customers. $500 is chicken feed.
Only one 2.2 SUV in the group.You mean the October 23 deadline? Is it safe to assume if that particular deadline is missed, VW/Audi will likely miss the other two deadlines in the 3.0 group? I am in the December 20, 2017 group.
The 2.2 SUV sub-generation consists of 2015 and 2016 VW Touaregs and Porsche Cayenne Diesels.
All diesel 2013 and 2014 Touaregs, Audi Q7s and Porsche Cayennes, as well as 2015 Audi Q7s, A6s, A7s, A8s, A8Ls and Q5s make up 2.1 SUV.
And 2 PC is made up of 2014, 2015 and 2016 Audi A6s, A7s, A8s, A8Ls, and Q5s.
http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-volkswagens-3-0-liter-1791924703
MBQ
Veteran Member
In another note, if EPA/CARB approves a certified repair with "substantially" reduced performance, the class action lawers can still file a petition to the court for further remedies including buyback.
From Mr. Rice of the PSC:
"But there's another. If there is an approval and that approval is granted but it does substantially adversely impact the car, then the consumers, through class counsel, have the absolute right to come back to Your Honor and demand a buyback, rescission, other remedies that the Court addresses, if there is found to be substantially adverse impact on the car."
From Mr. Rice of the PSC:
"But there's another. If there is an approval and that approval is granted but it does substantially adversely impact the car, then the consumers, through class counsel, have the absolute right to come back to Your Honor and demand a buyback, rescission, other remedies that the Court addresses, if there is found to be substantially adverse impact on the car."
MBQ
Veteran Member
So essentially it really comes down to where the class action lawyers draw a line regarding "substantial" adverse effects to the car from the approved "CERTIFIED" fix and how hard the lawyers will push on behalf of the consumers.
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MBQ
Veteran Member
delete
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I don't follow the boards very closely. I am guessing you are a collector of VW TDIs?
What is PSC? Who is Mr. Rice?
I looked it up. Mr. Rice is counsel for the Plaintiff's Steering Committee, and your quote is taken from a live transcript of the May 11, 2017 hearing.
There is a risk in relying on statements of Plaintiffs' counsel (or for that matter, Defendants' counsel) in establishing "rights" of the plaintiffs.
I looked at the Executive Summary of the the VW 3L Settlement at
http://cand.uscourts.gov/vwmdl/final-settlement-3-liter
What it actually says is:
Defendants represent that the Emissions Compliant Repair shall not result in “Reduced Performance.” In the event that the Emissions Compliant Repair causes Reduced Performance of the Eligible Vehicle, Volkswagen shall make an additional payment of $500 for each affected Eligible Vehicle. Reduced Performance means a change in any of the following performance attributes: (1) a reduction in fuel economy of more than 3 MPG; (2) a decrease of greater than 5% in peak horsepower; or (3) decrease of greater than 5% peak torque. These will be measured by Volkswagen pursuant to industry standards in its submission to EPA and CARB. If the regulators approve the Emissions Compliant Repair, Defendants shall disclose the extent of any Reduced Performance in a Notice to affected Class Members. If the Emission Compliant Repair causes substantial, material adverse degradation above and beyond the Reduced Performance levels specified above, Plaintiffs reserve their right to seek, and Defendants reserve their right to oppose, additional
remedies from the Court."
I also read the full settlement, in particular paragraph 7.5 on Reduced Performance, which mirrors the language above. The problem I see is that there is no definition or parameters giving clarity to "substantial, material adverse degradation above and beyond the reduced performance levels specified above."
So, if the fuel economy dips by 8 mpg, my interpretation of the language is that 3.0 L owners get an extra $500 and nothing else, because it is covered in the language of Reduced Performance. I have no idea, and the Settlement does not address what is "substantial, material adverse degradation." Fabulous work by the lawyers.
Fourplay
, TDI Parts Ninja Vendor , w/Business number
I would say that a 8mpg drop is substantial adverse degradation above and beyond the 3mpg allowed, as it is over double. You're right though, they should have laid out specific terms.I also read the full settlement, in particular paragraph 7.5 on Reduced Performance, which mirrors the language above. The problem I see is that there is no definition or parameters giving clarity to "substantial, material adverse degradation above and beyond the reduced performance levels specified above."
So, if the fuel economy dips by 8 mpg, my interpretation of the language is that 3.0 L owners get an extra $500 and nothing else, because it is covered in the language of Reduced Performance. I have no idea, and the Settlement does not address what is "substantial, material adverse degradation." Fabulous work by the lawyers.
I only have 1 2.2 SUV as well.
It's very difficult to find the SUVs at prices that make sense. Most of my cars are A6s or Q5s - they are generally better deals.
I've got:
'15 Cayenne
'13 Cayenne (x2)
Q5 (x7)
Q7 (x2)
A6 (x7)
A7 (x1)
Never quite managed to get an A8 - they always were priced a bit too high. Going to buy about 3-4 more and call it quits (I'm almost out of warehouse space) until we know what is going to happen.
I've got appointments for partial repair payments for 6 cars next Saturday, should be interesting.
Wow, you love Audi!
As soon as as I get my last payment from Audi (gosh I hope it is a buyback!), I am done with Audi/VW. Going to go for the Mazda CX-5 diesel or the GMC Terrain Diesel, both which will be available later this year. Yeah, not Audi, but with the $$ I am getting back, I will have $$ in my pocket and much cheaper maintenance.
Interesting event yesterday. I found a 2016 Touareg online and ran the VIN in the portal, it showed that all of the repair money was available. Hoping to get it for Low trade in price I met with the seller. Unfortunately he wasn't ready to take my lowball cash offer. We continued to talk about VW's and he said that he had already collected the first half of the restitution money.
So, portal showed ALL cash available. Current owner states he already collected 1/2 of the money. I have two vehicles that show all of the repair money available that I haven't taken in, I was waiting to see if the fix was approved and its 100 miles to the dealership for me. I'll be awaiting your report to see if the portal has been 100% correct or not.
843tdi
Veteran Member
Fixes have been submitted on all models a few months back they are just waiting for timely approval. Right now it is just whether they get them approved in time by the first deadline if not I would expect the full 90 days worth of extension time will be granted since they already have the fixes submitted. If they can't get them approved by the extension deadline buybacks should be enacted.Found these date for when fix was to be submitted
Do you have a source on the fix submissions? I cant find anything talking about how VW has submitted a fix for 2015 Q5 Gen II 3.0
843tdi
Veteran Member
It was in the June 23rd court update on page 18 of that update. Below is a link to keep up with the court docs.
http://www.cand.uscourts.gov/crb/vwmdl
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Well, how did it go? Any surprises?
Just picked up up a 2013 Touareg TDI Executive for $25,500 with full $7800 in repair money over the weekend. I needed a replacement vehicle anyway as both my 2012 Touareg's are going back in the next 3 weeks.
MBQ
Veteran Member
mileage？ How could you get it for this cheap?
It has 82k miles but is in flawless cosmetic and mechanical condition, the Honda dealer had no idea what they had. They where asking $29,998 (No Joke), they told me they owned it for $23,800 which is right at trade in value. I offered $25k right off the bat and over the span of a few days eventually came down to $25k plus a $499 dealer fee. Still gave them a nice $2k profit.
MBQ
Veteran Member
Sounds like a fairy tale.
Great work!
amizan
Member
how do you check the restitution and if I it has been claimed? I bought a Q7 and I don't know if the previous owner has put in a claim. is there a site to look it up?
Was it a black one with aftermarket wheels? If it is i was going to pull the plug on that too. But I just bought a boat. Lol. And I got discouraged of stories from the claims website not being accurate in previous claims lately...
Looks like a great TReg! Congrats.
No it is gray
Just a quick word of caution, just because the portal says all the $ is available, it doesn't really mean all the $ is available. Let us know when your paperwork is approved!
Regardless, you did well!
can you please elaborate? know someone where this happened to them?
duratitus
Veteran Member
Nothing in the portal is set in stone, it's all estimated.
You can't know for sure that your Touareg does not have a previous owner who could take 1/2 of your restitution amount upon emissions modification, until you receive the offer letter from VW.
You can't know for sure that your Touareg does not have a previous owner who could take 1/2 of your restitution amount upon emissions modification, until you receive the offer letter from VW.