Fogs On A Budget $143; wth Pictures

[Fordcougar]

ES, look above your fog lights, see the white line(gap) above the black insert?
you'll notice its not there in your "before" pictures.

I'm just trying to figure out if the replacement OEM, or replacement chinese versions
for some reason are shorter 1/8 inch causing this gap, in both the fog and non fog versions.
BTW thanks for putting together all this info, I'd love some fogs, they look good.

 

[ESFlash]

@Fordcougar -- good eye -- reflection --- most likely caused by the lights being on and the sun -- in the before fog lights pic, the car faces towards the house, in the after pic, the car faces away from the house and faces more towards the sun. Also, it was a bit tricky getting the bumper to seat correctly as well as getting it orientated so it fit nicely against and into the under car splash pan.

 

[Fordcougar]

Apparently my gap was there before as well, I just looked at some pictures I had..
strange.

 

[emerscape]

Is there any reason that I cannot or should not use just an aftermarket harness to wire up my lights and not have to replace my current headlight switch? Looking to do the install the week of thanksgiving and don't think I can get a headlight switch in time (for cheap at least). Thoughts?

Can someone explain this trigger wire thing to me? Sorry I'm just not that familiar with these things.

 

[ESFlash]

@emerscape

Why use a euroswitch???? -- short answer: the standard USA headlight switch has no provision to control fogs.

Without a euroswitch you have no way of turning your foglights off. If you connect the fogs to your headlight circuit (perfectly doable) they will always be on whenever you energize the headlights. A euroswitch permits other alternatives.

The trigger wire is a pretty simple idea. Short answer: It works to open and close a relay.

The headlight switch in your car, be it a euroswitch or standard "non-euro" design is basically set up for low current.

Headlights and fogs require a lot of juice. and prefer to not see voltage drops due to wire length, wire thickness or poor connection points. Plus, all that current running through that puny dashboard switch has the potential of burning it out.

A high current relay in the circuit minimizes these problems.

The headlights use a relay, the horn uses a relay, the starter circuit uses a relay and the fogs, you want to add, will use a relay which would be found as part of the after market wiring harness. All these relays have to be "triggered" or switched on/off by something. Most modern cars use 12 volts to trigger a relay.

The relay is a fast acting electronic switch capable of dealing with high current without burning out. Unenergized, it stays open, and current can't pass and your lights (horn, starter) stay off -- energized, via 12 volts supplied by the trigger wire coming from your headlight switch, the relay closes and the electrons can travel their merry way to your lights.

The foglight relay is a pretty universal device. The trigger wire for your fogs runs from the foglight pin in the euroswitch and connects to relay point #86 on your foglight wiring harness. Pin #85 on the relay goes to ground, #30 on the relay, is the main incoming 12V supply, it is fused and connects to the battery and relay point #87 is the output to the fogs.

So when pin #86 gets the 12 volts from your euro switch in the pulled out position, the connection on the relay between pin 30 and pin 87 is closed and the fogs light up. If the euro switch is not pulled out the relay still sees the 12 volts at pin 30 but it never closes or makes the connection to pin 87, and the fogs don't illuminate.

 

[ImBroke]

ES, awesome job explaining the relay. I think what emerscape was getting at, was why not use something like the lighted toggle switch that the McParts stores sell instead of getting a Euro switch to expidite the install.

 

[emerscape]

ES - thank you for taking the time to explain everything in detail. I found it very usefull.

ImBroke - yes thank you for chiming in. Basically I live in the city and have limited space and time to work on my cars. I have the opportunity over thanksgiving to work on my sportwagen on one day and really want to get the fogs installed. I've wired fogs on my jeeps in the past but never on my sportwagen. I'd like to have it have an OEM look but know that I probably can't get the parts in time. Therefore I was thinking of just putting in aftermarket harness, then upgrading the switch when I get the parts and have time. In the meantime I can just use a seperate switch to fire up the fogs.

 

[CRJSW]

There is no large current going through your headlights switch. As you said they are mostly trigger wires with your cecm handling the old style relay duties but since you don't have the highline cecm the easiest way is through a relay.

 

[ESFlash]

sorry that I cmplty misunderstood you and for such a long winded explnation -- yeah go ahead -- a toggle should work fine...connect the output from the toggle to the relay at 86 and that is your trigger; maybe you can even wire it into the space where the switch knockouts are near the shifter. I've done my own share of non spec non OEM guerilla wiring..... when my son's starter circuit burned out on a tieohtuh minivan I did some "direct" rewiring and installed an underdash heavy duty starter button.

 

[emerscape]

Esflash - thank you again. The explanation was very good and reinforced my understanding as to how it all works. Can anyone recommend a wiring harness to purchase? There are so many out there and being somewhat inexperienced I don't know which to pick. Basically I'm looking for someone to tell me exactly what products to buy ( not because I'm lazy but more because I want to get it right the first time)

 

[emerscape]

would this wiring harness be suitable?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-PIAA-85W-FOG-DRIVING-LIGHT-LAMP-WIRES-WIRING-HARNESS-KIT-/320792863226?_trksid=p4340.m7&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D5%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D4153607433031181530

 

[ESFlash]

Sure but it's expensive plus the shipping is high. Also I didn't notice dedicated 9006 connectors, just generic spade lugs (which would work -- you might have to check the polarity though).

This is the type I used:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Xenon-HID-C...es&vxp=mtr&hash=item3cb9fc0217#ht_1879wt_1212

except mine was from a different vendor but this one looks like the same product and at a better price. And, it includes dedicated 9006 connectors which are shrouded with neoprene gaskets to keep moisture at bay.

See my harness pix on page one, this link looks like the exact one -- there's plenty of them on ebay, inexpensive and free shipping on most -- you should rcv it in time for the Thanksgiving fog you must be expecting.

Ten dollars and free shipping -- hard to beat.

You supply the toggle which you can get at any auto parts store.

If you are unclear as how to wire it up......one side of the toggle connects to a 12 volts power power source: such as the battery, but I suggest you might find a suitable lead in the interior fuse box and piggy back onto that. Just make sure you connect your wire to the cold side....after the fuse as you want this line to be fused. You'll need a voltmeter to check which side is hot and which side is not.

If you go the direct battery route please wire in a 20 amp fuse close to the battery. The other end of the toggle connects to relay point 86; the harness will have a wire connected to 86.....connect to that. When you close or put the toggle to "on" it makes a circuit between the 12 volt source and pin 86 on the relay. They relay sees this voltage and closes to make the circuit. Thus, your toggle switch setup is your trigger which opens and closes the harness relay that is connected to the fogs. Pretty simple.

 

[ESFlash]

Sorry I might have pointed you at a more complicated harness -- look at this one (9.00 including shipping).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Xenon-HID-C...es&vxp=mtr&hash=item43aae128a2#ht_3425wt_1135

This is the type I used -- the other one I listed had some extra connectors which I don't think you need -- this is a little simpler setup.

 

[heidelberger75]

Battery disconnect?

Hey guys, thanks for all the great information! I plan to do my foglights once all the parts arrive. However, is there a procedure to follow or any watchouts regarding the disconnecting of the battery? I think a few of your mentioned it but no concrete info.

At some point the battery has to be replaced so am I worrying for nothing??

I found this pdf on instructions for installing the euroswitch from ECS. There is a rather serious warning about disconnecting the battery. Here is the link and also an excerpt.

http://www.ecstuning.com/stage/edoc/MKVIEuroswitchInstructions.pdf

Thoughts?? Thanks!!!

Safety First
Conventional wisdom says: Disconnect the battery before doing this repair. Our attorney agrees.
However...
Disconnecting the battery has a dark side you ought to know about. Doing so erases all volatile memory in your
vehicle computer, including driver preferences, antitheft radio code, radio presets and clock, and OBD II emissions
data. In some vehicles stored data about electronic throttle control learned positions will also be lost. Affected vehicles
will not idle following a power down until throttle position data are restored with a scan tool and the correct
vehicle software.
Loss of OBD II data is important if your vehicle is subject to a scan tool emissions test; erasing computer
memory resets all OBD II monitors to incomplete, and your vehicle will not pass its emissions test until a drive
cycle completes the required number of non-continuous monitors.

 

[rambalu80]

Hey guys, thanks for all the great information! I plan to do my foglights once all the parts arrive. However, is there a procedure to follow or any watchouts regarding the disconnecting of the battery? I think a few of your mentioned it but no concrete info.

At some point the battery has to be replaced so am I worrying for nothing??

I found this pdf on instructions for installing the euroswitch from ECS. There is a rather serious warning about disconnecting the battery. Here is the link and also an excerpt.

http://www.ecstuning.com/stage/edoc/MKVIEuroswitchInstructions.pdf

Thoughts?? Thanks!!!

Safety First
Conventional wisdom says: Disconnect the battery before doing this repair. Our attorney agrees.
However...
Disconnecting the battery has a dark side you ought to know about. Doing so erases all volatile memory in your
vehicle computer, including driver preferences, antitheft radio code, radio presets and clock, and OBD II emissions
data. In some vehicles stored data about electronic throttle control learned positions will also be lost. Affected vehicles
will not idle following a power down until throttle position data are restored with a scan tool and the correct
vehicle software.
Loss of OBD II data is important if your vehicle is subject to a scan tool emissions test; erasing computer
memory resets all OBD II monitors to incomplete, and your vehicle will not pass its emissions test until a drive
cycle completes the required number of non-continuous monitors.

No issues with radio code. If any OBD faults are present, you'd probably have a check engine light before you disconnect the battery and they would be erased when the battery is disconnected. However, after a few drive cycles (usually within 50 - 200 miles), the OBD faults that were previously present would pop back up. IMHO, there is no reason to worry about losing any data.

I disconnected the battery to install my fogs and:
1. trip meter reset
2. clock reset
3. steering error popped up cleared after a few seconds
4. TPMS erroe popped up and cleared after a few seconds

Can't think of anything else.

 

[ESFlash]

I did not disconnect or remove the battery; I couldn't see the point of doing so -- it's a very simple matter to remove the single battery hold down bracket which you would do anyway if you were going to remove the battery.

You then pop off and remove the hard plastic air housings in front of the battery.

You can now slide the, still connected, battery into a convenient position so you can poke around and route your trigger wire from the the Euro to relay point 86. I used a sharp pointed barbeque skewer to fish the trigger wire through the firewall.

I like working this particular install "hot" as I can check each step of the install with a volt meter before going on to the following step.

When I first secured the trigger to the Euro and then installed the Euro into the dash, I was able to check for 12 volts at 86 when I pulled out the Euro. If you see voltage at the end of the tirgger you can proceed to the next step. If you don't see pressure, you need to determine why there is no 12 volts.

Once you verify the trigger circuit works, you can then connect power to relay pin 30, pull the euro out and check for 12 volts at 87. If you show 12 volts you can then go ahead and wire up the lights to the harness. If you get no lights or only a single light, you might want to look for a bad bulb or faulty connector. Anyway, that's how I did it.....no battery removal and verifying each step as I proceeded.

 

[chris@revotechnik]

Fault codes are not cleared when the battery is disconnected. If you had a condition where the light was on it may temporarily go off until it retests whatever set the code in the first place and finds it is still a problem.

Radio stations and the security code have stored for over 10 years now assuming that the radio is originally or properly replaced and aligned to the vehicle.


I do agree with not disconnecting the battery unless necessary due to resetting of adaptations especially on petrol vehicles where as mentioned they may not idle right after requiring the throttle to be removed, cleaned, and reset. Heck I've done engine replacements without ever disconnecting the battery .. can't even count the number of airbag system repairs with it plugged in as well.

 

[zagato27]

No issues with radio code.

I disconnected the battery to install my fogs and:
1. trip meter reset
2. clock reset
3. steering error popped up cleared after a few seconds
4. TPMS erroe popped up and cleared after a few seconds

Can't think of anything else.

Just disconnected my battery to install a "proper" battery box (thread is in the Vortex forums.....had a pretty long narrative and got soundly "scolded" for such in a humorous way. Hey, there were pictures too. Here's the link if anyone is interested http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...h-old-In-with-the-new&p=74480606#post74480606 ) and had the same "faults". Also had a "ecms" (????, the traction contol thingy I believe) light. I actually went through the procedure to reset the tpms. Don't know if that cleared it or it just magically cleared. Anyway, all lights cleared after starting and backing down the driveway.

 

[emerscape]

what guage wire should I use for my trigger wire?

 

[emerscape]

getting ready to do the install on Wednesday. Couple quick questions:

1) How hard is it to remove the bumper? Any good links to instructions? Will I be able to do this by myself?
2) Connecting to the fusebox you had mentioned that there is a threaded nut? What is this in reference to? Where should I connect in the main fuse box? In the past I had just connected directly to my battery on my jeep.


Thanks for all the help. Sorry I might seem a bit slow on this stuff, just nervous the first time working on this vehicle. All my old vehicles were trucks and jeeps - so I felt really comfortable working on them.

 

[Mainely Diesel]

18 or even 20 is fine for the trigger wire, I used 18. Nothing special, just regular old wire is fine.

Getting the bumper off is tedious but easy. Remove all those T25 screws underneath, there are 3 inside each wheel well that have to come out (top edge of bumper, skip the next one down and remove the bottom 2), and there are two behind the grill next to the headlights that have to come out after you remove the grill. Each end between the headlight and wheel well is held on with little tab/slot arrangements in the seam between the bumper and quarter panel. They pop right out, just take your time and pull gently but steadily straight out away from the quarter panel.

That's about it. The bumper material is really flexible at any temp over 60 degrees F, I would exercise great caution if pulling and bending it in cold weather... actuallly, I would not bend it in cold weather unless absolutely required and even then it would make me nervous.

Can't think of anything else. PM me with any specific questions. Cheers!

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

 

[Mainely Diesel]

2) Connecting to the fusebox you had mentioned that there is a threaded nut? What is this in reference to? Where should I connect in the main fuse box? In the past I had just connected directly to my battery on my jeep.

It is a "threaded post" on the front of the relay/fuse unit that sits next to the battery. Remove the cover and you will see several threaded posts with red wires connected to all but one of them right on the front of it. I used the empty one on the outboard side to connect to, making sure to run the wire up through the clips at the bottom like the factory wiring. According to the ECS install giude, you could use on of the occupied posts, too. I just wanted mine on their own circuit.

HTH, good luck.

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

 

[chris@revotechnik]

Just disconnected my battery to install a "proper" battery box (thread is in the Vortex forums.....had a pretty long narrative and got soundly "scolded" for such in a humorous way.

People were "scolding" you for the 2K word 2 paragraph post that physically hurt to try and read. Not for the content.

 

[ESFlash]

I agree with Mainly D....trigger at 16, 18, or 20,shld be quite wrkable. You can Google Jetta front bumper removal for addtnl info. VW vortex had some information there. The time consumng hard part involves aligning the bumper with the front edge of the plastic "skid" plate during bumper reattachment....take your time and have a good work light.

 

[ESFlash]

@emerscape

This should help -- DIY bummer oops I mean bumper removal procedure with pictures; pretty good write up:

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/a5/front-bumper-remove-Jetta.htm

 

[emerscape]

guys thank you so much for all the help and patience.... I really appreciate it. Does anyone know what size nuts fit on the posts?

 

[ESFlash]

I don't......sorry. I just happened to have one that fit. You can connect on to any of the others on that distribution spur.

 

[Mainely Diesel]

I don't......sorry. I just happened to have one that fit. You can connect on to any of the others on that distribution spur.

Same here... just lucky to have one that fit. I tried 5 from my loose nut bin before finding one with matching diameter and thread pitch. They are a very fine thread pitch and are uncommon at typical FLAPS or hardware stores. Good luck!

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

 

[emerscape]

Thanks again guys for the help. I finally got time to work on my wagen on Wednesday. Removed the bumper per your suggestion and got the lights and wiring behind the bumper installed fairly easily. It's amazing how short they make those wiring harnesses, just barely fit.

Wasn't able to do the rest of the install as I ran out of time. I couldn't figure out how to remove the air filter assembly and move the battery forward. Does anyone have any pictures of the battery moved forward and the grommet that I'm supposed to poke a hole through?

Also how does the interior panel below the steering wheel come off? Didn't have much time to look at it so it may be really easy.

Going to try to get back into the shop right before xmas to finish this thing off so I've got a little time to order the euro switch and get everything else prepped.

 

[ESFlash]

If memory serves -- most of the air cleaner plastics are friction fit -- any bolts will be obvious.

You'll be able to find where to poke through from the inside of the car. I just rooted around, until I found a wire bundle going through the firewall. I used a short cooking skewer and attached my wire to that. I didn't have to mess with or remove any interior panel below the steering wheel. I only removed the Euro switch and worked everything from there.