Foglight wiring: OEM-style

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

What I do know so far:

The wire for the fog lights goes into the hole on the right, #2- top row.


The wire connectors to use look like this:


Close-up: connector and wire with wiring seal


The relay #53 can be placed under the dash or inside the engine bay.

The relay plate looks like this:


A detailed shot:


Relay plate parts:


Euroswitch wiring:



[ March 09, 2002, 21:09: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Where I need help:

I have a few ideas about where to take power from, but I'd like to use the same Ignition-switched power that the OEM headlights use as well.

So, where is this power located?

I know that this connector on the left will also fit into the fuse panel. (Position #3, with a 5amp fuse)


From power to the fuse panel, then to the Euroswitch;

From the Euroswitch to Relay #53, then to the headlamps and ground

Will this setup kill the fogs when the high beam lights are turned on?

Here is the diagram on Relay #53. I am guessing at the location of each component.

Is this correct?



Thanks,

Lito

[ March 09, 2002, 22:00: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

Birdman

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 7, 1999
Location
Near Hagerstown MD.
TDI
Jetta 2001 Died by Truck one snowy day. Jetta 2003
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

All you have to do is tap into the wire that suppies the power to the Low beam power. Icould come down on a slow day and help.
 

VW Vet

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2000
Location
Maine
TDI
Golf GL TDI, 2001
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Here is a question for you: Is there an empty socket in the relay panel for a foglight relay? If so, maybe it gets power when you plug it in.
There is a place on my fuse panel for fogs. Maybe you could run your wires to these locations and have it pretty close to a stock installation.

[ March 10, 2002, 07:48: Message edited by: VW Vet ]
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

From the Bentley diagram 60/2 in the latest manual, there is a relay socket (#4) in the relay panel for the front fogs. You could put the wires depicted above in that socket (there shouldn't be any there now) and it would look more like factory installed than having a loose relay somewhere.

"30" is the connection to the foglamp
"87" is the connection to "NL" on the headlight switch
"86" is the connection to fuse 3, the other side of which connects back to headlight switch position 16 "58". Through the headlight switch, this connection gets power from the load reduction relay (100). You can directly tap to this (but it won't be switched with the headlight switch) by attaching to the threaded connection labeled "75X" on the bottom edge of the relay panel.
"85" is the connection to the dimmer switch "56" position 4 of the headlight switch.

Your diagram has swapped "30" and "87".

(This is according to the Bentley diagram. I make no claims to accuracy.)
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Ok, I think I figured out how to make this relay work.

MOGOLF, I will now look to see if what you read in the Bentley's Manual works with what I've figured out.


The only question is:

If I use the power supply for the Low Beams, will it also kill power to the fogs when the high beams are activated? It seems to work in my simulation

Thanks,

Lito

[ March 10, 2002, 18:33: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

Michael Moore

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2001
Location
Toronto / Zürich
TDI
2004 Phaeton W12, 2015 Golf Highline (gas)
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Lito:

The problem with wiring the foglights up as you propose (using the power supply from the low beams) is that you will be unable to use the foglights by themselves, meaning, with the Euroswitch in the parking light position. This is how you would normally want to use them in heavy fog, without either the low beams or high beams operating. This is how the European Golfs function.

The North American cars are wired as you suggest, with power coming from the low beam lights. Remember, though, that the North American cars are not supplied with a Euroswitch (light switch that enables the parking lights only). So the problem of not being able to operate foglights with the headlights off does not exist.

Wish I had seen your thread before I left Zurich today, I would have got you a European wiring diagram.
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

LOL! Thanks Michael. I think you've got enough work helping out SVTWEB. This is small potates compared to the Nav system. But I will think about how to run the fogs with city lights next:)

Ok,

The MOGOLF info works too and makes sense to me.

Now, where does the fuse go? I suppose it's possible to have TWO wires coming from the fuse panel. (the connector from the relay or fuse panel are the SAME)

Revised Diagram:



[ March 10, 2002, 18:25: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Ok,

It's really simple.

All you have to do is provide a jumper wire from the city lights wire on the eurowitch, to the Relay #53(position 86 "power").

That way, when the headlights are on or off, the fogs can be turned on.

Power(for the foglights) is always supplied by the Relay 100 through the switch. You are simply controlling relay #53 with either power from the headlamps or citylights.

I will post some directions for proper wiring of foglights as soon as I finish them.

Lito

[ March 10, 2002, 18:46: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Here's the diagram, pic and directions to follow.



L
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Michael or Eric,

can you guys look to see if I add a wire from the rear fogs to the 32-pin Instrument Cluster connector, will there be an icon on the OEM cluster? The Bentley's manual shows an indicator light on the cluster, but I'm not sure if it'll light up.

Eric, is there a pin on the OEM cluster for this indicator light?

Thanks,

Lito
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Can someone with the EUROSWITCH wiring diagram, please check these pin assignments?



I am using Wiring Diagram No: 17/4 Golf/Jetta on page 97-157.

Thanks,

Lito
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Actually, power for the factory front fogs is via the ignition switch through fuse 36 through the headlight switch (Xr - #2). Then out through NL (#8) to the relay 87, out 30, to the fog lights.
You should just have to attach a wire from NL to the relay (based on what I see on my Golf), wire from relay to fogs. The control side of the relay is wired to the city lights and high beam circuits according to the Bentley. When the high beams get turned on, it is no longer a ground path for the control of the relay and thus the relay opens.

As for the indicator, it depends on the cluster used. Early A4's had the LED in them; others have not. Replacement MFA clusters have them. This indicator is meant for the rear fogs, but it doesn't really matter. It is pin 14 on the left side connector.
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

MoGolf, thank you for the info. I think I'm really close to understanding how to get this done.

If you'll indulge me a bit more...

Actually, power for the factory front fogs is via the ignition switch through fuse 36 through the headlight switch (Xr - #2). Then out through NL (#8) to the relay 87, out 30, to the fog lights.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I haven't looked to see if Xr -#2 Physically goes into the fuse panel at #36, but there does seem to be a wire in the switch harness.

If Xr does go to the fuse panel, then there is no need for an additional fuse after the relay and as you say, 30 from the relay can feed the fogs.

The control side of the relay is wired to the city lights and high beam circuits according to the Bentley.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If this is true, then the "city lights" or amber front turn signal lights are always "hot" no matter what position the Euroswitch is in, right? This makes sense because the turn signal stalk is AFTER the Euroswitch.

For example, you can still control the front "city lights" as turn signal lights when activated by the turn signal stalk. So, they must be powered at the Euroswitch all the time.

Now, the question is, how does one connect the power from the city lights(at the switch) to the Relay #53? I don't have my Bentley's at work, but if there is a location on the switch that is "open" or assigned to Fog light relay#53 what is that location? Is it the SAME circuit for 58R & 58L?

When the high beams get turned on, it is no longer a ground path for the control of the relay and thus the relay opens.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If this is true, then there MUST be an "open" pin location that can serve to keep the relay closed, breaking the path for either power(86) or ground(85) This pin location is probably connected to the "city lights" circuit. Any ideas?

As for the indicator, it depends on the cluster used. Early A4's had the LED in them; others have not. Replacement MFA clusters have them. This indicator is meant for the rear fogs, but it doesn't really matter. It is pin 14 on the left side connector.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I guess I need to borry someone's OEM non MFA cluster to fool around with the harness and see just what lights up?


If we have the indicator light in the cluster, then it's simply a matter of finding the correct location to connect to the Euroswitch.

Thanks,

Lito
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Ok, so now we have established that you'll hook up the yellow wire in your bottom photo above to the relay "87" and fogs to relay "30". The rear fog light wire should just go back to the rear fog lights.

Now for the control side of the relay. "85" should be connected to the high beam circuit somewhere. This could be at fuse 18, or the wire going to the instrument panel indicator (pin 17 of the blue cluster connector). My preference would be at the fuse. "86" should connect to fuse 3, which gets power from pin 16 on the headlight switch. Or attach to wire connected at the headlight switch pin 16, but be sure the wire has a fuse (3A at most) between the switch and the relay.

Ground for the relay control is actually through the high beam lights circuit. There just isn't enough current to light them up.(Think of an ohmmeter running current through a bulb to check continuity. Same thing here.) When the high beams go on, there is no ground potential on that side of the relay and the relay opens.
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style



A few Comments:

1. The line from fuse #36 to pin Xr is already wired in our cars so you don't have to do anything. This was just for information purposes.

2. The YELLOW line is a new wire that needs to go from the light switch harness T17/8 (NL) to the new Relay #53 at Pin #87

3. The GREEN line is a new wire that needs to go from fuse #18 to the new Relay #53 at Pin 85

4. The RED line is a new wire that needs to go from fuse #3 to the new Relay #53 at Pin 86

5. The BLUE line is a new wire that needs to go from the new Relay #53 at Pin 30 to the left and right front fog lamps

THAT's IT!!!

Thanks MOGolf


Lito

[ October 17, 2002, 12:27: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

BRBarian

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 11, 2000
Location
Chevy Chase, MD, USA
TDI
Five Golf TDIs!
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Originally posted by tongsli:
I haven't looked to see if Xr -#2 Physically goes into the fuse panel at #36, but there does seem to be a wire in the switch harness.

If Xr does go to the fuse panel, then there is no need for an additional fuse after the relay and as you say, 30 from the relay can feed the fogs.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Lito,
Your rear fogs are already powered through fuse #36, XR and NL/NSL. The wiring is certainly there.

If this is true, then the "city lights" or amber front turn signal lights are always "hot" no matter what position the Euroswitch is in, right? This makes sense because the turn signal stalk is AFTER the Euroswitch.[/QB]
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wait... The city lights are not the same as the turn signal lights... These are different light
systems.
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Originally posted by tongsli:
will the fogs work with the City Lights
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, if the switch physically allows you to turn them on.

Be sure you have a Euroswitch with part number suffix "A" to be able to run front and rear fogs separately. Suffix "B" is standard issue North American switch (no fogs), and suffix "C" has one position fog light position for rear fogs.
 

GeWilli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 6, 1999
Location
lost to new england
TDI
none in the fleet (99.5 Golf RIP, 96 B4V sold)
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

i've skimmed this over and find what you have done lito is very very cool! Like the diagramatic thought process


quick comment - on the #3 (TFL) that is the DRL.

If you do not defeat the DRL you will never get just the Fog and City lights. There are the couple ways to do that - #1 tape up the contact (insulate it) or #2 defeat it at the some other point - such as the relay (#73? don't remember - parking brake one).

The other question I'm wondering - does the Golf have that relay plate inplace and just needs the wires plugged in and the relay put on?

gettin close to goin euro lights (got the switch and rear fogs wired) (hopin Jim doesn't sell out before I get my pennies saved
)

Thanks for the work Lito!
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Thanks Gewilli!


Thanks Bernie!


Thanks MoGolf!
You know what, last night when I posted that question, I realized after turning OFF the computer that I knew the answer to my LAST question. Duh!


Right now, I have the Euroswitch and have the rear fogs wired to the front fog pin NL. And, I can have my City lights on(2nd click to the right) and pull out the switch one or two clicks.

So, it's possible to have the City lights on, rear and front fogs on at the same time.

When the regular lights are on, the fogs can be on but are cut out when the high beams are turned on.

Cool.

There are certainly many other places to draw power or different ways to wire everything up, but this method is as close to the OEM configuration as you're gonna get; in fact it is.

I will be posting the entire parts list as soon as I can compile them.

Lito

[ March 12, 2002, 11:19: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

PTC

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2000
Location
Zagreb, Croatia
TDI
HMaracic
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Originally posted by tongsli:
What I do know so far:

The wire for the fog lights goes into the hole on the right, #2- top row.


The wire connectors to use look like this:


...
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I would be thankful if somebody could tell me how to pull these wires out of this connector.
Thanks!

[ March 12, 2002, 11:57: Message edited by: PTC ]
 

GeWilli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 6, 1999
Location
lost to new england
TDI
none in the fleet (99.5 Golf RIP, 96 B4V sold)
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Originally posted by BRBarian:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by GeWilli:

quick comment - on the #3 (TFL) that is the DRL.

If you do not defeat the DRL you will never get just the Fog and City lights. There are the couple ways to do that - #1 tape up the contact...
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">This is not correct. With the Euroswitch in the "center" position, the DRL's are off and the city lights are on. You can still pull the switch to activate the fogs...
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not in my car not with the E-brake off. Wanna see?
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style





I have found that putting a little tension on the wire(you can use vise grips and place it under your leg) keeps the little tabs from "snaping" back into place. It's almost like you squeeze the tab flat on one side, put some tension on the wire and it pulls that side down a little.

Then you move the screw driver to the otherside and move that tab in so the whole thing kinda pulls out.

You have to go back and forth one side to the other until if finally pulls out.

It's very satisfying when it finally does


Once the thing is out, I take the screw driver and re-bend the tab out a little to make sure that when it goes back in, that it doesn't come out again.

Lito

[ March 12, 2002, 13:36: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Hmmm...
GeWilli maybe your wiring is different. My Euroswitch keeps my City lights on full time in the second position too. Strange


Lito
 

BRBarian

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 11, 2000
Location
Chevy Chase, MD, USA
TDI
Five Golf TDIs!
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Originally posted by tongsli:
Hmmm...
GeWilli maybe your wiring is different.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Perhaps he has one of those faux ("B") Euroswitches. The "A" switch cuts the DRL's in center position.
 

GeWilli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 6, 1999
Location
lost to new england
TDI
none in the fleet (99.5 Golf RIP, 96 B4V sold)
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

hmmm could be - i'll haveta check that . . .

Not that I care - it works great
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

If you don't have a small screwdriver to fit in the slot to release the connector's retaining tang, straighten out a paper clip and poke it in where shown.
 

BRBarian

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 11, 2000
Location
Chevy Chase, MD, USA
TDI
Five Golf TDIs!
Re: Foglight wiring: Euro-style

Originally posted by GeWilli:

quick comment - on the #3 (TFL) that is the DRL.

If you do not defeat the DRL you will never get just the Fog and City lights. There are the couple ways to do that - #1 tape up the contact...
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">This is not correct. With the Euroswitch in the "center" position, the DRL's are off and the city lights are on. You can still pull the switch to activate the fogs...


gettin close to goin euro lights (got the switch and rear fogs wired) (hopin Jim doesn't sell out before I get my pennies saved
)
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Make sure you get the "A" type...
 
Top