Finally Got To Race An Aligator Tuned PD On The Track!

[jetta-girl]

It finally happened! I got to line up against an Aligator tuned PD. Here's some of the details:
His car was a MK4, Mine a MK5. This is about a 500lb difference...I think. If anyone knows the actual difference, please post it.
His car was stock except for the tune: stock turbo, stock injectors/nozzles, stock clutch.
My car is stock except for the DieselPower Digi-PD, and DieselPower TPC.
Both cars were manual transmission.
Both racers have plenty experience.
Same track, same time, same conditions.
Boy vs. Girl..... Aligator vs. DieselPower

My RT: .822 His RT: .939 (the tree dropped before either of us were ready, so please don't be too harsh about the RT's )
My 60': 2.530 His 60': 2.515
My 330':7.004 His 330': 7.029
My 1/8: 10.700 His 1/8: 10.765
My MPH: 65.93 His MPH: 65.81
My 1000: 13.918 His 1000: 14.018
My 1/4: 16.626 His 1/4: 16.791
My MPH: 83.97 His MPH: 81.54

As you can see, it was a pretty close race. But, I was quicker 0.165. As I said before, he was a very accomplished racer - according to him and the spectators, I was told that he has a name for himself at the track and even holds a record for racing. Before we lined up, he told me that he has "the most aggressive tune Aligator has to offer." Not sure what that means exactly, but he is quite happy with his set up. I'm happy with my set up, too. This was not a grudge match in anyway, and we were both really good sports about it all. I would have liked the opportunity to line up maybe two more times to see if the results would be the same. But, we only got to race this once. A big thanks to Brendan for lining up with me!

....and I won

 

[drkblujetta]

You Go Girl!!!!!!! (I am so jealous)

No seriously you were so consitant this weekend.......
(I hope you win big @ NHRDA finals)

I wonder if anyone else would come to the NHRDA Nationals in Seattle (Pacific Raceway Sept. 15) and race a few chicks(hint hint-nudge)

 

[drkblujetta]

Our car tips the scale @ 3400lbs with two adults a baby and misc. crap.

His car was a MK4, Mine a MK5. This is about a 500lb difference...I think. If anyone knows the actual difference, please post it.

 

[LNXGUY]

Curb weight difference between the two is about 200lbs, with him being heavier. Also, how much fule did you both have? All kinds of unknown variables.

 

[jetta-girl]

He was way thinner than me... I have at least 30lbs or so on him. Yeah, I know fuel is also a huge variable...I was on a 1/4 tank.

LNXGUY, I know there are so many variables, and I know that just one race isn't enough to be a determining factor. Just as one dyno wasn't enough for me to know what my car is really putting out. But, this one race does show that the two set ups are really comparable. As I said in my original post, I would have perferred to race three times to see what the results would be each time. He (Brendan) did say that he has been running a consistant 16.7 in that car with that set up. I run consistant 16.5's with a best time of 16.38.

I just thought it was an interesting outcome, surprising to some, and I wanted to let you guys know what happened. Maybe this will persuade some of the other TDIs to show up at the track and play.

 

[jetta-girl]

Curb weight difference between the two is about 200lbs, with him being heavier. Also, how much fule did you both have? All kinds of unknown variables.

Oh, I might have misunderstood you, are you saying a MK4 is heavier than a MK5? Or assuming his personal body is heavier than me?

 

[Ed's TDI]

Curb weight difference between the two is about 200lbs, with him being heavier. Also, how much fule did you both have? All kinds of unknown variables.

According to VW's website, a MK4 Golf is 219 kg (480 lbs) lighter than a MK5 Jetta. A MK4 Jetta is 152 kg (335 lbs) lighter than a MK5 Jetta. These numbers are based on a 2.0 MK4 Golf/Jetta vs a 2.5 MK5 Jetta since there are no longer statistics on TDI's available on VW's website, but it still shows that the MK4's are lighter than the MK5's, not the other way around as you suggest.

Yes, there are other possible variables such as fuel, weight of the driver, etc, etc. If the Aligator chipped car had stuck around, he could have weighed his car at the tech area of the track for better comparison, but he only ran the one race ... hmm.

And as for the record the driver apparently holds, he currently holds the 60ft time record for a 1.8T at the track. This means he's no stranger to running this track and or to 1/4 mile racing. Just to enlighten people on the backgroun a bit.

Nice job Sarah!

 

[Ed's TDI]

Or assuming his personal body is heavier than me?

Maybe he saw how many chocolate bars you ate at the track while you were in Canada for the weekend! Just kidding!

 

[jetta-girl]

Maybe he saw how many chocolate bars you ate at the track while you were in Canada for the weekend! Just kidding!

Yeah, I'm going for a jog today.... Right down to 7-11 for a squishy.

Uh-Oh, did we just hijack my own thread? My tummy hurts, I even brought more candy bars back home, and already had one this morning...

 

[LNXGUY]

lol, I was referring to the weight of the car, not the drivers

 

[jetta-girl]

lol, I was referring to the weight of the car, not the drivers

Ha Ha!! Yeah, well, the dude was still way skinnier than me.

 

[drkblujetta]

Oh yeah Sarah the heavyweight...........ROFL...........

Was he really smaller than you??????? (he's a peanut then)

I hope he comes out again racing, there aren't many people out with V-Dubs.

We have our street legal racing every Friday night til. 11pm......

 

[KROUT]

Very nice. What boost levels were both cars running? Who smoked more? Any video of the race?

 

[jetta-girl]

Very nice. What boost levels were both cars running? Who smoked more? Any video of the race?

No, gosh darnit! There isn't any video, and when I scanned the time slip, the light on the scanner completely washed out the timeslip so if you really want the timeslip, I can try to run a copy and mail it... But, you just might have to trust me There were witnesses...

I don't know what his boost level is, maybe Quadcomm can answer that, I understand that he did the Aligator tune on Brendan's car. My boost was spiking at 19.5 according to my guage's high value recall. Don't know who was smoking more, I was looking forward and was only about 1 car length or so ahead. I don't really smoke that much now that I have the TPC on.

 

[Mark@MaloneTuning]

I don't know what his boost level is, maybe Quadcomm can answer that

Sounds like a great race! Brendan's MK4 does not have the all-out 'gator tune, he has a standard DI Sport. From the passenger seat his exhaust smoke is barely visible and he's sustaining 17.8-17.9 PSI boost. I have not gauged his exhaust opacity from outside his car. He's one of the first MK4 PD owners chipped in B.C. A chip revision may be in order after I receive further training for live remapping soon.

The MK5 has a large front-mounted intercooler whereas the MK4 has a small SMIC, so the MK4 is intended to have ~10hp less to keep EGTs low for all types of driving with the 'gator tune.

We should meet for an equal MK5 vs. MK5 race (all for fun). I think our cars are even the same colour (grey?) I'll try to come out this Friday if I can, if not next week Fri.

With just two runs my MK5 with only a 450 USD 'gator chip logged a consistent ~16.533sec and 85.63MPH. All-year round 18.0 PSI tune w/ 20 PSI spikes. That was on a wet road using GTech but I'd like to verify it on the 1/4 mile track. Everything else is stock including OEM all-season skinny tires, and some stuff in the trunk.

Concerning an all-out tune, Brendan may be referring to his boost level and he's close. We usually set 18.0 PSI as the maximum boost for turbo longevity, although he has room for fueling with his stock injectors. A 19.0 PSI + fueler drag-race switchable chip could be produced later after the training.

Cheers,
Mark

 

[drkblujetta]

GREAT!!!
We've got at least 2 TDI's maybe 3 racing this Friday @ Mission

Bring a few TDI friends........

I'll try to come out this Friday if I can, if not next week Fri.

 

[jetta-girl]

Sounds like a great race! Brendan's MK4 does not have the all-out 'gator tune, he has a standard DI Sport. From the passenger seat his exhaust smoke is barely visible and he's sustaining 17.8-17.9 PSI boost. I have not gauged his exhaust opacity from outside his car. He's one of the first MK4 PD owners chipped in B.C. A chip revision may be in order after I receive further training for live remapping soon.

The MK5 has a large front-mounted intercooler whereas the MK4 has a small SMIC, so the MK4 is intended to have ~10hp less to keep EGTs low for all types of driving with the 'gator tune.

We should meet for an equal MK5 vs. MK5 race (all for fun). I think our cars are even the same colour (grey?) I'll try to come out this Friday if I can, if not next week Fri.

With just two runs my MK5 with only a 450 USD 'gator chip logged a consistent ~16.533sec and 85.63MPH. All-year round 18.0 PSI tune w/ 20 PSI spikes. That was on a wet road using GTech but I'd like to verify it on the 1/4 mile track. Everything else is stock including OEM all-season skinny tires, and some stuff in the trunk.

Concerning an all-out tune, Brendan may be referring to his boost level and he's close. We usually set 18.0 PSI as the maximum boost for turbo longevity, although he has room for fueling with his stock injectors. A 19.0 PSI + fueler drag-race switchable chip could be produced later after the training.

Cheers,
Mark

Thanks for filling in a few of the details... Yeah, it would be a lot of fun to meet up on the track. Might even be fun to trade cars for one round just to compare the *feel* of the different tunes. I won't be able to be there this Friday, and I'll check my calendar about next Friday. Your times sound like the same as mine. What RPM are you shifting at?
I'll PM ya about meeting at Mission at a mutually acceptable time.

~Sarah

 

[Ed's TDI]

It would be a close race but I think that Mark would have an advantage because he has a DSG transmission in his car which will shift faster than even the most experienced racer (not taking anything away from Sarah's abilities!). It would still be interesting to see what a DSG Aligator MK5 TDI could do on the track. It would certainly be very consistent at the very least.

As for Brendan's tune, he was apparently going on about the aggresiveness of his tune and how he had 8 fine-tuned files uploaded to make sure it was just right. Maybe you can confirm this Mark?

 

[jetta-girl]

It would be a close race but I think that Mark would have an advantage because he has a DSG transmission in his car which will shift faster than even the most experienced racer (not taking anything away from Sarah's abilities!). It would still be interesting to see what a DSG Aligator MK5 TDI could do on the track. It would certainly be very consistent at the very least.

As for Brendan's tune, he was apparently going on about the aggresiveness of his tune and how he had 8 fine-tuned files uploaded to make sure it was just right. Maybe you can confirm this Mark?

Brendan was indeed going on and on about the 8 trips to get the tune just perfect and he ended up "with the most aggressive tune Aligator has", but it seems like from what Mark said, he has an aggressive-but-safe-for-your-turbo-tune. And IMHO, that's probably a good call considering he already blew one turbo...

It was a good race, I think our skills were fairly equal.. If I could have done it over, we would have gone to the scale first, taken notes on fuel levels, etc.

 

[Mark@MaloneTuning]

The DSG transmission is heavier than manual and unlike everywhere else in the world, we in North America don't have launch control for DSGs. We see cool videos from Japan or Europe of a GTI 2.0T DSG launching out of the hole just like a manual, but alas we don't have that here. Standard transmissions will have the advantage of cluch feathering at launch and during the first 60', which is important for trap times. If racing from a roll the DSG will have a slight advantage no questions asked.

Some 2.0T DSG owners were discussing installing european transmission ECUs to take advantage of launch control, but I haven't seen much progress. DSG + launch control will definitely outedge manual transmission a little bit.

As stated before, Brendan was one of the first MK4 PDs to get chipped. The revisions were not for adding power in each stage, but to start from scratch in a new ECU. Most of the time was spent finding & testing maps, then maintaining a smooth 17.8 PSI boost curve. The slight fuel increase was done in one revision. The first MK5 I did had 11 remaps (4 maps alone were only used for detecting the lambda sensor), but since these tests each customer only needs 1-2 remaps. Same goes for MK4 PDs. VNT-20 or larger equipped vehicles need a few remaps at least because of the greater variation in VNT-20+ setups.

Brendan always get excited with every mod

that's probably a good call considering he already blew one turbo...

For this reason this we did approach his first chip more cautiously to ensure longevity. He was happy with the tune - it was one of the more powerful ones at the time, but after having chipped more MK4 PDs it isn't the ultimate one anymore. Brendan just called me today and he's bugging me to install a drag tune!

I'm curious as to know how the exhaust smoke compares between Brendan's car and Sara's.

What RPM are you shifting at?
I'll PM ya about meeting at Mission at a mutually acceptable time.

Sounds good My shift point is near redline (~4,400) as the HP curve remains fairly flat up there.

Cheers,
Mark

 

[Ed's TDI]

It's too bad you weren't able to make it out this weekend, Mark. It would have been nice have a few more TDI's show up, regardless of tuning preference. The NHRDA's TDI Challenge is open to any and every TDI owner and, as mentioned earlier, there were various states of tune, right down to Grace's stock MK3 TD running 20-21 second 1/4 mile times.

Hopefully we can get more of a turnout for the next event and for the 2008 season as well!

 

[jetta-girl]

Yeah, I would have really liked to see some video of the run. I also wonder how the smoke compares...

Doesn't surprise me that Brendan wants a drag tune now... He was a great racer and I'm sure he would represent Aligator well at the track!

Did you ask him what was worse... getting beat by an American girl, or getting beat by a couple of boxes? J/K
He actually asked me if I wished I were Canadian!

Like I said, it would have been ideal to get in a couple more rounds to see what the overall results would have looked like.

 

[Ed's TDI]

Yeah, I would have really liked to see some video of the run. I also wonder how the smoke compares...

Doesn't surprise me that Brendan wants a drag tune now... He was a great racer and I'm sure he would represent Aligator well at the track!

Did you ask him what was worse... getting beat by an American girl, or getting beat by a couple of boxes? J/K
He actually asked me if I wished I were Canadian!

Like I said, it would have been ideal to get in a couple more rounds to see what the overall results would have looked like.

C'mon Sarah, admit it .. you know you wish you were! lol!

 

[KROUT]

He will retune and try you again Sara its a man thing. He lost to a women I will bet you money he gets a different tune, and I dont even know him.lol
I just wanted to see video to look at smoke levels no other reason. Good job with races guys.

 

[drkblujetta]

I'm not sure after learning about CLP's this weekend

C'mon Sarah, admit it .. you know you wish you were! lol!

 

[jetta-girl]

C'mon Sarah, admit it .. you know you wish you were! lol!

If Canadian citizenship came with a lifetime supply of free Aero bars, I'm there. I could eat about 4-5 each day

 

[jetta-girl]

He will retune and try you again Sara its a man thing. He lost to a women I will bet you money he gets a different tune, and I dont even know him.lol
I just wanted to see video to look at smoke levels no other reason. Good job with races guys.

That would be even better... I like to mix it up.

 

[Ed's TDI]

Hey KROUT not all men are the same though. I had my a$$ handed to me by Sarah in 3 races and I know that it's because she's a better racer than I am and have no problem admitting it. She's got a helluva lot more passes than I could hope to and she's got her car/reaction time/launch/shifting all down to a fine art. I almost had her in one race but the Wagon is just too heavy and slow.

 

[mojogoes]

Jetta-girl you won and thats it......people with less hp and more weight than others also win....and vice versa...but a win is a win....and engine's blow and wheels fall off....should we analyze that too and feel sorry for those who it happens to.....NO the record books never go into details other than the names who came 1st.

 

[storx]

good job... its about time i hear the women start to excell in this dang sport... i hate not seeing them come out on top sometimes...