Feeler: So. FL 02 Golf TDI 53k mi - Needs Engine Mount Repaired etc.

[FirstOrbit84]

Hi everyone. I've loved my TDI since the day I got it, but I've run into a few snags recently and now I'm just trying to see if there's a way out of this car. The car is currently located in Pompano Beach, FL.

The Car:

2002 VW Golf GL TDI
2-door
Tornado Red exterior
Black Cloth interior
Automatic
~53,000 mi on car
extended warranty purchased for an additional 36k mi

Upgrades:
OEM 17" Longbeach Wheels w/ R-line centercaps
w/ Fuzion ZRi tires that have ~15,000 mi left on them

The Problem:

Driving down the highway I had an engine mount break. The dealer refuses to cover it under warranty claiming that the car had been in an accident. BUT I HAVE NEVER BEEN IN AN ACCIDENT WITH THIS CAR, so the damage must've happened before I got the car and was never reported. Then they slapped me with a $6000+ repair bill including a whole new engine block, timing belt and tensioner, serpentine belt, radiator fan among others.

So I towed the car down to where I purchased it to see if they could write up the warranty claim differently and have it covered, but they still gave me the same answer, and the tow truck driver broke the oil pan when he dropped the car off!

See this post for some more details and pictures:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=71262&page=3

Basically if someone works on these cars and thinks they could do the work themselves for cheap, all the car needs is to have motor mounts fabricated or a used engine block and whatever else replaced. I'm trying to get the towing company to pay for the oil pan as well. The engine seemed to run with no timing problems and good tension on the belt even after the mount broke, so I think the internals should be OK.

The car has beautiful paint (hard to find color in 2-door), no noticable blemishes and was in excellent running condition (and quick too) before all this happened. Asking $9,000 or best offer.

 

[FirstOrbit84]

bump.

 

[jim04tdi]

Whoa - wait a minute! Before you go tossing in the towel PLEASE call this guy. He is in Tampa FL. Name of shop is THE DIAGNOSTIC GUY. Name of owner/mechanic is John. Phone number 813-685-3488. Email veedubguy@verizon.net. He has 34 years experience 18 of which on VW's. John really knows his stuff. Probably can give you a rough estimate over the phone. Be patient and ask him if he has time to talk with you. He is usually kinda busy. Right now he has our Nissan Frontier so don't slow him up too much - just kidding.

Again, please don't lose hope on your car. Stuff happens. Call John and find out what he can do for you. Let me if you need help transporting the car. Perhaps I can help you out.

Jim

 

[Harvieux]

Nice looking vehicle from the outside. This is the exact situation I cringe about when someone purchases a TDI or any vehicle for that matter. Folks, I/we have preached here for years now that you must perform your due diligence before forking out the cash. There are many, many examples archived here over the years on what to look for, questions to ask, and how to perform these pertinent tasks beforehand. Sorry to use the original poster's unfortunate situation as an example but, if these incidents are put in their true perspectives and if it prevents even one of our member's from getting porked, I think it's worth it overall. Later!

 

[fricker3]

I don't understand how a broken engine mount equates to needing a new engine block?

Can you explain this any further?

Eric

 

[Harvieux]

I don't understand how a broken engine mount equates to needing a new engine block?

Can you explain this any further?

Eric

Engine mount breaks, engine goes South in more ways than one. Later!

 

[FirstOrbit84]

Sorry to use the original poster's unfortunate situation as an example but, if these incidents are put in their true perspectives and if it prevents even one of our member's from getting porked, I think it's worth it overall. Later!

No, please do use this as an example. I'm young (22) and I got rolled by another slimy dealer. I have a meeting with an attorney on Friday. Know and trust your source when buying used.

I'm talking to several shops about getting the work done without replacing the block by fabricating a mount like in WingNut's post. Either way, it may be garaged for some time as I am looking into getting a Corrado. After it's all fixed though, the TDI still might be up for sale.

 

[Harvieux]

No, please do use this as an example. I'm young (22) and I got rolled by another slimy dealer. I have a meeting with an attorney on Friday. Know and trust your source when buying used.

I'm talking to several shops about getting the work done without replacing the block by fabricating a mount like in WingNut's post. Either way, it may be garaged for some time as I am looking into getting a Corrado. After it's all fixed though, the TDI still might be up for sale.

Unless the attorney can show you a slam dunk winner, I would not spend the money to go forward with your litigation. It will be very difficult to prove that a dealer knowingly sold you a bum vehicle. If the dealer acquired the vehicle through auction, have the attorney subpeona the auction documents and maybe there is something there that will show damage disclosure beforehand. If the vehicle was acquired via other venues such as wholesaler's, new car trade ins, or even if this dealer took it in on trade himself, I doubt that a disclosure trail will be obtained unless the previous owner testifies that they disclosed this damage to this dealer upon trade in and this dealer in turn conveniently forgot to tell you about it. Later!

 

[Farmboy]

So, the dealer you bought it from *now* says they sold you a car that had been in an accident, and has now broken, during the term of the warranty, because of that accident, and there's text in the warranty that denies you a repair? You discussed this text with them, and are aware of where the critical text is within the warranty?

They know this 'now', but they didn't know it 'then' . . . ? Legally, you are a 'layperson', the dealer is an 'expert'. You buy a car to drive, the dealer buys, sells, and repairs cars 'professionally', and is constantly having to 'judge' them. Can they make mistakes? Yes. Can they pretend intentional abuse is a mistake? Yes. Which is this . . .

Certainly be cautious about the viability and cost of litigation. Hopefully, the lawyer can simply help you convince the dealer to honor their warranty, and if not their warranty, then their good image in the market . . . I wouldn't think they'd want to let it be widely known they are selling even one car under this set of conditions . . .

The question isn't just whether they "knew" this would happen, but whether they reasonably "should have known" this *could* happen . . .

$0.02

 

[Harvieux]

So, the dealer you bought it from *now* says they sold you a car that had been in an accident, and has now broken, during the term of the warranty, because of that accident, and there's text in the warranty that denies you a repair? You discussed this text with them, and are aware of where the critical text is within the warranty?

They know this 'now', but they didn't know it 'then' . . . ? Legally, you are a 'layperson', the dealer is an 'expert'. You buy a car to drive, the dealer buys, sells, and repairs cars 'professionally', and is constantly having to 'judge' them. Can they make mistakes? Yes. Can they pretend intentional abuse is a mistake? Yes. Which is this . . .

Certainly be cautious about the viability and cost of litigation. Hopefully, the lawyer can simply help you convince the dealer to honor their warranty, and if not their warranty, then their good image in the market . . . I wouldn't think they'd want to let it be widely known they are selling even one car under this set of conditions . . .

The question isn't just whether they "knew" this would happen, but whether they reasonably "should have known" this *could* happen . . .

$0.02

Yea, now that I have read the other linked post and other input, I think you may have a case here. Especially if the selling dealer was a franchised VW dealer and the fact they sold you an extended warranty. I think now you need to concentrate in proving that the existing damage was not caused by you and this will take a professional to determine this. Maybe the professional can verify that the damage wasn't caused by you running over a concrete block or something and maybe there is some old evidence of a hit which could of been B4 your time. I noticed from a photo of the front end of the car that the factory emissions stickers were still partially in place which tells me that if this vehicle was in that serious of an accident, the radiator core support may of had to of been replaced as a result. You may also want to check the service history to see if a past repair required the right side engine mount to be removed. It's possible that they either didn't replace the (4) torque to yeild engine mount bolts or overtightened the (3) engine block to mount bracket bolts which resulted in breaking the ear tab on the block resulting in the current damage. Later!

 

[FirstOrbit84]

The question isn't just whether they "knew" this would happen, but whether they reasonably "should have known" this *could* happen . . .

You got it. If I can prove that, then I think I'm money in this situation, as far as dealing with the Honda dealer that sold me the car goes. But that will also be the most difficult path to choose. That is, if all else fails and I am forced to pursue legal action. Hopefully it won't come to that.

My insurance company sent out two claims adjusters and both said that this is a mechanical failure and they will not cover the repair because it was obvious that I didn't damage the car by running over something or otherwise.

So I've just moved the car to a friendlier VW dealer that will hopefully get these repairs covered under the extended warranty. The first VW dealer wouldn't even submit a claim once they saw the damage, saying that the adjuster would see the epoxy or whatever was on the mount.

Unless the attorney can show you a slam dunk winner, I would not spend the money to go forward with your litigation.

Don't worry, if I can't afford these repairs, I definately can't afford a lawyer. The counsel I'm getting is free legal advice from the University's Student Legal Services.

If anyone has been keeping up with this thread and they'd like to help me out by running a VIN on CarFax of a Corrado I'm looking at, please PM me.

Thanx a ton to everyone who has given me input on this problem. You're help is very much appreciated. Hopefully I'll be back into the TDI community ASAP.

 

[Losha]

FirstOrbit84, Did you got your car repaired or problem with dealer solved? If you haven't solved this issue with dealer then I would suggest that you contact VW in Michigan and complain to them. They might be able to help you. Good Luck!

 

[mrchill]

Whatever happened to this deal?

 

[ninedee_golf_tdi]

Whatever happened to this deal?

LOTS of DAMAGE... and the factory warranty wouldn't cover it because they saw a new subframe and some jb weld on a botched mount repair, but thankfully there IS a fix. i had a mount fabricated, per this post:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=71262 (thanx wingnut and JetAH) then replaced the timing belt, tensioner, water pump, etc.. and got out for around $2500 instead of the $6k+ that the dealer wanted for a new block....

I found that from a post he made back in march.

 

[FirstOrbit84]

thanks for updating everyone for me.
i'm still diesel trucking, and been auto-xing her on the newly fabbed mount.

 

[Keven]

Damn,.,,,,,thought this was still for sale!