Drastic oil usage

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
For those that are battling oil consumption on the CKRA engine I will share my journey. After more than 2 years of trying to fix this issue on my 2014 Passat tdi I have found the issue. The car was purchased used, with 60,000 on the odometer. It was a buy back that had the software update for diesel gate. At 100,000 K it had a plugged DPF and would re-gen every 100 miles. This went on for a while with no warning lights only reduced mileage. Im pretty sure now that this coked and glazed my rings. Soon after oil consumption got real bad. During the oil consumption era I tried every trick I could from searching the forums. CCV, New turbo, DPF delete etc. Nothing helped. Before the fix it was consuming 1 quart in 300 miles, but ran fine no smoke. The fix for me was a top end clean. It involved removing injectors and soaking pistons in bore with a GM cleaner made for this. I have repeated this twice now and the consumption has decreased considerably.
I have not added oil in the last 2000 miles and am watching dipstick daily. Im pretty confident the excessive heat from re-gens coked my oil control rings to where they couldn't flex in the piston groove. I wish I would have tried this first I could have saved a lot of money not changing out parts that weren't bad. Any way that's my story and very happy.
 

danmin

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2023
Location
DFW
TDI
2014 Passat 2.0 TDI @ 180k
1. What is ur current mileage?
2. What delete did you do? Only DPF? Or full emissions?
3. Regens shouldn’t let the engine get that hot.. There are so many sensors and checkers that verify stuff like temps, that the likelihood your piston rings #### themselves is low.
4. What did you do for the crank case vent fix?


Carbon buildup in the piston rings from an old EGR system is likely. Big problem with the Ford Ecoboost family. But things like the regen process and running your engine hard should cook that out. Also Fuel additives are supposed to help with that.

I would double check your valve cover gasket and replace the valve cover entirely- as the vent system is build into it.
 

x1800MODMY360x

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2021
Location
AZ, USA
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SEL
1. What is ur current mileage?
2. What delete did you do? Only DPF? Or full emissions?
3. Regens shouldn’t let the engine get that hot.. There are so many sensors and checkers that verify stuff like temps, that the likelihood your piston rings #### themselves is low.
4. What did you do for the crank case vent fix?


Carbon buildup in the piston rings from an old EGR system is likely. Big problem with the Ford Ecoboost family. But things like the regen process and running your engine hard should cook that out. Also Fuel additives are supposed to help with that.

I would double check your valve cover gasket and replace the valve cover entirely- as the vent system is build into it.
Sounds like a bot. Only 2 post and both say the same thing.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
1. What is ur current mileage?
2. What delete did you do? Only DPF? Or full emissions?
3. Regens shouldn’t let the engine get that hot.. There are so many sensors and checkers that verify stuff like temps, that the likelihood your piston rings #### themselves is low.
4. What did you do for the crank case vent fix?


Carbon buildup in the piston rings from an old EGR system is likely. Big problem with the Ford Ecoboost family. But things like the regen process and running your engine hard should cook that out. Also Fuel additives are supposed to help with that.

I would double check your valve cover gasket and replace the valve cover entirely- as the vent system is build into it.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
1-its at about 180,000 now

2-idid the full delete

3-I was thinking that the plugged dpf caused the temperature
to rise. When I replaced the valve cover the gasket was baked especially the backside by dpf.

4-full valve cover with ccv, check hose all the way to intercooler pipe.
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
I can see how a plugged dpf might foul up the rings. Good job getting them freed up.
 

JELLOWSUBMARINE

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Location
yes
TDI
2011 Jetta Sportwagen, 6M, red/tan, navi, pano, 83 5m diesel pickup, 82 p/u trailer,.04 5.5 TDI Passat wagon (gone), 80,81,82 diesel p/u (gone), 80,82 sportruck (gone), 59 passthru bus (long gone), 79&87 westy (gone), 57 baja bug (long gone), 73 914
Many modern high efficiency low ring tension motors have had issues with oil consumption due to ring issues. Toyota spacifically has recalled many thousands of engines due to the low tension rings freezing up. Ridiculous over extended oil change intervals give manufactures battling/bragging rights. They know that it sell cars.

Ive always leaned on the safe side of oil changes and never had oil consumption issues. My present Sienna @ 180k doest burn or leak a drop between changes... never had valve seals or pan valve cover gaskets. Yeah thats n/a and Toyota but...

Although there are so many other areas that can develope consumption issues like the turbo etc., excessive blistering regens... heat on the rings and coking... I'm convinced that VW is no stranger to this oil and ring issue. My "either it burn massive oil or doesn't" cjaa was in the no oil consumption catagory too, so...

Like what the o.p. stated, the later top end soak actually made the dramatic differance. a well maintained (oil intervals) and even an occasional seafoam or quality oil flush treatment will do miricles.

Glad you found the issue. (y)
 

eugene89us

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Location
Southern USA
TDI
2014 Volkswagen Passat TDI SEL Premium
Interesting! So you would remove injectors and place a GM cleaner into the cylinder bores. Did you do one cylinder at a time, placing pistons at the bottom of the stroke, or all at once? I presume the cleaner penetrated into the oil sump, requiring complete oil change after each cleaning? Did you suck all the cleaner back out or did all of it ooze down into the oil sump after letting it sit? Mine is starting to consume, just a little - maybe a quart every 10k miles, but with no clear causes of oil consumption, I too start to suspect the rings to be culprit. Did you test compression before and after, just curious? I assume if great cleaning happened with oil rings, there should be positive change with other rings as well. More details would be greatly appreciated, as many of us might go through with this at some point.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
Interesting! So you would remove injectors and place a GM cleaner into the cylinder bores. Did you do one cylinder at a time, placing pistons at the bottom of the stroke, or all at once? I presume the cleaner penetrated into the oil sump, requiring complete oil change after each cleaning? Did you suck all the cleaner back out or did all of it ooze down into the oil sump after letting it sit? Mine is starting to consume, just a little - maybe a quart every 10k miles, but with no clear causes of oil consumption, I too start to suspect the rings to be culprit. Did you test compression before and after, just curious? I assume if great cleaning happened with oil rings, there should be positive change with other rings as well. More details would be greatly appreciated, as many of us might go through with this at some point.
It doest sound like yours is using any oil, anyway what I did after some research was to even out the pistons (bamboo kabob skewers thru injector holes) I used some cheap plastic syringes that came with tubing to inject the cleaner into the cylinders. I also picked up a borescope so I could monitor the situation. I think I injected about 80 ml into each bore and let soak for three hours. Then looked and found most of the liquid had drained thru so then I hand cranked about 6 or 7 times (with wrench). Also sucked the remaining liquid out of piston bowls. re-installed injectors, drained oil, filled with cheap oil and some engine flush. ran for 15 min. drained then fill with good oil, change filter. After driving for a bit I did notice oil was not dirty like usual and when removing oil cap when idling there wasn't hardly any blow by like usual. I didn't do any compression testing but the engine does seem to idle very smooth now. When I looked at the cylinder walls a few looked to have all their hashing marks, I did take quite a few photos but don't have a clue how to put them on here.
 

eugene89us

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Location
Southern USA
TDI
2014 Volkswagen Passat TDI SEL Premium
@rwlucas Thanks for extra details. Was this the part number: GM part # 12378549 Cleaner, Piston And Ring (12 Ounce.)? I presume lots of folks that also have turbo leakage may have it due to excessive blow by from piston rings that pressurizes the oil sump causing poor oil outflow from turbo seals and thereby leakage. I wonder if that needs to become a part of our differential diagnosis?
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
@rwlucas Thanks for extra details. Was this the part number: GM part # 12378549 Cleaner, Piston And Ring (12 Ounce.)? I presume lots of folks that also have turbo leakage may have it due to excessive blow by from piston rings that pressurizes the oil sump causing poor oil outflow from turbo seals and thereby leakage. I wonder if that needs to become a part of our differential diagnosis?
It was #10-3015. 32 oz. can. You definitely want to have good ventilation when using it. Its got some nasty stuff in it.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA

Ok I figured it out. Here are a few pics I took during the process Keep in mind when looking at these you would think the engine had blown, but cylinder glare and reflection make it look worse than it is. Also image is upside down.
 

danmin

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2023
Location
DFW
TDI
2014 Passat 2.0 TDI @ 180k
Wow, I didn’t realize how much lift the valves had. Considering the space where the piston doesn’t travel, and the fact that the engine is an interference-engine.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
Wow, I didn’t realize how much lift the valves had. Considering the space where the piston doesn’t travel, and the fact that the engine is an interference-engine.
I'm thinking that it does go farther, that would be where the ring stops.
 

robco

Active member
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Location
Tennessee, usa
TDI
2003 GLS Jetta TDI loaded
rwlucas I feel your pain. Your story sounds exactly like mine. New turbo ( and that is a mother to replace ), valve cover, I just did the delete. Runs great now but using oil and stinks like hell driving it. Definitely going to give this a try. Thank you for posting this. Please keep this post updated. I searched for days on this problem. We can’t be the only ones. I really think the problem is the stopped up DPf’s. VW is getting the money back they gave us to keep these, but I bought this one used so I got rammed.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
rwlucas I feel your pain. Your story sounds exactly like mine. New turbo ( and that is a mother to replace ), valve cover, I just did the delete. Runs great now but using oil and stinks like hell driving it. Definitely going to give this a try. Thank you for posting this. Please keep this post updated. I searched for days on this problem. We can’t be the only ones. I really think the problem is the stopped up DPf’s. VW is getting the money back they gave us to keep these, but I bought this one used so I got rammed.
I forgot I had posted this. So far oil usage has dropped dramatically. It's not perfect but good enough to be satisfied and quit throwing money at it or new engine. last time I added half quart (full hashmark on dipstick) it had achieved almost 2000 mi. With would be about a 4000 % improvement Lol. Good luck with yours.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
We use BG products (and others) here. BG stuff works pretty well if there is a problem it can fix. Can't say I've run into a need for it on TDIs though, but I'm sure it would work. Not seen any CKRAs with oil consumption problems. Now leaks... yeah, see that all the time.

Rather than pull the injectors out, it would be easier to pull the plugs out.
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
We use BG products (and others) here. BG stuff works pretty well if there is a problem it can fix. Can't say I've run into a need for it on TDIs though, but I'm sure it would work. Not seen any CKRAs with oil consumption problems. Now leaks... yeah, see that all the time.

Rather than pull the injectors out, it would be easier to pull the plugs out.
Yes plugs out would be an easy option but I wanted to look at stuff. The smallest camera I could find cheap was like .2 inch and just fit through nozzle hole. if a person was to do it plugs would probably be a method. I'm a retired wireman and a firm believer that theirs always a hundred ways to do the same job.
 
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740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2017 Alltrack SE; Totaled 2015 Passat SEL, BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat SE w/ Nav,
I forgot I had posted this. So far oil usage has dropped dramatically. It's not perfect but good enough to be satisfied and quit throwing money at it or new engine. last time I added half quart (full hashmark on dipstick) it had achieved almost 2000 mi. With would be about a 4000 % improvement Lol. Good luck with yours.
How many short trips do you do? How often do you do Italian tune ups? (>85mph on the highway with repeated full throttle applications?)
 

rwlucas

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2023
Location
vancouver wa
TDI
2013 Passat CKRA
My wife was using it to drive to Corvallis for grandkid baby sitting 4 to 5 times a month (300 mi round trip). Now my son is driving it and I let him know to drive the piss out of it.
 

robco

Active member
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Location
Tennessee, usa
TDI
2003 GLS Jetta TDI loaded
That’s why we buy these cars. Great gas mileage and they will go forever. This is my 3rd one. I think the old ALH motors were the best then the liberals and their emissions ruined it. My old Jetta had 300,000 on it when I wrecked it. I have a 2015 Passat with 158k on it and so far it’s doing well. I think it’s mostly in what kind of oil you use.
 

robco

Active member
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Location
Tennessee, usa
TDI
2003 GLS Jetta TDI loaded
I did the soak and this thing is still using a lot of oil. And now with the new turbo it’s blowing the hose off at the intercooler. Could a stopped up intercooler cause oil usage ?
 
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