Does VW have to destroy buyback TDI's?

[MichaelJ1978]

If so, what condition does the car have to be when I sell it back? Does it just have to run under its own power?

I have a 2015 Passat TDI SE w/sunroof, 14k miles Owe $15k, buyback is a little over $31k

My question is can I strip the entire car down to bare bones and keep the parts while essentially giving VW back the engine/trans/drive train so long as it drives?

Could I remove the doors, hood, trunk, bumpers, air bags, interior, audio, replace wheels with spare tires, etc and keep the parts while still returning the car as long as I drive it to the dealer? If they are going to crush these, why not keep the parts for resale for someone who needs them in the future? I have a huge detached workshop and the parts would maybe take up 5% of my space but be worth thousands.

I will most likely take the fix and with the $ they give me have the car paid off before I hit my 40k service, BUT if you can give them back a stripped car and pull off 10K of parts and I get about 15k on top of what I owe I'll go that route.

 

[joewilhite]

you can't have it both ways, give it or keep it. if someone owed you 100 $ and they said here is 25 $ would you accept it

 

[BuyMeBackSoon]

2015s are probably fixable, I assume they aren't getting crushed and your idea isn't going to fly. Look elsewhere for revenge. Lol

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

If so, what condition does the car have to be when I sell it back? Does it just have to run under its own power?

I have a 2015 Passat TDI SE w/sunroof, 14k miles Owe $15k, buyback is a little over $31k

My question is can I strip the entire car down to bare bones and keep the parts while essentially giving VW back the engine/trans/drive train so long as it drives?

Could I remove the doors, hood, trunk, bumpers, air bags, interior, audio, replace wheels with spare tires, etc and keep the parts while still returning the car as long as I drive it to the dealer? If they are going to crush these, why not keep the parts for resale for someone who needs them in the future? I have a huge detached workshop and the parts would maybe take up 5% of my space but be worth thousands.

I will most likely take the fix and with the $ they give me have the car paid off before I hit my 40k service, BUT if you can give them back a stripped car and pull off 10K of parts and I get about 15k on top of what I owe I'll go that route.

Car has to be intact. No striping

Condition is nothing.

Has to drive under its' own power.

 

[DanB36]

Car has to be intact. No striping

Although I think that should be the case, do you have a reference? Because the only requirement I remember seeing in the settlement documents was that it be "operable", defined as driving under the power of its own 2-liter TDI engine, and not with a branded title under certain conditions.

Edit: and to answer the question that's the subject of the thread, VW can't sell them (or even export them) without installing an approved emissions fix. They can part them out, except for the ECU, DPF, and some other emissions-related parts.

 

[tadawson]

Which would tend to imply that export sans-ECU, install new ECU in destination country (outside an US regulation, and to whatever standard that country requires) and resell. If the target country doesn't require a DPF, that doesn't matter either . . . seems like a pretty idiotic (and ineffective) restriction, unless the goal is to remove US spec parts so they can't be re-imported.

 

[DanB36]

Which would tend to imply that export sans-ECU, install new ECU in destination country (outside an US regulation, and to whatever standard that country requires) and resell.

Don't think that's allowed. To export the cars, they must have an approved fix applied. Without a fix, they can part out the cars, minus ECU, DPF, etc. Presumably the parts could be shipped anywhere, and I suppose they could export parts wholesale and reassemble cars outside the country, but that doesn't seem like the plan.

 

[dropnosky]

If so, what condition does the car have to be when I sell it back? Does it just have to run under its own power?

I have a 2015 Passat TDI SE w/sunroof, 14k miles Owe $15k, buyback is a little over $31k

My question is can I strip the entire car down to bare bones and keep the parts while essentially giving VW back the engine/trans/drive train so long as it drives?

Could I remove the doors, hood, trunk, bumpers, air bags, interior, audio, replace wheels with spare tires, etc and keep the parts while still returning the car as long as I drive it to the dealer? If they are going to crush these, why not keep the parts for resale for someone who needs them in the future? I have a huge detached workshop and the parts would maybe take up 5% of my space but be worth thousands.

I will most likely take the fix and with the $ they give me have the car paid off before I hit my 40k service, BUT if you can give them back a stripped car and pull off 10K of parts and I get about 15k on top of what I owe I'll go that route.

Its amusing that people are so upset over VW's unethical behavior, and yet there are a dozen posts of this nature a day by the very same people. What happened to honesty, integrity, and ethical behavior?

 

[Diesl]

What happened to honesty, integrity, and ethical behavior?

Off topic.

 

[czeetah]

Well if going to a crusher I don't think it's unethical to pre-strip

 

[dropnosky]

Well if going to a crusher I don't think it's unethical to pre-strip

not if you are being paid a valuation for a complete car. How many cars have you sold to someone and before they picked it up removed all the body panels so you could sell them again individually?

This is something most people would never do in a private party sale, but suddenly its ok when its a large company purchasing the car instead.

VW is paying for complete cars, this is clear.

 

[kydsid]

Which would tend to imply that export sans-ECU, install new ECU in destination country (outside an US regulation, and to whatever standard that country requires) and resell. If the target country doesn't require a DPF, that doesn't matter either . . . seems like a pretty idiotic (and ineffective) restriction, unless the goal is to remove US spec parts so they can't be re-imported.

I think that is exactly the point of the restriction. That and removing the ability for any country to blame the US gov if and when the cars show up.

 

[dropnosky]

Off topic.

Right, lets stay on topic and discuss other ways fraud can get us some more cash. If i take the badges off my passat and glue them to a 15 year old 500 dollar burned out hyundai, VW will never know.

Think about how ridiculous and unethical the OP question is. Of course the car has to be complete, you are being paid for a complete car, not a shell that runs. What VW does with the car after they buy it is their concern, not yours. Lets say they plan to scrap them all and you dont like it, then dont sell the car back. Easy.

 

[GoFaster]

It has to have brake pads, but there's nothing saying there has to be anything left of the linings.

It has to have tires, but there's nothing saying there has to be any tread left.

It has to have an interior, but there's nothing saying your kids, dogs, and cats can't barf, chew, scratch, or leave hair everywhere.

It has to be in running order, but it doesn't say the accelerator hasn't been buried in the floor pan for the last month.

 

[dubStrom]

settlement

VW must disable the ignition system upon receipt of a buyback.

However, it can be reactivated if repaired to EPA compliance. Then the vehicle can be sold domestically, or exported.

I read this in the documents posted at VWcourtsettlement.com

 

[Max Period]

VW must disable the ignition system upon receipt of a buyback.

However, it can be reactivated if repaired to EPA compliance. Then the vehicle can be sold domestically, or exported.

I read this in the documents posted at VWcourtsettlement.com

Specifically, by removing the ECU. (which VW is not allowed to resell/export)

 

[MP517PRCT]

I certainly hope that they don't destroy all the TDI's, I'm hoping to sell my '09 JSW back and use the proceeds to buy one of those delicious looking '15 or '16 JSW's that have been sitting, quarantined at the back of the dealer lots!

 

[JRSYJET]

My moral compass allows me to 'sell my car back', not most of my car. 2 wrongs makes it right?

Should I decide to go the 'buy back' route, I shall decide simultaneously to let the buyer free of my sold-back car karma.

Do any of you tell the fire fighters how to put out a fire?

Tell the surgeon how to do an appendectomy?

'Jet

 

[Mike_04GolfTDI]

So it sounds like there's the potential that cars can be sold again if an approved fix is applied.

In other words, they buy it back, remove the ECU to disable the car, apply a fix if and when one is approved, and then they could sell the car to recover some of the money they paid to buy it back.

I have a feeling the reconditioned cars would be sold somewhere like China though, not in the USA.

 

[jims2321]

I am pretty sure, GEN2/3 cars will be fixable with minimal changes to the car itself. GEN 1 cars are headed for the parting pile. It makes no sense for VW not to strip these cars for parts sans the emissions/ecu. There are a helluva lot of non diesel VW cars that quarter panels, doors, and other sundry parts will fit. It also makes economic sense to do it, to recoup the money payout for the buyback. Will VW recover all of the money, no. But it will help make the its less expensive in the long run.

 

[dubStrom]

So it sounds like there's the potential that cars can be sold again if an approved fix is applied.

In other words, they buy it back, remove the ECU to disable the car, apply a fix if and when one is approved, and then they could sell the car to recover some of the money they paid to buy it back.

I have a feeling the reconditioned cars would be sold somewhere like China though, not in the USA.

I read in the settlement that they are allowed to sell them domestically once an EPA approved emissions system is installed. AND, they may export them and sell abroad once approved, but NOT before the car is fixed. I do not remember the exact wording, but I think that is the gyst of it.

This DOES bring up another scenario... Would it be possible for VW to create the fix, perhaps mostly by modifying injection to occur long after TDC (thereby reducing FE and performance), then export, reflash AGAIN to improve power and FE (along with increased NOx emission) and then sell abroad? Other countries have different emissions policies...

 

[fredthe]

This DOES bring up another scenario... Would it be possible for VW to create the fix, perhaps mostly by modifying injection to occur long after TDC (thereby reducing FE and performance), then export, reflash AGAIN to improve power and FE (along with increased NOx emission) and then sell abroad? Other countries have different emissions policies...

I expect that they would be required to apply the same fix to vehicles they are exporting as to the ones staying in the US, since as long as it's sitting in the US the EPA needs to approve any changes.

 

[dubStrom]

I expect that they would be required to apply the same fix to vehicles they are exporting as to the ones staying in the US, since as long as it's sitting in the US the EPA needs to approve any changes.

Yes, exactly what I said... VW may replace the ECU and reprogram to meet EPA emissions. That may include additional hardware, but lowering NOx can be done by changing the injection time (after TDC when pressures are lower), but it causes more diesel consumption and reduces performance (torque/HP).

BUT, ONCE EPA certified, they CAN BE EXPORTED to another market.

In that new market, they can make changes, improve performance, and sell.

The bottom line is that ALL buyback vehicles must meet EPA compliance before anything can be done with them-resold here, or abroad.

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

Although I think that should be the case, do you have a reference? Because the only requirement I remember seeing in the settlement documents was that it be "operable", defined as driving under the power of its own 2-liter TDI engine, and not with a branded title under certain conditions.

Edit: and to answer the question that's the subject of the thread, VW can't sell them (or even export them) without installing an approved emissions fix. They can part them out, except for the ECU, DPF, and some other emissions-related parts.

I might be wrong

read some where it had to be "INTACT"

Now I don't know what to bang on

 

[jjk58]

I certainly hope that they don't destroy all the TDI's, I'm hoping to sell my '09 JSW back and use the proceeds to buy one of those delicious looking '15 or '16 JSW's that have been sitting, quarantined at the back of the dealer lots!

I inquired about just this at a new england dealer this past weekend. vw is buying all of their 15 and 16 (at port) cars. they do expect to have 17s but didn't have a time line

 

[wrightwinger]

What if you just got new tires on your VW and you're considering a new one with the buy back money....... I wonder if they need the original wheels even.

 

[2015vwgolfdiesel]

What if you just got new tires on your VW and you're considering a new one with the buy back money....... I wonder if they need the original wheels even.

IMO Bottom line

Only drivable under its' own power

 

[98mkiv]

Folks - back to the OP question I'm sure it's been said already - but VW must scrap the cars. This isn't because they can't sell them, etc, it's a business decision.... here's a few reasons why these cars will be 100% recycled:

Liability - they don't know what kind of condition your car is in. Maybe it's perfect? Maybe you decided to see how it runs with Drano for lubricant before turning it in. They would be liable to warranty the car. They're not some fly by night car dealer, they are VW after all.

Stripping/Scrapping and selling components - same reason - VW doesn't sell used parts. Maybe reman, but folks - these are TDI's that everyone is turning in, they already have a reman program where parts come from the dealer with a diagnosis. They aren't going to figure out every little nuance of this tidal wave of lemons they are buying back.

Cost - Any reason you can think of will be a no, because of cost. Warranty, Liability, Reputation, etc. There is no equation you will come to where there is a net benefit to VW better than scrapping the whole pile for recycling. I'm not an oracle, so maybe you can think of some argument that makes sense and I'd love to know it. The only one that makes any sort of sense, possibly, is that they keep a select set of ultra low mile vehicles, refurb them, and donate them to needy families, because even though this costs VW money, it polishes some of the tarnish off the brand. Long shot IMO.

 

[tdi54]

Good point Dropnosky.

 

[flee]

Good point Dropnosky.

Oh crap, do I have to ignore him, too?