DIY: DSG Transmission scheduled maintenance (40K miles interval)

MacBuckeye

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Location
North Carolina
TDI
2009 Jetta
VAGCOM not needed for DSG service

cb1000rider-

You don't need VAGCOM for the DSG service. Warm up your engine/transmission. Drain, refill, done. It's really that simple.

IMHO... that whole thing about the transmission temperature being exactly XX degrees is bunk!

As far as owning a VAGCOM, I definitely recommend getting one. They are useful for clearing codes, reseting the Service Interval/Reminder, checking the DPF, and a host of other features. I bit the bullet about 4 months after I bought my car and I'm glad I did.
 

TonyJetta

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Joined
Sep 15, 2005
Location
Tucson, Az
TDI
'15 Jetta TDI SE / '06 Jetta TDI DSG Pkg0 / '96 Passat TDI
IMHO... that whole thing about the transmission temperature being exactly XX degrees is bunk!
Think what you want. This oil does expand enough that temperature does matter quite a bit.

Tony
Sent from my e-diesel fleet
 

dellaware

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Delaware
TDI
2010 JSW TDI AT
I am getting ready to perform this service, and I pretty much agree with the quote below. I can hardly believe that the temperature would change the volume of the oil enough to make a darn bit of difference. Shifting through the gears, however, would, and possible the increased viscosity would help it work into areas that it wouldn't if it was cold.
So two questions: Do you put it in "manual" mode and shift 1-6 gears or just the N, D, and S positions? How long (approximately) does it take for the tranny to warm up to the proper temperature? 5 min? 10, 15?
This is so I don't have to buy a VAGCOM.
Thanks


cb1000rider-

You don't need VAGCOM for the DSG service. Warm up your engine/transmission. Drain, refill, done. It's really that simple.

IMHO... that whole thing about the transmission temperature being exactly XX degrees is bunk!

As far as owning a VAGCOM, I definitely recommend getting one. They are useful for clearing codes, reseting the Service Interval/Reminder, checking the DPF, and a host of other features. I bit the bullet about 4 months after I bought my car and I'm glad I did.
 

Mrrogers1

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Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Location
Omaha NEEEBRASKA
TDI
2011 Golf TDI 6MT, 2015 Golf Sportwagen S TDI DSG
I am getting ready to perform this service, and I pretty much agree with the quote below. I can hardly believe that the temperature would change the volume of the oil enough to make a darn bit of difference. Shifting through the gears, however, would, and possible the increased viscosity would help it work into areas that it wouldn't if it was cold.
So two questions: Do you put it in "manual" mode and shift 1-6 gears or just the N, D, and S positions? How long (approximately) does it take for the tranny to warm up to the proper temperature? 5 min? 10, 15?
This is so I don't have to buy a VAGCOM.
Thanks
I'm just going to say, the tranny is quite expensive to replace and the VAGCOM is unbelievably handy for all things dealing with our cars. Believe what you want and of course, do what you want but I'd advise anyone that asked me personally to a) follow procedures prescribed by VW which closely matches the methods tried and trued by many members here and b) buy VAGCOM = Happy and worry free (well, as worry free as we can be with the CR motor ;) )

Just my 2c and welcoming to the club!
 

dellaware

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Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Delaware
TDI
2010 JSW TDI AT
Thanks for the advice, but I'll take my chances this time. The following is not me trying to be a smart a$$, just telling how I justified to myself. You're probably right, I'll end up buying a VAGCOM for another reason in the future, but maybe not.
If you figure an over estimated expansion coefficient of 0.0005, on 5 liters, thats about 125ml volume change if you had a temperature error of 50 degrees F (another over estimate). 125 ml is less than 5 oz. I think there will be more error in other areas of the fill rather than just the temperature.
But, like I said, I still want a rough idea of how long I should run it before letting excess run off over the snorkel thing.

I'm just going to say, the tranny is quite expensive to replace and the VAGCOM is unbelievably handy for all things dealing with our cars. Believe what you want and of course, do what you want but I'd advise anyone that asked me personally to a) follow procedures prescribed by VW which closely matches the methods tried and trued by many members here and b) buy VAGCOM = Happy and worry free (well, as worry free as we can be with the CR motor ;) )

Just my 2c and welcoming to the club!
 
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Mrrogers1

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Location
Omaha NEEEBRASKA
TDI
2011 Golf TDI 6MT, 2015 Golf Sportwagen S TDI DSG
Thanks for the advice, but I'll take my chances this time. The following is not me trying to be a smart a$$, just telling how I justified to myself. You're probably right, I'll end up buying a VAGCOM for another reason in the future, but maybe not.
If you figure an over estimated expansion coefficient of 0.0005, on 5 liters, thats about 125ml volume change if you had a temperature error of 50 degrees F (another over estimate). 125 ml is less than 5 oz. I think there will be more error in other areas of the fill rather than just the temperature.
But, like I said, I still want a rough idea of how long I should run it before letting excess run off over the snorkel thing.
You (nor can I) can't know for sure, too many variables BUT if you drive the car and it's at operating temps and you pull in, get on stands, do fluid change right away, maybe 5min tops BUT what temp are you working in will dictate how quickly the car/tranny cools. Depending on the temp of the area you are working in, the tranny temp can be where it needs to be without even running, you just don't know unless, well, you know. :)
 

meerschm

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Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
if you want an educated guess. let us know where you will do the service, we could help with a guess.

do you have to drive there, will you be inside, or outside? how will you get it elevated and level?
 

Spike_africa

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Aug 8, 2012
Location
Sarasota,FL
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2013 Passat TDI/w DSG
I did the drain it all out. filled it up from the top method. added the 4.6L back in put in the new filter and its been 42k miles now. Everything is great. Will be doing it again this way soon.
 

dellaware

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Delaware
TDI
2010 JSW TDI AT
Doing it this Friday or Saturday, it will be in the high 50's, outside, the most level part of my yard by the shed, and will be after I get home from work, a 60 mile drive, so it will be at operating temperature. 5 minutes to get changed from work clothes. I'll put the new tranny oil by a heat vent in the house so it will be warm before I fill.

if you want an educated guess. let us know where you will do the service, we could help with a guess.

do you have to drive there, will you be inside, or outside? how will you get it elevated and level?
 

MacBuckeye

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Nov 11, 2008
Location
North Carolina
TDI
2009 Jetta
Curious, how do you know if the fluid level is off? What if too much fluid is inside? What happens if too little is inside? I'm guessing too little fluid wouldn't allow the DSG to shift from 1st to 2nd, etc.? I'm thinking it would be better to have a little extra (excess) than being low.

If .5 to 1.0 L drains out, why not just add 4.5 to 4.7 and not go through the process of letting it drain out to the proper level? Has anyone tried that?

Has anyone had any problems after they did their DSG service?
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
Doing it this Friday or Saturday, it will be in the high 50's, outside, the most level part of my yard by the shed, and will be after I get home from work, a 60 mile drive, so it will be at operating temperature. 5 minutes to get changed from work clothes. I'll put the new tranny oil by a heat vent in the house so it will be warm before I fill.
How will you get clearance to the underside of the car and keep it level? (or are you a skinny acrobat?)


My guess is with those conditions, after drain, fill and filter change, start, and run through each gear (p, r, n, d s) (count to six or so in each gear)

leave running in P and should be good to go. (I would guess you will be at low end of temp range pretty quick, esp if you warm the fluid first)

again, this is just a guess.

if the case feels hot to the touch, wait a bit more before you start.

I did my first change on a lift in the summer, and fluid was already at the high end when I started the car. next time, i changed oil and air filter as well as empty the DSG, and enough time had passed (in the 60s or so as I recall, but inside a building) to be at the low end of the range within a few minutes of starting.

remember it takes a bit to crawl back under the car, check drain pan location and pull hose to drain the overflow, and the DSG fluid continues to warm during this time with the engine running.
 
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dellaware

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Delaware
TDI
2010 JSW TDI AT
Thanks! This is the advice I was looking for. Didn't get to it this weekend, but hopefully this week. Merry Christmas everyone!

How will you get clearance to the underside of the car and keep it level? (or are you a skinny acrobat?)


My guess is with those conditions, after drain, fill and filter change, start, and run through each gear (p, r, n, d s) (count to six or so in each gear)

leave running in P and should be good to go. (I would guess you will be at low end of temp range pretty quick, esp if you warm the fluid first)

again, this is just a guess.

if the case feels hot to the touch, wait a bit more before you start.

I did my first change on a lift in the summer, and fluid was already at the high end when I started the car. next time, i changed oil and air filter as well as empty the DSG, and enough time had passed (in the 60s or so as I recall, but inside a building) to be at the low end of the range within a few minutes of starting.

remember it takes a bit to crawl back under the car, check drain pan location and pull hose to drain the overflow, and the DSG fluid continues to warm during this time with the engine running.
 

dellaware

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Delaware
TDI
2010 JSW TDI AT
I did the service this last Saturday and first of all, it's pretty easy.

Took out the battery and airbox, then accessed the DSG filter, then climbed underneath and removed the dirt shield/air flow cover, then pulled plug and snorkel. Fluid looked extremely clean btw.
People mentioned it taking forever for you to fill from the top of the tranny. I had no issue; I put the bottle on the tube then put a hole with a knife in the bottom of the quart container and it drained into the tranny in about a minute each quart. Also had the oil sitting in a hot water bath while I was prepping to fill so it flowed easier.

started the car, shifted through gears, and let running for about 15 minutes. Pulled the plug again and drained until it was a slow stream then plugged back up.

Running perfectly after a couple hundred miles. I don't think I'll change that fluid for another 50K or so miles.

Couple of additional notes: when I pulled the plug, maybe a 1/2 liter of fluid came out before the snorkel was removed. I guess the factory had put extra in it. when I drained it after running with new fluid, about a 1/2 liter fluid came out, so about 4.5L is all you need, but it makes sense to overfill and let it drain the excess. Lastly, make sure you have it on level ground, and elevate it level when you drain/fill it.

I also did the fuel filter. Like I read on here, if you completely empty the fuel filter compartment and clean it out, it will take some cranking to start because it has to fill the filter compartment. But after a minute or two of cranking, it fired right up. I found very few small pieces of dirt. In general, I was very impressed with how clean the fluids/filters were. This is coming from someone though, who is used to draining gray differential fluid from a jeep because he drove it too deep in a mud hole. :)
 

tdiatlast

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Jan 21, 2009
Location
Fort Worth, Texas
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2009 Sportwagen (boughtback); 2014 Passat TDI SEL (boughtback)
Off-topic, but...dellaware: sounds like you didn't refill the FF canister with clean diesel before installing the FF. Is that so? When I've refilled the canister, car starts completely normal, zero delay or extra cranking.
Next time, probably best to fill the canister. (This has been discussed extensively, not trying to re-open the discussion!)
 

GD

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Toronto
TDI
2011 Jetta TDI Highline DSG
I did the service this last Saturday and first of all, it's pretty easy.

Took out the battery and airbox, then accessed the DSG filter, then climbed underneath and removed the dirt shield/air flow cover, then pulled plug and snorkel. Fluid looked extremely clean btw.
People mentioned it taking forever for you to fill from the top of the tranny. I had no issue; I put the bottle on the tube then put a hole with a knife in the bottom of the quart container and it drained into the tranny in about a minute each quart. Also had the oil sitting in a hot water bath while I was prepping to fill so it flowed easier.

started the car, shifted through gears, and let running for about 15 minutes. Pulled the plug again and drained until it was a slow stream then plugged back up.

Running perfectly after a couple hundred miles. I don't think I'll change that fluid for another 50K or so miles.

Couple of additional notes: when I pulled the plug, maybe a 1/2 liter of fluid came out before the snorkel was removed. I guess the factory had put extra in it. when I drained it after running with new fluid, about a 1/2 liter fluid came out, so about 4.5L is all you need, but it makes sense to overfill and let it drain the excess. Lastly, make sure you have it on level ground, and elevate it level when you drain/fill it.

I also did the fuel filter. Like I read on here, if you completely empty the fuel filter compartment and clean it out, it will take some cranking to start because it has to fill the filter compartment. But after a minute or two of cranking, it fired right up. I found very few small pieces of dirt. In general, I was very impressed with how clean the fluids/filters were. This is coming from someone though, who is used to draining gray differential fluid from a jeep because he drove it too deep in a mud hole. :)
Is this a normal step in this process?
 

dellaware

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Delaware
TDI
2010 JSW TDI AT
Yup, I knew that this would be the case, but didn't feel like going to the station to get fuel (and have to purchase a new container to prevent gas contamination) and also didn't feel like siphoning fuel out of the tank. I didn't see any negative impact other than possibly draining the battery if it took a long time.

Off-topic, but...dellaware: sounds like you didn't refill the FF canister with clean diesel before installing the FF. Is that so? When I've refilled the canister, car starts completely normal, zero delay or extra cranking.
Next time, probably best to fill the canister. (This has been discussed extensively, not trying to re-open the discussion!)
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
just for the record, would not recommend trying to start with the fuel filter canister empty (full of air).

you may get away with it, but with the history of HPFP issues, would not want to push air into it for too long.
 

disco biscuit

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Dec 25, 2012
Location
Texas
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI DSG
IMPORTANT info...

The vaico filter kit has a undersized o-ring for the filter cap. Mine unnoticeably leaked on my pretrip inspection but when I got to Colorado after my 17hr one way trip I guess the cold amplified the leak and it gushed out on the 17 hr return trip. I noticed it when I got back. I haven't verified how much it leaked exactly...right now appears to be over a quart. After I've been back I researched more and this is a common problem with this Vaico aftermarket manufacturer.

Use VW o'rings. I did like the pentosin but found a dsg oil change kit on amazon with all OEM parts for 136$s. I'm gonna go this route this time. Also change the cooler orings while your there for piece of mind.
 

DanG144

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Aug 2, 2007
Location
Chapin, South Carolina, USA
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2005 A4 Jetta 5spd
Good to know. I have also see folks put the O-ring right up against the flange, where it pushes out a bit and leaks.

Always ensure it is in the O-ring groove about an eight of an inch (3mm) below the flange.

Where did you source your Vaico kit?
 

TonyJetta

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Sep 15, 2005
Location
Tucson, Az
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'15 Jetta TDI SE / '06 Jetta TDI DSG Pkg0 / '96 Passat TDI
Interesting! That would explain the leak I've been chasing. 2 weeks ago I changed out the vaico o-ring for an OEM o-ring. I'll check it tonight to see if it is still leaking.

Fyi...mine was leaking for ~4000 miles before I found it and topped it off. The trans was only ~500ml low.

Tony
Sent from my e-diesel fleet
 

disco biscuit

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Dec 25, 2012
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Texas
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2010 Jetta TDI DSG
I can't remember where exactly I got the vaico kit. I've been mulling over it for quite sometime. I believe it came from idparts. I know it wasn't the parts distributer fault so it really didn't matter that much to me. It is however the Vaico kit at fault. When I pulled it apart to diagnose it I removed the filter housing and you could tell the o-ring was cheap quality and hardened already after 20k mi. I also reinstalled it and found a place between the fender well and a-arm to actually see it. It continued to weep past the seal even after over tightening the housing. It is the o-ring faulty I wish someone who experienced this and threw it up here as forewarning. I don't intend this as slander or or negatively...only constructively. Again I got an OEM set for dsg oil change from amazon as cheap or cheaper than the pentosin/vaico aftermarket kit. Again I was pleased with the pentosin but for the price...Amazon...it shipped from Fowler Volkswagen. I ordered a case of Castrol Edge engine oil from Amazon about 8mths ago and it also shipped from Fowler Volkswagen and was very cheap...I had good luck with that transaction so seems like a legit vendor. Maybe a good place to source things from obviously.
I put around 20k mi on this since I changed it and didn't notice any symptoms until it got cold so hopefully it was less than 6k mi leaking.
 

disco biscuit

Well-known member
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Dec 25, 2012
Location
Texas
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI DSG
I guess I should. Like I said it was 20k mi ago and Im sure it was them but I have no proof. This was the only thing I ever bought from them also which makes think more it was them. Again they were not at all at fault. But I would like to at least peak interest on it. Just hesitant again cause I have no proof. I'm gonna do it anyhow because I know for sure the kit is faulty and potential failure for me now and future dsg owners is huge. Over 4k$ for a new dsg from what I understand.

If anyone would like to find some of my research findings. Google dsg leak and do another search vaico o-ring...failure...problems etc..
 

TonyJetta

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Joined
Sep 15, 2005
Location
Tucson, Az
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'15 Jetta TDI SE / '06 Jetta TDI DSG Pkg0 / '96 Passat TDI
I looked for evidence of the leak, last night. I did not see any. Only the same level of residue in the webbing around the filter assy.
So, it appears the Vaico o-ring is an issue.

Tony
Sent from my e-diesel fleet
 

Rod Bearing

Veteran Member
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Sep 18, 2007
Location
Fort Worth
TDI
Several
If your DSG is working perfectly and not leaking oil anywhere, it is far easier to measure the exact quantity of oil you drained and install the same quantity of new oil back in. I know this will inflame the purists but it is a fact. I have 7 TDI DSG geared Jettas and have used this process with no ill effects. The factory fill is what it is and if the damn thing is working fine, I just don't see a need to buy VAG-COM and go that route. If you have a leaky one then yes you need to do it by the book to get it filled properly. Fix the leak though.
 
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