I could care less what VW owes the government or about the state of the company when all is said and done. I also don't care that Toyota paid the EPA nothing. They took care of the customer!!! That is what matters.
VW cheated, they lied, the committed fraud and tried to cover all of it up. VW is 2nd in the world to Toyota. They are trying to get out of this for pennies on the dollar at the expense of their patient, loyal customer base.
Oh, but I am required to sell.... I have 3 options. A fix that does not exist, sell back my car to the dealer, or opt out of the entire circus. Hmmmm....
What you are not understanding is this is not about how much pizza I have eaten. It is about cars that were sold under false promises (Clean diesel), marketed to a sector of people that value clean air, excellent MPG, and longevity/reliability. This was a huge case of fraud. It is not about how much of the vehicle I used because quite honestly, I could argue that the more someone drove their TDI, the more they polluted, caused environmental damage etc etc.. This is why CARB and the EPA are involved right? This is why the DOJ is suing VW right? Pollution...Lying..... Cheating.... Misrepresentation.....fraud.....
** I don't care about VW being "solvent" when this is done. As far as I am concerned, they can shut the doors and turn off the lights. They didnt care when they made a fraudulent sale to me..
You weren't around when "threadzilla" was up and running. If you were, you might understand that people have different life scenarios. Some have young families and needed larger vehicles last year. They wanted to sell. Some transport goats in their Sportwagons. Some are perfectly happy with no buyback, no fix, and just want to keep driving their car until it dies. Some had no interest in selling before the scandal broke and now are faced with a huge dilemma. I personally have a growing family and wanted to sell at least one vehicle late last August/early September. Unfortunately this mess stopped everything. Those that NEED to move on have been held hostage by VW for 9 months now. Radio silence with virtually no communication. If YOU are ok with this then fine... I am not!
We were promised "generous compensation" both by the Judge and by Ken Feinberg. Well, my idea of generous compensation does not start with a baseline of "Clean trade in value" and BS additions and SUBTRACTIONS for mileage and options with some high dollar options not even recognized. Sorry, your mileage may vary...
First, thank you for the clarification of terms, as well as how to get the retail price from KBB. According to them, right not, my car with my mileage should retail for $18,208. That is the suggested retail price. And as of right now, the value of my potential buy back offer from VW is $26,655. The +20% number for my current retail value brings me to $22,760, and that's still almost $4000 less.
I'm perfectly okay with that number being less than the $5100 I'm "supposed" to get, because my 2015 is fixable. There is no reason VW should have to pull it off the road, they should fix it, and get it back out there, in my opinion.
Now, to address some of your points above:
First, you miss the point I'm making about Toyota not having to pay that massive fine - it is entirely possible, if VW didn't have that fine hanging over their head, that they would be able to give everyone 150% of KBB value. It's a matter of reasonability - Toyota's total payout was $100 million, from what I've read - and VW will be out at least $17 billion. That is a massive difference. If VW had the option of not paying that fine, then that money could easily be used to do the "right" thing that Toyota did, and everyone could be happy. I don't find it at all hard to believe that they do not have that kind of resource available. $100 million is a slap on the wrist to Toyota, while $17 billion could easily be the kind of hit that closes the doors of VW forever.
You say you don't care whether or not VW is solvent at the end of this. You quote back to threadzilla (while I didn't have an account, I did read much of it...I generally don't feel the need to be as involved as I have been lately, but have read this forum for quite a long time - and have had nothing but good experiences doing so). You quote to how people have all kinds of different situations and circumstances, and how they rely on their VWs. 500,000 TDIs is only a small fraction of VW owners - what happens to everyone else who is relying on the company being around, if they're suddenly not? How does the average joe with a gas VW deal with warranty if VW doesn't exist, and the car he's relying on wets the bed? Or worse yet, someone out of warranty who now needs a part that previously only VW was building? Repair and maintenance costs will go through the roof, and people everywhere will be screwed.
Promises of "generous compensation" by a federal judge and Ken Feinberg...really? You're going to hang up on that? If I promise you generous compensation from Mark McGwire, due to all the lost innocence and wonder you experienced as a kid watching him hit home runs, now that you know he was on steroids...are you going to show up at his door demanding it? It's not the place for either of them to make that kind of promise to begin with. Judges are there to deliver justice, not payoffs.
Here's an excellent question. September 15, 2015, this announcement hits. You now know that your car is putting more into the atmosphere than it should be. You're arguing nice and loud that you're owed more than you're being offered. How much of that are you going to kick back, for the extra damage to the environment? It can be argued that you didn't know for all the driving you did before 9/15/2015...but what about the driving you've done since then? You knew it was more than should be allowed, and drove anyway - you're off the hook, because VW already lied? That's just as good as every time you hear some politician or other campaigning against same sex marriage, who was caught in a public bathroom with another guy.
Your argument against being penalized for higher mileage is also absurd. By your own estimation, you should be compensated based on the higher "retail" value of your car. A value which is very much calculated with that mileage in mind. You're already being given a pass on condition - something that those of us with pristine cars are paying for - now you want a pass on mileage, too. And the full retail value. And 150% of that value, to boot. Should a VW executive have to deliver it all in unmarked cash directly to your door, too, in between sessions with a VW provided supermodel/masseuse? You heard someone (who definitely had no place using the word) say "generous", and your eyes rolled over with dollar signs just like a Bugs Bunny cartoon, and now you're pissed. We should absolutely throw out a decision which is probably perfectly fine for 75% or more of the people it affects, to cater to your delusions of grandeur.
Once again, I'm hearing how you're "required" to sell. Give me some proof. Show me the link to a single article that says the state you are in is banning TDIs from the road, and that it is absolutely unfixable. For every one of you spouting how they don't have the fix yet, unless you're a high level VW employee, you're talking out of your ass. For all any of us know, they absolutely do have the fix, for all generations of the engine, and they are currently being evaluated by EPA and CARB, but just haven't been approved yet. They have 2 (or was it 3?) years to come up with the fix - to assume it isn't going to happen (when it will cost them even more in fines than they're already being made to pay) is naive in the extreme. If the fix was impossible, there would be no column in that spreadsheet for the older engines - it would be "sorry, we have to take them off the road, here's your buyback".
Also, the "I was held hostage for 9 months" argument...seriously? If you were in such dire need of trading in your car, and you'd have taken such a hit, where was the lawsuit you filed to cover your damages? YOU opted to wait and see what the fix would be, and to participate in the class. VW wasn't there holding a gun to your head preventing you from taking the loss on what you perceived to be the value of your car. Had the scandal not happened, and you went to sell it anyway, and you were only offered 90% of what you wanted because of your high mileage, who would you be pointing the finger of blame at while shouting "PAY ME" to anyone willing to listen?
You're entitled to so much money for being lied to, absolutely. Let me know once you've finished suing your parents about the stories of Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy. And then the US Government, who we know isn't lying to us. I'm not saying any of that is right, and not excusing what VW pulled, just trying to exercise a little (and apparently quite uncommon) reasonability.
