Dieselgate, The Canadian Edition

[tobianogreg]

Printed today p.a9 https://issuu.com/kamthisweek/docs/ktwn160811_a

Remember Dieselgate, about a year ago, where Volkswagen admitted to cheating on emissions in their TDI "clean diesel" cars?
As a result, resale prices tanked (assuming you can find someone to buy the vehicle,) owners faced diminished value if involved in a total loss accident and the vehicles continue to pollute in excess of legal limits.
Ever since, Volkswagen Canada assured owners that they were working to make things right.
VW diesel owners in the US are well on their way to achieving a settlement with a preliminarily court-approved plan which includes a variety of choices for TDI consumers, including buy-backs of offending vehicles.
Apparently the federal government is still investigating VW but, at this point, no charges have been laid in one of the largest consumer fraud cases in Canadian history. So far, VW faces no fines here unlike in the US where the company must pay upwards of $15 billion to make things right.
Canadian VW TDI diesel owners don't know anything further about VW Canada's plans to "make things right" and probably won't anytime soon.
#donewithvw

 

[Lister]

"Investigators found the cars actually released toxins such as nitrogen oxide at levels more than 40 times higher than current regulations in the United States allow".

Such as nitrogen oxide? Isn't that the only one?
They make it sound like these things are spewing out huge clouds of all kinds of toxic waste.

This is all for show for a mass audience of people that do not know any better. I don't care about the pollution, I care about my value of my car, which has taken a huge hit in regards to resale value because of this. I used to live in Chilliwack, and would use my car as a vehicle for work(sales) and it was great for that. But since we moved in closer to Vancouver, I do not need it anymore, and would like to have picked up a gasser model of something else, but I cannot do that now because of this bloody mess. I do not like being held hostage like this.

 

[TouaregGuy]

I love my TDI, but I am ready to replace my 2009 Touareg, out of extended warranty, and now I am stuck waiting for VW Canada and the courts to do something, or say something. What I buy will depend on what VWC does for me, I would like to get the fair value of my TDI from before the dieselgate started, plus some incentive to buy a new VW, may be 0% financing, and past owners credit program.

 

[FVWVWF]

...past owners credit program.

What is that?

 

[volks27]

Re: stickers: I was debating getting a sticker made: Fort NOX

 

[tobianogreg]

Jameson Berkow (@crudereporter)
2016-08-11, 9:34 AM
Canadian government just told @BNN it is "not involved in any negotiations related to a settlement" between @VWcanada and its customers.

 

[GigaFire]

Jameson Berkow (@crudereporter)
2016-08-11, 9:34 AM
Canadian government just told @BNN it is "not involved in any negotiations related to a settlement" between @VWcanada and its customers.

So the Cleveland Browns will win a Super Bowl before we see anything because there's no government pressure?

 

[Lister]

So the Cleveland Browns will win a Super Bowl before we see anything because there's no government pressure?

This explains why VW hasn't "mirrored" the US offer right away. They are going to screw us guys. This clearly falls under the "bait and Switch" scenario, and as consumers, are we not protected by this? Maybe someone who has some legal experience on here can comment.

 

[Bahamut]

Jameson Berkow (@crudereporter)
2016-08-11, 9:34 AM
Canadian government just told @BNN it is "not involved in any negotiations related to a settlement" between @VWcanada and its customers.

And what you now hear is the collective shiver from 100,000 Canadian owners who have been left out in the cold!

 

[tobianogreg]

Well, soon we should be able to access tons of used parts.

 

[Rembrant]

There are no facts, only conjecture. Buying a CR TDI is a gamble right now, but I think it could be a very nice option. I'm sure values are in the tank right now so you could get, what has been for me, a fabulous car at a bargain basement price. If there is ZERO restitution for Canadians you still have a great car that you bought for a low price, if there is a US style program you benefit by either getting to sell the car back to VW for more than you paid for it or you get 6K+ cash to have it modified. If the modification sucks spend some of the 6+ at a tuner shop to have it made better than before!

Good points. I may go look at it next week, as there's also an '06 TDI in the same area I wanted to have a look at. I thought for 8 grand, a 2011 TDI might be worth the gamble, but we'll see. I don't need a new car, but I've been watching what comes up used in case any deals show up. Between the two TDI's I have now, they'd last me quite a while even at the 50,000 kms I'm doing per year.

Anyway, I'll stay subscribed so I know what's going on here, just in case. Thanks guys.

 

[Scratchy101]

"Investigators found the cars actually released toxins such as nitrogen oxide at levels more than 40 times higher than current regulations in the United States allow".

Such as nitrogen oxide? Isn't that the only one?
They make it sound like these things are spewing out huge clouds of all kinds of toxic waste.

NOx = Nitrogen Oxygen1or2
So basically Any one of several oxides of Nitrogen.
They are proven to be carcinogens.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx

NOx is a generic term for the mono-nitrogen oxides NO and NO2 (nitric oxide and nitrogen dioxide).[1][2] They are produced from the reaction among nitrogen, oxygen and even hydrocarbons (during combustion), especially at high temperatures.[1][2][3] In areas of high motor vehicle traffic, such as in large cities, the amount of nitrogen oxides emitted into the atmosphere as air pollution can be significant. NOx gases are formed whenever combustion occurs in the presence of nitrogen – as in an air-breathing engine; they also are produced naturally by lightning. In atmospheric chemistry, the term means the total concentration of NO and NO2. NOx gases react to form smog and acid rain as well as being central to the formation of tropospheric ozone.
NOx should not be confused with nitrous oxide (N2O),[1] which is a greenhouse gas and has many uses as an oxidizer, an anesthetic, and a food additive.

 

[Ursadorable]

More sad times to start your weekend..

http://www.bnn.ca/canadian-law-prevents-ottawa-from-making-vw-pay-for-rigging-emissions-1.545032

 

[Ptplayers]

More sad times to start your weekend..

http://www.bnn.ca/canadian-law-prevents-ottawa-from-making-vw-pay-for-rigging-emissions-1.545032

Would like to know who voted yes on the poll?

 

[tobianogreg]

What changed?

The article and in particular the headline are misleading. Pretty poor journalism IMO.

 

[Lucsar]

Just when you thought there might be a silver lining to this dark cloud that's been hanging over us for the last 10 months; the Canadian government is probably going to sell us out, as they usually do. Is it just me or why is it that a consumer has to be raked over the coals and tossed to the curb whenever he or she has been done wrong by large corporations ?? Why the hell would this Tetzleff person(not sure on spelling) but he's the canadian CEO of VW Canada,state that a settlement in Canada would mirror the one in the U.S. ?
and now this news report states that Ottawa doesn't even have the means to force VW to compensate owners like they're doing in the U.S. ?

 

[tobianogreg]

Thing is, if do nothing was an option for the government then they should have grandfathered them all right away. Instead they allowed the resale market to tank, holding a number of owners hostage in the process.

Oh yeah, there was an election in this time frame. Silly me.

I guess the question now is, can VW Canada afford to lose 107,000 TDI customers?

 

[NSTDI]

Sales and reputation are what will drive our settlement.

Last September, VW sales dropped- TORONTO • Canadian Volkswagen sales fell off a cliff in September, plunging 19.6 per cent even though the company’s emissions-rigging scandal didn’t come to light until the latter half of the month. This was after being up 8% YTD.

So VW sells how many cars per year in Canada? The reports say there are 100,000 of us affected by this cheat, screw us all and see where sales go?

 

[Bahamut]

Would like to know who voted yes on the poll?

I would definitely like to know who voted yes. They must be on some powerful medication!

 

[Bahamut]

Just when you thought there might be a silver lining to this dark cloud that's been hanging over us for the last 10 months; the Canadian government is probably going to sell us out, as they usually do. Is it just me or why is it that a consumer has to be raked over the coals and tossed to the curb whenever he or she has been done wrong by large corporations ?? Why the hell would this Tetzleff person(not sure on spelling) but he's the canadian CEO of VW Canada,state that a settlement in Canada would mirror the one in the U.S. ?
and now this news report states that Ottawa doesn't even have the means to force VW to compensate owners like they're doing in the U.S. ?

I'm not 100% sure, but I believe that Tetzlaff is the official VW spokesperson in Canada: Maria Stenstroem is the president of VW Canada.

I'm starting to think that the lack of ability of the Canadian government to impose fines relating to environmental damages (as has been mentioned in other posts) may be one of the reasons that VW changed their tone from "the settlement will be mirrored" to "we hope follow a similar settlement". If there are no environmental penalties, that alone would significantly alter the agreement.

I have just had my morning coffee and am feeling optimistic so take this with a grain of salt .

 

[Bahamut]

Thing is, if do nothing was an option for the government then they should have grandfathered them all right away. Instead they allowed the resale market to tank, holding a number of owners hostage in the process.

Oh yeah, there was an election in this time frame. Silly me.

I guess the question now is, can VW Canada afford to lose 107,000 TDI customers?

Better question: do they really care about losing 107,000 TDI customers? When we look at the overall world market, the Canadian portion is probably peanuts to them. Technically, they probably could just leave Canada altogether and not really notice a difference. Not saying they would do this, but everything they have done lately, and the poor communications coming from VW Canada, certainly implies a certain lack of caring.

 

[1sTDI]

They DO NOT care about losing us as customers. It's pretty clear. Anyone here surprised about that? They are in the business of making money. End of story.

 

[joey003]

Better question: do they really care about losing 107,000 TDI customers? When we look at the overall world market, the Canadian portion is probably peanuts to them. Technically, they probably could just leave Canada altogether and not really notice a difference. Not saying they would do this, but everything they have done lately, and the poor communications coming from VW Canada, certainly implies a certain lack of caring.

They DO NOT care about losing us as customers. It's pretty clear. Anyone here surprised about that? They are in the business of making money. End of story.

Yeah, agreed. At this point they're just trying to minimize their losses. Canada is likely a tiny market for them. Still terrible that they can get away with it, but I guess not overly surprising if they try to go that route.

 

[NSTDI]

I know what they sell in Canada is a drop in the bucket, but they do need to beware of their reputation, and I can't see them walking away. 107,000 TDI customers is one thing, but they have to restore their customers trust or worldwide sales will slowly decline and they will be in such bad shape, Fiat or GM will buy them.

There is a growing trend to buy environmentally friendly products and VW is now on the bottom of that list. To move up, they have to restore their name for making a quality product and move away from being a "cheater".

 

[BigWorm]

Tetzlaugh strategically made that statement "Rest assured the CANADIAN settlement would mirror the US settlement" to ward off the canadian government from taking action. The Canadian government figured they don't have to waste money court proceedings because VW would handle it. Then the July 29th date came and the settlement was reached leaving Canadian's in the dark with no further information. Then they put a gag order on the class action law suite? So VW can pay off the lawyers to make this go away. Seems like the only people that will benefit from this is VW and the Lawyers.

I'll drive my passat into the ground and it will be a lesson learned not to buy from VW ever again. But If they think they can mess with the engine/fix without compensation or buyback they can SMD I'll put it through the VW dealerships that I bought it at's window before that happen....

Yes im beating that same drum to that "Happy Person" that works for VW that's been riding my nuts.

 

[questman]

VW Canadian sales probably in the neighbourhood of 3.5 billion Euros (based on North American sales of 35 billion Euros), compared to revenue in Europe of 133 billion Euros. Certainly we may not be a big deal to VW worldwide, however, I believe at one point they were looking to sell 800,000 units in North America. With the U.S. receiving a decent deal one would think Canada would also get something reasonable, or at the very least, sloppy seconds.
Does this link work?; http://www.statista.com/statistics/260805/revenue-of-volkswagen/

 

[1sTDI]

10 million owners in Europe got nothing. Would 100k owners in CAN, getting nothing, surprise anyone?

 

[tobianogreg]

Environment Canada (@environmentca)
2016-08-12, 10:01 AM
@elle_ober VW Canada has advised that once a vehicle remedial plan is finalized in the U.S., the company will follow suit in Canada.

 

[Bahamut]

Environment Canada (@environmentca)
2016-08-12, 10:01 AM
@elle_ober VW Canada has advised that once a vehicle remedial plan is finalized in the U.S., the company will follow suit in Canada.

More lackluster action from the powers in Ottawa . I like how it sounds like "we're just waiting for VW to decide what to do". Unless I'm reading too much into this statement.

 

[tobianogreg]

I think you are (reading too much into it). I take this as good news and somewhat assuages my boundless paranoia as far as this company goes.