Dieselgate, The Canadian Edition

[FVWVWF]

FFS you're like my bloody wife, reading so much into such a simple bloody comment. I don't have to explain s#it to you. Yes, the fact that it was a "clean diesel" played into the attraction of the car. Is this why I bought the car? No, and I never said it was.... No, I didn't know what the NOx levels were. And I'm not mad specifically because of the emissions levels. I'm mad because what VW did was unethical and a blatant lie. Get over yourself. What a dick.

LOL....someones on PMS.

Obviously cant continue talking to you because you cant seem to be able to answer simple questions without feeling offended and calling me names.
Have a fantastic day kid. (and I say kid because no way you're an adult with that sh*tty attitude)

 

[Bahamut]

Wow, go away for 4-5 hours and the forum postings get ugly quick .

Lets face it guys, all of us have different opinions on what to be angry about, what to be concerned about, etc. No single person's opinion is more valid than another: we all have different viewpoints on this and all of those viewpoints should be heard.

I for one enjoy having this forum to discuss ideas. Don't let it descend into the anarchy that defined Threadzilla.

Do some people feel more upset than others over this? Yes. It is their right to be upset. It is also the right of someone to not be upset. Doesn't require namecalling: we're adults and I'm sure we all know how to get along.

Personally, I'm ticked over the lack of communication from VW, and the lack of equal treatment as compared to our U.S. neighbours. Regardless of the difference in legal systems, we are on two sides of the same border, and have the same environmental regulations (to some degree). We should see comparable compensation (even VW said awhile ago that we would, which has sinced changed, and caused people to be upset).

 

[tdegeld]

LOL....someones on PMS.
Obviously cant continue talking to you because you cant seem to be able to answer simple questions without feeling offended and calling me names.
Have a fantastic day kid. (and I say kid because no way you're an adult with that sh*tty attitude)

Or maybe I don't feel like putting up with a pretentious ahole who feels the need to judge someone else's opinion because it isn't the same as his own?

 

[Lister]

The value of the car is the result of the scandal....My post was more about the "feeling" of being lied to and cheated in regards to the emissions levels.
In other words...if your car's value wasnt affected...would you still give a flying duck about the emissions levels? Those who cared before purchasing the car might...but majority didnt care. And the reason I say that is because if someone who is out there buying a car and looking at its emissions levels...they wouldnt be looking at a TDI but a Hybrid, electric or something else. (not speaking overall green car..just strictly emissions)

NOPE! I don't like losing money in any regard, and this pissed me off.

 

[tdegeld]

Wow, go away for 4-5 hours and the forum postings get ugly quick .

Lets face it guys, all of us have different opinions on what to be angry about, what to be concerned about, etc. No single person's opinion is more valid than another: we all have different viewpoints on this and all of those viewpoints should be heard.

I for one enjoy having this forum to discuss ideas. Don't let it descend into the anarchy that defined Threadzilla.

Do some people feel more upset than others over this? Yes. It is their right to be upset. It is also the right of someone to not be upset. Doesn't require namecalling: we're adults and I'm sure we all know how to get along.

Personally, I'm ticked over the lack of communication from VW, and the lack of equal treatment as compared to our U.S. neighbours. Regardless of the difference in legal systems, we are on two sides of the same border, and have the same environmental regulations (to some degree). We should see comparable compensation (even VW said awhile ago that we would, which has sinced changed, and caused people to be upset).

And that's all I'm here for as well. Sharing information and discussing the situation. Someone asked some questions, I gave honest answers. Then I get jumped on because I must be a moron if emissions played into my decision to buy and because I didn't know the exact emissions levels. Come on.

 

[Bahamut]

And that's all I'm here for as well. Sharing information and discussing the situation. Someone asked some questions, I gave honest answers. Then I get jumped on because I must be a moron if emissions played into my decision to buy and because I didn't know the exact emissions levels. Come on.

On some minor level the emissions bother a lot of drivers.

I can only speak for myself on this, but I think about it. I certainly didn't buy the car for its emissions: I bought the car because it was fun to drive, got great fuel economy, and was reasonably comfortable. It still is all of those things.

It has also lost resale value, which means I'm in constant risk of being upside down in the event of a write-off (due to an existing loan on the vehicle), which is a risk I would not have had otherwise. Would some people say I'm "butt-hurt"? Yes. I don't like being lied to. I don't like being sold a vehicle that should not have been sold here because it didn't meet emission requirements. I don't like the complete lack of respect that VW has shown Canadian customers, and that irritates me too.

If anyone wants to call me out on that, so be it: I will happily debate the points intelligently with anyone who would like to.

 

[Baba O'Riley]

Why do people want out of their vehicles so badly anyway?
Bought car Apr 2012. Keep cars 4 years, around 160,000km, then get new. This one`s value has plummeted due to VW cheat. Waiting for compensation. Well pissed now!
Do you not like the car?
Really enjoyed driving the Golf. Enough power and amazing economy. See Fuelly below.
Are you genuinely concerned about the small amount of extra pollution?
No, not at all, to be honest.
Are you worried about how the "fix" might affect performance?
Not interested in fix. Moving on. Possibly VW at one point in thinking, but no more.
Do you have a big loan that you've grown weary of paying and you want an easy way out?
No, always pay cash.
Would you be happy if the Canadian negotiations resulted in VW paying a fine to the government, NOT modifying the cars, and allowing owners to just carry on driving their cars as if nothing happened?
No. Why should their cheat that depreciated my car over and above normal cost my pocket?

Done with VW. They had their opportunity last Friday and decided to screw us.

 

[Lister]

The value of the car is the result of the scandal....My post was more about the "feeling" of being lied to and cheated in regards to the emissions levels.
In other words...if your car's value wasnt affected...would you still give a flying duck about the emissions levels? Those who cared before purchasing the car might...but majority didnt care. And the reason I say that is because if someone who is out there buying a car and looking at its emissions levels...they wouldnt be looking at a TDI but a Hybrid, electric or something else. (not speaking overall green car..just strictly emissions)

So whats your deal in all of this? Are you still a VW fanboy, or are you grabbing your torch and pitchfork too?

 

[Rob_MacCara]

I knew when I bought my car that the "Clean" in diesel really referred to the quality of our fuel compared to the diesel of old - at least that's what I thought it meant. Didn't make any difference to me anyway. I wanted a nice car (Highline), TDI, good performance and held comparatively good resale value.
The only part where I've been failed now is the diminished resale value. Car has better performance than new (Malone stage 2 plus DSG tune) and better fuel economy, so I'm happy there. Interior (and exterior) are still in great shape and I'd be just as happy keeping the car for the long haul - although it would only be fair to receive some token compensation to keep us at least within 75% of our southern neighbors basic financial settlement.
If we don't get anything (and I'm not holding my breath), then life just goes on.

 

[FVWVWF]

So whats your deal in all of this? Are you still a VW fanboy, or are you grabbing your torch and pitchfork too?

Im pissed at the cars value.
Not a fanboy but most likely getting another VW (GTI) because I do like these cars. Either that or an Audi, depending how much Im left with after they buy it from me.
The way I look at this...is that I can be pissed at VW all I want...the other guy isnt any better. These corporations screw you one way or another, be it the ignition, the tires, the airbags...it doesnt matter. You take money from one ahole...you give it to another. Makes the world go round.

 

[Lister]

Im pissed at the cars value.
Not a fanboy but most likely getting another VW (GTI) because I do like these cars. Either that or an Audi, depending how much Im left with after they buy it from me.
The way I look at this...is that I can be pissed at VW all I want...the other guy isnt any better. These corporations screw you one way or another, be it the ignition, the tires, the airbags...it doesnt matter. You take money from one ahole...you give it to another. Makes the world go round.

I'm in the same boat. My wife has the 2013 Zed 4 as my summer driver, but I am looking at an Audi a3 for my fall/Winter car. I would like to get away from VW but I like the A3 too much.

 

[FVWVWF]

I'm in the same boat. My wife has the 2013 Zed 4 as my summer driver, but I am looking at an Audi a3 for my fall/Winter car. I would like to get away from VW but I like the A3 too much.

A beemer (328 or 335) is my 3rd choice. I guess in short...being from Europe..I like European cars. These Mercedes, the ones I want are out of my price range. So what am I left with? VW, BMW, Audi....(dont even think Fiat is European anymore) I really wish there were more options such as Renault or Skoda...

 

[CanuckRS]

I didn't buy my TDI based on it being a green or clean vehicle, although it was a nice perk I guess. I bought it because it's fun to drive, fits all my work gear, gets great milage, lasts forever and has fantastic resale value. We paid a premium to get the TDI engine in the first place, because of all of these things.

Has the car shrunk or gotten slower since the news broke last September? Of course not. Is it any less efficient? Nope. Any less fun to drive? Nope. No one is claiming it is.

Here's my issues:
-Resale value has dropped through the floor.
-Any potential fix will absolutely reduce performance, efficiency and reliability.

We paid for these vehicles based on performance, efficiency, durability, and resale value, all of which will be will be negatively impacted because of this scandal.

 

[Steve Ferrous]

Bahamut, I'm calling you out: your CBR650F pollutes more than my VFR800.
Someone else said it well that they were already spending their buyback cash on a new vehicle. I'll be the treasurer of that club!
I did the math, went and looked at a GLC - no diesels yet, an X3 cd (new model coming 2017) a 4k TV and and and .....
So yeah, I kind of feel like some one took my allowance away.
However, we're off to Goderich this weekend; I have about 1/2 tank, but I will be able to go there and back on that, and I LOVE that damn Passat!

 

[dwfdiesel]

fraud
frôd/
noun
noun: fraud; plural noun: frauds
wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
"he was convicted of fraud"
synonyms:fraudulence, cheating, swindling, embezzlement, deceit, deception, double-dealing, chicanery, sharp practice; Morepharming
"he was arrested for fraud"



swindle, racket, deception, trick, cheat, hoax;
informalscam, con, rip-off, sting, gyp, fiddle, bunco, hustle, grift
"social insurance frauds"





a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
"mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds"
synonyms:impostor, fake, sham, charlatan, quack, mountebank;VW

 

[dwfdiesel]

Canadian Criminal Law/Offences/Fraud


Fraud
380. (1) Every one who, by deceit, falsehood or other fraudulent means, whether or not it is a false pretence within the meaning of this Act, defrauds the public or any person, whether ascertained or not, of any property, money or valuable security or any service,
(a) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to a term of imprisonment not exceeding fourteen years, where the subject-matter of the offence is a testamentary instrument or the value of the subject-matter of the offence exceeds five thousand dollars; or(b) is guilty (i) of an indictable offence and is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years, or(ii) of an offence punishable on summary conviction,
where the value of the subject-matter of the offence does not exceed five thousand dollars.
...
R.S., 1985, c. C-46, s. 380; R.S., 1985, c. 27 (1st Supp.), s. 54; 1994, c. 44, s. 25; 1997, c. 18, s. 26; 2004, c. 3, s. 2; 2011, c. 6, s. 2.

 

[dwfdiesel]

Victims of crime tend to get pissed off

 

[nozel]

I want a fix that won't cost me extra each month in higher fuel costs.
Higher consumption = higher cost.
VW have invested a lot to bring the gen 3 closer to published limits.
Technology for gen 1 clearly didn't work out as planned on paper so VW, self forced itself to upgrade said technology to gen3 specs, (2017 limits for noX are tighter yet) so if I wanted to stay in diesel, VW could just slide me a 2016 Sportwagen TDI...straight across.
I would also take a fix that put the 2016 power train package including emissions after treatment in my 2013 TDI wagon (with USA style keep -me-bonus).
We all would be foolish to accept anything less based on gen1 or gen2 , as I don't think VW would be foolish enough to so in the first place.

There is a lot of activity behind the scenes going on to resolve this issue.
No need for any of us to wear twisted knickers over it!
I have worries and trust issues wrt gen1 based technology and have my doubts a fix is feasible , So much so, that I would be happy to take a 2016 TSI Sportwagen if my wish for gen3 swap-in fix is a non starter

I have to wait , either way.

 

[Bahamut]

Bahamut, I'm calling you out: your CBR650F pollutes more than my VFR800.
Someone else said it well that they were already spending their buyback cash on a new vehicle. I'll be the treasurer of that club!
I did the math, went and looked at a GLC - no diesels yet, an X3 cd (new model coming 2017) a 4k TV and and and .....
So yeah, I kind of feel like some one took my allowance away.
However, we're off to Goderich this weekend; I have about 1/2 tank, but I will be able to go there and back on that, and I LOVE that damn Passat!

Bahahahaha! My CBR650F can pollute all it wants: 401 highway speeds in 2nd gear . My GS500F probably pollutes more than your VFR800. It also does its own oil changes due to a slow but persistent leak from the crankcase (somewhere on the left side below the stator cover).

My Passat reminded me today why I like driving it: 4.9l/100km over 75kms (including city driving), A/C on. Projected range on the tank right now is 1305 km.

 

[nozel]

Bahahahaha! My CBR650F can pollute all it wants: 401 highway speeds in 2nd gear . My GS500F probably pollutes more than your VFR800. It also does its own oil changes due to a slow but persistent leak from the crankcase (somewhere on the left side below the stator cover).

My Passat reminded me today why I like driving it: 4.9l/100km over 75kms (including city driving), A/C on. Projected range on the tank right now is 1305 km.

Ya caught that one between ALL emissions regeneration cycles...

 

[Bahamut]

A beemer (328 or 335) is my 3rd choice. I guess in short...being from Europe..I like European cars. These Mercedes, the ones I want are out of my price range. So what am I left with? VW, BMW, Audi....(dont even think Fiat is European anymore) I really wish there were more options such as Renault or Skoda...

Fiat really isn't European anymore...you're right...more of a cross-continental quality control nightmare right now with the 9spd auto issues and build quality issues.

I do like the 500 Abarth though.

 

[Bahamut]

Ya caught that one between ALL emissions revenue cycles...

I lucked out a while ago on the way into work (eastbound in the morning I always get better mileage): same trip was about 4.3l/100km one day!

 

[CanuckRS]

My 2014 Sportwagen 6mt won't seem to get below 5.6L/100km. I guess the DSG actually helps the milage quite a bit.

 

[Ptplayers]

My 2014 Sportwagen 6mt won't seem to get below 5.6L/100km. I guess the DSG actually helps the milage quite a bit.

I have a friend with same car and dsg and he gets about the same as you and is pissed when i tell him i have seen 3.9 om my 6m passat .

 

[node_one]

So I've been driving on tires that have been approaching bald for this year as I wait to see what happens. Get to work today to discover that one of the tires is flat. Go to get it plugged and it turns out I'd driven enough on it that I needed to get it replaced. Luckily it was a $30 used tire that had about as much wear as the other three.

This waiting is getting annoying. VW really needs to say something.

And speaking of saying something (and this may have been posted - been away from the thread for a couple of weeks as the situation has me annoyed):

https://www.strosbergco.com/class-actions/vw/whats-new.56eab6b305eac.htm

1. All of the United States’ class actions against Volkswagen, Audi and Porsche, concerning the installation of the so-called “defeat device”, in the diesel motor vehicles have been consolidated in the Northern District of California before Judge Charles R. Breyer.
2. On July 26, 2016, Judge Breyer gave the US Consumer Settlement Agreement for US 2-liter diesel vehicles preliminary approval.
3. On July 29, 2016, Class Counsel and the Volkswagen and Audi lawyers (“Defendants’ Lawyers”) reported to Justice Belobaba of the Ontario Superior Court of Justice on the status of settlement discussions.
4. Class Counsel and the Defendants’ Lawyers are continuing to negotiate, aiming to settle the class actions in Canada concerning the diesel Volkswagen, Audi and Porsche diesel motor vehicles. We are not able to report to you about the particulars of the settlement discussions.
5. On October 18, 2016, Class Counsel and the Defendants’ Lawyers are scheduled to appear before Justice Belobaba to report to him. If a settlement has been reached, Justice Belobaba will give directions for a settlement approval motion to be heard on December 19 and 20, 2016.
6. If on October 18, 2016 a settlement has not been reached, Justice Belobaba will direct that the certification motion be heard on December 19 and 20, 2016.

Look's like we have to wait until Christmas to maybe hear something. (again, sorry if this is has been posted - trying to read 30 pages of forum to catch up)

 

[nozel]

I have a friend with same car and dsg and he gets about the same as you and is pissed when i tell him i have seen 3.9 om my 6m passat .

A 2013 or 2014 Passat use a different exhaust after treatment system. While a 2014 Golf uses the same engine, the after treatment in the Golf is LESS efficient by using fuel to burn the noX.
The Passat uses urea injection to treat those noX.
Can't compare fuel efficiency fairly because of this difference.

 

[b1jackson]

I knew when I bought my car that the "Clean" in diesel really referred to the quality of our fuel compared to the diesel of old - at least that's what I thought it meant. Didn't make any difference to me anyway. I wanted a nice car (Highline), TDI, good performance and held comparatively good resale value.
The only part where I've been failed now is the diminished resale value. Car has better performance than new (Malone stage 2 plus DSG tune) and better fuel economy, so I'm happy there. Interior (and exterior) are still in great shape and I'd be just as happy keeping the car for the long haul - although it would only be fair to receive some token compensation to keep us at least within 75% of our southern neighbors basic financial settlement.
If we don't get anything (and I'm not holding my breath), then life just goes on.

I'm about the same as Rob. The Golf was our first new car purchase ever. Always had second hand before that. Still love it's performance and fuel economy. Just hopeful that in the end, you are not turned away with ridiculous offers if you want to try another brand. If in the fall I want to try a Mazda, I shouldn't get half assed trade offers based on VW's lies.

 

[Rollout-G]

I'm 18000km away from Timing Belt replacement. Gonna get to the 180,000km mark in December-January.

NOT. GOOD. TIMING. (no pun intended)

 

[tobianogreg]

Letter to editor local newspaper

Remember Dieselgate, about a year ago, where Volkswagen admitted to cheating on emissions in their TDI "clean diesel" cars?

As a result, resale prices tanked (assuming you can find someone to buy the vehicle,) owners faced diminished value if involved in a total loss accident and the vehicles continue to pollute in excess of legal limits.

Ever since, Volkswagen Canada assured owners that they were working to make things right.

VW diesel owners in the US are well on their way to achieving a settlement with a preliminarily court-approved plan which includes a variety of choices for TDI consumers, including buy-backs of offending vehicles.

Apparently the federal government is still investigating VW but, at this point, no charges have been laid in one of the largest consumer fraud cases in Canadian history. So far, VW faces no fines here unlike in the US where the company must pay upwards of $15 billion to make things right.

Canadian VW TDI diesel owners don't know anything further about VW Canada's plans to "make things right" and probably won't anytime soon.

#donewithvw

 

[Bahamut]

Remember Dieselgate, about a year ago, where Volkswagen admitted to cheating on emissions in their TDI "clean diesel" cars?

As a result, resale prices tanked (assuming you can find someone to buy the vehicle,) owners faced diminished value if involved in a total loss accident and the vehicles continue to pollute in excess of legal limits.

Ever since, Volkswagen Canada assured owners that they were working to make things right.

VW diesel owners in the US are well on their way to achieving a settlement with a preliminarily court-approved plan which includes a variety of choices for TDI consumers, including buy-backs of offending vehicles.

Apparently the federal government is still investigating VW but, at this point, no charges have been laid in one of the largest consumer fraud cases in Canadian history. So far, VW faces no fines here unlike in the US where the company must pay upwards of $15 billion to make things right.

Canadian VW TDI diesel owners don't know anything further about VW Canada's plans to "make things right" and probably won't anytime soon.

#donewithvw

Well-said!