Crazy Diff Play

[RKDiesel220]

Hey everyone, I believe this is my first post on TDIClub but I did not think the content constituted it to be put into the Tech 101 area.

My 2005 Golf TDI currently has a 5 speed in it. I use it for daily driving and I also have a 5x8 trailer I pull with it. I bought the car a few months ago for a very good price, know I would probably have to come to make the choice I am about to explain. I have been noticing transmission fluid on the ground when I leave places, and the trans became louder than normal. Naturally I get under the car and begin investigation. I find the trans fluid is very low and I can tell it is coming from the drive flange seals (they are the only things that aren't covered in old oil). I proceed with inspection and come to find that I can move the diff up and down about 1/8" and left to right about the same. The weird thing is, the car only has 125K on it and it was a one owner car, she was an old lady so didn't dog it. Enough lead-in, I suppose I have a few options and maybe some that y'all can bring up that I don't mention.

I have seen threads about this "Ryan" fellow in the Uk who will ship an 02M 6-speed for 1200 pounds. (Are they truly plug and play swaps? Obviously I would like to have a 6-speed.)
I can purchase a send trans and rebuild it (probably total of $600-1000 depending on condition)
Or I can do the scrap yard boogie and rip one out of a car and hope it works.

Thoughts???

 

[Ol'Rattler]

How can you tell if you have to much play in your diff without dismantling the transaxle? Play at the axle flanges has nothing to do with wear on the diff.

 

[A5INKY]

Very strange and uncommon issue for sure. I have a hard time believing that happened all on it's own. Probably had some help from some sub-par "service" work at some point in the past. The 02J 5-speed in that car is a fairly tough transaxle in a stock up to moderately modded car.

More common (but still not very) diff related issues are either having the roll pin fall out that retains the diff cross shaft or loosening of the ring gear to diff rivets. Both are very rare at that low of mileage and late of build and would not manifest as simple diff bearing play. Those failures tend to self machine a hole in the case.

A solid used trans should not be too costly and likely less than having yours rebuilt. Buy from someone reputable and it should be fine.

How can you tell if you have to much play in your diff without dismantling the transaxle? Play at the axle flanges has nothing to do with wear on the diff.

Not so much. The axle flanges engage directly into and bolt solidly to the spider gears in the diff and are quite solidly attached. If they are moving as described the diff is most likely way too sloppy in the bearings for whatever failure/reason.

 

[GTiTDi]

NO, not that uncommon to see. I had a client bring in a Golf to have some work done by another "guru" corrected...such as a turbo that would not spool that was blamed on the tune but was due to massive exhaust leak before the turbine..and other comically simple stuff...anyways He wanted a clutch but upon inspection before disassembly I found the differential to have excessive play by moving the drive flanges,as there was evidence of heavy fluid loss as well. Needless to say he ended up with a used transaxle as well (tight budget, aka never work on an accountant's car)

 

[jprine]

Happened to me on my 03 around 200k, its why I have a 6 speed now. Diff bearings give out :/ I read it happens allot more from things like wheel hop if you are rough on it and spin the wheels allot. Still haven't pulled my 5 speed apart to fix & sell.

Surprised it happened with so low miles and a old lady driver though, bearing probably had a defect.

If your considering the 6 speed its worth it. If you drive on the highway allot the engine is half as loud, people have comment on how mine rides like a luxury car on the highway now. Also Feels beefier, when I spin the tires it doesn't hop anymore, and the stock clutch holds allot more. My stock 5sp clutch felt fine but after removal it was down to the rivets.

 

[Kevinski4]

Very strange and uncommon issue for sure. I have a hard time believing that happened all on it's own. Probably had some help from some sub-par "service" work at some point in the past. The 02J 5-speed in that car is a fairly tough transaxle in a stock up to moderately modded car.

More common (but still not very) diff related issues are either having the roll pin fall out that retains the diff cross shaft or loosening of the ring gear to diff rivets. Both are very rare at that low of mileage and late of build and would not manifest as simple diff bearing play. Those failures tend to self machine a hole in the case.

A solid used trans should not be too costly and likely less than having yours rebuilt. Buy from someone reputable and it should be fine.



Not so much. The axle flanges engage directly into and bolt solidly to the spider gears in the diff and are quite solidly attached. If they are moving as described the diff is most likely way too sloppy in the bearings for whatever failure/reason.

I've seen 3 with bad diff bearings in the past couple years. All were 2005 BEWs with under 150k on them. One of which was serviced by me since new. Maybe VW had a batch of lower quality bearings or some noob setting preload...

 

[jprine]

Are they truly plug and play swaps?

It was a little more work not bad.
Swap the shift cables - stock exhaust was nice to work with even though i am in the rust belt.
Swap the axles - EZ
5 speed clutch line had to be bent slightly and had to make a little strap.
6 Speed has a different power steering hard line / bracket. I carefully bent my 5 speed hard line and made a simple bracket to replace what it used to have. Everything else was not more work really.

The only things i replaced that it didn't come with was a new release bearing/slave cylinder and I changed the seals on the trans. Just wanted to be safe and not have to mess with it again.

 

[RKDiesel220]

jprine, thanks for the info. I am still exploring my options but that helps in the consideration. I am assuming they are junkyard pull-outs if you replaced the seals before you put it in??

I am not generally rough on it. I had an '03 Golf ALH 5-Speed and I regularly pulled my 5'x8' trailer and there was zero issues with the trans on that car. Very interesting to know that is a Golf thing...kind of peculiar.

I will keep y'all posted on what happens with the Golf. Thanks for the help!

 

[SilverGhost]

Had that happen to my 2005 BEW with less than 55k miles. Making some noise that shop foreman said was just the roads. Finally got bad enough to start leaking badly and I could move the axle flanges up and down more than 1/2 inch. Replaced the differential bearings and seals then drove it another 100K + miles.

Jason

 

[Whitbread]

I've rebuilt at least 6 or 8 transmissions with blown diff bearings. It's more common than you would think. If the play gets too bad, it will take out the ring and pinion as well from the mesh being so far off. At that point, a rebuild is not cost effective.

 

[A5INKY]

Interesting. Still not sure if call this common even with the few failures reported. Must be some odd coincidence that in all the 02Js I've had in and out replacing clutches etc. I've not ran into failed diff bearings all alone.

 

[epracmetcon]

I just purchased an 05 mk5 that had excessive diff play. When I drained the fluid in it, there was almost no fluid. It had a leaking axle seal. I believe it damaged the bearings causing play. I have yet to dismantle the trans, as I just replaced it with a used one. But it is entirely possibly to grab the flanges and move them. There should be almost no movement.