Crank to Start Time, alh vs bew

Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Stafford Virginia 22556
TDI
96 glx variant tdi
I have two new to me bew nb's and are the only two bew's I've owned. Both have identical issues where upon first cranking the engine to when they start, the engine seems to turn over a few times before it starts, where every alh I've seen they start at the first revolution. Is this normal ? Both have charged batteries, clean cable connections, blah blah blah. Thanks.
 

The Cream Dolphin

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2021
Location
Fernie, B.C. originally Dwight, ON
TDI
02 VW Golf TDI ALH 245k
My brothers bew you can hear 3 rotations and it fires on the 4th every single time, no matter what. My alh will sometimes start faster, sometimes start slower, but his is never changing. It is not slow by any means, still less than a second, but you hear it turn first.
 

burpod

teh stallionz!!1
Joined
Nov 27, 2004
Location
cape cod, ma
TDI
82 rabbit vnt ahu, 98 jetta vnt ahu, 05 parts car, 88 scirocco.. :/
if everythings healthy, a BEW should start just as fast as a healthy alh - 1-2 clicks
 

CanadianALH

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2023
Location
Canada
TDI
2002 Jetta 5spd 2006 Jetta DSG (wifes)
Can you hear the in tank pump running when you turn the key?
 
Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Stafford Virginia 22556
TDI
96 glx variant tdi
Yes, pump runs and I tested it by disconnecting a fuel line. New crank position sensor, new cam, but it did it before the parts replacements. Starts just like The Cream Dolphin stated in his post. Odd.
 

burpod

teh stallionz!!1
Joined
Nov 27, 2004
Location
cape cod, ma
TDI
82 rabbit vnt ahu, 98 jetta vnt ahu, 05 parts car, 88 scirocco.. :/
when its hot, warm, cold, all the time? camshaft in good shape? injector balance good? what is the torsion value?
 

Vince Waldon

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 25, 2009
Location
Edmonton AB Canada
TDI
2001 ALH Jetta, 2003 ALH Wagon, 2005 BEW Wagon
Every ALH I've ever had was a second or so faster at starting than every BEW I've ever had.

I personally don't sweat it, and in my spare time chalk it up to the tandem pump needing to build up pressure thru the head to the injectors, vs. the VE IP being inches away from the ALH injectors. Just my drive more worry less theory. :)
 

turbocharged798

Veteran Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Location
Ellenville, NY
TDI
99.5 black ALH Jetta;09 Gasser Jetta
Clean behind the crank sensor where it meets the block and do the extra grounding TSB. BEWs are REALLY picky with the crankshaft sensor. A bit of rust can push the sensor out a little bit and that reduces generated voltage when cranking and the ECU can't get a good timing reference.
 
Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Stafford Virginia 22556
TDI
96 glx variant tdi
Extra grounding tsb ? It does have a new crank sensor, but I didn't do much cleaning on the block mating surface. I'll do that tomorrow.

After thinking about Vince's comment about fuel pressure, are there check valves in the system to maintain pressure ? If so, where, at the tank ? A simple fuel pressure gauge should show pressure bleed off, I'll plumb that in in a few hours. Thanks.
 
Last edited:

PakProtector

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Location
AnnArbor, MI
TDI
Mk.4's and the Cummins
I have a BEW with a troublesome cam position sensor plug. When it is making contact it fires quickly. And reads a +1 kw number. When it is not, it cranks longer, and shows a 0.0 kw number. The other BEW has no such issue and fires just as quickly as my ALH's.

Douglas
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
BEWs need the CMP input, so they crank a wee bit more. But by wee bit, I mean not a lot. Mine always has a 1 second crank vs. a half second crank for the ALHs. Curiously, the BHWs start instantly.

On a hot soak restart, my BEW ALWAYS has a "crank-crank-VROOM"... it starts faster when cold.
 

Vince Waldon

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 25, 2009
Location
Edmonton AB Canada
TDI
2001 ALH Jetta, 2003 ALH Wagon, 2005 BEW Wagon
Ah ha. I think the CMP input theory probably trumps my fuel delivery length theory... the BEW ECU does need to see a reasonable amount of odd teeth gaps pass the CMP hall-effect before it knows exactly where things are.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
I've always found certain differences between the three [4cyl] PDs sold here as odd. The BRMs typically have a very quick crank and start, but they use a slightly different CMP tone ring, and a completely different CKP arrangement.

But back to the quick-starting BHWs; they use the same CMP tone ring, and the same CKP sensor arrangement. Clearly something else in the setup allows for a BRM-like quick start while using the longer cranking BEW components. And the BHWs never had the TSBs involving the CMP/CKP ground stuff.
 

Boosty

Well-known member
Joined
May 20, 2024
Location
Indiana
TDI
04 Golf GL
Whoever did my bew grounded the cam to the block just after the ecm side of the connector. There's a handy bolt right on the block to ground to. Or is that factory?
 
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