Crank but no start - Sorta Resolved, but interested in further opinions

[Bookerdog]

Been a while since I posted here on the forums, but need to ask a few questions. On Sunday, I drove about 8 minutes up to the local Jimmy John's to get lunch for the family. Car was running completely fine.

When I came back out, I go to take off, and find that the car cranks, but will not start. It's turning over, but it is behaving as if there is not any fuel being delivered. There is no traditional Relay 109 problem here as all the standard lights are lighting up and going out on the dash.

So I call the wife, she comes and picks me up so they can have lunch and I won't be late for my Fantasy Football draft. After getting a killer team, I did some research here, and figured I had a few potential problems. Anti Shudder Valve and Fuel Cutoff Valve being the prime contenders for a problem.

Went back with some tools, my voltmeter, and a length of patch wire in hand. Checked the ASV. Was working, was in the right position, and the valve looks pretty clean. Then I test for voltage at the Fuel Cutoff Solenoid. DING DING, no voltage, so therefore no fuel and no start. In the parking lot, I checked the resistance of the wire from the solenoid to the first wire connector near the Oil Filter. It checks out fine.

So just to test and see if this is the true problem, I ran a jumper wire from the positive terminal on the battery to the Fuel Cutoff Solenoid. I hear it click, and holding it in place, the car fires up. At least this will get me home so I can chase it down further. I wire it up and drive home without incident.

After reading the forums, everybody says this has to be a wiring issue. Well, I go back out and pull the wire connector off the ECU and check the resistance between the ECU wire and the attachment at the solenoid. I'll be damned if it didn't check out completely fine.

So still scratching my head, I snipped the jumper wire I put in place and sure enough, the car starts and runs perfectly, clearly putting voltage through the ECU to the Fuel Cutoff Solenoid as it should.

I know I should be happy that the electrical gremlin has decided to fix itself, but let's be honest, does that ever REALLY happen. For now, I've left the two ends of the jumper wire attached to their respective ends and set it up so it will be easy to reattach the wire should I have this problem again.

So now the questions.

1. Do you think that there is a problem in the wiring somewhere between the ECU and the Shut Off Solenoid, and my moving things around and testing caused it to "fix" itself by reconnecting a tenuous wire.

2. Could this be the sign of a failing relay somewhere? Potentially a 109 problem?

3. Do you think there may be a problem with the Fuel Cutoff Solenoid itself? It did click right away when power was attached from the battery directly.

4. Should I just be happy that my wife and kids were amazed that I fixed my car with a single strand of electrical wire?

 

[wmgeorge]

When my NB failed to start and I had to be towed home. Oh it started fine when I got in the drive way. I ordered 2 Relay 109's. I pull my old one apart and it was only soldered on one side of the connection and that side was so bad, I wonder how it ever worked. New 109 relay no problems. BTW my glow coil light never comes on, and why would it?? It has to be cold enough for the glow coil to work.

I spent many years of my life repairing electrical, on air craft and as a master electrician, and commercial HVAC. Start with the simple stuff.

Yes my Glow Coil light does come on, briefly when the key is turned on!!

 

[jettawreck]

When my NB failed to start and I had to be towed home. Oh it started fine when I got in the drive way. I ordered 2 Relay 109's. I pull my old one apart and it was only soldered on one side of the connection and that side was so bad, I wonder how it ever worked. New 109 relay no problems. BTW my glow coil light never comes on, and why would it?? It has to be cold enough for the glow coil to work.

I spent many years of my life repairing electrical, on air craft and as a master electrician, and commercial HVAC. Start with the simple stuff.

GP light should ALWAYS come on for a second +/- as a self system test and the GPs actually do cycle in all temps according to TDI guru "oilhammer". They are not needed much above 40*F, but they will cycle on briefly.

 

[Bookerdog]

Yep, Relay 109 appears to have solved the problem. I still had the old whitish one in mine. Honestly for a 12 year old car, that's not a bad lifespan for a part known to have problems. Out of this little incident, I have discovered that if you're really stuck and Relay 109 is down, you can use a jumper wire from the battery to the fuel cutoff switch, and limp home.

 

[KLXD]

I don't think running power to the solenoid will help if relay 109 is dead. The ECU still needs power. Whether it can get it through that path is a good question.

Also, the fuel cutoff solenoid only gets power for a few seconds if the key is just turned on. If you turned the key on and took too long to read it you may have missed it. It comes back when you crank it.

 

[Bookerdog]

I would have thought the same thing, but nope. It ran. It was definitely in limp mode, but it ran.

I checked the power to the N109 with my wife cranking it. Never had a bit of voltage. Worked immediately when power was applied.

BTW, after originally reporting that the gremlin had gone away, it came back. (Such is the nature of the bad solder in the original relays). My car was back to crank but no start without the jumper wire in place. Then I put the new 109 relay in and it fired right up. Just sayin' it worked for me, and it might work for somebody else.

 

[wmgeorge]

Just for fun take the old Relay apart. I could not believe how it ever ran at all!!
Cr@ppy solder job from day one.

I never bothered testing the old one in the car, just R&R after I read the posts on here.