Common Rail Timing Belt Protector

2micron

Vendor
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Location
Canada
TDI
None
Hello Folks,
After hearing about another failed timing belt, due to the serpentine belt shredding,
I thought surely this has to stop!!!
This is the 8th Common Rail Failure I have heard about, so driving home today, I decided to make a better shield.
The factory one is pressed tin, offering no protection from a failed serpentine belt.
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?p=4629402#post4629402
Oh, it's big alright: $5,100. Just got off the phone with the service guy. He says the serpentine got wound up around something, the tension caused it to jump out of timing.
The Timing Belt Cover over the cogged timing belt, one that drives the cam, HPFP, water pump, is a piece of idiotic design the defies explanation. I know why they did it, but it is still bad.

The cover has ZERO protection to the lower timing belt crankshaft pulley. The pulley is very small, only about 2.5" in diameter. The outer pulley for the serpentine belt, about 5" Dia., bolts directly to the timing belt pulley. The cover basically is wide open because the pulleys are bolted onto each other. Anything that gets between the outer serpentine pulley and the cover, gets fed right into the timing belt pulley......

Ever take a fork and stick it in spaghetti and spin it, wrap it up the spaghetti. The serpentine belt does not break it splits long ways in strips, think spaghetti. Then it gets between serpentine belt pulley and timing belt cover. It goes right into the cogged timing belt pulley (think fork) and wraps up between the pulley and the timing belt.
Well said gmc. Quote of the Year for me!!!
This is what we have for a Stock Shield:
Huge center hole and a great deal of clearance behind the Pulley backside.

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Well, tonight, I started to make up a solid 1/2" thick aluminum cover, in hopes of preventing this disaster.
The Timing belt Protector!!

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The new design is such that there is a major labyrinth path before the shreds of serpentine belt can get into the lower timing sprocket. Close fitting around the crankshaft pulley outer diameter, back face and the diameter of the sprocket, compared to the "open" factory tin.

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The Crankshaft Pulley fits into a recessed diameter on the new shield, as well as contours to the mounting hub.

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I'll finish it off with some counterboring for the mounting screws and a bit of backside clearance machining.
Lets open it up for discussion!!!
All the best,
Andrew
 

TNriverjet

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2011
Location
Mid TN
TDI
2013 JSW TDI 6MT
Holy cow! Nice work Andrew. If this is your free time work, I hope you are paid well for your real job!!!
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Looks neat and all, but I would be more concerned about why was the accessory belt "failing" in the first place? Because they usually don't. This is an item that should be checked at every service, along with things like the alternator pulley, tensioner, etc.

Or if people drive around with missing shields under the car (quite common).
 

JasonG

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
Location
Warwick N.Y.
TDI
1994, 2003 JSW (sold), 2012 Jetta
We bought ours at 41K.
The previous owner sold the car because something caused the serpentine belt to break.
Car came to us with 2-3K on a new head from VW.
One of these could prevent that from happening again.

Once again, 2 micron has out engineered the Germans vw hired. :)
 

wilcharl

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Location
Northern Virginia
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI BOUGHT BACK 23 NOV 16. Now owner of 2016 Jeep Cherokee
Funny I w just thinking about this

But my question is what is the root cause of the belt shredding?

Is it the alternator pully ? Is it simply belt failure?

I'm not one to replace things out of schedule but would a early belt change help?

If it's the alternator I'd say no...
 

schreibers

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Location
Asheville, NC
TDI
2011 JSW TDI
Great work! I can't thank you enough for your contributions and would love to invest in one of these once available (along with all your other goodies).
 

Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
Looks neat and all, but I would be more concerned about why was the accessory belt "failing" in the first place? Because they usually don't. This is an item that should be checked at every service, along with things like the alternator pulley, tensioner, etc.

Or if people drive around with missing shields under the car (quite common).
Ya, pretty stupid fix. Why would you make a fix for a problem caused by ignoring the maintenance schedule? The maintenance schedule tells you what to look for at every scheduled maintenance.

Performing proper scheduled maintenance is really stupid simple. Absolutely no need to make something that protects against not performing proper maintenance. It's to funny that folks think a scheduled maintenance is just changing the oil.

Do you have a fix for protecting against a nuclear explosion?
 
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canux

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2010
Location
Toronto
TDI
2013 Beetle TDI
Honestly, the horse and buggy are good enough for me. If people just planned better there would be enough time to get where they needed to go without the noise, smell, and risk associated with an ICE...

Why improve on anything after all?
 

wilcharl

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Location
Northern Virginia
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI BOUGHT BACK 23 NOV 16. Now owner of 2016 Jeep Cherokee
My question is what is the failure mode of the belt? I have heared everything from alternator pully lockup to AC compressor clutchless pulley lockup to a bad tensioner to just a bad belt. Every 10k service I do a full visual inspection of the belt and every time I check the oil or pop the hood I do a quick glance and feel but, if its not the belt itsself failing and its a catastrphic failure of say the tensioner that comes without notice, there is nothing I am going to be able to see that will warn me. Kind of like my HPFP, I see it everytime I pop the hood, its there, it looks nice but aside from that I cant tell you if and when it will ever fail.
 

redbarron55

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 10, 2010
Location
Navarre, FL.
TDI
2012 Touareg TDI Executive
Ditto. I am getting close to my second timing belt change.
I like my 2 Micron Filters already.

Thanks, Andrew!
 

2micron

Vendor
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Location
Canada
TDI
None
Ya, pretty stupid fix. Why would you make a fix for a problem caused by ignoring the maintenance schedule? The maintenance schedule tells you what to look for at every scheduled maintenance.

Performing proper scheduled maintenance is really stupid simple. Absolutely no need to make something that protects against not performing proper maintenance. It's to funny that folks think a scheduled maintenance is just changing the oil.

Do you have a fix for protecting against a nuclear explosion?
Hello Elite,
Shame, but a fellow I Respected said the Above. Geez, I was only trying to help. I was getting geared up and got the price way down to a more than easy to swallow upgrade.
Funny he mentions a Nuclear explosion. I work at a facility where we all work together to protect the public from a disaster like that.
Sorry for trying to help.
Andrew
 

ticketed2much

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Location
Lehigh Valley
TDI
2010 JSW
I am interested, even though the failure rate is low, it is catastrophically expensive when it does happen. I had a tensioner bearing go on my F250 diesel 2 months after I replaced it completely shredding the accessory belt. S**t happens sometimes and the thought of a 5K+ engine repair is a bit scary.
 

elitegunslinger

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2010
Location
Barnegat NJ
TDI
2010 Golf TDI :D
Hello Elite,
Shame, but a fellow I Respected said the Above. Geez, I was only trying to help. I was getting geared up and got the price way down to a more than easy to swallow upgrade.
Funny he mentions a Nuclear explosion. I work at a facility where we all work together to protect the public from a disaster like that.
Sorry for trying to help.
Andrew
I follow the maintenance schedule but I'd like the extra protection from the possibility of a lesser belt breaking under incident. I'd be down for a group buy if you're still willing, maybe we can get enough people together to mitigate the cost of a single run.
 

BuzzKen

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
May 16, 2011
Location
Markham, Ontario
TDI
'10 Touareg TDI, '09 335D, '10 X5D
Hello Elite,
Shame, but a fellow I Respected said the Above. Geez, I was only trying to help. I was getting geared up and got the price way down to a more than easy to swallow upgrade.
Funny he mentions a Nuclear explosion. I work at a facility where we all work together to protect the public from a disaster like that.
Sorry for trying to help.
Andrew

Ignore the BS. I wasn't aware scheduled maintenance was pulling the belt off and checking the alternator pulley every oil change..................(which appears to be the root cause of this from what I've seen, caught mine just in time)


MAKE THIS PART!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

ATR

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 18, 2005
Location
Baltimore
TDI
2011 Golf TDI 6MT
I was thinking that the reason the belt may fail is because someone at some point may have accidentally spilled diesel fuel on the belt during a filter change. The nay sayers make a valid point of checking the belt out... But keep in mind even if you check it it may still shred 5k miles after checking out the belt.

That said I'm all for the innovation that 2micron brings to the table and look forward to this coming out!
 
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elitegunslinger

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2010
Location
Barnegat NJ
TDI
2010 Golf TDI :D
I was thinking that the reason the belt may fail is because someone at some point may have accidentally spilled diesel fuel on the belt during a filter change.

That said I'm all for the innovation that 2micron brings to the table and look forward to this coming out!
Hey who would have done that! :eek:

I know I have gotten some drips near there.

Count me in for 1 when you do the first run.
 
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waltzconmigo

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2010
Location
chicagoland
TDI
none
Andrew---some still exist who believe that a skip plate (underside protection) is not needed. Please do not let the negative Nancies dictate your decisions. PM Sent.
 

Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
Oh, I don't know, I have 145K miles without a skid plate no issues yet. Just don't drive over anything that will damage your pan, right? Not that simple. Many thing can FUBAR your car and it really is your decision to what things you improve your chances on. You can't really prevent every possible type of misshap.

Proper preventative maintenance means inspecting many items on a regular basis. A deteriorated belt that is ready to break is pretty remote if you keep an eye on it.

Removing the belt at every oil change is just an asinine response. What you do is observe the belt/tensioner at idle, and if they appears like they are "jumping around" your pulley is seized. If you have charging issues or there is noise coming from the pulley it may be slipping.

And really, that is what preventative maintenance is all about, making observation of many thing on your car on a scheduled basis so you can catch problems before they cause a catastrophic failure. And contrary to some folks way of thinking, scheduled maintenance is not just changing oil and filters.

READ YOUR MAINTENANCE SCHEDULE. IT TELLS YOU WHAT YOU ARE SUPPOSE TO DO/CHECK AT EVERY SCHEDULED SERVICE.


It just kills me that folks are so proud of the fact that they were able to skip a major part of the actual preventative maintenance of their scheduled service by doing a topside oil change.:rolleyes:
 
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Henrick

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 24, 2010
Location
Ireland
TDI
Golf VI TDI, 77 kW (CAYC)
Will this part also fit 1.6 TDIs?
What are the expected costs of this?
Plus shipping overseas?

Thanks.
 

elitegunslinger

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2010
Location
Barnegat NJ
TDI
2010 Golf TDI :D
Oh, I don't know, I have 145K miles without a skid plate no issues yet. Just don't drive over anything that will damage your pan, right? Not that simple. Many thing can FUBAR your car and it really is your decision to what things you improve your chances on. You can't really prevent every possible type of misshap.

Proper preventative maintenance means inspecting many items on a regular basis. A deteriorated belt that is ready to break is pretty remote if you keep an eye on it.

Removing the belt at every oil change is just an asinine response. What you do is observe the belt/tensioner at idle, and if they appears like they are "jumping around" your pulley is seized. If you have charging issues or there is noise coming from the pulley it may be slipping.

And really, that is what preventative maintenance is all about, making observation of many thing on your car on a scheduled basis so you can catch problems before they cause a catastrophic failure. And contrary to some folks way of thinking, scheduled maintenance is not just changing oil and filters.

READ YOUR MAINTENANCE SCHEDULE. IT TELLS YOU WHAT YOU ARE SUPPOSE TO DO/CHECK AT EVERY SCHEDULED SERVICE.


It just kills me that folks are so proud of the fact that they were able to skip a major part of the actual preventative maintenance of their scheduled service by doing a topside oil change.:rolleyes:
The point is that this protector would provide people with idiot proof protection. Also could cover your ass in the instance that the belt fails between inspections (unlikely but could happen). Point is, if I can add anything to prevent catastrophic engine damage, I will. People buy insurance for things and may never use it if they are lucky, this would just be a little more insurance that my timing belt would be safe, regardless of an immediate need. Not arguing that routine maintenance shouldn't occur but outliers do exist in statistical analysis and I don't plan on being one of them.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Are you going to take your trans out, and take it apart, drive out all the pins holding the ring gear to the carrier, and replace them with a bolt kit? Because, from a "statistical analysis", that is more likely to be a problem.

Do you have runflat tires? What about a brush guard on the front of your car? Because I bet in the time it took to read this sentence, more cars were wrecked from hitting deer than accessory belts on VAG diesels failed.

What about a fuel guard under the pump? If those leak, it ruins coolant hoses and can cause a catastrophic loss of coolant and engine damage. I've seen that about 20 times more than I've seen an accessory belt fail. I have two such cars in the shop right now with fuel leaks and ruined coolant hoses.

Some people like to worry about nothing, I guess. :rolleyes:
 

ATR

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 18, 2005
Location
Baltimore
TDI
2011 Golf TDI 6MT
Are you going to take your trans out, and take it apart, drive out all the pins holding the ring gear to the carrier, and replace them with a bolt kit? Because, from a "statistical analysis", that is more likely to be a problem.
Do you have runflat tires? What about a brush guard on the front of your car? Because I bet in the time it took to read this sentence, more cars were wrecked from hitting deer than accessory belts on VAG diesels failed.
What about a fuel guard under the pump? If those leak, it ruins coolant hoses and can cause a catastrophic loss of coolant and engine damage. I've seen that about 20 times more than I've seen an accessory belt fail. I have two such cars in the shop right now with fuel leaks and ruined coolant hoses.
Some people like to worry about nothing, I guess. :rolleyes:
Which fuel gard are you talking about?
Is it the hpfp or aux fuel to the left of the timing belt cover?
 

Lightflyer1

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 13, 2005
Location
Round Rock, Texas
TDI
2015 Beetle tdi dsg
Ya, pretty stupid fix. Why would you make a fix for a problem caused by ignoring the maintenance schedule? The maintenance schedule tells you what to look for at every scheduled maintenance.

Performing proper scheduled maintenance is really stupid simple. Absolutely no need to make something that protects against not performing proper maintenance. It's to funny that folks think a scheduled maintenance is just changing the oil.

Do you have a fix for protecting against a nuclear explosion?
VW must have thought it was some kind of issue as they put one there in the first place, and they are the ones who made the maintenance/service list and usually do the inspections/service. An inspection means it looks good right at that moment. It could break anytime after that. How many times have I read here that the looks of a belt (TB in particular) give no indication as to how serviceable it still is. No one said anything about neglecting servicing their car but you. Some people will always neglect their possessions no mater what anyone tells them, they know better. Regardless of whether this thing is installed or not.
 
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elitegunslinger

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2010
Location
Barnegat NJ
TDI
2010 Golf TDI :D
Are you going to take your trans out, and take it apart, drive out all the pins holding the ring gear to the carrier, and replace them with a bolt kit? Because, from a "statistical analysis", that is more likely to be a problem.
Do you have runflat tires? What about a brush guard on the front of your car? Because I bet in the time it took to read this sentence, more cars were wrecked from hitting deer than accessory belts on VAG diesels failed.
What about a fuel guard under the pump? If those leak, it ruins coolant hoses and can cause a catastrophic loss of coolant and engine damage. I've seen that about 20 times more than I've seen an accessory belt fail. I have two such cars in the shop right now with fuel leaks and ruined coolant hoses.
Some people like to worry about nothing, I guess. :rolleyes:
This is a simple bolt on improvement done during maintenance; not as extensive as the transmission example. Point is accidents happen, I run into a deer insurance covers it, if I get a flat I have a spare, if my spare is **** I get a tow from insurance, etc. It's one less possibility, however small it may be.

Agreed, it may never happen and it could be a waste; but for that one unlikely instance, it could be worth it.
 
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