Clutch change procedure G60 and DMF flywheels

ymz

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 12, 2003
Location
Between Toronto & Montreal
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI Wagon, 2003 Jetta TDI Wagon
Can't speak for the more experienced and expert members here, but... I put lengths of 2x4 under the square "tubes" running under the front seats and had those sitting on jack stands... The transmission, while not "light", is light enough that one can lift it off and on the harbor freight transmission jack while it's still under the engine compartment... I slid it in and out on top of a board...

Good luck!!!

Yuri
 

wakdady

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Location
San Francisco
TDI
2001 Jetta TDI 5spd
bringing this thread back. have one question;
why does it matter the whole finding and marking TDC?

i'm not able to find a marking on the flywheel that i'm removing. the new one (single mass) has no marking either.
if it really is important. what the heck am i supposed to do?

i had an interesting breakdown with it not being able to shift gears. there were also some interesting noises when i depressed the clutch. i knew it was the throwout bearing. and once the trans came off it was pretty funny.





169,000 miles, original clutch. i'd say the surfaces were in pretty decent condition.





and the pressure plate was missing a finger!





the clutch release lever is a little gouged in a few places so i'm going to replace it.

i also learned that i should have removed the exhaust downpipe. when i read that i figured it didn't have to happen, although i was able to remove the trans i know i wont be able to install it with the exhaust limiting engine clearance



my '01 apparently has the 99.5-2000 shift linkages, at least that's what the FSM said.

 

Keith_J

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2007
Location
West
TDI
2000 Jetta MT
Stock pressure plates with DMFs appear to be missing a clutch finger. This is normal, the clutch/DMF is installed as a kit, pre-assembled from the factory (as are the LUK Rep Sets). The missing fingers are to allow flywheel bolts to be installed with pressure plate bolted to the DMF.

That throwout bearing...wow. Borrowed time?

I bet the DMF is also toast. The Sachs unit uses 8 cog bearings, made of Nylon, to support the OD of the second mass, relative to the part bolted to the flywheel. These cog bearings engage an internal ring gear on the second mass. The reason for the gearing is to assure the bearings turn instead of sliding. But Nylon suffers from embrittlement due to heat aging. Once the bushings harden, they can fracture. Then, the only bearing surface in the DMF is the central bearing and seal.
bearings
In my DMF failure, there were only two of the eight cog bearings remaining! Those two bearings were PARTIALS, 1/3rd gone. This caused the friction surface to be misaligned with the transmission input shaft and shifting issues.

I've had the shifting issue for years. Had these cog bushings been made of bronze, it would have been fine for 20+ years. Since these are sealed units, no one can see.

It took 15 minutes of grinding with my 14" abrasive chop saw to discover this problem. Plus I know a bit about Nylon and aging with heat. Think the clutch gets above 220 F?
 

DanG144

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 2, 2007
Location
Chapin, South Carolina, USA
TDI
2005 A4 Jetta 5spd
Very important.

On the Sachs VR6 flywheel that is so common a replacement, there are timing marks clearly visible when it is out of the engine, however they are too far forward to be visible once installed.

On any flywheel the bolt pattern only allows it to be installed one way. So lay the two flywheels on top of each other, with the bolt patterns aligned, and transfer the TDC mark from one to the other.

The original TDC mark can be almost impossible to find, due to rust and the light, delicate nature of the original marking. But I have always been able to figure out where it should be and then see the original mark.

Put the lock pin in your injection pump. That puts the TDC mark at the top, right under the pointer in the hole. Then look for the faint tracing of the original mark. Zero with a slash through it most often. Then transfer the mark to your new one.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=3455863&postcount=22

Even on the well marked new flywheel, the marks had to be extended to be of any use.
 

DanG144

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 2, 2007
Location
Chapin, South Carolina, USA
TDI
2005 A4 Jetta 5spd
Go to SEARCH on the top bar, then ADVANCED SEARCH then go all the way to the bottom and use Google search of the club.

Search for "new flywheel TDC mark" and you will get plenty of good tips. and pictures; something is bound to work for you.
 

ymz

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 12, 2003
Location
Between Toronto & Montreal
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI Wagon, 2003 Jetta TDI Wagon
my '01 apparently has the 99.5-2000 shift linkages
Actually, your '01 has the proper linkage for the EBJ transmission in it... the DQY in the 1998 New Beetle and early Golf/Jettas (?) has a much different mechanism that's difficult to adjust... the 2002 and later transmissions (EGR and subsequent) have the easiest-to-adjust versions...

BTW: you're supposed to replace those shift cable ends (according to the manual) if you've popped them off the knobs... (I simply kept them in place and removed the shifter counterweight...)

Have fun!!

Yuri
 

smendick

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2009
Location
CA
TDI
2003 Golf ALH 5-sp manual
Hi. I plan to do my clutch soon. Can you provide recommendations for what to replace at the same time? (i.e -- which wear items are easy to access at the same time).

Comments on the plan below?
SBC Daily Clutch
Oil: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1438
Short Shifter: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=551
Bolts: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=726
RMS Seal: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=625{47}72
Release Lever:http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1461{74}60
Gear Select Lever: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2601
Shifter Tower Bushings: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2281

Anything else you can think of?
 

wakdady

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Location
San Francisco
TDI
2001 Jetta TDI 5spd
Hi. I plan to do my clutch soon. Can you provide recommendations for what to replace at the same time? (i.e -- which wear items are easy to access at the same time).

Comments on the plan below?
SBC Daily Clutch
Oil: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1438
Short Shifter: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=551
Bolts: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=726
RMS Seal: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=625{47}72
Release Lever:http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1461{74}60
Gear Select Lever: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2601
Shifter Tower Bushings: http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2281

Anything else you can think of?
i don't believe you need a clutch release lever unless yours is somehow ruined. I've never seen one that needed replaced, that was until i removed my trans and found the exploded throw-out bearing that gouged into the lever.

also, from what the above poster has already stated, you need to replace the cable end clips. i just chose to buy the shortshift kit from dieselgeek, it's more expensive but i know it's worth it.
I had the pleasure of playing with one at a GTG a while back and have wanted one ever since. not to mention their salesmanship on the website is very well written
"There is nothing as important to the feel of your car as what you actually touch. This includes the seats, the steering wheel, and of course, the shifter. Many people have mentioned that installing a Dieselgeek Shifter should be the first mod added to a new car. In the pursuit to make our own cars the best they can be, we have created the finest short shifter with the best materials, engineering, and craftsmanship to transform the way you feel about your car." - dieselgeek
 

DanG144

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 2, 2007
Location
Chapin, South Carolina, USA
TDI
2005 A4 Jetta 5spd
I have seen clutch release levers fail after reinstallation, especially if you go to a heavier clutch. The side wall cracked and it bent in the middle.

At least do a good inspection of the old one, looking for any cracks.

If I put in a stronger pressure plate, I will use a boxed release lever. Who wants to pull the tranny an extra time?
 

Speedster

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2001
Location
Wichita, KS
TDI
2000 NB TDI 5M, 2002 Jetta TDI 5M & 2012 Jetta TDI 6M
Just completed G60/VR6 install

At 217,000 miles, the clutch pedal and shifter had some vibration in them. I figured that the DM flywheel was going south, so ordered parts from 1stVW. The day before they arrived, the tranny just quit shifting, and I had to turn off the engine to get 1st gear to engage. I nursed the car back home by applying pressure to the shifter for each gear.

DB has done an excellent write-up on the change-out procedure. All that I can add to that are some notes from my experience.

1. I happen to have a chain hoist from HF already bolted into the ceiling of my garage, and used that to lower the motor from the driver side lift point. I put a shackle bolt through the small hole and used the shackle to attach a lift strap, which was then attached to the chain hoist hook above the hood of the car. I did not need to attach anything to the passenger side lift point. The chain hoist made it so very easy to position the engine.

2. To the tranny, I attached my come-along to the hoist hook also, and used some rope around the tranny that went to the come-along hook. Easy again.

3. Be sure to remove the electrical connector from the speedo drive on the upper back side of the tranny prior to taking the tranny out. No one seems to mention this item in write-ups or the Bentley manual.

4. As DB states, be sure to remove the short half shafts from the tranny prior to removing the tranny. To reinstall, I just used several ratchet extensions to be able to put enough pressure on the Allen bolt from outside the car to get it to engage.

5. Set aside at least 12 hours for a first time.
 

Speedster

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2001
Location
Wichita, KS
TDI
2000 NB TDI 5M, 2002 Jetta TDI 5M & 2012 Jetta TDI 6M
Clutch slave cylinder

In regard to the clutch slave cylinder, the How-To says to disconnect the line from the slave cylinder. The Bentley manual says to just take the two bolts out of the slave cylinder and move the cylinder with line attached out of the way.

First, I took the line off, and then removed the slave cylinder. After reading the Bentley manual, I reconnected the slave cylinder to the line. The bottom line is that there is no real reason to remove the line from the slave cylinder. Just take out the two bolts and move the cylinder with line attached up to the firewall and zip tie to something. No chance of losing some brake fluid or getting any onto your paint.
 

Jet 02

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2007
Location
Californa
TDI
2002 Jetta, Vanagon AHU project
One time use bolts

While it may not seem necessary to replace the horizontal motor mount bolts on the transmission, I would recommend it. When I did my clutch change I fought those two bolts out all the way. I ended up using an impact because my arm gave out. The new bolts when in by hand. The old ones had been streached so much the thread pitch was off, thus it made them hard to remove. (reminds me of the saying: "cross thread the bad sub for a lock-washer")
 

ymz

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 12, 2003
Location
Between Toronto & Montreal
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI Wagon, 2003 Jetta TDI Wagon
While it may not seem necessary to replace the horizontal motor mount bolts on the transmission, I would recommend it. When I did my clutch change I fought those two bolts out all the way.
...um... there are three horizontal transmission bracket (lower mount) bolts... yes, they're marked "always replace" but I've seen experienced VW dealership techs just lather them up with LocTite - I wouldn't recommend it, but... that's what I've seen...

Yuri
 

Dimitri16V

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Location
DE
TDI
01 Golf, 04 Golf
Ditto on those mount bracket bolts. they are tight because factory used Loctite on them.
Did the clutch this week, definitely remove passengers side axle flange.
VR6/G60 clutch setup is nice, softer pedal but chatter at idle
 

Clatterman

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 30, 1999
Location
So Cal
TDI
1999 Golf GLS
The blue VW loctite will loosen up with heat. While removing the trans mount bolts, I had two of the long bolts turn into playdoh, and snap off. To get the threaded sections out, I used a plumber's torch (use butane, not MAP gas.) The heat turns the blue loctite into gel and they come out easily. For tools, I used a Craftsman easy-out that grabs the studs from the outside - no drilling req'd.
 

macoombi

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2011
Location
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
TDI
'02 Jetta TDI
Just need a clarification on the orientation of the parts on the flange. This is the passenger side.

If you can't tell from the photo the order is (right to left) flange, stub axle pressure spring, stub axle thrust washer, tapered brass ring, circlip.

I found this reference here:
http://www.zelek.com/diagram02j-311.htm

Another pic:


Does anybody re-use the circlip or the flange gasket? I don't see any reason not to.
 

mikeny

Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2014
Location
husum,wa
TDI
2004 tdi pd wagon
Hi thank you for your PDF really help me good job the power steering line for sure needs to be lifted up but other than that I loved it now the problem I put in the new clutch put it all back together and now I have an awful noise I turn the motor over slowly looking with a mirror I can't see where anything is binding on the new pressure plate and flywheel new bearingI bought the clutch from clutch Masters it is a single mass flywheel pressure plate throw out bearing kit stage 2 what do you think
 

Dimitri16V

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Location
DE
TDI
01 Golf, 04 Golf
can you row thru all the gears ?

did you install the small cover plate correctly in the back of the tranny ?
 

mikeny

Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2014
Location
husum,wa
TDI
2004 tdi pd wagon
I took the cheap aftermarket clutch back out and replaced it with a vr6 21 pound balance silent clutch I got from bora parts end of the problem
 

TDITALIAN

Active member
Joined
Nov 7, 2004
Location
Los Angeles, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta Wagon, Slv, 5 spd 1999.5 Silver Jetta Sedan 5spd
Broken Stretch Bolt

The blue VW loctite will loosen up with heat. While removing the trans mount bolts, I had two of the long bolts turn into playdoh, and snap off. To get the threaded sections out, I used a plumber's torch (use butane, not MAP gas.) The heat turns the blue loctite into gel and they come out easily. For tools, I used a Craftsman easy-out that grabs the studs from the outside - no drilling req'd.
Same thing has happened to me. 1 of the 3 horizontal stretch bolts has snapped. Does anyone have any advice as how to remove this broken bolt?? Is it nessesary to weld a nut to broken bolt for removal or does somebody have an alternative method? Only have about 5mm of thread to grab onto.
 

CoolAirVw

Vendor
Joined
Nov 9, 2005
Location
Kansas City Missouri
TDI
Jetta
Is it nessesary to weld a nut to broken bolt for removal or does somebody have an alternative method? Only have about 5mm of thread to grab onto.
That's probably gonna be your best bet. After you weld the nut on use a torch to heat the aluminum around the bolt to free up the lock tight and to release the squeeze on the bolt.
 

454k30

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2006
Location
Long Beach, CA
TDI
2002 Jetta
TDITALIAN, what terrible news! I was fortunate that during my recent clutch change all of those bolts came out easily. As was stated a few posts earlier these bolts have some factory loc-tite holding them in place. That loc-tite is heat sensitive, and heating it will turn it into a gel state, allowing for easier removal. 5MM of protruding bolt is a good thing. If you can weld a nut onto it then you are way ahead of most bolt removals. The keys for you will be to heat the bolt and then turn the bolt. Heating is the easy part. Turning the bolt will require a welded on nut or you will need to drill into the bolt and use some sort of extractor (like an easy-out) to turn the bolt. Good luck to you.
 

TDITALIAN

Active member
Joined
Nov 7, 2004
Location
Los Angeles, CA
TDI
2003 Jetta Wagon, Slv, 5 spd 1999.5 Silver Jetta Sedan 5spd
TDITALIAN, what terrible news! I was fortunate that during my recent clutch change all of those bolts came out easily. As was stated a few posts earlier these bolts have some factory loc-tite holding them in place. That loc-tite is heat sensitive, and heating it will turn it into a gel state, allowing for easier removal. 5MM of protruding bolt is a good thing. If you can weld a nut onto it then you are way ahead of most bolt removals. The keys for you will be to heat the bolt and then turn the bolt. Heating is the easy part. Turning the bolt will require a welded on nut or you will need to drill into the bolt and use some sort of extractor (like an easy-out) to turn the bolt. Good luck to you.
Thank you CoolAir and 454 for your advise. Looks like I'll be heading to the muffler shop.
 
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