Chicago 2009 TDI Owners: Non-Biodiesel Support Group

[woofie2]

more than likely 90% of Illinois Diesel is Southern FS blended B11, doing some research around the southern part of Illinois Southern FS claims about 99% of the diesel pumps are spewing their blend.
They make and distribute B11 blended soydiesel which fits the Illinois 5-20% Illinois farm kickback.
I found one pump within 50 mile radius that is not biodiesel and sells premium diesel. but a 50 mile drive out of my way for fuel is not practical, so I kept records, and receipts from everywhere I fill up. if there is a fuel issue or problem then I can pass the info back to the stations, if needed with my lawyer's help.

MSU- I am currently not using any fuel additives. Have you heard of any recommendations for additives for our vehicle?

there are only 1 or two additives approved by VW for the 2.0L TDI, Lubromoly is one, I am not sure about the others.
the trick is not burning too hot to burn out the particulate filter.

 

[TDI BRI]

Woofie - Thanks for the information.

 

[MSU Spartans]

Geebs- I agree totally. The " We rely on our dealers...." response from VW is perplexing. Not sure how to read into that. Maybe they might be giving the dealers an unofficial "nod and wink" to address the fuel issues as they see fit?.

My dealer readily acknowledged the contradictions on bio fuel blends and the VW requirements in Illinois...but also, without putting it in writing ( of course), implied that I shouldn't have issues with my warranty being denied because of such.

I think we all would like something official, in writing. Enough of the VW mind games.

TDI, in follow up to yours, I have read elsewhere that Stanadyne performance/ lubrication formula has been approved by VW. On the other hand, I have also read where VW supposedly does not recommend fuel additives for the newer CR TDI's. Like you, I want the best performance but I'm not sure I would screw up anything by trying such.

Funny story: Last night I pulled up to a the diesel pump, swiped my credit card and stuck the nozzle in. Clerk ran outside and yelled "Sir, you realize that is a diesel pump don't you!". I laughed and said "Yep....it's not a problem, it has a diesel engine". He said he only sees larger trucks using the pump so it threw him off. I thanked him for looking out for me.

 

[woofie2]

Funny story: Last night I pulled up to a the diesel pump, swiped my credit card and stuck the nozzle in. Clerk ran outside and yelled "Sir, you realize that is a diesel pump don't you!". I laughed and said "Yep....it's not a problem, it has a diesel engine". He said he only sees larger trucks using the pump so it threw him off. I thanked him for looking out for me.

Funny, I had the same thing happen, the cashier came running out around the building, I looked at the car, looked at the pump, then looked back at her and said all is good.

I have also seen a manager of a Fuel station, come out with 2 big jugs of Power service and dump them into the underground tank. I ask what he was doing he said "the fuel we purchased yesterday is not winterized", (this was November) I was already filling up, and noted he was using the Silver jugs of powerservice not the white (winter blend with anti-gel) {Thankfully I had already added my own anti-gel blend}
I thought it was odd and asked why he was only treating 600 gallons, (two 96 once jugs) he said eh, that's close enough, he only bought 2000 gallons.

 

[DasTeknoViking]

I love this tread.. Saved me from buying a new TDi for my wife and went with a GTi 4 door. As much as I love frugal TDi I don't want to have to drive around looking for the right fuel. Thankfully my B4 will run on almost anything. VW needs to step up to the plate n save their own azz from all these warranty claims.

 

[TDI BRI]

I filled up yesterday at Meijer and they have switchd to premium, just thought I would let everyone know.

Bolingbrook (Premium)
Meijer
735 E. Boughton Rd., Bolingbrook, IL 60440
630-783-5301

 

[tlak77]

I filled up yesterday at Meijer and they have switchd to premium, just thought I would let everyone know.

Bolingbrook (Premium)
Meijer
735 E. Boughton Rd., Bolingbrook, IL 60440
630-783-5301

Thanks for info, I wonder what Premium really refers to...

 

[MSU Spartans]

Thanks for info, I wonder what Premium really refers to...

Meijer markets their diesel as blended with Schaeffer fuel additives with a minimum 45 cetane. I guess, in their eyes, that makes it "premium". To me, it's just plain diesel fuel with the necessary ingredients to make up for the lower sulfur content.


http://www.schaefferoil.com/diesel-fuel-additives.html

 

[woofie2]

Thanks for info, I wonder what Premium really refers to...

The price?

There was a station ins SE Missouri that had Premium Fuel that was 50+ Cetane, I managed to get upto 60 MPG on the highway off that hooch.
it was selling Amoco PowerBlend.

 

[tlak77]

Meijer markets their diesel as blended with Schaeffer fuel additives with a minimum 45 cetane. I guess, in their eyes, that makes it "premium". To me, it's just plain diesel fuel with the necessary ingredients to make up for the lower sulfur content.


http://www.schaefferoil.com/diesel-fuel-additives.html

45 is better than 40, but not as good as 50
Meijer is still confirmed to be D2 I assume? Is there a lot of Diesel traffic at that particular station "fresh fuel"?

 

[MSU Spartans]

tlak77- Meijer is pure D2. A couple weeks ago I spoke to corporate in Grand Rapids and confirmed such. They do have a few clearly marked bio pumps at select locations, mostly downstate.

I have been pondering the same "fresh fuel" question as you. Honestly, I don't see alot of commercial vehicles pumping fuel at Meijer. All the big trucks I see are filling their tank at Speedway.

 

[SuburbanTDI]

The price?

There was a station ins SE Missouri that had Premium Fuel that was 50+ Cetane, I managed to get upto 60 MPG on the highway off that hooch.
it was selling Amoco PowerBlend.

I see premium diesel so rarely that I don't even think twice about the price and whether the upcharge is at all reasonable. I just buy it.

I don't think I see it twice a year. But I did just run out a tank of it last week. And boy could you see the difference in MPG's.

 

[vwthingguy]

For those of you in the Terre Haute, In to Decatur IL area, The Sunshine Gas Station in Arcola Illinois has straight #2 diesel at their self-serve pumps. One more for us small town guys!

 

[clem151]

It seems that northern Cook and southern Lake Counties have gone exclusively to B20.

To make things worse, the Mobil at Half Day & 41 now has labels saying" "Biodiesel is not a Mobil branded fuel, this product may not meet your engine manufacturer's specifications, ExxonMobil disclaims any warranty as to its fitness, quality or performance".

As far as I can tell no one has had problems _yet_ by using B20...I wonder what problems we might expect to experience.

 

[Tom in chicago]

Sorry for my ignorance. What does UOA stand for?

My limited knoweldge is that bio-diesels provide less lubrication than the higher sulfur non-biodiesels and the result is that the engine wear (rings, gaskets) is more with bio-diesel.

Thoughts, pearls of wisdom?

Tom, Rogers Park, Chicago.

 

[All of Us]

Tom:

In case nobody p-mailed you the answer, it generally stands for Used Oil Analysis.

Dan

 

[roblatham]

non-biodiesel at Phillips 66, kingery and plainfield

Last week (13 September 2011) I filled up at this station and was pleased as punch to find no biodiesel sticker on the pump.
Phillips 66
6949 S Kingery Hwy
Plainfield Rd
Willowbrook, IL 60521
Phone: 630-325-8068
This station is just a bit up the road from the Mobile near the stevenston that went biodiesel about 6 months ago.
Is palos parked updating the google map any longer?

 

[AndySRT]

Bp in bartlett at route 59 and stearns rd has Bp premier diesel no bio sticker on the pump and according to bp's website it is 47 cetane

 

[clem151]

BP at Central and Green Bay in Highland Park is standard diesel...and you pay for it too.

Looks like BP is the way to go if you can find one that has diesel.

Talked to the service manager at North Shore Volkswagen, and she had no idea that people were having a hard time finding non-biodiesel.

 

[MikeUnited]

This will be my first post in the forum. I have recently purchased a 2012 VW Jetta TDI and have been suffering through the issues of locating B5 Diesel. I have read pretty much every comment in this thread. I feel that so many of us have been burned by misrepresentation from our sales people on the ease of finding fuel.. I love my TDI just not this issues of quality fuel in IL. I feel that VW has done nothing to help us resolve this situation. I think a petition needs to be devised to send directly to VW to make our issues known on a larger scale. Let me know what you think.

 

[TDiSkater]

This will be my first post in the forum. I have recently purchased a 2012 VW Jetta TDI and have been suffering through the issues of locating B5 Diesel. I have read pretty much every comment in this thread. I feel that so many of us have been burned by misrepresentation from our sales people on the ease of finding fuel.. I love my TDI just not this issues of quality fuel in IL. I feel that VW has done nothing to help us resolve this situation. I think a petition needs to be devised to send directly to VW to make our issues known on a larger scale. Let me know what you think.

Are you looking specifically for B5? That's not an option. It's straight D2 or the more easy to find B11? Is your issue finding straight diesel to blend down to B1 or B2? Just checking.

 

[clem151]

It has occurred to me that one of two results could happen if we did a letter writing campaign to VW:

1) They do some testing and figure out whether or not the car can handle typical B20 found in Illinois.

2) They give Illinois the finger and stop selling the TDI's here

Given VW's stellar customer service, I wouldn't be even a little surprised if they took option 2.

 

[Tom in chicago]

I think a petition is an awesome idea. If you want to organize, I'd suggest drafting something and then just asking folks who want to sign to send you for their model, year, dealer purchased from and name and addresss.

They could send you this info via private email if they are concerned about privacy.

I would be happy to add my name to a list.

Tom, Rogers Park, Chicago,IL

An additional option would be for all of us to send something to Bob Weber's column in the Tribune. He may have enough clout to get VW to tell us how they are going to address our issues. His email: motormouth.trib@verizon.net. I am going to send him an email and ask him what the risk is of using the Illinois blend and let him know the difficulties we have been having with finding gas dealers with non-bio-diesel dealers and VW's general indifference/misrepresnetation about the availability.

 

[Tom in chicago]

letter to Chicago Tribune

This is what I sent to Bob Weber at the Chicago Tribune (motormouth.trib@verizon.net):

Dear Bob,

Thank you for your great column in the Chicago Tribune.

I have a 2009 Jetta Sportwagen TDI (Turbo Diesel). I bought it for its outstanding fuel economy, functionality and reasonable price. I love the car. However the owner’s manual says:

"Diesel fuel with a higher concentration than ULSD-Diesel No. 2 ASTM D975 and Bio-diesel with a higher concentration than 5% like B11, B20 or B100 are strictly prohibited."

"For owners who wish to comply with this specification, residents of Illinois are at an extreme hardship. Under SB 46, signed into law in 2003, biodiesel blends above 10% receive an exemption from state sales tax. For this reason, the vast majority of diesel pumps exceed VW's biodiesel requirement." (quoted from thread mentioned below).

It is becoming more and more difficult to find pure diesel in Illinois. VW dealers continue to sell TDI’s in Illinois without being upfront about the difficulty in finding 5% Bio-diesel or regular diesel. There is a whole forum for Illinois TDI owners to help track diesel stations that sell pure diesel: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=237849

On this thread there is much debate about the risks of using the Illinois 10% and above subsidized diesel and whether VW would cover any issues that may arise in the future if they know we are using the higher percent biodiesel.

Do you have any advice for us? Should we petition VW to test the Illinois Biodiesel or assure us that we will be covered by the warranty if we use above 10% Biodiesel? My understanding is that Biodiesel has less lubricating properties than pure diesel. Perhaps more frequent oil changes would minimize this problem?


Tom

 

[MikeUnited]

Are you looking specifically for B5? That's not an option. It's straight D2 or the more easy to find B11? Is your issue finding straight diesel to blend down to B1 or B2? Just checking.

I guess that I am a bit confused. I have no issue finding b11 it seems to be all I can find out here. Is it ok to run b11??

 

[MikeUnited]

The Ohare Oasis Management has informed me that their Diesel contains only 5% biomass. The receipt printed saying D2. As I am still learning the numerous abbreviations I may have stated that incorrectly. However, I do know that that is a good find for me. Here is the address to add to the list.

10201 Belle Plaine Avenue
Schiller Park, IL 60176-1875

 

[Tom in chicago]

I guess that I am a bit confused. I have no issue finding b11 it seems to be all I can find out here. Is it ok to run b11??

according to the owner's manual it is not OK to use B11:

"Diesel fuel with a higher concentration than ULSD-Diesel No. 2 ASTM D975 and Bio-diesel with a higher concentration than 5% like B11, B20 or B100 are strictly prohibited."

This is my understanding of the issues including the larger issue of why Illinois subsidizes:

FYI, there is no way I am going to bother trying to blend Illinois with pure diesel. My time is more valuable than that.

I am finding that it is almost impossible to find pure diesel. I always assume that in Illinois folks selling biodiesel are over 10% since that is what is subsidized.

I like the concept of biodiesel to support the Illinois farmers instead of middle eastern producers (or even Texans for that matter). I don't like the idea of ruining my engine. One BMW mechanic told me that the problem with biodiesel is that it lubricates less than straight diesel. The question is whether that is a serious issue or a fantasy issue. If it is a real issue, then perhaps more frequent oil changes are in order. Would be nice if VW addressed this issue.

 

[Tom in chicago]

TDI Skater,

But why blend in the first place, if you are going to buy pure diesel anyhow? I didn't mean to be flippant, but I am already kind of pissed that I have to plan my gas purchases around when I am going to be in the nieghborhood of a pure diesel dealer. Going to yet another gas station would add even more time to the process. I bought this car for high mileage capability and now I am traveling extra miles to buy fuel. Kind of ironic.

Thanks for the update on the UK bio-fuel status and the effects of using bio fuel.

 

[TDiSkater]

Found another in Lake Cty. BP at 12 and 176. Unlabeled. $3.999 as of today.

 

[MikeUnited]

Meijer in Bolingbrook IL is only $3.56!