Cam bearing Reengineering for PD motors

oldpoopie

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2001 golf gl, 2006 jetta, 1981 ALH swapped rabbit pickup, 1998 beetle
I currently have 196k on my BEW. Timing belt is due and clutch is slipping. So I am going to drop the motor out and put it on a engine stand. I will be doing the cam with franks grouved bearings and oil feed mod, pull the oil pan off change the oil pump, chain and tensioner pull the intake clean it up and egr cooler delete. Can anyone think of anything else that needs to be done while the motor is out?
H-beam rods and a turbo capable of 35psi!
 

Franko6

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I'm doing a Frank06 cam replacement and found this piece of aluminum round stock in the #1 outside head bolt while cleaning up the oil. Can someone tell me what it is?

The ends of the rockers are where those parts come from. They need to be reinserted, then dimpled so they won't fall out again. You are losing oil pressure through those pins.
 

Henrick

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I guess you're talking about this piece. Any pics about the exact location of these thingies on the rocker shaft?




 

Henrick

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You mean in each end of each side of where the roller's central axis meets the shaft, right? A good point for inspection, I'd say.
 

Ol'Rattler

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Hey all. I'm biting the bullet and doing franko6's oiling improvements. After reading all the post on PD cam problems, it sure seems reasonable that I could actually get 200K miles on the new cam and lifters with improved cam oiling.

I'm at 88K miles and all though the cam isn't as bad as I thought it would be, #1 lower bearing is showing copper, there is very noticeable wear on the other 4 lower bearings, the chamfer on several lobes is gone and there is right at .010 inch difference between the tallest lobe and the shortest lobe, as best as I can measure with a 6" caliper.

Mostly, I posted to bring this thread to the top so that a can find it easier............
 
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Henrick

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only 0.01 inch difference? That's about as thick as one sheet of office paper
 

Ol'Rattler

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Yea, it isn't much. Frank told me that's about the limit for being able to use my old cam for a core and that even at .010 inch there is a performance hit and since the wear is started, it's only going to get worse. Like I said, #1 lower bearing is worn down to the copper.

The new cam I got from Frank is a stage 2, so there will be a performance gain over OEM and with the re-engineered bearings new lifters and oil path re-clocking I should get some real longevity out of VWs weak design.
 

Henrick

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Strange but I've heard of failures with more than 0.06" of meat missing but still running fine.

Hope your replacement lasts longer. Switch to the popular Schaffers, T6 or TDT oil (I wish I could get any of these here) oil. Also, would be nice if you could share the pictures of worn parts. Sometimes it's really interesting to see how things fail.
 

Ol'Rattler

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Ya, but it's time for the T/B change and it's mine understanding that once you see wear, the oiling starts to degrade which accelerates the wear which means more and more metal will be worn off and circulated by the oil. Can't be good for the oil pump or any of the bearing surfaces in the engine.

My intention is to not have to do anything till the next T/B change except normal maintenance and take an occasional look at the cam/bearings for evidence of wear and with any luck get at least 2 T/B changes on the new cam.

When I get done with this project I will post some pictures and some observations about the project's end result.

Almost forgot, Frank hooked me up with the Schaffers............................
 
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Ol'Rattler

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Cam replacement is complete.

On my Injector rocker shafts one oil plug was sitting in the top of a head bolt and one was backed 1/2 way out. I seated all 4 of them with a punch, cleaned with brake cleaner and then acetone and glued the plugs in place with J/B weld. If they don't hold I will have some plugs machined for a press fit. The only way to get the oil plugs from VW is to buy the complete injector rocker assembly's. There are 2 assembly's at $300+ each.

When drilling be very careful. I drilled through the side of the #3 bearing cap and had to have the extra hole welded closed. Drilling the #1 bearing position in the head was actually the easiest. I used a shop vac as I drilled and after I was done drilling, I put tape under the #3,4 and 5 lower bearings, put tape on the #2,3,4 and 5 galleries that supply the injector rockers and blew air from a can of compressed air I bought for computers into the #2 bearing gallery hole to blow out any chips that may have made there way into oil gallery for bearing #1.

More to follow.....................
 
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Henrick

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I guess you're talking about this piece. Any pics about the exact location of these thingies on the rocker shaft?





OK, sorry but I think it's not that clear to me yet. As far as I understood, this thing came from the center of this (in the picture the part in question is missing as far as I understand, right?):

 

Ol'Rattler

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The plugs I'm talking about are on the very end of each rocker shaft. There are 2 per rocker shaft.

Your picture shows the axles for the rollers and the plugs i found are not those.
 

Henrick

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Oh, so the rocker shaft itself? I guess it can be seen in this pic, in the center of the rocker shaft edge, towards the back of the car:




I wonder how those can get loose of even get lost? It seems things are tight there unless the rocker shaft is dismantled
 

DanG144

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Yes, one plug in the end of the rocker shaft is visible above - the one off center. I found two of 4 plugs ejected (one on each rocker) on the BRM I worked today. I was amazed that the two plugs had landed in the triplesquare opening of two headbolts. Did not even have to remove the pan to find them. The car owner said his karma was good.

They were driven in to place and center punched very hard to expand/deform the soft aluminum to grip the shaft. But they hole they fit into is very smooth, and they apparently vibrated out (the engine had 3 holed exhaust valves and was vibrating pretty badly. Air flow was down to 400 mg/str max, even at max boost.)

I reinserted them and centerpunched them to deform them again, then dulled 3 chisels staking the edges of the holes they are mounted in. The rocker shaft is made of some tough stuff. I hope the hole edges are staked enough to keep them from being ejected again.
 

nic_a_bod

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Frank,

Read the new no drill thread, so just double checking because I was thinking there was one time you changed the procedure on the bottom bearings for those that went with the drilling procedure. I think I was one of the first group that got your bearings before you started removing the tang so my bottom bearings are the same orientation as stock. I think it was later on you were recommending to flip the bottom bearing around with the drilling procedure? Anyways, I was just wondering if you could clarify the bottom bearing situation for those that drill. Thanks
 

2footbraker

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You have to reverse the bottom bearing in both cases, so the oil can only go through the drilled oil passage and out through the new hole.
 

spooner miller

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Nov 27, 2007
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Dubuque, Iowa
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06 Jetta BRM
Hey, just checkin back into the forum, it's been 5 years since i've been on here! So back in 2007 i took my fiance's 06 BRM tdi and drilled a new oil passage to the top of the cam bearings and also cut slots all the way around. It now has over 200,000 miles running absolutely perfect no hiccups whatsoever. Next time i do the timing belt change i'll pull the cam out and take some pics of the bearings. I'll post pics of the cut bearings when i get home later. For now here are some pics (if i can post them) of the gutted cat and 3" exhaust. Eric



 

Kriesel

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Feb 22, 2009
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Afton, MN
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2006 Jetta TDI
Not to rob the thread, but sweet looking car!

I had an issue with no front plate after making my front end similar to a GLI, and recently put the front plate back on using a tow hook mounted plate from US Mill Works (google them). idk if Iowa has front plate laws, but MN does... I hate it.
 

spooner miller

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06 Jetta BRM
Thanks, yea i had to put the front plate on.. i hate front plates..

Here are the pics of the bearings from 5 years ago before i installed them. I have a spare head if this didn't work but i'm more of a "let's just try it and see what happens" type of guy. So please don't be a hater. I cut the bearings with a dremel tool just slightly, enough for oil to travel across. I started the cut at the oil port and stopped the cut just before the end of the bearing. I deleted EGR valve and cooler, gutted the cat and ran 3" back exhaust and made my own cold air intake. My fiance with the "lead foot" has been getting 52 mpg average with 30 mile trips everyday. Runs absolutely perfect. Still need to have Kerma chip it.
Thanks, Eric




 

Henrick

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Waiting for the 'after' pics! Be sure to take pics of each cam lobe if you decide to take it out. Also the lifters :)
 

zanzabar

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Oct 18, 2002
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Petaluma, CA
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2004 Jetta BEW 5spd (dual duty track car and daily driver beater)
An update for information concerning the engineered cam and rocker bolts..

The rocker shaft bolts are the reason that the #1 and #5 cam top bearings get a wear pattern on the inner edge of the bearing. The problem is yet another design issue for the PD motors. On the #2, 3 and ...#4 bearing caps, there are two rocker bolts torqued at equal spacing that go through the cam cap. On the #1 and #5 cam caps, there is a single bolt toward the inside of the cam cap. This offset loading is warping the cam cap causing the offset wear.
Frank, I have a question here. I did this job in March 2009 on my BEW Jetta using parts you supplied:
8 BEW Cam Follower 038 109 309 C
10 BEW Camshaft Cam Bearing Cap Bolts 038 103 714
8 BEW/ BRM Rocker Arm Shaft Bolt 038103 714 A
5 BEW/ BRM Camshaft Bearings 038-103-6730B-GLB

The torque I put on these bolts was 6 ftlbs + 90deg on the cam cap bolts, and 15 ftlbs + 90deg on the rocker arm shaft bolts. Recent inspection after 45k miles is that all cam lobes and lifters look ok except for #1 exhaust which has visible wear on the medial surface of the lobe and the lifter is visibly worn as well. Is it possible that the torque on the caps and rocker shafts is partly to blame here and I can alleviate this somewhat by re-torquing properly to relieve the cocking on the #1 cam cap?

Also, why is the torque I used so much smaller than what you list above? I assume that's because I have the OEM style TTY bolts and your torque specs are for your reusable ones?
 
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James & Son

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2006 Jetta
Frank, I have a question here. I did this job in March 2009 on my BEW Jetta using parts you supplied:
8 BEW Cam Follower 038 109 309 C
10 BEW Camshaft Cam Bearing Cap Bolts 038 103 714
8 BEW/ BRM Rocker Arm Shaft Bolt 038103 714 A
5 BEW/ BRM Camshaft Bearings 038-103-6730B-GLB

The torque I put on these bolts was 6 ftlbs + 90deg on the cam cap bolts, and 15 ftlbs + 90deg on the rocker arm shaft bolts. Recent inspection after 45k miles is that all cam lobes and lifters look ok except for #1 exhaust which has visible wear on the medial surface of the lobe and the lifter is visibly worn as well. Is it possible that the torque on the caps and rocker shafts is partly to blame here and I can alleviate this somewhat by re-torquing properly to relieve the cocking on the #1 cam cap?

Also, why is the torque I used so much smaller than what you list above? I assume that's because I have the OEM style TTY bolts and your torque specs are for your reusable ones?
I am in the process of looking at my followers at this very moment. Once the center of a new black follower wears through you must replace it as the metal beneath is soft and picks up on the lobe. Just replace the followers that show metal and add 1.5 ounces of Zddplus to your oil and check it in 35000 km. Also remove any metal from the lobe that may have picked up. I thought it was a gouge at first but it is metal transferred from the scored black follower.
Edit I now see you had addressed this to Frank. He does need to reply to another post here as well.
 
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2footbraker

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zanzabar, why did you use the TTY torque on Frank's bolts? They would be horribly over-torqued and probably damaged if you did.
 

oldpoopie

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zanzabar, why did you use the TTY torque on Frank's bolts? They would be horribly over-torqued and probably damaged if you did.
I believe back then Frank hadn't supplied the non tty bolts yet, so he used OEM bolts.
 

Franko6

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Jetta, 99, Silver`
Frank,

Read the new no drill thread, so just double checking because I was thinking there was one time you changed the procedure on the bottom bearings for those that went with the drilling procedure. I think I was one of the first group that got your bearings before you started removing the tang so my bottom bearings are the same orientation as stock. I think it was later on you were recommending to flip the bottom bearing around with the drilling procedure? Anyways, I was just wondering if you could clarify the bottom bearing situation for those that drill. Thanks
Nic a bod,

Even as I used to drill, the top bearing was radially slotted. Also, the bottom bearing was reversed. Otherwise, any improvement for oil wedge will be lost through the original oiling hole. The point is to change the oiling path; not add to it. As I do it now, the path cut on the exterior of the bearing moves oil from the original galley hole to the top bearing slot. I think continuing the oiling as if it were a crankshaft bearing improves the total amount of oil that can come out of the bearing.

Please understand, the main reason for the oiling slot in the top bearing is to allow oil to eject from the bearing, doubling the oil to the cam followers.
 
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