BRM cam's to choose from... Lets discuss

Spike_africa

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So there seems to be a few choices now for cams. I know many of us are at the point were it needs to be changed or will need to be changed again as a OEM one was used before aftermarket stepped in. I figured this would be a good place to gather our scatered knowledge of the cam choices as of now.

OEM VW: Terrible idea and will wear out again
Colt stage 1: Better then stock power? won't wear out
Colt Stage 2: Even better power, won't wear out
Frank06 Stage 1:Better then stock, won't wear out
Frank06 stage 2: Even better power, won't wear out

Here is where the questions come in. What are the gains, if any, from these aftermarket cams? I have looked and looked and didn't find much info on them. Or how they affect the power band or drive ability of the car. Something you really worry about on a DSG equipped car. Will a tune need to be done to address the extra lift and duration?

I think I saw one person with a Frank06 stage 2 say he made 5hp more then without it. Didn't see a graph or anything else on it.

Like many of you I am over 80k miles on mine now. I know it will need to be replaced soon. I always do my research before getting into the motor incase there is better info out there then what I know currently.

Lets get into it....
 

A5INKY

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This has been discussed ad nauseam. I do a lot of PD cams though and have installed OE, Colt and Frank's. I can speak from experience.

I think there is a lot of marketing effort for the aftermarket bump sticks but I remain a bit of a skeptic. I honestly don't think a "cure" has been found for the tragic PD head design, or ever will be. Best we can do is assemble best practices for parts design, install and maintenance. In this regard I think both Colt and Frank have made improvements to the OE design that will prolong cam life. Those specific improvements alone do not make the cams actually robust by my definition though. I think Frank's modded bearings add an important extra piece. That (and for other reasons that are not techical) is the reason I choose to install Franks's cam for my customers.

As for performance and economy gains, I remain a skeptic too. Even the "Stage II" cams are not radically different than OE. Yes there is a little more lift and overall profile is different, but there are so many other variables to getting air in and out of the cylinders that expecting a mild cam alone to make a huge improvement is wishful thinking. Combine that bigger cam with porting, multi angle valve job, and other mods and the cam can help more. Our engines are somewhat Lego-like and that parts can mixed and matched to upgrade, but all the pieces have to work together.

So, to summarize, I like Frank's cam and bearings, got a great warranty too that I match with a labor warranty. I believe in and install them. I just do so with eyes wide open as to the possibility it won't be the last cam, make "X" more HP nor increase FE by "Y". If those other benefits are realized - BONUS!
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Problem with "performance" cams is there's no data available. People claim improvement, but often it's based on how the car drove previously when needing a cam replacement. And try to find a before and after dyno with a PD replacement cam: you won't.

Regarding wear, one way to look it is VW cams last about 200K. All of them. If you use the correct oil in a PD (meaning not 5W30) then OE cams will easily last that long.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
I have several PD customers with over 300k miles, valve cover never been off... including BRMs. I admit it is a weak design, but that doesn't mean it cannot live a decent length of time. Who keeps a car 300k miles anyways? Not many people. Guess what? At 300k miles, the valve guides are all worn out too.

Until someone comes along with a replacement cam that has a better track record, it is all speculation. I'm talking real-world use. Now as far as performance gains are concerned, I really don't know. A BRM can enjoy a 50% increase in output with software alone... which tells me the engine already has enough breathing ability and fueling ability as it left the factory as-is. And even at that level of tune, the first thing that will probably die is the stupid BW turbocharger anyways, no magic camshaft is gonna help that.

FWIW, I don't see any VE TDI cams failing, ever. I've seen a picture of one once, though. But otherwise, the only VE TDI cams I replace are from damage from a belt/moron/tooef mishap.
 
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Spike_africa

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Excellent info thus far guys. That is my main point to oilhammer. No actual data to backup these performance cams.
 

scrichy84

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Awesome info...but right now at 176k miles, I don't see myself doing a cam at 200k. My mileage was over 50mpg for 2013, and the power is all there. I don't even think my dengine was fully broke in until 120k. My turbo actuator, now that is a different story, what a piece of junk.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Yep. The actuators on the BW turbos are about 15 times more likely to fail than the ones on Garrett turbos, yet Garrett sells them separately. Luckily for the CR folks, if your turbo actually lives long enough to need just an actuator, Volkswagen will sell you one of those by itself.

We're starting to see quite a few actuator failures on BRM cars now that they are getting older. :(

I still think they are a decent car, though.
 

kdawg89

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Yep. The actuators on the BW turbos are about 15 times more likely to fail than the ones on Garrett turbos, yet Garrett sells them separately. Luckily for the CR folks, if your turbo actually lives long enough to need just an actuator, Volkswagen will sell you one of those by itself.





We're starting to see quite a few actuator failures on BRM cars now that they are getting older. :(





I still think they are a decent car, though.





It is definitely too bad that the MK5 has these few nagging issues but the way I look at is at least most of the issues are at least fixable with an upgraded part. The only 2 that come to mind that really are not is potentially the cam which even the stock cam goes 200k with proper maintenance so you can expect at least that and almost certainly more out of frank06 cams. The only one that really frustrates me is the egr cooler because the only "upgrade" is a delete and I don't like that. In my opinion if you want a diesel powered car mk5 is still the best choice all things considered. The real shame is the lack of diesel powered cars to choose from in North America.





Sent from my Lumia 1520 using Tapatalk
 

A5INKY

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Regarding wear, one way to look it is VW cams last about 200K. All of them. If you use the correct oil in a PD (meaning not 5W30) then OE cams will easily last that long.
"All of them"? Eh, no. My personal car was purchased with about 15K miles on it. I had no tune or mods and ran only 5w40 505.01 spec oil. Car was dealer serviced before that - holed a lifter by 49k miles. Granted, the previous owner's dealer could have been putting 5w20 conventional oil in it by mistake. I have seen other "legitimate" cam failures in customer cars at far less than 200k miles since then too. Gotta be careful with absolute statements.

I have several PD customers with over 300k miles, valve cover never been off... including BRMs. I admit it is a weak design, but that doesn't mean it cannot live a decent length of time. Who keeps a car 300k miles anyways? Not many people. Guess what? At 300k miles, the valve guides are all worn out too...
Some last, some don't. I do not doubt you have these 300K mile plus BRMs with original cams that you service. Issue I think is that the overall design is not robust enough to handle the many and varied tolerances introduced by all the contributors that effect cam wear. Sometimes maintenance, environment, driving habits and overall manufacturing tolerances all conspire to keep the cam happy a long time. Knock one or two of these factors a little out a whack and you have a dead cam. VW came up short on the PD cam. A few surviving cams at high mileage does not exonerate VW of their deficiency.

...FWIW, I don't see any VE TDI cams failing, ever. I've seen a picture of one once, though. But otherwise, the only VE TDI cams I replace are from damage from a belt/moron/tooef mishap.
Just came across my first dead ALH cam, exhaust lobes just like the dead PD cams. Then I learned from the machinist I was looking at a dead Prothe (Chinatastic) head. In the scrap bin it went. Add inferior aftermarket part to your list.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Oh I won't argue the PD cam is a weak spot, one only need LOOK at it to see that. Narrow lobes, flat tappets, and hydraulic lash adjustment... trifecta of fail. But still, I say that most can live a decent life with 100% proper care.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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What I meant by "all of them" is that rotary pump car cams get tired, too. One guru I know replaces cams in 1Zs and AHUs at 200K. They're cheap, so it's no big deal. And VW seemed to have a problem with cams in '01 TDIs, lots of them failed before 100K.

And like you posted, if an owner (or dealer) used the wrong oil on a PD the cam won't make it to 200K. But if 5W40 505.01 oil is used they seem to go that far. I don't think it's the life span of these cams that annoys people but the cost of replacement. We have a cam and lifter kit for ALH cars for $155, compared to $600-750 for PDs. That's a big difference.
 

Bob_Fout

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FWIW, I don't see any VE TDI cams failing, ever. I've seen a picture of one once, though. But otherwise, the only VE TDI cams I replace are from damage from a belt/moron/tooef mishap.
What about some of the early ALHs with butter-cams? Probably already been replaced by now...
 

bl00tdi

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Oh I won't argue the PD cam is a weak spot, one only need LOOK at it to see that. Narrow lobes, flat tappets, and hydraulic lash adjustment... trifecta of fail. But still, I say that most can live a decent life with 100% proper care.
Plus the oiling slots on the bearings being on the load side of the head. It's amazing these cams last as long as they do, all things considered. With that said, the PD design is an incredibly neat and efficient package when viewed conceptually.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
That's the weird thing about those cam bearings... first, that they even thought to put them there at all (most OHC engines, including all other VAG engines, don't have them), but also the fact that they all seem to wear the exact same way, and only to a certain point, and then pretty much stop.

Seriously, I've looked at cam bearings that had 30k miles on them, and ones that had 280k miles on them, and everything inbetween: they look the same. Strange.
 

Franko6

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We have people looking for 'performance' numbers. The problem is, we don't think this car has a 'performance' engine! Not in the sense that we find it reasonable to load it up with big horsepower and see if it won't break, because it will.

I can see that some PD cams last longer than others, but most often, when you compare driving styles and conditions, you find the answer. The car is not a city stop-and-go car. I think that is rough on this cam. It likes cooler climates, so, it's not the greatest choice for very hot climates. We've seen cars with 440,000 miles on the OEM cam. But that was a '06 Jetta driving back and forth along the Canadian Border between Michigan and Idaho. Cooler climates, run all at highway speeds.

That being said, we did make special efforts to make a cam that would last. We think, optimally, we would expect 250,000 miles from a cam/ lifter set. If they do that, I doubt we will receive any vicious complaints. The good news, we've already got a cam setup that's done it. What is more, we have had Zero cam failures in 4 years. THAT is OUR idea of PERFORMANCE!

We have questions from a limited audience about the dynos to show performance improvements for our modified cam. Quite honestly, most people driving the BEW BRM and BHW are a lot more interested in the car's performance in longevity and economy. That is the ultimate purpose of this diesel engine. Our cam is not designed particularly for blistering performance, but to allow a reasonable amount of extra lift, which translates into efficiency, without working the engine into an early grave. The merit of our cam design is smooth transitions between point of opening and the peak of the lobe, which reduces the forces necessary to open the valve.

That is not something that can be translated into dynos because the dyno doesn't care about smooth transitions. If you want maximized dynos, your opening and closing would look more like a square wave than a sine wave. But then, your cam's life would be measured in minutes...

Also, we most certainly agree with OH's observations with cam bearing wear... it is quite predictable. This also is misunderstood why we modify cam bearings. The main purpose for the cam bearing mod is to get more oil to the cam followers.

We alter the cam bearings to make the oil flow to the top bearing shell, which allows oil to squirt out the small gap between the cam and bearing. This is additional oil flow prevents overheating of cam followers. The other advantage is that the oil has an opportunity to build an oil wedge to help protect the cam journal and bearings.

Our next improvement for the PD cylinder heads....

We are at the cusp of receiving an align bore bar to fix another problem of the PD cylinder head. With the cam removed, we are torquing the rocker shafts onto the cam caps, then align boring the journals. The rocker shafts place an unequal load onto the cam caps and bearings. In the same way that many engine blocks are bored with a torque plate to compensate for the loading of head bolts that warp a cylinder out-of-round, we are using the rockers to load the cam journals. With the bolts in place, this will correct the problem most often noticed on the #1 and #5 caps, which have uneven wear. The new tool is also necessary for a cylinder head that has warped due to overheat.
 

Franko6

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Problem with "performance" cams is there's no data available. People claim improvement, but often it's based on how the car drove previously when needing a cam replacement. And try to find a before and after dyno with a PD replacement cam: you won't.

Regarding wear, one way to look it is VW cams last about 200K. All of them. If you use the correct oil in a PD (meaning not 5W30) then OE cams will easily last that long.
Peter,

Starting with your comment "no data", we have data. LOTS of cams, with improved fuel economy in excess of what they ever got before. If the engine never was able to obtain the increase in mileage prior to our cam, you can't speculate and say it's not an improvement.

The second thing: "Try and find a dyno"... We have been offered 'free' testing of our cam (If we would offer several 'free' reprofiled cams). Side-by-side comparisons.. From "impartial persons". We have seen how 'impartiality' works. Thank you, but NO thank you..

Our whole purpose was to design away from problems; not create them.

We want to be perfectly clear on this point. We do not think creating a big power PD cam is realistic. The reason is that when pushed, the PD head cracks between the injector hole and the intake seats. When pushed hard enough, it will blow out under the intake seat. The secondary crack location is at the glow plug hole. I will explain this in a separate thread, with pictures.

The cam design we have has shown DECREASED EGT's. That is what you want in this problem head. Reducing exhaust gas temperatures is, in itself, optimizing fuel burn, which is the point of our mild additional lift. A cooler head is less prone to cracking. In other words, our goal is longevity. That does not dyno well. But we do have a dyno-less track record with our cams and it's better than good; it's great!

"VW cams last 200k..." It depends on which engine you are talking about... BEW's, maybe so. BHW's less likely. BRM's.. I don't think so... Talk about data... We've seen enough BRM cams worn out at 70k. 200k cams in the BRM are the exception, not the rule. There are a LOT of PD cams run with the correct oil, reasonable maintenance, with poor life expectancy. We see the results DAILY.

I'm willing to bet many parts vendors sell BEW cams to install into BRM engines. That was one of our first recommendations to reduce the excessive loading on the BRM engine... change to the BEW cam's less radical injector lobe. Except for the injector lift, BRM and BEW cams are identical. When you finish the redesign and get away from what amounts to a solid lifter valve lobe profile, there are great benefits.
 
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James & Son

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I can't see slaping the outside of the cam follower with the cam lobe that bad a thing as it traps more oil on the inside of the lobe before it is drawn across the follower.

Its the center of the follower that wears out caused by the injection loading the base circle of the cam against the zero clearance follower. In other words the bearings do not necessarily take all the injection loads but I am sure the center of the follower is taking a beating unnecessarily because of clearance and rocking up down type loads on the cam.

Edit: The beating I am talking about takes place on the compression and firing stroke when the injector fires and the valves and follower are locked under compression.

Frank when do you plan on having this equipment in place. I think you have had plans to do this for a while now. Another year or sooner?
 
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IndigoBlueWagon

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The OP asks about power and driveability, not FE. And I'm glad to see you agree that you don't have comparative dyno results. I'm dubious about there being any power increases from modified cams, and it appears you are, too. 200K is general comment. I've replaced cams in my own rotary pump cars at that mileage or lower (my ALH OE cam went 155K). Oilhammer would say they last much longer. And PD cams do fail sooner when 5w30 oil is used, a point that's been covered here many times.
 

Spike_africa

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Good to know info about Frank's cam. I don't ever plan to make this a big turbo, big injector car. I just don't care about that with this small motor. But making more power, being more efficient, and having a longer lasting cam is a nice promise. I just wish there was some sort of back to back dyno data to show what changed in power curves if at all. Not that it 100% matters if it makes more power. But I would be happy with a 5hp bump on the top end.
 

A5INKY

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I honestly doubt you will see a big enough change on the dyno to get outside of basic dyno tolerances, but I am curious to see if my expectation plays out or not. If Frank (or even Geoff, for that matter) would pick up the tab for the dyno pulls. I would do the work, coordinate the dyno pulls and report the results. Trick will be to find a customer wanting to upgrade their cam while the OE one is not yet damaged. Best chance of real numbers would require good controls in place so that we completely isolate the cam. I see this to mean:

1. Same dyno ran by same operator at same time of two consecutive days during a time of year with more consistent weather patterns (to minimize need for correction factors)
2. OE stock car (BRM preferred as it has the poorest record for cam life) with healthy OE cam and no other modifications.
3. In case of belt stretch (common issue) torsion should be set back to 0.0 for baseline pulls. Injector lash should be verified to 180 degrees back from full stroke.
4. Aftermarket cam set to exact same torsion and injector lash.

I've now thrown it out there, any takers?
 

James & Son

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How about this. One car 3 cams.
Indigo supplies the stock cam.
And kerma and franko supply their best.
I think A5Inky can be counted on to be impartial with say another witness.
We all chip in to buy the dyno time.
 

A5INKY

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How about this. One car 3 cams.
Indigo supplies the stock cam.
And kerma and franko supply their best.
I think A5Inky can be counted on to be impartial with say another witness.
We all chip in to buy the dyno time.
Sorry James, but this will never work. As a consumer, product comparisons are great, I get that part. But I can tell you that the two main North American PD cam makers will never support such a test. One of them does not actively market his product for performance so much as longevity, and the other markets through a company that fancies themselves so utterly with peer that they would never risk any kind of objective comparison. Then there is the fact that Darkside and Dibilas also make performance PD cams too.

Honestly, I don't believe there would be enough performance difference to see anything on the dyno anyway. My motivation is to prove out my theory that mild TDI performance cams do little for performance in a OE application. I'm not knocking them, as a little more lift can be a good thing in a build that justifies it. However, if you want more power, there are much better steps to take before looking at the cam. I think PD cam "upgrades" are best motivated by factors that are not measured on a dyno.

My proposal was to compare one of the two popular cams to OE. For a test like that the cam maker would benefit by having an objective comparison available for marketing, hence my suggestion they pay for the dyno runs. There would be no downside for this maker as any gains would not be in contrast to their competition but to OE. Trying to set up a PD cam "shootout" would invariably start a pi$$ing match, one in which I am not interested in taking part.
 
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Spike_africa

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Just to add more to this. I did my fuel filter change, and oil and filter change yesterday. I pulled the valve cover when I had the oil draining. My car has 84k miles. We are the 2nd owners who go it from a local VW dealer with 30k miles. Maintance before hand, who knows. What the gf did before I came around at 50k miles, who knows. However the cam and lifters are in great shape. There is literally no wear on the cam at all. Which was a nice surprise. I will check it again in another 10k miles when I change the motor oil again. I'm using OE spec oil.
 
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Franko6

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Spike,

We have seen good cams at that mileage, however be aware that cam lobe wear is not always plain to see. In order to measure the height of the cams, you have to remove the rocker shafts, which isn't at all difficult. The bolts are throw-away, but we can supply a set that is inexpensive and reusable.

We use a 2-3" mike and measure from the base circle to the top of the lobe. The brand-new stock cams measure 2.430"- 2.432". If wear is below 2.424", it is worn out. Looks can be deceiving, but the micrometer doesn't lie.

Use the best oil you can find. Good luck to you...

Pete, we seem to be jousting semantics. The whole point of a cam that creates better economy in a diesel is also one that, by extracting more energy from the fuel, IS more power. Quite simply, the project would have to be screwed up real bad for a .020" taller lift cam with more duration at the cam peak to LOSE power. The main purpose was to avoid the wear issue. Secondary interest was to create a by-product of performance enhancement.

Although there are so many who would like to create a monster torque, tire-burning machine out of a PD, the head runs hot in it's stock form. Our goal is to gracefully create the best performance without overly destructive consequences. That means a cam that can actually reduce EGT's while curing some of the vexing problems of this engine.

Dax, I think that sums it up fairly well. There is more to a cam than a dyno will necessarily show. I've said it enough... show me a dyno for longevity and I'll be interested. I appreciate the business you bring my way and I am always happy to help a like-minded guy.
 
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oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
We use a 2-3" mike and measure from the base circle to the top of the lobe. The brand-new stock cams measure 2.430"- 2.432". If wear is below 2.424", it is worn out. .
Where did this information come from? I find a wear limit of .15mm (sorry, I don't speak 'inches') in Alldata, and that is for axial play (the only dimension given). Nothing for lobes. Which I find puzzling. I also have found that even a cam that LOOKS worn (no need for a micrometer) can often still continue to work just fine for a while longer. Which is also puzzling, since the only other engines I have ever come across with flat cam problems were domestic pushrod lumps, and those go from running fine to dead cylinder in no time. The PDs don't seem to do that.

I'm betting the cams that you set a micrometer to that you label as "worn out" are in engines that are running, and will continue to run, perfectly fine for quite a while longer. In some cases, 100k mile longer (from my experience). I think in many cases, we could compare it to valve guides. At 100k miles, they are indeed worn. Are they "worn out"? Well, I dunno... if the engine is still running OK, no excessive oil use or anything strange, then is it really worth pulling the head off to put new guides in? I wouldn't. Ask the same question again at 200k. Are they worn more? Sure. Once again, are they worn out? Probably. Engine still running OK? Yep. Are we gonna pull the head off? Not a chance.

Eventually, if the owner still has the car at 300k miles (some will, most will not), they probably either won't care about anything wearing in the engine so long as it is still running well enough. They've often already given up caring about the bad door latches, the missing splash shields, the headliner falling down, and all the other things they've let fall apart on the car. So long as it starts, runs, and moves, they're good.

I think at some point and time, one has to look at the PD's "vexing problems", and think "hey, this isn't so bad, with normal upkeep, this engine will last as long or longer than any other car's engine I have ever owned anyways, and that is just fine with me". Because that is pretty much how I see it through my customers' eyes. If the cam wears enough, or more to the point, if the lifter wears enough that it causes a loss of power in a cylinder (holed lifter), then we fix it. Just the same as when a brake pad wears out. If not, we just keep on driving and enjoying the ride. ;)

And this isn't to say I don't see PD cam/lifter problems. I keep new ones on the shelf. But I also see plenty that never need the valve cover removed for anything, ever, for as long as the people would dare own a car anyways. Who cares if a cam is worn out at 250k miles if you never keep a car longer than 150k?
 
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Franko6

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We get new cams all the time. We measured them. We know your feelings about stock cams. We have plenty of votes otherwise, too. It's not hard for me to replace a cam that arcs in two directions, and that is so common here, I don't know how you can be so immune from seeing it.

To be quite honest, the fact the car will run 'normal' for so long, with a cam to the point you can hole a lifter and it's STILL RUNNING NORMAL, EATING UP THE OIL PUMP AND TRASHING A VALVE STEM, CUTTING AN ARC INTO THE INJECTOR LOBE...that is more a problem than an advantage to me. We don't think tearing metal off a lifter and throwing that into the oil pan is a very good idea. I don't know how we can be at such opposite ends of the spectrum, except that perhaps you are focused mostly on engines in a decent arc around the St Louis area and we see plenty shipped to us from all over and the Southern States. Hotter; more wear potential, we think.

And we do see plenty of good cams... never said we don't. But I can show you a pile of bad cams right now and ask VW how many they've seen below 150,000 miles. They won't tell you, but they know. They sell a TON of them.

A valve guide in a running engine is just a valve guide I'm not replacing. However, when you are trying to reset a valve and VAG says tolerance is okay with .051" rock measurement, I disagree. We replace the guide so we can decently cut the seat.
 

A5INKY

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Louisville, KY
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI, 2002 Eurovan Westphalia VR6
This is a case of differing perspectives IMO. My own falls somewhere in between OH and Frank, I think. I can certainly see OH's perspective in that all cars are wearing out and comprised of nothing but used parts. Striking a balance between an immediate problem and one that will continue to return good service for the owner is where an experienced technician's judgement is quite valuable. Fact is a PD will run for a long time with well worn cam, followers and bearings. On the other hand, Frank see's a lot of those cases where excessive wear went unchecked and/or unremediated which then led to very costly repairs for the customer.

I have seen many a post here of people spooked by the spectre of PD cam failure and replacing a serviceable cam on a preventative basis. I think this is a bit silly as all cams wear in time. On the other hand there are those that expect their TDI to last 400-500K miles with nothing but oil changes and TB jobs who drive their cars around with perpetual CELs and all manner of unhappy noises and vibrations. When their cams die, the job is typically much more costly than it would have had to be had the cam been looked at by an experienced tech at TB time.

My strategy with this issue is to look at the cam at every PD TB time. I don't disassemble anything, nor get out my micrometer. I have seen enough of them as they die to use my judgement on the remaining service life. It is not uncommon for me to see some lobe nose wear but some remaining chamfer and nice flat followers. For these cases I inform the customer but also let them know that I think they are safe until the next belt in 80K miles when we will look at it again. If they choose the new cam anyway, I'm good with that. If not, I'm good with that too.

My goal is to never have a PD car under my care hole a follower. If the cam is replaced before that happens the job is all in the top end and not too much more (labor) costly than a TB job. If the follower holes, there is now damaging debris in the bottom end and the job just got much bigger to fix, with more uncertainty involved.

I never refuse to reinstall an OE cam. I do prefer Frank's kit though when the customer will pay for it as I think his set-up has value and merit. An open and honest conversation with the customer is always the answer for determining which direction to go.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
My strategy with this issue is to look at the cam at every PD TB time. I don't disassemble anything, nor get out my micrometer. I have seen enough of them as they die to use my judgement on the remaining service life. It is not uncommon for me to see some lobe nose wear but some remaining chamfer and nice flat followers. .
That was pretty much my strategy, too, until I saw that more times than not, a cam that showed a little visible wear at 100k was still doing its job at 200k. So at 100k, I simply stopped looking on cars I have a good track record on. Because on those cars, I never saw any [visible] wear.

Of course, Frank, you probably see more broken stuff because that is your primary pursuit, fixing broken things. That is only part of what I do, much of my TDI work is just keeping them from breaking in the first place. You are in a much more rural area, the number of vehicles on the road is much less. Plus, you don't do everything I do (like selling tires, etc.), so many people may only see you IF something major is broken. The hum-drum daily stuff, not so much. Like my machine shop, who ONLY sees broken stuff, because as he puts it "if it doesn't break, I'll never see it". So his opinion on what is good and bad is certainly subjective. He does a LOT of Toyota 2AZ-FE engine block jobs, where the head bolt holes strip out. But the fact of the matter is, there are still many more on the road that never break... there are a LOT of Camry models sold here.

So I think that is probably why we experience different things. Cars I see at each and every PM interval, like clockwork, are the norm. Lots of gasser VAGs, too. :p
 
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