Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

[dieseldorf]

Just when you were getting comfortable with the new PD engine oils, VAG does it again!!

Volkswagen standard (releases)


VOLKSWAGEN 504.00 and 507.00 describe formulated low SAPS oils special - engine oils with small sulfur, phosphorus and sulfate ash portion. Particularly for the new models with WIV and EURO4 petrol engines and/or diesel engines with soot particle filter.

-- Motul

VOLKSWAGEN gives oil standard some lubricant manufacturers releases for the new Diesel specification 507.00 and the new specification 504.00 for Otto engines gave. The Wolfsburg manufacturer published no details to the new engine oil standards still.



The new products "Shell Helix Ultra VX" and "Vapsoil 507 00" are applicable according to manufacturer in all vehicles of the company marks with Longlife service. It is mixable and on all valid extended oil change intervals (WIV) laid out with all usual oils. Besides provide the special additives - particularly suitably for the employment in direct injecting FSI engines for less abrasion at the highly loaded construction units and is at the same time appropriate for the use of soot particle filters.



In the context of the co-operation of Volkswagen AUDI partner service (VAPS) and Shell VAPS besides the Shell product will drive out.

Also, the new Castrol SLX LongLife III received the appropriate after-sales releases according to data of the lubricant producer after VOLKSWAGEN 504.00 and 507.00. The lubricant with "Clean performance Technology" on basis of a formulation of low ash is aligned to the requirements of diesel engines with particle filter, however according to manufacturer even for further models will in particular be applicable.

 

[jasonTDI]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Too bad we can't find it here in the states like they can in Europe. Not easily at least.

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

J, this stuff is newer than new....I am not certain it's really ready for sale, even in Europe.

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Shell was involved in the developement of a new engine test for VAG on these two new specs. It is very rigourous in that it permits no more than 50% ash build up within the DPF over a certain time when utilizing a low SAPS* oil.


*low sulphated ash, phosphorous and sulphur content

 

[TornadoRed]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Too bad we can't find it here in the states like they can in Europe. Not easily at least.

We don't need it, because our TDIs don't have particulate filters. Perhaps in 2007, though, as that may be the only way to get new diesels in the CARB states.

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

not today, but if diesels are still for sale in a few years, we'll surely have the DPFs fitted.

 

[philh]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

not today, but if diesels are still for sale in a few years, we'll surely have the DPFs fitted.

...and rest assured that VW will have yet another oil that you can only (according to them) buy at the dealer!

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

at some point VW will consolidate all their oil standards so there aren't so many "decisions"...it's confusing for everyone..dealers, owners and independant shops.

 

[SUNRG]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

at some point VW will consolidate all their oil standards so there aren't so many "decisions"...it's confusing for everyone..dealers, owners and independant shops.

exactly. VW is at the cutting edge of diesel oil technologies. without engine, oil and fuel innovation diesels will disappear.

instead of getting bent out of shape about new VW oil specs, try smiling and being thankful that the company you support is constantly trying to balance diesel efficiency, real environmental concerns, and an excellent driving experience.

also, consider that you've bought a european car - primarily designed for europeans - which IMO is great. europeans are expected to be more aware of their automobile's needs.

Fred's is a TDI enthusiasts site and while a little "whining" about having to use an advanced OEM oil spec. is expected, the volumes and volumes of whining on this website amazes me.

If there's a record in the guiness book of world records for "most whiny posts in an auto enthusiasts forum" I bet the TDIclub Fuels and Lubricants forum has it!

And we're whining about technology enabling oil specifications

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

instead of getting bent out of shape about new VW oil specs, try smiling and being thankful that the company you support is constantly trying to balance diesel efficiency, real environmental concerns, and an excellent driving experience.

A-MEN !!


(I'd much rather deal with an lubricant that's been developed around a specific powerplant vs. resorting to the API lowest common denominator philosophy.)

 

[Dan_Ruddock]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

instead of getting bent out of shape about new VW oil specs, try smiling and being thankful that the company you support is constantly trying to balance diesel efficiency, real environmental concerns, and an excellent driving experience.

Nonsense! Cars should be designed to be able to run oil off the local parts store shelf or in other words be idiot proof. The dealers can't even get it right how do expect John Q public to not screw up his car. I manufacture a electro mechanical product myself and I deal with people who refuse to read my instruction sheet and screw things up (check my bio). Honda and Toyota build cars with a broad range of oils that can be used and there engine don't fall apart. Yes I realize they don't build turbos and if they did I am sure they would probably recommend synthetic oil which can be found anywhere. I too am like you guys and want to take the best care of my car, I just ordered a case of 10-40w amsoil hp AMO but the general public is not like us. I think VW's ultra specific oil spec is hurting VW not helping. Dan

 

[TooSlick]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standa

DD,

These new VW specs correspond roughly to the new ACEA, "C2" specification for low viscosity, low SAPS engine oils. This is the new trend in Europe, where the additive content of engine oils has become a major contributor to exhaust emissions with the advent of very low sulphur fuels. Some of the new aftertreatment, emissions systems are also easily degraded from burning various chemical compounds.

TS

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standa

Yes, there's been a lot written about this new standard recently.

C2






Stable, stay-in-grade oil intended for use as catalyst compatible oil in vehicles with DPF and TWC in high performance car and light van diesel and gasoline engines designed to be capable of using low friction, low viscosity oils with a HTHS higher than 2.9 mPa.s.

These oils will increase the DPF and TWC life and maintain the vehicle's fuel economy.

 

[SUNRG]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Dan, I'm happy to agree to disagree with you, but you wrote:

Cars should be designed to be able to run oil off the local parts store shelf or in other words be idiot proof.

followed by...

I manufacture a electro mechanical product myself and I deal with people who refuse to read my instruction sheet and screw things up

why didn't you just make your "electro mechanical product" idiot proof?

some people have PD manuals that actually specifying 505.00 oil, and for this VW has no excuse, but for everyone else who purchased a european car with a high tech diesel engine and has not read through the manual...

just think Dan, do you really want to live in a world where engine and emissions developments are limited by the oils on the shelves of Wal-Mart?

if so, let's just leave this as agreeing to disagree. personally, i want VW to constantly be pushing the envelope. i want the car of tomorrow to be cleaner, more-efficient and faster than the car of today and i'm happy to buy a high-tech application specific oil if necessary.

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

... i want VW to constantly be pushing the envelope. i want the car of tomorrow to be cleaner, more-efficient and faster than the car of today and i'm happy to buy a high-tech application specific oil if necessary.

the demands on ALL oils will continue to increase. We will be see more of the mfr. spec'ed oils and fluids.

Take a look at the Euro4 regulations coming into force and the new standards for the US beginning in 2007. Oil is being asked to do far more than it had to ten years ago. That's quite apparent. Generic standards just aren't going to cut it.

 

[Old Navy]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Fred's is a TDI enthusiasts site and while a little "whining" about having to use an advanced OEM oil spec. is expected, the volumes and volumes of whining on this website amazes me. Not bad for a 4000 lb 120" WB car running on regular.

If there's a record in the guiness book of world records for "most whiny posts in an auto enthusiasts forum" I bet the TDIclub Fuels and Lubricants forum has it!

I don't know about that statement, you should see the whiners on the Chrysler LX forums (Chrysler 300, Dodge Magnum, & Charger) if they ain't crying about poor service at dealership, electronic grimblins, oil specs, it because their cars (Hemi V8's) are CPU limited to 126 mph.

But God forbid you mention they are MB cross breeds, that can get one run off some those forums. Wonder what they think when they see Bosch, VDO and such on electronic parts, or seats that came directly from MB E320 sedans that have a part # that cross ref with MB seat. The Hemi uses MB electronic controls for the 4 cyl hydraulic turn off system, and requires the MB spec oil for that hydraulic system, has MB designed trans with same fluid spec's and service method of MB units. That's not to mention the drive by wire from MB the cars have.

Just filled my 2.7L Mag up and it did 20 mpg (20.3 to be exact) for all city (20,000 population) driving, and I have a size 15D lead foot for those who have never met me.

 

[Dan_Ruddock]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Sunrg, first off I have done the absolute best I can in making my product as idiot proof as possible which is why it has a reputation of being more reliable than my competitors products. Nothing is 100% bullet proof. As for VW the reason for the oil spec is so specific is VW is trying to squeeze PD into a head that was not designed for it (cam lobes too narrow)and not because VW is pushing the envelope. VW needs to design a new motor with plenty of space for large cam lobes and make it a push rod motor with the cam close to the crank so two simple gears can drive it and the gears will last the life of the motor. The low rev limit of a diesel does not need OHC but remember the TDI motor started life as a higher reving gasser. Yes they will have to run fuel lines from the unit injectors but an engine like that would be a lot more idiot proof. What ? mobil 1 truck & suv at walmart is not good enough!! nonsense Dan

 

[dieseldorf]

Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Castrol Introduces a New Revolutionary Oil for the BMW Group


Text courtesy BP Lubricants
edited 12-07-2004



‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’


Castrol, strategic partner of BMW, have developed a new lubricant with `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` in close cooperation with BMW, which sets new standards in the industry. Castrol SLX LL04 0W-30 is specially engineered to keep the engine and exhaust system clean, reducing harmful emissions to the environment. SLX LL04 is developed for the new generation of BMW’s with particulate filters and meets the latest specifications BMW Longlife-04. Due to its `Clean Performance TechnologyTM`, SLX LL04 reduces long term blocking of the particle filters and can be used in all BMW diesel and petrol engines (excluding M series). Castrol is the first lubricant manufacturer to bring a `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` oil onto the market.



BMW have started fitting diesel particulate filters (DPF’s) to their cars. Initially the BMW 5 series will be offered with a DPF, other models such as the new 3 series will follow. These new diesel engines fitted with a DPF need an engine oil based on new lubricant technology. Together with the engine management system the DPF ensures long-term reduction of particle emissions. In order to prolong the durability of the DPF the so called ‘Low SAPS’ oils are required. Castrol’s `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` is a totally new ‘Low SAPS’ formulation containing lower levels of Sulphated Ash, Phosphorous and Sulphur compared with conventional oils.



Castrol’s ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM‘ is specially engineered to keep the engine and exhaust system clean, reducing harmful emissions to the environment. High levels of metal-based additives in engine oil can contribute to long term blocking of exhaust filters and increased harmful emissions. ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’, from Castrol, uses low levels of these metal-based additives to prolong the life of the exhaust system. By keeping exhaust systems clear, Castrol’s ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’ provides superior power flow through the engine, maintaining vehicle performance and fuel economy.



With Castrol’s revolutionary `Clean Performance TechnologyTM`, new Castrol SLX LL04 meets the requirements of the future generation of both diesel and petrol engines of the BMW Group.





Key features and benefits of Castrol SLX LL04 0W-30:


Features:

New ‘Clean Performance TechnologyTM’
Special Fully Synthetic 0W-30 Low SAPS formulation
Compatible with Diesel Particulate Filters
Long drain capability
Approved to BMW Longlife-04 (including Longlife-01)


Benefits:

Cleaner environment (reduced emissions of harmful particulates from the exhaust)
Helps keep exhaust system clean
Maintains engine performance and fuel economy
Prolongs durability of the exhaust system
Fast cold start properties through 0W viscosity
Castrol SLX LL04 is the first engine oil, which fulfills the new BMW Longlife-04 specification. With the `Clean Performance TechnologyTM` it has a wide range of applications from the latest diesels fitted with DPF filters to new and existing petrol engine technology. The new product offers profitable opportunities for the BMW network. Castrol will support the dealers with tailor made marketing and communication concepts to exploit this new opportunity.

 

[tdijerry]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

vw does use the 505.01 oil in some gas engines here in the states.like all ready said i think vw will use one oil spec some time in the future.

 

[SUNRG]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Sunrg, first off...

The great news (according to your profile) is that you do <u>not</u> own a PD. I'm happy that you are unaffected by the 505.01 oil non-issue.

if you're confident that you can design a push rod diesel that will meet future emissions standards, get better fuel economy and be more powerful than today's diesels, and do it all using M1 T&SUV in it's current formulation - you are going to be one fantastically wealthy engineer

good luck! and please keep us posted!

 

[AndyH]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Nonsense! Cars should be designed to be able to run oil off the local parts store shelf or in other words be idiot proof.

Dan - don't loose sight of the fact that this is EXACTLY what VW has done - visit any of the auto parts stores in Germany or Belgium or the UK or ... and you'll find what you need on the shelf.

I don't think it's fair to blame VW if we in North America can't figure out that Quaker State doesn't define the high-quality point for lubricating oil.

As for specific manufacturer requirements for oil, on either side of the pond -- get used to that as well. Not only the Euro and Japanese vehicles, but more and more US automakers are forced to strengthen their oil requirements.

My wife's 2003 Saturn Vue has a 3.0 liter V6 made by Opel in the UK that's mated to a 5-speed auto tranny made in Japan. This is happening more and more among US automakers.

Andy

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Dan - don't loose sight of the fact that this is EXACTLY what VW has done - visit any of the auto parts stores in Germany or Belgium or the UK or ... and you'll find what you need on the shelf.

Andy, thanks for mentioning that. In addition, you can find the VAG spec oils in many larger stores and just about any petrol station...it's mainstream...with a capital M.

 

[Dan_Ruddock]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

All I am trying to say here folks is just how ludicrous the idea of only being able to get the proper oil for a car from a dealer or mail order. What if you go on long trip and a simple oil leak develops you fix it but oh s**t I left my 505.01 on the kitchen table and you are 500 miles from the nearest dealer who only has 505.00 in stock. Fuel and oil are the two things that should be readily available for any car sold in the USA period. Is anybody else out there willing to stand up with me and say the emperor is wearing no clothes. Yes sunrg your right I don't own a pd car and there is no way I would until I can buy oil for it anywhere like the rest of the cars out there except maybe the enzo but that is a special case. If I could afford to own that car I would be willing to put up with almost anything. Dan

 

[dubvulture]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

I just keep 2 liters in the trunk. But then I used to be a Boy Scout.

 

[Rustynuts]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

instead of getting bent out of shape about new VW oil specs, try smiling and being thankful that the company you support is constantly trying to balance diesel efficiency, real environmental concerns, and an excellent driving experience.

Nonsense! Cars should be designed to be able to run oil off the local parts store shelf or in other words be idiot proof. The dealers can't even get it right how do expect John Q public to not screw up his car. I manufacture a electro mechanical product myself and I deal with people who refuse to read my instruction sheet and screw things up (check my bio). Honda and Toyota build cars with a broad range of oils that can be used and there engine don't fall apart. Yes I realize they don't build turbos and if they did I am sure they would probably recommend synthetic oil which can be found anywhere. I too am like you guys and want to take the best care of my car, I just ordered a case of 10-40w amsoil hp AMO but the general public is not like us. I think VW's ultra specific oil spec is hurting VW not helping. Dan

Don't be ridiculous! If cars were designed to run with "off the shelf" oil, we'd all be driving around with engines designed to run on whatever came before 20w 50 multigrade, (I'm not old enough to remember what that was) and nothing would move forward. The oil company would have no incentive to produce better oil as there would be no need to. If VW design a new engine and decide a spec for it in relation to oil, then the oil manufacturers are forced to move forward. It wouldn't be the same if the engine manufacturers had to wait for an oil spec and then design a unit which would work with it.

 

[Dan_Ruddock]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

If cars were designed to run with "off the shelf" oil

There is no if about it, all cars are able to run off the shelf oils today except the VW TDI pd and we have outstanding oils avalible today so your premise dosen't wash. What is ridiculous is having to buy the correct oil only from the dealer or by mail. Dan

 

[nortones2]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

No doubt someone could compile a list of cars requiring specific lubricants from Japan and NA, but from Europe: VAG, BMW, Mercedes, Ford, for starters.

 

[dieseldorf]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

Yeah, it's really a distribution issue, not an availability issue. The list of oils is just massive.

A few have asked (the mfrs) why these litres of oil aren't available in the US when they're available everywhere else around the globe.

 

[Rustynuts]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

If cars were designed to run with "off the shelf" oil

There is no if about it, all cars are able to run off the shelf oils today except the VW TDI pd and we have outstanding oils avalible today so your premise dosen't wash. What is ridiculous is having to buy the correct oil only from the dealer or by mail. Dan

"except the VW TDI pd" ?

Dan, the world continues after the border of your county, all the way over to the European countries and then further still. You should at least investigate other manufacturers before making statements like this. VAG, as a company, do all they can to provide an excellent diesel engine. They also provide a service schedule and specification to keep it operating at its best efficiency. Can you not buy the correct oil from a dealership, and indeed at other places also? The issue that dealers in your country have no knowledge of how to maintain your engine properly is lamentable and should be sorted out as soon as possible. But to expect to be able to use the cheapest oil which is readily available at the local motor store is for Luddites!

 

[Dan_Ruddock]

Re: Breaking News: New VAG 504.00 & 507.00 standards

It for me is not about being able to run cheap oil but about availability. Is the dealer open till midnight no, are dealers located in every medium size city here no. VW has to make many changes to there cars for sale in the USA if they cannot make the car for the oil we use here or get the correct oil on the shelves of a none dealer outlets than it should not be here.

VAG, as a company, do all they can to provide an excellent diesel engine

Ha tell that to everyone who has had a timing belt snap before the service interval. If vw really wanted to give us the best posible they would get rid of the timing belt. I don't care what other country's do I don't live there. Cars sold in the USA should have redily avalible the correct fuel and oil period. Look at those fine cloths the emperor is wearing. Dan