Biodiesel goes mainstream?

m1ketdi

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Would be interesting to see what changes have been made vs the standard Diesel engine to make this work. To make best use of this and allow use of bio and standard fuel I’m thinking, Glow plug cylinder pressure transducer and active combustion phasing?
Possible durability changes in fuel pumps?
 

nwdiver

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Fantastic news, a much better idea than the EV movement. Now bring the diesel option back to the USA !
If they can get the cost to ~$1 per gallon and solve the NOx problem and find a sustainable feedstock. That WOULD be AWESOME! Think it's possible? Be nice to have a good source of Jet Fuel... I haven't flown in 9 years.
 

CleverUserName

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This isn’t biodiesel. This stuff is available in California and marketed as Renewable Diesel in varying blends 70-100%. It’s a subsidized “Low Carbon” fuel and it would be significantly more expensive than diesel if you had to pay the actual cost of production. It’s better than biodiesel however it also has some negatives as well.

Unfortunately the supply is limited as it’s made from recycled waste fats. It won’t replace diesel anytime soon.
 

nwdiver

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Unfortunately the supply is limited as it’s made from recycled waste fats. It won’t replace diesel anytime soon.
I guess it's a good thing VW is determined to fully electrify their vehicles ASAP. Can't happen soon enough...
 

m1ketdi

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This isn’t biodiesel. This stuff is available in California and marketed as Renewable Diesel in varying blends 70-100%. It’s a subsidized “Low Carbon” fuel and it would be significantly more expensive than diesel if you had to pay the actual cost of production. It’s better than biodiesel however it also has some negatives as well.

Unfortunately the supply is limited as it’s made from recycled waste fats. It won’t replace diesel anytime soon.
Given this fuel could effectively transform the carbon footprint of the existing fleet I can see this going somewhere. I think the real question will become if you just drop it into something older how transparent are NOx emissions? As my understanding is the cetane ratings of these blends is significantly higher...
 

nwdiver

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Given this fuel could effectively transform the carbon footprint of the existing fleet I can see this going somewhere. I think the real question will become if you just drop it into something older how transparent are NOx emissions? As my understanding is the cetane ratings of these blends is significantly higher...
The problem is the feedstock. There's no where near enough to fulfill the needs of aviation let alone having any left over for ground transportation.
 

CleverUserName

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Given this fuel could effectively transform the carbon footprint of the existing fleet I can see this going somewhere. I think the real question will become if you just drop it into something older how transparent are NOx emissions? As my understanding is the cetane ratings of these blends is significantly higher...
I used this fuel exclusively for a couple years but stopped using it for numerous reasons including lower power, torque, fuel economy and strange hardening or breakdown of the fuel I called polymerization.

I believe that much of the so-called benefits are actually marketing hype and when compared to California Diesel #2 this Renewable Diesel is an inferior product.

You can read my posts and documentation in this thread: https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/anybody-use-propel-hpr-in-a-bew.516765/#post-5681927
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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I ran B20 in my TDIs for years. Seemed to be the best of both worlds: higher cetane and lubricity, quieter operation, but none of the power drop you get with 100% bio. I even installed a fuel tank and pump at my house to make it easy to fill with the blend.

Limited availability and the restrictions on DPF-equipped cars caused me to stop. If I could run another bio blend that is DPF (or post-combustion injection) friendly I'd do it. I poked around a bit to see what's currently available for biofuels in my area: almost nothing.
 

wxman

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nwdiver

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EIA forecasts that renewable diesel production will grow exponentially over the next several years...




I hope so. Aviation uses ~95B gallons per year. Decarbonizing 5% of that by 2024 would be a nice start I guess...
 

nwdiver

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You seem a bit focused on av fuel...
Because no one makes electric passenger planes yet, probably not feasible. I haven't booked a flight in 9 years... be nice to have that option again.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Honestly I'm still not clear on the difference between biodiesel and this new "renewable" diesel.
 

tikal

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Fantastic news, a much better idea than the EV movement. Now bring the diesel option back to the USA !
I doubt it very much frankly. Just properly maintain your current TDI until it is no longer safe or cost/benefit to drive it.
 

wxman

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Honestly I'm still not clear on the difference between biodiesel and this new "renewable" diesel.
The distinction is based on the structure of the fuel molecules.

Both are biomass-based diesel fuels. By convention, biodiesel is a fuel that's an ester (fatty acid methyl ester - FAME) which has oxygen in the molecular structure.

Renewable diesel is a diesel-range hydrocarbon fuel which has no oxygen in the molecular structure. It's identical to petroleum-based diesel (ULSD) from a molecular perspective, except it's nearly 100% paraffins as opposed to ULSD which typically contains some aromatics (ring molecules with carbon-to-carbon double bonds).
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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What about moisture content? I know that's an issue with post combustion injection.
 

wxman

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If I recall correctly, that's a problem with biodiesel (FAME) if stored for extended periods, but not as much with renewable diesel since it's essentially the same as ULSD.

Renewable diesel is infinitely miscible with ULSD up to 100%.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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It's a problem with bio even if not stored because it washes down cylinder walls during post combustion injection, diluting the engine's oil. Rising oil levels in diesels with DPFs is common when too high a percentage of bio is used. Sounds like this fuel doesn't have those properties, as I'm sure that the engines VW is running it in have post-combustion injection.
 

Ragdude

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I doubt it very much frankly. Just properly maintain your current TDI until it is no longer safe or cost/benefit to drive it.
Hopefully that will be a LONG time, I average about 50 miles a week.
 
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