Are these TDIs still built in MEXICO?????

drydog

New member
Joined
Mar 20, 2004
I still have a problem with the quality of the mexican built jettas! I always see them with one headlight out or some tail light not working on new looking vehicles.

My old jettas that were made in germany were the best, but when I had one of the first made in mexico in the early 90s well , I have not owned one since. I want to buy a new TDI for the gas mileage but I wonder????
 

GoFaster

Moderator at Large
Joined
Jun 16, 1999
Location
Brampton, Ontario, Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI
All Jetta sedans are built in Mexico and all Jetta wagons are built in Germany.

... and the build location has nothing to do with burned-out headlights!!
 

drydog

New member
Joined
Mar 20, 2004
Seriously,

Would you have a problem with the quality of todays mexican built jettas??
 

master cylinder

RIP, Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
May 1, 2002
Location
Brighton, Michigan
TDI
Jetta GLS, 2002, Cool White
My '92 Mexican built Jetta was the best car I ever owned and it is still going strong after 267,000 miles! 12 years of Michigan salt and there is no rust - still looks like new! It has held up unbelievably - all original with the exception of the exhaust (only on 2nd one) and the alternator which was changed as a precautionary measure. Hell - I changed the brakes just because I couldn't believe they were still good after that long - rear shoes were original riveted and were nicer than the relined shoes I was to put on!!! I didn't have a problem with this Mexican built vehicle and my '02 is turning out to be just as good (so far). It is not the country of origin but the parent company producing it. Do you think VW or Honda or Toyota are going to produce less of a product just because they are operating a plant outside of the homeland? They instil their ethic and methods where ever they are operating. You would be hard pressed to tell the difference between countries of origin within the same company. Don't sweat it - they're all good /images/graemlins/wink.gif.
 

ten100

Active member
Joined
Nov 4, 2003
Location
Orlando, FL
TDI
2003 Jetta Wagon
The idea that the build location means anything is at best unsubstantiated. If you look around long enough here or anywhere you will find people claiming that the worst all come from $location (their location), another point to consider is the quanity of vehicles coming from a location as opposed to another location.
 

NorthPilot

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2000
Location
Healy, Alaska, USA
TDI
Jetta Wagon, 2003, emerald blue
I would hope that most readers of this forum would recognize that it's pure racist drivel to assume that a vehicle build by Mexicans in Puebla would not be as good as one built by Turkish guest workers in Wolfsburg, all things being equal.

However, all things are not equal. Mexico has a pervasive culture of corruption and social inequality that make it difficult for even a large corporation like VW to build a world class product. Are all the locally produced parts and materials, the electrical connectors, the plastics, the paint and wiring, etc. the same quality? Is the Mexican educational system capable of turning out the highly trained workers needed to work in a modern plant? My experience living in both countries somehow makes me doubt it.

In my own experience, my '00 Jetta sedan built in Puebla, Mexico has been a troublesome, high maintenance vehicle, while the '03 wagon built in Germany, flawless. I realize that two vehicles, that is two data points, hardly constitute a meaningful sample, but I wonder if my experience is being played out by thousands of other owners? Where are all the unsatisfactory, poor quality VW's reported by Consumer Reports and other surveys coming from? Where are the Jettas being made that have put VW on the ropes? Where are the cars being made that are turning off so many customers who have become accustomed to Asian car quality?

VW could provide some answers, but, of course, never will...
 

Variant TDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2002
Location
SS, MD.
TDI
2002 Golf Variant, Reflex Silver
As if your German made VW is actually assembled by Germans??? /images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Mexicans did not design the Window regulators. They did not design the MAFs. They did not design the O2 sensors. They did not design the Coilpacks. They didn't even design the original glovebox door design....

Take those parts out, and you're not left with much to complain about. My Mexican built Mk3 was put together quite well... It's lasted through massive abuse and is still very tight.

One must wonder how much blame the Mexicans can take for the German's poor sourcing and R&D.
 

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
[ QUOTE ]
As if your German made VW is actually assembled by Germans??? /images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Mexicans did not design the Window regulators. They did not design the MAFs. They did not design the O2 sensors. They did not design the Coilpacks. They didn't even design the original glovebox door design....

Take those parts out, and you're not left with much to complain about. My Mexican built Mk3 was put together quite well... It's lasted through massive abuse and is still very tight.

One must wonder how much blame the Mexicans can take for the German's poor sourcing and R&D.


[/ QUOTE ]

Excellent point. Moreover the better reliability some claim with their wagons may come from the fact that by the time the wagons came out, the product had matured and many of the kinks were worked out.

However parts sourcing might be part of the problem too. I work in QA and while the original spec from VW might have been OK, the execution might be something else. There might be too much process variation and as a result the parts vary wildly around the spec. Seen that too often.

And the Mexican dimension might still be a factor: the A4 cars are very complicated compared to an A2 or even an A3. If VW is sourcing parts from Mexico, it could be through very young suppliers in the supply chain who have not yet got their processes capable enough for the task, while German-sourced suppliers may have been around longer. Boom-type economies can lead to quality problems due to growth so rapid the quality systems can't keep up.

It's not so much a race issue as an industry maturity issue. Processes, especially new processes, take a while to bring under control. The A4s probably hit the Mexican suppliers with a whole whack of new parts to deal with. Even the TDI engines have signficant design differences between the A3 and A4.

And the Germans themselves are no great shakes at electronic design. We had plant equipment made in Germany. The hardware was superb, robust, greatly overengineered, looked like it could last forever. The control systems had to be gutted and replaced with Allen-Bradley...
 

Drivbiwire

Zehntes Jahr der Veteran
Joined
Oct 13, 1998
Location
Boise, Idaho
TDI
2013 Passat TDI, Newmar Ventana 8.3L ISC 3945, 2016 E250 BT, 2000 Jetta TDI
Heck German or Mexican a person does not even touch the car till its welded and painted and even then the components are already assembled for installation.

The factory in Puebla is identical in function to the one in Germany. Every single problem can be traced back to component supplier NOT where the component was installed.

For me I prefer a car painted in Mexico...think dry climate and better paint quality and reduced likelyhood of rust /images/graemlins/laugh.gif and yes I know the factory in Germany is climate controlled!

DB
 

Variant TDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2002
Location
SS, MD.
TDI
2002 Golf Variant, Reflex Silver
I do take issue with Pueblo paint. 7000 feet of elevation does make a difference.

Mk3's were plagued by paint problems... especially the silver ones.

That's about all I'll give our original poster on Mexican quality... and even that isn't really their fault.
 

Ed's TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2001
Location
Victoria, BC, Canada
TDI
2001 Bora and 2016 Touareg
I have to concur with the remark about the paint. A good friend of mine that works at the VW dealership in town was telling me that there was a real problem with the silver paint (Silver Arrow) and they were actually sending the cars off-site to have them painted. In '00 and '01, this resulted in a shortfall of silver cars available, at least in Canada. Apparently one out of every 20 cars was designated to be silver and of those, only every 4th was a TDI. If you do the math, that meant only one out of every 80 cars was a silver TDI. When I was looking to order one, there were 5 to be delivered to the entire province of BC in a 4 month period. I happened to luck out and got one that was already ordered and the guy backed out. All this because of a problem with paint.

As for fit and finish quality, I think there's more chance that the build date had something to do with problems than location. You know, the old wive's tale about cars built on a monday compared to cars built on a friday. (Maybe they were still a bit groggy after there afternoon siesta?).All in all, I'd have to say that the quality is still leaps and bounds over a lot of cars I've driven that were made in Japan. Just my 2 cents' worth.
 

tjl

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 19, 2001
Location
California, USA
TDI
2001 Golf GLS
[ QUOTE ]

In my own experience, my '00 Jetta sedan built in Puebla, Mexico has been a troublesome, high maintenance vehicle, while the '03 wagon built in Germany, flawless. I realize that two vehicles, that is two data points, hardly constitute a meaningful sample, but I wonder if my experience is being played out by thousands of other owners? Where are all the unsatisfactory, poor quality VW's reported by Consumer Reports and other surveys coming from?

[/ QUOTE ]

What problems did your 2000 Jetta have? Poorly designed parts like window regulator clips that break, relay 109s that burn out, and mass air flow sensors that fail make trouble regardless of which country they are in when they are installed in a car.

Golfs sold in the US were made in Germany in 1999-2000, then transitioned to being made in Brazil. I have not read anything to indicate that reliability was significantly affected by this change.
 

TornadoRed

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 3, 2003
Location
West Des Moines (formerly St Paul)
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI wagon, silver; 2003 Jetta TDI wagon, indigo blue; 2003 Golf GL 5-spd, red (PARTED); 2003 Golf GLS 5-spd, indigo blue (SOLD); 2003 Jetta TDI wagon, Candy White (SOLD)
[ QUOTE ]
Golfs sold in the US were made in Germany in 1999-2000, then transitioned to being made in Brazil. I have not read anything to indicate that reliability was significantly affected by this change.

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree wholeheartedly. I'm extremely pleased with my Brazil-built 2003 Golf (36k miles and nothing except a bad MAF sensor). I would definitely recommend a 2002 Golf with 80k or even 100k miles, over a 2000 German-built Golf with 30k or 40k miles.
 

mrGutWrench

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 29, 2002
Location
Carrboro, NC
TDI
'03 Jetta Wagon, 5-speed, 563K Miles (July '23)
[ QUOTE ]
(snip) In my own experience, my '00 Jetta sedan built in Puebla, Mexico has been a troublesome, high maintenance vehicle, while the '03 wagon built in Germany, flawless. I realize that two vehicles, that is two data points, hardly constitute a meaningful sample, but I wonder if my experience is being played out by thousands of other owners? (snip)

[/ QUOTE ]

__. Worry no longer. There are two TDI's in my house. My Mexican-built '02 has 42K miles. It's had ordinary maintenance, the fuse pulled to wake up the radio (port installed item), and the window clips changed. MzLauraLee's waggin ('03) has 14K miles, it's only had ordinary maintenance. She has leather and a sunroof but the "feel" build-quality is better on my sedan.

__. I call it a draw.
-
 

geon116

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2002
Location
Seatac
TDI
04 Passat GLS Wagon, Silverstone
I once drove by the Puebla plant. /images/graemlins/blush.gif /images/graemlins/wink.gif
 

Neel

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2003
Location
Red Oak, Texas
TDI
Passat, 04, white
As I understand it, currently the Jetta wagon is built in Germany, the Jetta is built in Mexico, and the Golf
is built in Brazil. My wife has a Jetta wagon TDI and I have a Golf TDI. We are quite pleased with both
although we have only 3,000 and 8,000 miles, respectively. I think the engine on my Golf was made in
Poland.
 

ARBY

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2004
Location
Royal Oak, MI
TDI
2011 Golf Sportwagen - really want a F-150.
But I think many are still missing the point. While the Mexican workers may be able to assemble a vehicle to the same exacting standards as those built in Germany, most of the parts out of which the Mexican/Brazilian built VWs are sourced from Mexico and/or South America. Despite the best efforts by the assemblers, if the parts are built by substandard suppliers, then even the most skilled German assemblers could not rectify the situation. I got my '02 TDI after 4 years in a German-built GTI. I must say, the quality difference between the 2 vehicles is astonishing. Rear hatch quality, hinge quality, overall feel of the construction is down quite a bit.
 

alex wetmore

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2002
Location
seattle, wa
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI
I've owned 3 TDIs.

Our first one was a German built 2002 Jetta Wagon. This is my wife's car and we still have it.

The second was a Mexican built 1998 Jetta sedan. I bought this with 85,000 miles on it in Feb 2003 and sold it with 95,000 miles on it in Dec 2003.

My current car is a Brazilian built 2000 Golf.

The Jetta Wagon has had the most problems with rattles. They mostly fixed now, but we went to the dealer to fix rattles a number of times. Now that the rattles are gone I don't find fit and finish with it to be any different than the other two cars.

A good friend has a 2000 Golf that was made in Germany. Fit and finish compared to my 2000 Golf seems to be very similar (her car is a GL, I have a GLS, so obviously not everything is the same). Her car has a few more rattles than my Golf.

In general I don't think that VW fit and finish is as high as it should be. All of the VWs that I've been in have had some rattles that should have been taken care of in the design and build process. They are fun cars to drive though and the TDI engine is great, so I'm willing to overlook rattles here and there.

I expect that car to car variation is higher than any differences based on where the car was assembled.

alex
 

MRIBOB

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2003
Location
TIJUANA MEXICO
TDI
None- Jetta-0 - Mexico 1
I hate Mexicans!
I can say that because I live in Tijuana /images/graemlins/grin.gif


Tacos are really good in Tijuana and that’s all that matters to me.
My TDI runs fine and no codes yet in 15,000 miles.

Now remember every car company puts out a lemon here and there.
I even heard Rolls Royce had a car go bad or something like an axle broke. They fixed it out of warranty and when the owner asked about a bill they told him he must have imagined the whole thing since Rolls Royce don’t break down. So VW or Rolls - anything mechanical will fail regardless of where it was put together.

But:
I don't care if the guy who bolts on the parts eats Frankfurters or Menudo for breakfast.
I dont see my car could have been assembled any where else as good. Germany or Mexico it still works and to say the quality is poor in Mexico VS Germany will always be subject to personal opinion

IT’S A JOKE I dont hate Mexicans-
My wife is Mexican and my little boy is part Mexican, so I don't hate Mexicans- I told it to my wife what I wrote and she asked me if that included her. I told her I always thought she was Irish /images/graemlins/grin.gif


As far as the State of Pueblo goes- All of the people I know from Pueblo make baskets. SO if you need a big basket I can get it wholesale for you /images/graemlins/grin.gif /images/graemlins/grin.gif


.

Now since I live in Tijuana I have infomation and connections to VW of Mexico.

Jorge the head of VW of Mexico was not at all pleased that some of you questioned the quality of Mexican VW Jetta's.
He read this thread and has recorded the names of any NEGITIVE statements.
He has refered this to PEPE!


I am posting a photo of PEPE the head of Public Relations for VW of Mexico
Meet PEPE- Lead Mexican VW Tech and cholo ( LMVTAC) in Puebla Mexico. If you get a visit from him /images/graemlins/crazy.gif You can explain why Germans are better /images/graemlins/grin.gif



 

compu_85

Gadget Guy
Joined
Sep 29, 2003
Location
La Conner, WA
TDI
... None :S
LOL

Well, I guess if you make fun of yourself, then its ok. FWIW, I get into debates about geek v. nerd, and how i am a geek, not a nerd, and am proud og my geekdom.

Does anyone know where Bosch assembeles their parts? AIRC, it says Germany on the box...

-Jason
 

Variant TDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2002
Location
SS, MD.
TDI
2002 Golf Variant, Reflex Silver
[ QUOTE ]
While the Mexican workers may be able to assemble a vehicle to the same exacting standards as those built in Germany,

[/ QUOTE ]

You're assuming the German workers are capable of being 'exacting'.

/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 

2kjettagls

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2003
Location
near a big pond
TDI
2000 jetta gls
The key to getting a better quality Mexican built VW is to make sure it was built on/between Tuesday and Thursaday, and BEFORE the afternoon Siesta. /images/graemlins/smile.gif
 

ARBY

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2004
Location
Royal Oak, MI
TDI
2011 Golf Sportwagen - really want a F-150.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
While the Mexican workers may be able to assemble a vehicle to the same exacting standards as those built in Germany,

[/ QUOTE ]

You're assuming the German workers are capable of being 'exacting'.

/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

you know what they say when you assume things
 

lofranco

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2004
Location
PX, AZ
TDI
2013 Passat SEL TDI
We have two Golfs. Both built in Curitiba, Brazil. My TDI has 60% German made parts including the engine, 30% Brazilian made parts 3% U.S./Canadian made parts and the other 7% Must be from Argentina because the transmission was made there. My car has had zero problems in 25,000 miles and feels a quite a bit more solid than my wifes Pueblo Mexico built Golf 2.0. Maybe hers was built on a friday right after the siesta. haha
 

TDIinRI

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2002
Location
NOT in RI
TDI
2003 GOLF silver
I really think that parts suppliers are the main issues with these cars, NOT where they are assembled. My Golf is built in Brasil, Cliff's Jetta in Mexico. I also have a cousin in NY with a 2.0 Golf built in Germany. I have not noticed any difference between the cars. The funny thing is that the parts on these cars come from a multitude of countries. Example: Golf: headlights-Slovenia, Jamara alloys-China!, Goodyear tyres-Brasil and the Jetta: alloys-Hungary, Michelin tyres-USA Transmission on both cars-Argentina. Who knows where the rest of the stuff comes from. I will also say this though: Parts suppliers' quality seems to have a direct correlation with what a parent company is willing to spend on a part! Keep that in mind guys!
 

AndyBees

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 27, 2003
Location
Southeast Kentucky
TDI
Silver 2003 Jetta TDI, Silver 2000 Jetta TDI (sold), '84 Vanagon with '02 ALH engine
I have to disagree about the early model Jettas.... I have owned three of them ..... JUNK! The Engines and trannies were okay. Everything else was a pain in the rear. You name it and I had a problem with it!

My "used" '00 Jetta TDI has been incredible with no major issues at 106K.

BTW, if you buy a TDI for "Gas" mileage, make sure you put DIESEL fuel in it ..... they don't run too good on GAS. /images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
The assembly lines are not always the same in different countries. The Wolfsburg line in Germany was more automated when it was building the A2 cars than the Puebla one was building A3 cars /images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif This I think can make some differences.

Also, some plants get some minor parts locally, although this is much more common in the US with Japanese and American branded products.

FWIW, many cars, especially American branded ones, have quite a few parts built in Mexico and South America.

Now here's a twister for you: this is fresh in my head as it just happened today. I did a PM on a Volvo S80 today. Volvo is owned by Ford, the S80 uses a GM 4T-60E automatic (garbage!), the car was built in Sweden, but the inline 6's cylinder head said Finland on it, the igniton coils were Spanish and the Volvo-branded spark plugs were French. Air filter came from Belgium, the Girling brake pads came from the UK. And to top this off, the rotors were manufactured in Portugal /images/graemlins/confused.gif Talk about a global car!!! /images/graemlins/eek.gif
 
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