Another no start, but this one is tricky.

rattlenbang

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Location
Victoria BC
TDI
2004 wagon
2002 tdi gradually getting harder to start, randomly won't start even when warm. All the basics gone through, lots of fuel getting to injectors, shutter valve open. Absolutely should start because it has fuel, air, and compression.
Sounds like a timing issue.
The intermittent no start sounds like electrical issue, but starting is a mechanical timing process, set and forget, so how could it be jumping around? The electrical settings only kick in after start, so shouldn't be that. Im running out of answers. I know some engines have had problem with loosening crankshaft pulley boots screwing with timing?
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
You mention timing but not that you checked it.

Air leaks can get progressively worse. Air in fuel pipes can cause late timing since it compresses. Does situation improve until next time after bleeding injectors?

Have you ever removed the big crank bolt without replacing it with a new one? And properly torquing it.
 

rattlenbang

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Location
Victoria BC
TDI
2004 wagon
Nope and nope. We just checked timing of the belt and everything seems correct, but i know the p.o. had pulled the pump and i wonder if he didnt time it right when he reconnected it to the sprocket. Like it's retarded and so marginal its hard to start until the electronics take over.
 

csstevej

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 12, 2004
Location
north nj
TDI
2001 golf tdi 4 door auto now a manual, mine, 2000 golf 2 door M/T son's,daughters 98 NB non-TDI 2.0, 2003 TDI NB for next daughter, head repaired and on road,gluten for punishment got another tdi 2001NB,another yellow tdi NB
How did you check timing?
Did you pin it and lock everything at TDC , or did you eyeball it?
If you did that , what was the dynamic timing with VCDS , below the center line , above the center line or is it even on the chart?
 

rattlenbang

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Location
Victoria BC
TDI
2004 wagon
We made sure the engine was at tdc through flywheel, the cam slot looked completely horizontal, and you could see the pin hole centered through pump sprocket. if it was even one tooth off on the belt, it would have been obvious.
And can't run vcds until it starts, which it won't at the moment.
Last time I was able to get it running with a squirt of ether. It was ugly, but it did start.
 

csstevej

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 12, 2004
Location
north nj
TDI
2001 golf tdi 4 door auto now a manual, mine, 2000 golf 2 door M/T son's,daughters 98 NB non-TDI 2.0, 2003 TDI NB for next daughter, head repaired and on road,gluten for punishment got another tdi 2001NB,another yellow tdi NB
You said the cam slot looked horizontal……did you install the plate? It doesn’t take much to be off.
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
I was wondering about the crank sprocket moving but that should show up as the pump and cam being off in relation to the flywheel. Enough to be eyeballed? Idunno.

I think the cam being off enough to affect starting would be readily visible. Need the tool to get it perfect but I think eyeballing it is enough in this situation.

PO had the pump out. Why? What made him think it was ok to reinstall? Did he have the requisite tools?

Sounds like you don't have the timing belt setup tools. In your situation I'd advance the pump a bit. Loosen the three bolts and rotate the pump shaft clockwise. You can count the sprocket teeth and divide 360 by that number and use that as a reference for moving the shaft. Remembering of course that 1 degree on the pump would be 2 degrees on the crank.

Oh, when you eyeballed the pump did you see the actual 6mm hole in the boss and not the edge of the boss also known as the "sucker hole"? You said you could see the "hole", just making sure.
 

jmodge

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Location
Greenville, MI
TDI
2001 alh Jetta, RC2 w/.205's 5speed daily summer commuter and 2000 alh Jetta 5spd swap, 2" lift, hitch, stage 3 TDtuning w/.216's winter cruiser, 1996 Tacoma ALh
You said you started it on ether, makes it sound fuel related. Did it run ok once started? FYI, if you use ether again, pull your glow plug harness off.
 
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