Another B4 Speedometer Issue Thread - RESOLVED

Steve Addy

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Aw, i appreciate it, yeah a bit far away. Im confident I can do the soldering too I am wondering if I could just unsolder this capacitor from the spare mk3 cluster I have and solder it onto the b4 board. ANy idea which capacitor it could be on the mk3 cluster?
I would match up the cap specs if I was going to borrow one, but I think that's going to be hit or miss, you might just be moving one problem from one cluster to another...

Honestly I would just buy some new caps and be done with it. They are readily available.

Steve
 

jhax

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Thanks steve, which ones are they?
 

Steve Addy

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I used a 470uf 25v cap when I replaced mine. If you're going to do the one I would think it wise to do the other as well.

The 470uf is a Nishicon cap, the 220uf 6.3v cap was Fcon. You may not find these brands though, but I don't recall if I specifically looked for these brands either. You will have to buy a few more than you want but that just means some backup for another cluster down the road too.

I just searched on e-bay to find the ones I needed. It was 50k miles and 5 years ago and I've had no problems. When I got the cluster it squealed like a pig, so even before I powered it up I replaced the caps in hopes of salvaging the cluster...and it did.

Steve
You'll need one of each

470uf 25v cap
220uf 6.3v cap

As I said I'm not sure what brands you're going to find out there now, but IIRC the brands I bought I cleared through an electronics friend at the time I bought them.

Hope this helps.

Steve
 

Steve Addy

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Seriously. Desoldering a component from another board has a risk of heat damage - to both the component and to the rest of the donor board.
Crazy thing, years ago I had a motherboard fail, probably Pentium III, a whole slew of caps bulged on that thing and I scavenged enough caps from misc garbage motherboards to fix it, and it worked until I tossed it some years ago. IIRC, and that was a while back, it was a 1GHZ PIII clocked to 1337...man that's a long time ago....lol.

But you're right, chances are good that the components from that other cluster aren't going to be worth desoldering....

Steve
 

roadrunner89

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Eurovan R5 102HP
Hi,

I would recommend using new caps, because used caps taken out of old clusters have a high risk of showing the same aging issues after some time again

You need a 470uF Capacitor and depending on the hardware version of the cluster, a 220uF or a 68 uF capacitor.

You will find more information in the german eurovan wiki
On this side, reichelt part numbers are mentioned, which do not help you directly, but you can find the specs to search for the caps at an American Distributor

Best regards

Alex
 

jhax

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96 Passat B4V, ALH engine out of a 2002 Jetta, some IE Rods and ASV Pistons. Nothing drivable yet though
I found a 220uf 16v capacitor at my local microcenter, would it be advisable to use it or stick with the 6.3v?
 

jhax

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I have not yet, been busy with house and wedding stuff. Maybe I will get to it this weekend? Doubtful though. Speaking of @reise would you happen to know of anyone in your neck of the woods (Germany) that has a T3 Westfalia Camper TD they are willing to sell for less than 8000Euro? My fiance and I are planning on spending a month in the EU for our honeymoon. I floated the idea of buying a T3, driving, camping in it and then importing it back to the US as our camping vehicle.
 

roadrunner89

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Hi jhax,
Sorry for my late reply

I personally don't know anybody who wants to sell. T3 Camping van.
Anyway getting one for less than 8000 which is in a good condition from overseas will be hard due to the camping and vanlife boom in europe
 

jhax

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No worries, I found one! He is willing to sell it to me, an enthusiast for 8000 Euro. He is reupping TUV this week!
 

jhax

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96 Passat B4V, ALH engine out of a 2002 Jetta, some IE Rods and ASV Pistons. Nothing drivable yet though
You better believe it. Likely shipping the van from Amsterdam so we might end up in your neck of the woods.
 

tbones

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I'm going to need cluster repair services, also... so no one in the states is up and running at this time?
 

Steve Addy

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I'm going to need cluster repair services, also... so no one in the states is up and running at this time?
I would say that depends on what you need done and on what cluster.

There are misc talents on here that can do a lot of things. The 'jack of all trades' is alive and well on this forum, just depends on what kind of work you need done.

Steve
 

tbones

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om my 97 B4, the temp and fuel Gauges work, the speedo and odo stopped at same time. I replaced the little drive unit down in the transmission, thinking that went bed, but it wasn't that apparently.
 

roadrunner89

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Sounds like issues with the capacitor in the top left corner.

I've written some stuff about the clusters in the german eurovan Wiki. There is also some stuff about eeprom mods.
With those infomation every electronics technician should be able to fix this.
Perhaps you can help yourself with google translate.
If you have specific questions pleased ask, and I will try to translate and help.
 

Steve Addy

Top Post Dawg
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Location
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Sounds like issues with the capacitor in the top left corner.

I've written some stuff about the clusters in the german eurovan Wiki. There is also some stuff about eeprom mods.
With those infomation every electronics technician should be able to fix this.
Perhaps you can help yourself with google translate.
If you have specific questions pleased ask, and I will try to translate and help.
IIRC the voltage regulator can be a problem and they aren't available anymore. I'm going by very old memories here of a discussion I had with Derek a few years back.

If the problem goes on for too long I think it can render the cluster unfixable, but again this is based on a discussion from a few years back.

om my 97 B4, the temp and fuel Gauges work, the speedo and odo stopped at same time. I replaced the little drive unit down in the transmission, thinking that went bed, but it wasn't that apparently.
Do you still have clock and odometer working?

It seems unlikely that in your case the stepper motors went, the chances of both dying at the exact same time is pretty remote.

Steve
 

roadrunner89

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IIRC the voltage regulator can be a problem and they aren't available anymore. I'm going by very old memories here of a discussion I had with Derek a few years back.

If the problem goes on for too long I think it can render the cluster unfixable, but again this is based on a discussion from a few years back.
Yes, the combined Elmos voltage regulator and stepper driver can also cause lots of trouble, bust mostly all four gauges do strange things or nothing at all if it fails.
The regulator is out of productions since many years. There are also a few replacement clusters, which have a 2004 PCB revision, which don't have the elmos anymore. Instead a stepper driver and two separate voltage regulators are used.

When I get clusters with burned traces due to a leaked capacitor I always test the Elmos regulator on a special PCB to have spare parts for other clusters.
On the other hand, I've a prototype cluster running, which has a separate voltage regulator to suppourt a semi-dead elmos ;)
When it proves itself, I will also document the solution.

Anyways... for @tbones cluster I recommend exchanging the two capacitors in the top right corner, checking the traces underneath the large one and then measuring the voltage on the smaller one. If it has a large ripple, the elmos seems to have a problem

Best regards

Alex
 

jhax

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Greetings, I am finally getting around to this, I notice that my new capacitor (smaller one that goes into L101 on the right side) is directional, however, I do not see any pole indication on the board. Any help?
 

jhax

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For reference, there is an inlaid copper strip that traces from the + pin on the larger capacitor to one pin hole on the smaller capacitor, and the - pole of the larger cap faces toward the center (gauge side) of the cluster, I assume that all capacitor poles point the same way but I could be wrong.
 

roadrunner89

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Hi,
the orientation of the two capacitors is dependent on the hardware-revision of the capacitor, which you can find in the bottom-right corner of the PCB (for example 14/96)

If you tell me your revision number, I can have a look in my collection ;)
 

jhax

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motometer kw27/95
 

jhax

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turbodieseldyke

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Use an ohmmeter to follow the traces from L101. One of them should be tied to ground.

Also, not sure if it's a German thing, but L in L101 would indicate Inductor, not Capacitor, in an English circuit.

edit: capacitor = kondensator, so L shouldn't be German for cap. You'd have to look at the rest of the board, to see if other caps are marked C, and if other L's appear to be inductors. I would guess the markings would be a global standard for circuit boards:
C, L, R, D, U, (capacitor, inductor, resistor, diode, integrated circuit/chip)

#970 down-and-right of L101 would be the easiest to check. It appears to be polarized, so i'm guessing it's C970
 
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Steve Addy

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I couldn't swear but I don't think I paid attention when I did the caps last time I had one to work on...but again that was a while back....

Steve
 

jhax

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96 Passat B4V, ALH engine out of a 2002 Jetta, some IE Rods and ASV Pistons. Nothing drivable yet though
So when it was mentioned to change BOTH capacitors in the top right corner. That is incorrect? Really it is changing ONE capacitor? I am confused.
 
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