Advice and guidance mk6 tdi turbo upgrades

[lemoncurd]

Also Mr. Curd, I had an interesting discussion with Malone Tuning about the Fuel Pressure Sensors. They actually recommended I get a 2200BAR sensor over the 2700BAR. My guess is since the voltage range is the same (0-5V I assume), the 2200BAR sensor gives better resolution/finer detail control over rail pressure. Now after working with them, the 2200BAR map is available in their "InstaTune" configurator... Is there a specific advantage to the 2700BAR sensor?

im not a tuner, so i really dont know and cant give much of an informed opinion on it

i do know from a physical / electrical side of things, if the 2 sensors have the same voltage range, and the 2700BAR has expanded the readable pressure then yes you would get lower resolution. if they (the sensor manufacturer) just moved the readable range, then resolution is the same.
example:
2200BAR: 100-2200BAR readable range
2700BAR: 600-2700BAR readable range
in this example, both sensors would have the same resolution.

running a higher pressure sensor lets you run higher pressures. which lets you get more IQ in the same injection duration providing the pump can maintain the pressure while injecting (flow).

 

[p.e.fletcher]

im not a tuner, so i really dont know and cant give much of an informed opinion on it

i do know from a physical / electrical side of things, if the 2 sensors have the same voltage range, and the 2700BAR has expanded the readable pressure then yes you would get lower resolution. if they (the sensor manufacturer) just moved the readable range, then resolution is the same.
example:
2200BAR: 100-2200BAR readable range
2700BAR: 600-2700BAR readable range
in this example, both sensors would have the same resolution.

running a higher pressure sensor lets you run higher pressures. which lets you get more IQ in the same injection duration providing the pump can maintain the pressure while injecting (flow).

I’ve heard the 2700 is only needed if you’re going for head work and bigger injectors. Made sense - don’t need something that can read that range unless you’re actually planning on getting close to it especially if you’re sacrificing resolution. Same goes for MAP sensors, etc.

 

[lemoncurd]

Same goes for MAP sensors

MAP sensor is 100% required for big turbo, unless you port the head + put cams in

stock head flow is more restrictive, so higher pressure. you of course cant go wrong with a bigger MAP sensor with a ported head etc, but you can get away with the stock one when the head has work done to it

 

[p.e.fletcher]

MAP sensor is 100% required for big turbo, unless you port the head + put cams in

stock head flow is more restrictive, so higher pressure. you of course cant go wrong with a bigger MAP sensor with a ported head etc, but you can get away with the stock one when the head has work done to it

Absolutely yes. Sorry, that’s not what I was trying to imply and you’re 100% correct. I just meant same principle applies so no point for a 6bar when a 4bar is more than enough for the hardware upgrade.

 

[Garrison]

Another option for intercooler and the AUS dollar is weak right now, if youre in the US

QLD-Intercooler VW Golf GTI Jetta Passat MK5 MK6 Audi A3 S3 8P TT 8J FSI TSI 2.0 | eBay

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[Xtremefunky]

@Xtremefunky ..... him. 100% him

naah. Just because I ran world record powers on stock cylinderheads without cams, doesnt mean I know what Im talking about
*sarcasm off*

I get a 2200BAR sensor over the 2700BAR

There is no reason on earth to chose the 2200bar instead of the 2700bar. Other than a few bucks less.
Range wise, the higher they read, the more they need to cover, the voltage range stays the same.
So "indeed" the 2200bar would give a more finer reading, but thats not really the case.
Logging wise, on the CP14 with KWP protocol you will see a difference, but what you log, doesnt correspond with
what the ECU sees. In other words, the ECU has not a single problem to read +/-1Bar no matter if you use the 2000, the 2200 the 2700 or the 3000bar sensor.
I can only see the advantage that you dont need to implement the 2200bar sensor at all, if you want.
It will offset the rail pressure by about 200bars, the ECU wont complain and your car runs "better", while some "tuner" did nothing.
I think I read somewhere in here, that some people suggest to install the 2200bar without any tune due to this.
I can only shake my head about this. Everyone can do what they think is best. What do I know.

anyway. installing the 2700bar sensor correctly can lead to more "tuners problems" as the ECU can see now all the juicy pressure spikes,
which will throw nice faults and MIL and Limp and then the "tuner" has to correct various PID maps in order the get the pump regulation in line.
Or you just install a 2200bar sensor, so all the higher spikes will be cut out and the ecu is happy, because its halfway blind.

Im not saying someone is doing anything of what Ive written above. But if you want to know the advantages, why some would chose
the 2200 over the 2700, there you have it.

 

[lemoncurd]

naah. Just because I ran world record powers on stock cylinderheads without cams, doesnt mean I know what Im talking about
*sarcasm off*


There is no reason on earth to chose the 2200bar instead of the 2700bar. Other than a few bucks less.
Range wise, the higher they read, the more they need to cover, the voltage range stays the same.
So "indeed" the 2200bar would give a more finer reading, but thats not really the case.
Logging wise, on the CP14 with KWP protocol you will see a difference, but what you log, doesnt correspond with
what the ECU sees. In other words, the ECU has not a single problem to read +/-1Bar no matter if you use the 2000, the 2200 the 2700 or the 3000bar sensor.
I can only see the advantage that you dont need to implement the 2200bar sensor at all, if you want.
It will offset the rail pressure by about 200bars, the ECU wont complain and your car runs "better", while some "tuner" did nothing.
I think I read somewhere in here, that some people suggest to install the 2200bar without any tune due to this.
I can only shake my head about this. Everyone can do what they think is best. What do I know.

anyway. installing the 2700bar sensor correctly can lead to more "tuners problems" as the ECU can see now all the juicy pressure spikes,
which will throw nice faults and MIL and Limp and then the "tuner" has to correct various PID maps in order the get the pump regulation in line.
Or you just install a 2200bar sensor, so all the higher spikes will be cut out and the ecu is happy, because its halfway blind.

Im not saying someone is doing anything of what Ive written above. But if you want to know the advantages, why some would chose
the 2200 over the 2700, there you have it.

the man, the myth, the legend has weighed in. im done folks!

but yes i agree about the sensor. im not a tuner, so i dont have a formal opinion but i cant see a good reason to not use 2700BAR..... i know i am going to.

 

[p.e.fletcher]

naah. Just because I ran world record powers on stock cylinderheads without cams, doesnt mean I know what Im talking about
*sarcasm off*


There is no reason on earth to chose the 2200bar instead of the 2700bar. Other than a few bucks less.
Range wise, the higher they read, the more they need to cover, the voltage range stays the same.
So "indeed" the 2200bar would give a more finer reading, but thats not really the case.
Logging wise, on the CP14 with KWP protocol you will see a difference, but what you log, doesnt correspond with
what the ECU sees. In other words, the ECU has not a single problem to read +/-1Bar no matter if you use the 2000, the 2200 the 2700 or the 3000bar sensor.
I can only see the advantage that you dont need to implement the 2200bar sensor at all, if you want.
It will offset the rail pressure by about 200bars, the ECU wont complain and your car runs "better", while some "tuner" did nothing.
I think I read somewhere in here, that some people suggest to install the 2200bar without any tune due to this.
I can only shake my head about this. Everyone can do what they think is best. What do I know.

anyway. installing the 2700bar sensor correctly can lead to more "tuners problems" as the ECU can see now all the juicy pressure spikes,
which will throw nice faults and MIL and Limp and then the "tuner" has to correct various PID maps in order the get the pump regulation in line.
Or you just install a 2200bar sensor, so all the higher spikes will be cut out and the ecu is happy, because its halfway blind.

Im not saying someone is doing anything of what Ive written above. But if you want to know the advantages, why some would chose
the 2200 over the 2700, there you have it.

Thanks for this explanation!

 

[WWJSWD]

naah. Just because I ran world record powers on stock cylinderheads without cams, doesnt mean I know what Im talking about
*sarcasm off*


There is no reason on earth to chose the 2200bar instead of the 2700bar. Other than a few bucks less.
Range wise, the higher they read, the more they need to cover, the voltage range stays the same.
So "indeed" the 2200bar would give a more finer reading, but thats not really the case.
Logging wise, on the CP14 with KWP protocol you will see a difference, but what you log, doesnt correspond with
what the ECU sees. In other words, the ECU has not a single problem to read +/-1Bar no matter if you use the 2000, the 2200 the 2700 or the 3000bar sensor.
I can only see the advantage that you dont need to implement the 2200bar sensor at all, if you want.
It will offset the rail pressure by about 200bars, the ECU wont complain and your car runs "better", while some "tuner" did nothing.
I think I read somewhere in here, that some people suggest to install the 2200bar without any tune due to this.
I can only shake my head about this. Everyone can do what they think is best. What do I know.

anyway. installing the 2700bar sensor correctly can lead to more "tuners problems" as the ECU can see now all the juicy pressure spikes,
which will throw nice faults and MIL and Limp and then the "tuner" has to correct various PID maps in order the get the pump regulation in line.
Or you just install a 2200bar sensor, so all the higher spikes will be cut out and the ecu is happy, because its halfway blind.

Im not saying someone is doing anything of what Ive written above. But if you want to know the advantages, why some would chose
the 2200 over the 2700, there you have it.

I wonder why Malone recommended the 2200BAR sensor over 2700BAR.. Now they show the 2200BAR sensor on their "InstaTune" tool... I was in the process of purchasing the 2700BAR sensor before installing the CP3 conversion and they recommended against it. Perhaps they had issues correcting for those pressure spikes.. Moving forward, do you think its worth changing the sensor to 2700BAR and retuning? Or only after moving to a GTD2060VZ?

 

[WWJSWD]

Another option for intercooler and the AUS dollar is weak right now, if youre in the US

QLD-Intercooler VW Golf GTI Jetta Passat MK5 MK6 Audi A3 S3 8P TT 8J FSI TSI 2.0 | eBay

Excellent before and after sale service. Products include radiators for cars, trucks and motorcycle, silicone hoses, intercoolers, oilcoolers. Instruction is NOT included.

www.ebay.com

Returning to the subject of turbo upgrades and intercoolers. Sorry for getting way off topic. Has anyone personally done a custom FMIC?
The TR6 (6" high) should fit below the crash bar and rest on the lower radiator support... Thick core, most inline intercoolers will have less pressure drop than ones that must conform to the stock sizing.. the fewer turns the air must make, and the wider the passages, the less restrictive. Sustains less than 1psi pressure drop up to 600CFM, which we'd only hit at 5K RPM and 3BAR of boost

Treadstone TR6 Intercooler 400HP

Fast shipping, amazing customer service, performance parts for your performance car, straight to your door.

edgeautosport.com

 

[Rogerbslee]

I’m in a similar position to the OP but looking for an upgrade compared to the CR140 which doesn’t sacrifice anything in terms of spool up.
I’m afraid I would really miss that instant torque.
Does such a thing even exist? Maybe the xman hybrid?